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Synbot
Expert Intervention Caldari State
148
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Posted - 2013.09.22 04:13:00 -
[1] - Quote
Mine? Would blow everything out of the water. Even the water itself. I'm curious about the community's opinion. Especially CCP's, if they don't mind. |
itsmellslikefish
DIOS EX. Top Men.
253
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Posted - 2013.09.22 04:14:00 -
[2] - Quote
Great I can get murder taxied outside a match. |
Mobius Kaethis
Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION
802
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 04:27:00 -
[3] - Quote
I can see it now. I walk out of my merc's quarters and into the war barge's war room. As I step down the stairs a RDV wobbles and drops a HAV, which then promptly crushes me. I wake up, gasping for breath, as the clone tank drains of birthing nutrients. |
Coleman Gray
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
711
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Posted - 2013.09.22 04:37:00 -
[4] - Quote
It'd be amazing, Eve players could charge taxi fair for transporting mers between planets, tho a clone system similair to EvE's would have to be implemented, which alone would flood us all with tears |
Synbot
Expert Intervention Caldari State
148
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Posted - 2013.09.22 04:47:00 -
[5] - Quote
Physical marketplaces instead of it just being in a neocom would be cool too. |
Shion Typhon
Intara Direct Action Caldari State
267
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 04:58:00 -
[6] - Quote
I think it would redefine mankind's place in the universe, bring about universal peace, cure cancer and generally engender a new paradigm of humanistic karmic wellbeing.
The devs would have mile high golden statues built to them as praise from a grovelling, worshiping populace of true believers.
Seeing our new-found enlightenment the Galactic Council would descend to Earth and invite us to join their Million-Year-Utopia where we all played Dust together in harmony for the rest of time.
Or ..... |
Coleman Gray
GunFall Mobilization Covert Intervention
711
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Posted - 2013.09.22 05:01:00 -
[7] - Quote
Shion Typhon wrote:I think it would redefine mankind's place in the universe, bring about universal peace, cure cancer and generally engender a new paradigm of humanistic karmic wellbeing.
The devs would have mile high golden statues built to them as praise from a grovelling, worshiping populace of true believers.
Seeing our new-found enlightenment the Galactic Council would descend to Earth and invite us to join their Million-Year-Utopia where we all played Dust together in harmony for the rest of time.
Or .....
This would never happen, we would use iron over gold, it's tougher and cheaper.
|
Vyzion Eyri
The Southern Legion The Umbra Combine
1328
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 05:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
I imagine convoys of tanks escorting supplies from one district to another... only to be set upon by pirates, IN DROPSHIPS.
Wouldn't even need a girlfriend anymore. |
TcuBe3
Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION
144
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Posted - 2013.09.22 05:13:00 -
[9] - Quote
Would it be kinda free roam like red dead redemption? |
Vrain Matari
ZionTCD
937
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Posted - 2013.09.22 05:18:00 -
[10] - Quote
It's actually something that CCP have expressed a a long-term goal for DUST, CCP's physicist talked about it at fanfest. |
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Xender17
Ahrendee Mercenaries EoN.
663
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 05:36:00 -
[11] - Quote
Synbot wrote:Mine? Would blow everything out of the water. Even the water itself. I'm curious about the community's opinion. Especially CCP's, if they don't mind. First you need water. |
Godin Thekiller
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
802
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 05:39:00 -
[12] - Quote
Picture this:
You fly in a shuttle, flown by a Cap (or maybe even a Valkyrie pilot, whatever the **** they are called) down onto a barren planet, in which the surface resembles the Wild West (only it is in New Eden standards, so holographic billboards and ****). You land in a station, and walk casually to a building labeled "Local (the Town you're in) Agent Office". You walk in, and ask the local agent of your choice for a mission, and she gives you a assignment, which is to clear out a small Serpentis camp. You walk out, and go to the weapons construction area. You request for a Abron Scout LAV, as well as a Scout suit, with the modules, and a Sniper Rifle, and a extra Assault suit with a Plasma Rifle and a Ion Pistol, as well as A Small Autocannon. All of it is constructed for you, you hop in, and drive off.
You arrive on a hillside close to the camp. You set up the Autocannon between some rocks, and get into the Scout suit and Sniper Rifle. You screw on a Suppressor, and snipe out all of the guards. Then, you go back and get into a Assault suit, grab your weapons, and get on the Autocannon. Then, you light up the base, destroying the homes, killing the pirates panicking and running around, and when it's out of ammo, you grab you Plasma Rifle, and go to work.
