the flaylocks need either a buff in damage and splah damage, keeping the current radius...
OR
an increase per level by .5 meters in splash radius.

MD should be left be. Flaylock pistol I agree with 100 percent. Now that hit detection has been fixed, you need that blast radius to compete with the smg.

The flaylock should never have got a radius nerf IMO, only the damage should have been nerfed

not letting it die

No one has thought for a second that you would let it die. If you browse through the forums you see the same names over and over pushing the MD agenda and dogging "AR noobs". The bottom line is that any grenade or rocket launcher type of weapon is and will always be the the real noob tube. They require very little accuracy and very little skill to use. PERIOD. The fact that certain players have formed their whole playstyle around these weapons and learned to be even more effective with them only compounds that issue. In those cases I have found that the AR is outmatched because it REQUIRES LINE OF SIGHT AND ACCURACY to get kills with. No dropsuit in the game can be killed just by slashing across it with random fire from an AR.

In my experience in attempting to counter excessive MD usage the only thing that is effective is another MD. I have skilled into the EX0-5 because that is the only effective counter against players who are spamming explosions as a "skilled tactic". Strangely enough, with my very limited skill using the weapon, I have been able to effectively kill and eliminate MD squatters many times with the spray and pray tactics you MD users accuse everyone else of.

But, what do I know. I only use ARs, SMGs, HMGs, Forge guns, SCRs, and sniper rifles on occasion. The only one that makes me feel like a douche is the MD or Flaylock. Guess I'm just a noob with no real skills and I'm jealous because I can't play at the elite level of explosion spamming. I'm so jealous...

Go ahead don't let it die. But if you succeed, Dust might very well be what dies.

Bro. i understand your concern. because you mostly likely played CoD and battle field (not calling you a noob), and in those games, yes splahs fro rockets and grenades are instant kills. grenade launchers as well.

however, in this game there is alot more involved. i'm not going to bore you with details unless you request them. but, think about the following 2 things:

• since patch almost no one uses MD, or any explosives other than locus grenades really (forguns dnt count)
• 80-90% of all kills in the killfeed are milita AR, std AR, GEK, and duvolle assault

if the AR is such a skilled weapon why is it that almost 90% or higher of the player bass is using them?

there are skilled things you can do with an AR getting a headshot, on an enemy 88m away is skill. but, most players dnt do that.

buffing MD ammo will encourage people to use them more, since ammo is a big issue with MD, and supply depot are rare on the new maps. Flaylocks need the extra .5m radius to compete with SMG now that hit detection makes SMG secondary ARs.


i never called you a noob. but, please, note: in PC battles no one uses anything other than ARs. . no one uses heavies in PC, no one uses shotguns, MDs are a joke in PC, no one uses anything other than ARs, the occasional proto assault scrambler.


also: "No dropsuit in the game can be killed just by slashing across it with random fire from an AR." this is called hipfire, and this gets tons of kills with AR. im pretty sure you may have had some of your suits killed by an enemy noob that sneaks up behind you and just wastes you with a milita AR (due to the low scanning profiles now). it happens to everyone but reveals a vital truth.

Mass Driver is fine.

Flaylock had it's blast radius nerfed - it doesn't need a buff when it was nerfed for balance in the first place.

I believe that most of the players of Dust DO NOT want to see more mass drivers being used. I am all for weapon diversity and more options. I completely welcome it and would love to see it. Just not grenade launchers or rocket launchers. I can even accept that ARs could use more recoil and possibly even less hip fire accuracy, but using them as the measuring stick to buff mass drivers or flaylocks would be very bad. Be careful what you wish for.

I'm not asking for a radius or damage buff for the MD. just an ammo increase. its a primary weapon.
the flaylock ONLY needs a radius increase of .5m to keep in line with SMGs, and scrambler pistols.


serious, the MD with direct impract and splash have less dps than a milita AR.

milita AR dps = 425 (467 with 10% buff)
MD dps= 200+/115 [direct impact/splash]

SMGs have much higher dps that flaylocks...

infact...lol. even nova knives have higher dps than flaylocks. IDK why everyone is scared of explosives...lolol
any suit in the game can by killed in 1 second or at max 3 seconds by a milita AR upto 66m away. but you scared of a MD?

