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Sgt Kirk
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1197
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Posted - 2013.08.19 23:34:00 -
[1] - Quote
Uplinks as we all know are a valuable asset to a team, but in all honesty it gets a bit ridiculous when there are 20 uplinks spammed everywhere.
I advocate a system that prohibits uplink staking within a given area by means of signal interference.
The tier and or type of uplink would determine it's signal radius, varying from a large signal radius (80-70m) to small signal radius (40-30m) . The numbers are up for change and were thrown in there just as an example.
The first uplink placed within an area would get first priority while if a second person wanted to lay down uplinks there would be an indicator when the uplink is readied if there is not within signal interference range.
Thank you for your time.
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Mobius Kaethis
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
596
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Posted - 2013.08.19 23:41:00 -
[2] - Quote
This would be nice. It would make it easier to tactically spawn in an area rather than the random luck of landing on a good uplink in the mass of, seemingly, hundreds that we have now. |
Synbot
Expert Intervention Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2013.08.19 23:45:00 -
[3] - Quote
I agree, and with Mobius. Strategically placed uplinks are obviously better than randomly, clustered ones. |
lithkul devant
Legions of Infinite Dominion
33
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Posted - 2013.08.19 23:56:00 -
[4] - Quote
I agree with the message of the OP, but I think that the size of interferance for each type should be reduced by 10-15m otherwise for small maps you could have it where people decide to troll and completely screw a team just out of griefing. |
Cosgar
ParagonX
4369
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Posted - 2013.08.20 00:03:00 -
[5] - Quote
I'd like to keep uplinks this obvious to scouts to make them more useful. |
Blake Kingston
Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation
50
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Posted - 2013.08.20 00:55:00 -
[6] - Quote
Are you saying it kills the other uplink, or merely supresses it?
If weaker uplinks were suppressed and can't be used (until the stronger ones were used up), that'd seem an interesting fix. Though still show the weaker ones on the map (perhaps with alpha, to show they aren't currently working at full strength) |
Auld Syne
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
74
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Posted - 2013.08.20 02:28:00 -
[7] - Quote
This is a grade A Idea. +1 |
Sgt Kirk
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1205
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Posted - 2013.08.20 02:54:00 -
[8] - Quote
Blake Kingston wrote:Are you saying it kills the other uplink, or merely supresses it?
If weaker uplinks were suppressed and can't be used (until the stronger ones were used up), that'd seem an interesting fix. Though still show the weaker ones on the map (perhaps with alpha, to show they aren't currently working at full strength) I'm saying that you can't place it down but I guess I could go with it being inactive until the first uplink runs out, not sure that's up for further discussion. |
Auld Syne
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
74
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Posted - 2013.08.20 05:31:00 -
[9] - Quote
I'd also like to throw in an idea. Indoor and out door(concealed) capable uplinks. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1562
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 05:47:00 -
[10] - Quote
Just give hostile forces the ability to earn WP by destroying uplinks, then combine that with the upcoming bug fix for signal profile, and the fix for glitching links into solid objects. Throw in a dash of being able to hack enemy equipment and mix well with a use of Flux nades, server liberally.
Doing things to put a mechanical hard cap on uplinks deployed is bad practice as it unfairly burdens anyone who has actually skilled into, or fielded uplinks. From a use and value perspective this is the same as saying that ARs need to lock if they are brought within a given range of each other because while ARs are a valuable tactical asset to the team it gets ridiculous when a whole squad of them is spamming fire into one area.
There are a lot of players talking about how the support mercs, particularly those in logi suits, need to not compete with the assault role... while at the same time there are a lot of threads, sometimes containing the same people, advocating for nerfs and restrictions to the value and application of equipment. Whether intended or not this combination nerfs support play creating a trend which marginalizes roles that fall outside of the 'slayer' rubric. In short reducing game diversity, and if carried far enough the actual longevity of the game.
Find solutions to things which don't require mechanical hard caps or the creation of artificial/heavy handed 'walls' to player action and choice. This is a sandbox, a developing one as far as Dust is concerned but a sandbox nonetheless, solutions require less force and more eloquence to avoid losing that vital attribute.
0.02 ISK Cross
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ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
294
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Posted - 2013.08.20 06:12:00 -
[11] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:Just give hostile forces the ability to earn WP by destroying uplinks, then combine that with the upcoming bug fix for signal profile, and the fix for glitching links into solid objects. Throw in a dash of being able to hack enemy equipment and mix well with a use of Flux nades, server liberally.
