And the thread has been cursed

..
The LOS Scanning[/center]

Anything that you can see will appear on your radar within 80 meters. So regardless of my lower profile, I popped up on Reav's radar as long as he saw me within 80 meters. However if I dropped behind something I disappear.

Blip Brightness Effect

....
LOS: The same as passive but with an interesting twist. As they leave your LOS they get dimmer. So when I was aiming at Reav and he began to walk sideways, his blip got dimmer the farther from my cross hairs he got. Aiming at a target instantly makes the Blip at it's brightest intensity.

First of all, there's an additional twist to the LOS stuff.
Some things may not just show up on your radar, even in your LOS view... UNLESS you specifically run your crosshairs over them.
Technically, its (crosshairs, plus a width approximately the size of an SMG or sniper ADS targetting reticule.

Also.... there may be some very special weapons, that may light it up on your radar, out to 100m. Sniper rifle might be one. but maybe not.

Also... this effect is in effect, even for those weapons that dont have particularly noticable crosshairs. Such as knives. Or hip-carried sniper rifles.

Also... If something is out of rader range, but you happen to run your crosshairs over it.. it may light up, not on your rader screen, but on your REGULAR SCREEN. ie: chevron lightup, or even more details if you are close enough.
Range is somewhat weapon dependant, i THINK. It's usually corresponding to your weapon's efffective range.
Exception being turrets and tanks; they light up at long distance for almost any weapon, if I recall.
I did a long post about this stuff a few weeks back.

This is why you may randomly get a brief light-up of a chevron, for an enemy that doesnt even seem to be there. You just happen to have run your crosshairs across their exact position on your screen while running somewhere, etc. Even if you dont have enough precision to see them normally on your passive scan.
If you stood still, and they stood still... they would continue to be lit up on your screen, even though they're too far for radar.
(IMO, this should really really be taken away)
Unlike the passive-scan "height doesnt matter" feature.. vertical position matters. your crosshairs really need to be ON the target, for this to happen.

Lastly..
There may be a similar crosshair effect, for EXACTLY BEHIND YOU. This is rather difficult to test :) but I seem to have occasionally observed this sort of behaviour. that is to say, a red chrvron in the "behind" position.. but them NOT being on my passive-scan radar, because they were too far away.
This makes absolutely no sense, though. So it may be a +-sign bug in the code, rather than a deliberate feature.
I would suggest not relying on it. But do pay attention if you get those wierd red-chevrons at the botom of your screen that indicate enemies behind you :-}

i

1) Can you specify what those "things" are? Or give an example to test?

mmm. no, sorry.
Suggestion: Try being in a domination, where the enemy is clustered around the one point. Get to within 90 yards, and experiment.
But make sure you are experimenting with either a scrambler rifle or sniper rifle equipped.


3) Are you talking about the blip getting brighter when it is directly behind you? If so, that is true for fore and aft. Except it isn't true that it goes beyond your passive range (as we tested) Reav was pretty much every where he could be on my minimap, and he only shows up behind me when he is inside passive scan radius.

Speaking of which.. turns out that enemy uplink detection is now also a good test of passive scanning. They seem to disappear outside of passive scan range now.

(Unless of course you get them in your crosshairs :-/ )

More useful, concisely worded gifts of knowledge?

Freaks.

One thing I forgot to ask. If you, or anyone you know, have trained up passive scan range skills to the max can you check to see if stacking penalties apply?

I did some Math-Fu of my own. Assuming you have trained up Gallente Scout Dropsuit to Level 5 and Range Amplification to level 5 and have a Scout GK.0 fitted with four complex range amplifiers, you should be able to see up to 99 meters with the passive scan. But if there is a stacking penalty then the range would about 60 meters. Can you check that for me?

just a heads up; as most of you know DUST 514 is currently not calculating movement penalties on armor modules in the right order.

Exampel: Put 2 armor plates on a suit and mark your movement, then put a ferroscale ( 3:rd module ) on and you will see that your movement just increased. This is because the ferroscale is incorrectly calculated as being first in line for stacking penalty - meaning that stacking penalties are applied to the armor modules but not the ferroscale. ( since it is first in line. )

Now if DUST 514 incorrectly calculates 'negative precentages' in the wrong order it would be fair to assume that it could very well do the same while dealing with other modules. Such as 'Profile Dampeners' and 'Precision Enhancers'.