After the mission is done, you go back to town and collect your payment. Then, a alert go on at the planet. The Serpentis are attacking the planet! Now, many Mercs are coming in to assist. a friendly Warbarge sends in a Suyra for you to use. TIme to get to work. Again. |
Operative 1171 Aajli
Bragian Order Amarr Empire
340
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Posted - 2013.09.22 05:45:00 -
[13] - Quote
I'm sure between the info they gain from this game plus The World of Twilight (Darkness) they will be able to finally make the ground warfare game that should go with EVE. |
Avallo Kantor
Paladin Survey Force Amarr Empire
182
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Posted - 2013.09.22 06:21:00 -
[14] - Quote
The problem is that there are multiple planets in New Eden, not just one, and there are FAR more than could ever be feasibly fleshed out.
Think on this: Most EVE players have NOT been to every system, and likely many have not even been to even half of all the systems in game. So already just the number of systems is beyond what most MMOs even have in scope, and then take into consideration -every- system has -multiple- planets.
The only way an open world would be feasible if they vastly reduced the scope of what mercs can explore, either making each planet only have a tiny, tiny fraction of it's surface be "open world", or only open a small planet (Even a dwarf planet is massive in this case) for players to interact in. Even then, things would have to be crunched together, or only have one demi-continent to hold player interest.
Not to mention the issues already inherent in the game such as simultaneous player count in an area, or the issue of the massive number of art assets that would be needed in the game.
Ultimately I think DUST would be better served by deployment to specific locations in the Universe (such as current battles) except there would be the option to deploy to much larger warfronts (perhaps the entire 5k x 5k map) that host multiple installations, large player count etc. |
Himiko Kuronaga
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1540
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 06:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
CCP will not do this because it would involve EVE-side work as well.
Last I checked, Hilmar was still terrified of what happened during the Jita riots, so I'm afraid the rest of you will be made to suffer until that changes.
Which will probably be never. |
Godin Thekiller
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
806
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 06:38:00 -
[16] - Quote
Avallo Kantor wrote:The problem is that there are multiple planets in New Eden, not just one, and there are FAR more than could ever be feasibly fleshed out.
Think on this: Most EVE players have NOT been to every system, and likely many have not even been to even half of all the systems in game. So already just the number of systems is beyond what most MMOs even have in scope, and then take into consideration -every- system has -multiple- planets.
The only way an open world would be feasible if they vastly reduced the scope of what mercs can explore, either making each planet only have a tiny, tiny fraction of it's surface be "open world", or only open a small planet (Even a dwarf planet is massive in this case) for players to interact in. Even then, things would have to be crunched together, or only have one demi-continent to hold player interest.
Not to mention the issues already inherent in the game such as simultaneous player count in an area, or the issue of the massive number of art assets that would be needed in the game.
Ultimately I think DUST would be better served by deployment to specific locations in the Universe (such as current battles) except there would be the option to deploy to much larger warfronts (perhaps the entire 5k x 5k map) that host multiple installations, large player count etc.
Well, we operate on destricts, in which are on a 5x5 Km plane. they could use that random generator that they were making,and gradually on each system, on and on, they could have just similar, but random environments on them. |
Godin Thekiller
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
807
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 06:39:00 -
[17] - Quote
Himiko Kuronaga wrote:CCP will not do this because it would involve EVE-side work as well.
Last I checked, Hilmar was still terrified of what happened during the Jita riots, so I'm afraid the rest of you will be made to suffer until that changes.
Which will probably be never.
I sat back and ate popcorn and watched about 100km from the madness with some friends. I even saw some devs. It was fun |
FATPrincess - XOXO
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
557
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 13:22:00 -
[18] - Quote
Dust will always be a lobby shooter.
-XOXO |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces League of Infamy
494
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 13:56:00 -
[19] - Quote
Coleman Gray wrote:Shion Typhon wrote:I think it would redefine mankind's place in the universe, bring about universal peace, cure cancer and generally engender a new paradigm of humanistic karmic wellbeing.
The devs would have mile high golden statues built to them as praise from a grovelling, worshiping populace of true believers.