1) all equipment, not just uplinks. 2) +1 for the entire comment.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
ADAM-OF-EVE
Svartur Bjorn
212
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Posted - 2013.08.20 06:19:00 -
[12] - Quote
change the uplink from a tiny little box which is hard to see and kill to something a bit more obvious like a pillar/beacon of some sort. most of the spam isn't for usage purposes anyway but to confuse the enemy where they are and to make it impossible to kill them all before someone spawns in on another and drops more. if they were more obvious and can't be placed in tiny gaps etc then this allows enemy to kill them easier(when no one is about to stop them doing it that is) if they are not placed strategicaly |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
294
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Posted - 2013.08.20 06:34:00 -
[13] - Quote
ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:change the uplink from a tiny little box which is hard to see and kill to something a bit more obvious like a pillar/beacon of some sort. most of the spam isn't for usage purposes anyway but to confuse the enemy where they are and to make it impossible to kill them all before someone spawns in on another and drops more. if they were more obvious and can't be placed in tiny gaps etc then this allows enemy to kill them easier(when no one is about to stop them doing it that is) if they are not placed strategicaly
Pillar? Makes them easier to snipe I suppose. I destroying them grants WPs then snipers now have a new target. Good scouts would have an outrageously simple time taking these out if they were even more obvious(UI-wise) and that's not good as I, a scout, enjoy the mental challenge of weaving through the enemy undetected in search of placed equipment, destroying them, and making it out alive.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
Sgt Kirk
SyNergy Gaming EoN.
1206
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 06:46:00 -
[14] - Quote
ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote:ADAM-OF-EVE wrote:change the uplink from a tiny little box which is hard to see and kill to something a bit more obvious like a pillar/beacon of some sort. most of the spam isn't for usage purposes anyway but to confuse the enemy where they are and to make it impossible to kill them all before someone spawns in on another and drops more. if they were more obvious and can't be placed in tiny gaps etc then this allows enemy to kill them easier(when no one is about to stop them doing it that is) if they are not placed strategicaly Pillar? Makes them easier to snipe I suppose. I destroying them grants WPs then snipers now have a new target. Good scouts would have an outrageously simple time taking these out if they were even more obvious(UI-wise) and that's not good as I, a scout, enjoy the mental challenge of weaving through the enemy undetected in search of placed equipment, destroying them, and making it out alive.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST . I don't have a viewpoint on the matter but just wanted to say that what you enjoy and what's good for the game are two separate things. |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
294
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Posted - 2013.08.20 06:57:00 -
[15] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote:I don't have a viewpoint on the matter but just wanted to say that what you enjoy and what's good for the game are two separate things.
Was simply pointing out an interest of mine. If it's too easy to find a destroy equipment then there will be no point in placing them tactically if they are just gonna be taken out quickly anyway. That being the case, you would be better off creating mine fields of uplinks as it would take the enemy longer to take out all of them and that means an increased chance of spawning.
If they are harder to find then that increases the longevity of the uplink and therefore allowing it to be used to it's fullest.
Yes there is a difference between what someone enjoys and what's good for the game in some cases but also you must know that what's good for the game is that the game is enjoyable.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
Bettie Boop 2100190003
A.N.O.N.Y.M.O.U.S.
106
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 07:10:00 -
[16] - Quote
Sgt Kirk wrote:Uplinks as we all know are a valuable asset to a team, but in all honesty it gets a bit ridiculous when there are 20 uplinks spammed everywhere.
I advocate a system that prohibits uplink stacking within a given area by means of signal interference.
The tier and or type of uplink would determine its signal radius, varying from a large signal radius (80-70m) to small signal radius (40-30m) . The numbers are up for change and were thrown in there just as an example.
The first uplink placed within an area would get first priority while if a second person wanted to lay down an uplink there would be an indicator when the uplink is readied if it is not within signal interference range.
Thank you for your time.
With one change I really like this idea, it would make uplinks much more useful.
The change is this, higher spawn speed uplinks have priority over lower spawn speed uplinks.
Example: -Player1 puts a militia uplink down, two people spawn from that uplink -Player2 tosses another uplink 2m from the first players uplink, Player2's uplink is an advanced uplink with 30.5% speed increase. This up link would "destroy" player1's uplink when it activates. -Player1 goes back and tries to put another uplink down but is denied because there is a "better" uplink already in the area.
The problem becomes how a player knows when they are with in range of another uplink and if that uplink is better than the one they are about to drop. I do like the idea, but my concern is added complexity (If its not a complex mind Frack, you must not be in the EVE universe) and possible server lag this increase data could cause. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1567
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 07:23:00 -
[17] - Quote
ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote:Cross Atu wrote:Just give hostile forces the ability to earn WP by destroying uplinks, then combine that with the upcoming bug fix for signal profile, and the fix for glitching links into solid objects. Throw in a dash of being able to hack enemy equipment and mix well with a use of Flux nades, server liberally. 1) all equipment, not just uplinks. 2) +1 for the entire comment.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST . Yes, thanks for clearing that up, all equipment. |
I-Shayz-I
Forty-Nine Fedayeen Minmatar Republic
651
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Posted - 2013.08.20 08:04:00 -
[18] - Quote
Honestly, there should just be more CRU's in skirmish, and the objectives spread out into the map more instead of being in the center. Also, getting rid of objective spawning would help too. The reason why Domination makes it an uplink frenzy is because there's only one objective, and the CRU's are not in between on on the way to any objectives.