If the stacking penalties are calculated in the right order a medium suit with 1 ' complex profile dampener' and 1 'advanced profile dampener' would have a scan profile of 27.88 dB how ever if it is calculated in the wrong order it would end up being 28.18 dB.

Since a prototype scanner has a scan precision of 28 dB it should be easy to verify if the bug exists while dealing with these modules.

Feel free to send me in-game mails if you have any questions and / or want me to help out in any way.

( Oh and btw you can see that DUST 514 has stacking penalties on percentages by stacking 'cardiac regulators' or 'kinetic catalyzers' they'll experience the standard EVE pattern of stacking penalties. )

One thing I forgot to ask. If you, or anyone you know, have trained up passive scan range skills to the max can you check to see if stacking penalties apply?

I did some Math-Fu of my own. Assuming you have trained up Gallente Scout Dropsuit to Level 5 and Range Amplification to level 5 and have a Scout GK.0 fitted with four complex range amplifiers, you should be able to see up to 99 meters with the passive scan. But if there is a stacking penalty then the range would about 60 meters. Can you check that for me?

all very interesting. However, as a mini light with good radar skills but w/o mods I find myself being skeaked up on very often. Sometimes a heavy would be right behind my back w/o lighting up on the radar. Does it take a certain time for the radar to actually register them in the 10- 20m radius or is it instant?

Its pretty quick but that 10 to 15 meters is also very short. Minmatar light with range enhancement 5 will only be 15 meters. My guess is you are probably misjudging the range and they are engaging just outside the passive range and closing quickly. Even a fat suit could move in at 5 m/s and the time-to-kill of a light is about 1 second.

Since it seems like we are in different parts of the world I'll just share my data and the experiments I was going to ask you to help me with.

First off is the hit-miss charts I made ( I have already made them availible on the forums but I'll put the link in here aswell )
The first chart is no stacking penalty at all ( I'm leaving it in there )
The second is with stacking penalty.

Link: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvYSJ6FRJlihdDI1NVpNdk5BQUh0bFphNktjLTU3R1E&usp=sharing

And here is a link to the complete data ( which I haven't shared before and only uploaded to google docs yesterday )

Link: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvYSJ6FRJlihdFVJeWI5NVFUcmYwZERDQWhUSXZac2c&usp=sharing

The data is separated into a lot of sheets:

Heavy - Profile Dampening
Medium - Profile Dampening
Light - Profile Dampening
Scout - Profile Dampening

Heavy - Precision Enhancement
Medium - Precision Enhancement
Logistics - Precision Enhancement
Light - Precision Enhancement

Almost Everyone - Range Amplification
Gallente Scout - Range Amplification

All functions are intact in this spreadsheet so you can clearly see how stacking penalty is calculated.

Link to Aenigma's guide on stacking penalties in EVE: http://eve.battleclinic.com/guide/9196-Aenigma-s-Stacking-Penalty-Guide.html

Just a heads up; as most of you know DUST 514 is currently not calculating movement penalties on armor modules in the right order.

Exampel: Put 2 armor plates on a suit and mark your movement, then put a ferroscale ( 3:rd module ) on and you will see that your movement just increased. This is because the ferroscale is incorrectly calculated as being first in line for stacking penalty - meaning that stacking penalties are applied to the armor modules but not the ferroscale. ( since it is first in line. )

Now if DUST 514 incorrectly calculates 'negative precentages' in the wrong order it would be fair to assume that it could very well do the same while dealing with other modules. Such as 'Profile Dampeners' and 'Precision Enhancers'.

If the stacking penalties are calculated in the right order a medium suit with 1 ' complex profile dampener' and 1 'advanced profile dampener' would have a scan profile of 27.88 dB how ever if it is calculated in the wrong order it would end up being 28.18 dB.

Since a prototype scanner has a scan precision of 28 dB it should be easy to verify if the bug exists while dealing with these modules.

Feel free to send me in-game mails if you have any questions and / or want me to help out in any way.

( Oh and btw you can see that DUST 514 has stacking penalties on percentages by stacking 'cardiac regulators' or 'kinetic catalyzers' they'll experience the standard EVE pattern of stacking penalties. )

Damn. Also, I assume that the scout-MLT Dampener is a Level 5 scout, nes pas?
Also, the stacking penalties to Range Amplifiers sort of institutes a passive scan range buff IMO.