Seeing our new-found enlightenment the Galactic Council would descend to Earth and invite us to join their Million-Year-Utopia where we all played Dust together in harmony for the rest of time.
Or ..... This would never happen, we would use iron over gold, it's tougher and cheaper.
...Everyone would just fine something else to complain about.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
Kasote Denzara
A Vulture
310
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 14:02:00 -
[20] - Quote
Wait, what the hell "water"? I don't know what this "water" thing is. How much SP does it cost? Can I shoot it? Is it a kind of rock? Or sand?
I'm just a simple mercenary! |
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Athena Sentinel
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
78
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Posted - 2013.09.22 14:03:00 -
[21] - Quote
Synbot wrote:Mine? Would blow everything out of the water. Even the water itself. I'm curious about the community's opinion. Especially CCP's, if they don't mind.
I think that boat has sailed. But they will have stations where Dust and EVE characters walking around (Seen in CCP long term future vids). So I think in a way (long time in the future) your open world and trade markets will be in the game. But that is just my opinion. |
Canari Elphus
Pro Hic Immortalis
449
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 14:40:00 -
[22] - Quote
There is no way I see this being a true open world game as it would turn it into a RPG rather than a FPS. That said, it doesnt mean that there cannot be open world aspects to build out the immersion of the game. There are a couple areas where this might work.
PvE missions - These can be done on full terrain maps where you can partition the maps to control server load when you have a lot of people on them. This is how MAG was able to hold 256 people at a given time. This could also be a good balance between roam space and viable interaction. Each of the missions would have a insertion point which would be a landing complex that would have some market/interaction points in it as well. You could also control some of the mayhem by having these complexes patrolled by Concord troops.
Corporation 'Districts' - IF/When PC expands, you can give each corporation their own district in High Sec (for a very large price somewhere in the 10s of billions) which would be a free roam for corp and alliance members.
EVE Stations - These would be primary EVE interaction and the place you go to for accepting EVE contracts and to arrange for shipments of goods (clone packs/weapons/etc) |
lordjanuz
Norwegian Dust514 Corporation Top Men.
194
|
Posted - 2013.09.22 14:44:00 -
[23] - Quote
Vrain Matari wrote:It's actually something that CCP have expressed a a long-term goal for DUST, CCP's physicist talked about it at fanfest.
This, and they said also that battles with no limits on clones and time is a goal, the loosing team will be that with poor supply lines. Check out CCP presents 2013. |
DJINN Jecture
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
52
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 14:32:00 -
[24] - Quote
Some degree of Open World design needs to be implemented for this game to get out of competition with games like COD and BF4. Although I like lobby shooting, it is a game about working with other mercs to achieve something. Right now we have nothing to achieve. If we could conquer a planet by wiping it clear of drones then be ambushed by another like minded group of mercs and push them back at a district command center after losing the ambush I think we would be seeing a game that would grow and change into something that CCP could be really proud of.
That Eve connection is a huge selling point for me and many of my friends, working on opening trade, cause and effect between the two games and something that allows mercs to enjoy the same or similar isk making opportunities as Eve would be a smart idea. I have also noticed that while I can buy Plex in Eve to buy ships and other items with the isk from the sale of the Plex, there is no easy button to replenishing isk when a major loss occurs.
With all this in mind I was pleasantly surprised to find this video in my email this morning: CEP Pyrex 2.55 . Check it out, maybe we can all help point CCP to a better client form for this fantastic shooter at our fingertips. |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1823
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 15:10:00 -
[25] - Quote
So you mean skirmish 1.0? Yeah it was fun it was better than anything I've played in this game since. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
6913
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 15:12:00 -
[26] - Quote
I would love to walk through a town and buy parts for my gun, or new upgrades for my dropsuit, or maybe grab a new coat of paint of my HAV.
|
Beeeees
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
267
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 15:14:00 -
[27] - Quote
Im just going to repeat myself here
The maps are build in a way that eventually multi-district battles may be possible. We are however lightyears away from getting that implemented effectively. |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1823
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 15:41:00 -
[28] - Quote
Athena Sentinel wrote:Synbot wrote:Mine? Would blow everything out of the water. Even the water itself. I'm curious about the community's opinion. Especially CCP's, if they don't mind. I think that boat has sailed. But they will have stations where Dust and EVE characters walking around (Seen in CCP long term future vids). So I think in a way (long time in the future) your open world and trade markets will be in the game. But that is just my opinion.