But yes, having uplinks and equipment less detectable by normal dropsuits would be nice. Scouts should be the only ones that can detect them, unless you're using precision modules. Also, the icons should be much smaller on the minimap. |
Kekklian Noobatronic
Goonfeet Top Men.
304
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Posted - 2013.08.20 08:15:00 -
[19] - Quote
Agreed.
Seeing 8-10 drop uplinks clustered together on a map is the most frustrating thing ever, expecially because of where they tend to get placed by tryhards(in areas with only specific access I.E. dropships).
Balance does not mean countering rock with rock. Right now the only counter is drop uplink spam on your team. And even that's hardly a counter. |
Galvan Nized
Deep Space Republic Top Men.
213
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 09:34:00 -
[20] - Quote
Like the signal interference idea but agree that it has to smaller radius.
On the flip side I want an "anti-uplink" equipment. It could have the increased radius that was originally suggested (maybe even larger?) but adds time to respawn timer. Maybe like 2x for std up to like 5x for proto. This would encourage the use of higher uplinks but give a way to combat uplink spam but not kill them entirely.
I'm sure we could come up with lots of ideas for a spawn "scrambler." |
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SirManBoy
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
157
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 09:55:00 -
[21] - Quote
Suggestions like this make me realize that this community just doesn't get it. Uplink and nanohive spam is a legit strategy, especially when employed by players with L5 skills. Stop trying to water this game down and nerf EVERYTHING.
The only smart idea that I've seen in this convo is the suggestion about granting WP for destroying uplinks. That's actually quite a brilliant idea. |
Auld Syne
Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic
74
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 10:07:00 -
[22] - Quote
SirManBoy wrote:Suggestions like this make me realize that this community just doesn't get it. Uplink and nanohive spam is a legit strategy, especially when employed by players with L5 skills. Stop trying to water this game down and nerf EVERYTHING.
The only smart idea that I've seen in this convo is the suggestion about granting WP for destroying uplinks. That's actually quite a brilliant idea. You're in Molon Labe, AKA Ex. Planetary Response Organisation. All you guys know how to do is spam and zerg meatshields so this comment does not surprise me. |
XxGhazbaranxX
Bannana Boat Corp
286
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 11:50:00 -
[23] - Quote
I honestly don't understand why people hate uplink spam. If they have em they can use em. Anyways to each his own. I let my brother get to the devil in his own way. I do like the idea of a radius to the drop uplinks and that stronger ones suppress weaker ones till the stronger ones are used up. I have proto uplinks and am so used to only having to wait 5 seconds to spawn that when a blueberry puts an uplink next to mine to leach off my points I get angry. Not because that Blueberry is obviously a war point wh*re but because they made me wait more than 5 seconds to spawn. Worse when they put it right next to my imperial flux drop uplink with a 3 sometimes 4 second spawn time after they spawn on it in a carefully selected, scout reachable only area. |
Zendeal
Horizons' Edge Orion Empire
17
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Posted - 2013.08.20 13:43:00 -
[24] - Quote
What about the idea of Nanohives and Uplinks not persisting through death? Or that if you change suits at a supply depot to a suit without a valid uplink they dissapear?
Just an FYI, I believe people do it because of the decent amount of WP earned through uplink spam. Take any Logi suit and throw on 3 different types of uplinks (Requires 2 skill points invested). Militia Uplink, Stable Uplink and Standard Uplink. Drop your 3 down and profit... again, in skirmish or OMS you can even switch to a regular suit after the fact.
If they did not persist after death the uplink would be a more defensive equipment and would require more tactics when holding positions or pushing forward instead of drop, charge, repeat. |
G Torq
ALTA B2O
202
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 14:36:00 -
[25] - Quote
Reducing the number of uplinks is too simple!
Instead, let the "interference" cause the uplinks to become slower >:] |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1575
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 16:24:00 -
[26] - Quote
Kekklian Noobatronic wrote:Agreed.
Seeing 8-10 drop uplinks clustered together on a map is the most frustrating thing ever, expecially because of where they tend to get placed by tryhards(in areas with only specific access I.E. dropships).