Yes. My enemy would have to hold concentrated fire on me for 3 seconds to kill me, which is not going to be easy. I don't get killed very often at that kind of range by ARs (unless I get stupid and run out into the wide open). At that same distance, I have easily killed AR users with a mass driver with point and click ease. I didn't have to be accurate because I had plenty of rounds to splash them to death. The reason I skilled into mass drivers was because I was tired of being on the other side of that. I have held off entire squads before solo with a mass driver. The only thing that gave them any chance to move in and take me down was that I had to reload. I absolutely disagree with giving it more ammo to make it more powerful.

Yes. My enemy would have to hold concentrated fire on me for 3 seconds to kill me, which is not going to be easy. I don't get killed very often at that kind of range by ARs (unless I get stupid and run out into the wide open). At that same distance, I have easily killed AR users with a mass driver with point and click ease. I didn't have to be accurate because I had plenty of rounds to splash them to death.

The reason I skilled into mass drivers was because I was tired of being on the other side of that. I have held off entire squads before solo with a mass driver. The only thing that gave them any chance to move in and take me down was that I had to reload. I absolutely disagree with giving it more ammo to make it more powerful.

i know im going to get trolled...lol

MD: 50% increase in ammo, 0% increase in damage (after 1.4 patch)

flaylocks: .5m increase in blast radius for all variants.



EDIT: i changed the damage increase from 15% to 0%. the comment by breakin' stuff is logical. i must agree an increase to damage could have an adverse effect on non-armor users and unforseen consequences. I still stand firm by my belief that the MD needs more ammo. its a primary weapon. having such limited ammo isn't justified.

the MD hs plenty of draw backs:

.the possibility of suicide
.slow fire rate
.slow reload time
.trajectory calculations (if your not good at this you will die fast)
.elevation considerations
.weak against shields (so, flux grenades are nessesary for functionality as without them you will waste more limite ammo and die faster)


having limited ammo limits its use as an AD weapon, which is stupid.

Flaylock: Hate 'em but they could use either a direct damage buff or a splash range buff. Either is ok with me as they are now more of a skill weapon.

MD: It is a AoE weapon that has a high damage output per round and has splash damage. It's low ammo count is to keep it from being OP and that is barely working (I've never once ran into a MD user that had no ammo). If anything needs more ammo it's the dam Plasma Cannon (have you ever tried using one of those? It's UP even with it's OHK)
I have used the MD once to see the ammo situation and yea, speccing into Nano hives is a must OR always stay within range of a logi.

---

`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST.

I've noticed that the majority of MD users are Logi or Assault and if I'm correct I believe both classes usually keep a nanaohive on hand anyway. This make it less of an issue but I suppose if you insist on an ammo increase we can find a compromise.

How about give all versions an extra clip but reduce there resupply rate so that it is unwise to resupply while in the open. This also means that the user will have to spec into a higher quality hive or rely on an ally to give a decent amount of ammo.

IDK, but I always like to find the solution that works for everyone as apposed to just saying "NO, stupid" or "This guy's got it, everyone else is stupid".

---

`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST.

I exhaust my nano hives if I don't die during a round of 50 clone ambush. That's an issue.

But you're saying that while resolving that issue, that the MD nanohive resupply rate should be nerfed harder than the TWO rounds per cycle it's currently at? Should nanohives supply ONE round per cycle? What sort of compromise is that? And why is a compromise even needed? The MD is one of the lowest DPS weapons in the game, and the amount of damage carried in terms of ammo comes out to about 4860 damage, while the Duvolle AR carries 11220.

The solution to the MD's lack of battlefield longevity is to give it 6 extra rounds to start with, and there is no point to a compromise.

Yeah MDs only have 12 rounds and the first 6 in the clip (18 total) and the ammo skill only gives you 1 extra round

They definitely need more ammo.

But yeah here come the trolls & AR users saying that MDs need a nerf

[quote=D legendary hero][quote=nukel head]
Yes. My enemy would have to hold concentrated fire on me for 3 seconds to kill me, which is not going to be easy. I don't get killed very often at that kind of range by ARs (unless I get stupid and run out into the wide open). At that same distance, I have easily killed AR users with a mass driver with point and click ease. I didn't have to be accurate because I had plenty of rounds to splash them to death. The reason I skilled into mass drivers was because I was tired of being on the other side of that. I have held off entire squads before solo with a mass driver. The only thing that gave them any chance to move in and take me down was that I had to reload. I absolutely disagree with giving it more ammo to make it more powerful.

Yeah I don't know what your using (unless their dumb enough to get close to you) but MDs arc so long distance kills are hard to do (sometimes)