I agree it's why dust SHOULD be awesome. It should have endless expansions into forever right? Well I hope they push pass the PS3 asap becuase unless they do that how will we ever be able to have those long term goal experiences? |
Alan-Ibn-Xuan Al-Alasabe
Planetary Response Organisation
440
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:10:00 -
[29] - Quote
I did a write up a while back about a way it could be done. I certainly hope the game gets to that point, because lobby shooters are stupid. |
J'Jor Da'Wg
KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION
944
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:19:00 -
[30] - Quote
Honestly? I'm not a fan. Open world games sound good in concept but very rarely are they made well in a multiplayer setting, especially for an FPS. The game would have to become so different from its original concept that I fear it would just go completely off the right track.
I prefer large scale, large map battles with social lobby elements in between. That makes it easy to focus the action into a specific area or map. Otherwise if you just have free roam you have giant dead zones and just nothing happening with maybe one or two squads max of players fighting. Like in Planetside how even with that huge map there is only a few big battles ever happening...
So no. I dont want open world. I like interconnected battle instances affecting a sov map |
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TechMechMeds
Swamp Marines Kleenex Inc.
396
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:22:00 -
[31] - Quote
I think I'd be putting remote explosives at spawn points or the drop off point. |
ADAM-OF-EVE
Svartur Bjorn Neo Terra Empire
411
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:23:00 -
[32] - Quote
Synbot wrote:Mine? Would blow everything out of the water. Even the water itself. I'm curious about the community's opinion. Especially CCP's, if they don't mind.
just how exactly do you make an open world that spreads over thousands of planets ? |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1824
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:26:00 -
[33] - Quote
J'Jor Da'Wg wrote:Honestly? I'm not a fan. Open world games sound good in concept but very rarely are they made well in a multiplayer setting, especially for an FPS. The game would have to become so different from its original concept that I fear it would just go completely off the right track.
I prefer large scale, large map battles with social lobby elements in between. That makes it easy to focus the action into a specific area or map. Otherwise if you just have free roam you have giant dead zones and just nothing happening with maybe one or two squads max of players fighting. Like in Planetside how even with that huge map there is only a few big battles ever happening...
So no. I dont want open world. I like interconnected battle instances affecting a sov map That's all an open world sandbox is it just a bunch of instances in dusts case.
The future plan is you let you drop down into your own maps while not defending them and run around and do PvE.
It's not lik eyou can walk from district to district or walk through space. It's still mostly lobbies.
But it's got a player market, the ability to explore persistent worlds you can capture and hold, upgrade, make your own, fight over. we basically jump minds to get around the universe. But the experience can be made to create the feeling of an open world sandbox game.
Also in the future of PC battles the battles will have a moving red line that moved based on where the MCC is. So the redline would be in constant movement between objectives.
It'll happen when and IF CCP can finish with the core. which to be fair has needed a lot of work. I can't believe how far the game as come, but I fear loss of direction towards the goal put forth in 2007... |
crazy space 1
Unkn0wn Killers
1824
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:28:00 -
[34] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:Synbot wrote:Mine? Would blow everything out of the water. Even the water itself. I'm curious about the community's opinion. Especially CCP's, if they don't mind. just how exactly do you make an open world that spreads over thousands of planets ?
Easy, you make tiny open worlds on 1000s of planets.
And planets are huge so you can still have district boundaries, with warp gates connecting them. Actually I think they already starting to have that in mind you can see the warp gates in the maps sometimes. Maybe we can fly dropships and jets through them some day to jump around the planet. |
Funkmaster Whale
0uter.Heaven
832
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 16:42:00 -
[35] - Quote
This game simply has too many issues to be put into an open-world. The entire game would have to be rebuilt if such an element was implemented. Not only that, I don't think the engine nor the hardware has the ability to support such a game. CCP's sort of behind on the ball.
They keeping toting this view that the "core" of this game needs to be brought in line before moving on, and yet it seems like their idea of the core game is completely backwards. The lobby shooter can only get you so far. We have a merc quarters and yet it's absolutely pointless. Ultimately this game comes down to a handful of maps and a few ill-conceived game modes. Even as someone who does PC it really doesn't mean much to me to be able to claim some pixels on a starmap. We can't actually do anything on the planets we own which is just sad. We work so hard to fight for territory and it just becomes an ISK drill for the directors to manipulate.