Balance does not mean countering rock with rock. Right now the only counter is drop uplink spam on your team. And even that's hardly a counter. OBs, and flux nades both work wonders for me, though they are far from the only things that work, are you seriously suggesting that in a sandbox game the option to use deployable gear you've spent SP and ISK to access, in a location that is raised/hard to reach because you got there by using a transport asset which you spent SP and ISK to access, should be mechanically locked out?
If so that sounds rather like "everyone should play my way or not at all" which is not only outside the sandbox method but is decidedly bad game balance. Counters and options should exist within game first as much as possible not be based on gutting mechanics and options. To bring up an example from earlier in this thread liming uplinks mechanically in such a manner is the same as limiting ARs from functioning if you have friendly players too close to you. Those mechanical limits are actively taking the primary purpose of the item in question an artificially bottlenecking it to relieve players from having to actually address it in game more make effective efforts to counter a new/different in match meta.
0.02 ISK Cross |
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf
Brutor Vanguard Minmatar Republic
5494
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 17:22:00 -
[27] - Quote
I support this |
SirManBoy
Molon Labe. League of Infamy
157
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Posted - 2013.08.20 18:07:00 -
[28] - Quote
Uplinks establish a point of entry and assault in battle, not unlike a beachhead. The more uplinks deployed, the stronger and more resilient the beachhead. If you don't like that your enemy has its talons in your territory then destroy the uplinks. Will it take you time and precious ammo to clear out multiple uplinks? Yes, and that's the point! Of course I'm making it difficult for you, it's my job as a logi. You people who constantly rail about this game's features and who want to remove every creative element of gameplay that makes Dust unique irritate me to no end.
If you don't like my uplink spamming, do something about it that doesn't involve a developer--kill me and my hives.
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ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
299
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Posted - 2013.08.20 18:12:00 -
[29] - Quote
Zendeal wrote:What about the idea of Nanohives and Uplinks not persisting through death? Or that if you change suits at a supply depot to a suit without a valid uplink they dissapear?
Just an FYI, I believe people do it because of the decent amount of WP earned through uplink spam. Take any Logi suit and throw on 3 different types of uplinks (Requires 2 skill points invested). Militia Uplink, Stable Uplink and Standard Uplink. Drop your 3 down and profit... again, in skirmish or OMS you can even switch to a regular suit after the fact.
If they did not persist after death the uplink would be a more defensive equipment and would require more tactics when holding positions or pushing forward instead of drop, charge, repeat.
There is already a AUR only uplink that is destroyed when the user is killed. Has the fastest spawn time but only allows 6 spawns and I think (not sure) it is restricted to squad spawns.
I don't know of anyone that actually uses it though.
I would say restrict the uplinks to the first one placed. By that I mean if you have multiple types of uplinks, lets say MLT and STD, and you throw down a STD the game will register that you may only throw down 1. If you throw down the MLT next then the STD will be destroyed. This would discourage players from equipping multiple on a single suit and even if they switch they could still destroy there current uplinks by throwing down another (if you are lv5 on uplinks then you can have multiple suits, each with different uplinks, and just place, switch, place, switch, place, switch, etc. This would prevent that).
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
299
|
Posted - 2013.08.20 18:25:00 -
[30] - Quote
SirManBoy wrote:Uplinks establish a point of entry and assault in battle, not unlike a beachhead. The more uplinks deployed, the stronger and more resilient the beachhead. If you don't like that your enemy has its talons in your territory then destroy the uplinks. Will it take you time and precious ammo to clear out multiple uplinks? Yes, and that's the point! Of course I'm making it difficult for you, it's my job as a logi. You people who constantly rail about this game's features and who want to remove every creative element of gameplay that makes Dust unique irritate me to no end.
If you don't like my uplink spamming, do something about it that doesn't involve a developer--kill me and my hives.
My gripe isn't the enemy spamming but my own team spamming. A teammate needed reps and I was on the spawn screen. I asked him where he was and when he told me I still couldn't find the right location to spawn as all I could see was blue pulses. I literally couldn't see were a single teammate was on the entire map! There are many ways to utilize an uplink;
Offensive = 3-4 at the target area to ensure the enemy stays pressured. Defensive = 1-2 on the way to the target area to ensure you have a fall back when the offensive uplinks are down. This keeps you from being redlined. Tactical = 2-8 at hard-to-reach vantage points to give your teams a way to out maneuver the enemy. This allows you to more easily flank the enemy and disperse there attacking forces.
It annoys me when 100% of the uplinks are offensive as it becomes far to easy to be flanked. If the enemy does it then I just run in with fluxes and destroy all of them. Since they have no defensive uplinks, they are quickly forced off the target area and eventually redlined.
I plan to get proto uplinks that allow me to place 3 at once. This will allow me to set up an uplink for all 3 tactics mentioned above.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
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