It's just sad how much potential this game had but never actually took the time to materialize. I feel like the whole concept was rushed and not enough time and resources were put into the design. The sheer amount of content they want to put it is being worked on by a handful of DEVs. That's simply not feasible for the product they are envisioning. |
Canari Elphus
Pro Hic Immortalis
642
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 17:24:00 -
[36] - Quote
They will never drop the type of confined FPS matches that we see today and they shouldnt. It keeps the battle in focus.
However, having an open world PVE and social aspect with things such as industry and mining would make many players who want something beyond lobby fights happy. That being said, you are talking about a good year or more of development time to make that happen. |
Vrain Matari
ZionTCD
1079
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 17:40:00 -
[37] - Quote
I think open world is definitely possible, but the design is what will make or break it ofc. And it is a big project and will require a carefully thought out and pre-meditated rollout.
The core design principles in New Eden are always: good gameplay coupled to the strategic importance of gamemode rewards/resources. If the open world gamemode does not influence balance of power in New Eden then it's pointless, a waste of developer resources and a needless dilution of the playerbase.
I believe the area of the world most in need of relevance is Faction Warfare, both EVE-side and DUST-side. FW is good for printing ISK and obtaining Faction loot, and provides a natural home for roleplay, but is otherwise wholly irrelevant to New Eden geopolitics. And to be honest, the same criticism is true of highsec, but hisec is tricky and best saved for last, imo.
Based on these arguments, limited-theatre open-district DUST FW gameplay that supports EVE-side manufacturing stands to contribute the most to the game, imo. I would like to see lowsec as the natural home for manufacturing in EVE, but with bonuses only attainable through DUST operations that incorporate both initial strike/capture phases and ongoing maintenance phases to preserve bonuses. One area that mercs must make an important contribution to if lowsec is to become a manufacturing powerbase is secure/convenient transport of resources and products - via persistent passive transport buffs based on infrastructure or temporary highly-secure transport missions. What form these take who knows, but transportation is the primary factor limiting lowsec manufacturing in New Eden today.
Gonna stop it there because once we get into specifics of design walls of text are not far away.
One of the take-aways from the 'strategic relevance' argument for content is that everything becomes at least an order of magnitude more complicated because now we have to consider both EVE and DUST in all gameplay content decisions going forward from basically now, and anything that affects EVE-side geopolitics is a potential minefield for CCP. There is no way around this, however, because irrelevance is not an option for the mercenary soldiers of New Eden.
P.S.: Timeline is after we have made the transition to PS4 and ironed out all the kinks. So for open-world gamemodes i'd imagine a couple of years down the road. |
KingBlade82
The Phoenix Federation Ascension Alliance
206
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 17:54:00 -
[38] - Quote
if they did turn it into open world dicks would just camp new player areas and camp the **** out of them :P |
calvin b
Molon Labe. RISE of LEGION
703
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 17:59:00 -
[39] - Quote
+1 |
S Park Finner
DUST University Ivy League
332
|
Posted - 2013.10.12 18:13:00 -
[40] - Quote
The gateway into open worlds is Planetary Conquest.
Once a district is owned it's structure GÇô the placement and types of facilities GÇô can be frozen and owner players can return to it at any time. It is instanced when an owner wants to enter it and if it is already instanced owner players can join it. There may be limitations on the number of players but if there is no battle it could at least be 32 players from the owning Corporation.
If the Corporation owns multiple locations on a planet they can travel between them via GÇ£transportersGÇ¥ which are a variation of the clone mechanism that instances them at the new location GÇô perhaps at the cost of a clone or ISK
If the Corporation owns some minimum number of districts on a planet they can get a special district which contains facilities for DUST player trading, manufacturing, whatever.
Or the Corporation could convert facilities on existing districts that support additional activities.
Or the Corporation could get an expanded War Barge over the planet where various functions could be carried out in space.
Or the Corporation could get locations on existing EVE stations if they had enough ISK to rent the space and the station was in orbit near the planet.
Or all those things could be implemented over time depending on which additional activities the developers and community wanted to build out first.
Which is all to say the vision of open worlds that meaningfully involve players can exist without major conceptual or engine change to EVE or DUST 514 -- though it would be a huge development investment for CCP. And I agree with those folks who say the work on core systems is job one at this stage of the game. |
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