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D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 642	Posted - 2013.08.16 01:09:00 - [1] - Quote i know im going to get trolled...lol MD: 50% increase in ammo, 15% increase in damage (after 1.4 patch) flaylocks: .5m increase in blast radius for all variants.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 642	Posted - 2013.08.16 01:57:00 - [2] - Quote yeah, the flaylocks need ONLY the radius buff. Adding damage would be too much... OR the flaylocks could get a 25% increased in damage, with the radius small. its gotta be either high risk high reward, OR low risk low reward. can't be any combination because high risk low reward (current status ) is UP, and low risk high reward is OP. i'd take radius over damage anyday because hitting my target is more important than dealing tons of damage.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 642	Posted - 2013.08.16 01:57:00 - [3] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: D legendary hero wrote: i know im going to get trolled...lol MD: 50% increase in ammo, 15% increase in damage (after 1.4 patch) flaylocks: .5m increase in blast radius for all variants. I wouldnt mind the flaylock buff while the damage stays the same. The MDs are ok man. If you cant kill with an EXO-5 you are doing it wrong. And the ammo is their down side, carry nanohives. that buff for the MD is supposed to be after 1.4 when armor gets buffed, so that MD don't become obsolete.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 643	Posted - 2013.08.16 06:26:00 - [4] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: D legendary hero wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: D legendary hero wrote: i know im going to get trolled...lol MD: 50% increase in ammo, 15% increase in damage (after 1.4 patch) flaylocks: .5m increase in blast radius for all variants. I wouldnt mind the flaylock buff while the damage stays the same. The MDs are ok man. If you cant kill with an EXO-5 you are doing it wrong. And the ammo is their down side, carry nanohives. that buff for the MD is supposed to be after 1.4 when armor gets buffed, so that MD don't become obsolete. You know what will be obsolete? Scouts and commandos XD Aren't they already? I think instead of getting massive speed bonuses, etc, they should give scouts, 20% less EHP than a medium frame, 25% higher speed. and they should never show up on the mini map, except when firing, or by an active scanner with full skill points in it. A scout should never show up on the mini map.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 643	Posted - 2013.08.16 06:31:00 - [5] - Quote KING CHECKMATE wrote: If you think commandos are For AR , you should see what one can do with Scram rifle and Mas Driver. Or absolute Long Ranged dominance with sniper rifle + Swarm launchers. But thats The 2 Light weapons talking, not the Commando suit working. As it is ANY Med frame has more HP than them, and they are supposed to be heavies (And move like heavies)...so yeah... commando bass ehp 500 milita amar medium = ehp 450 WTF? who thought it was a great idea to give the commando 500 ehp?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 643	Posted - 2013.08.16 06:34:00 - [6] - Quote castba wrote: Why do I feel like this is a troll thread? its not, but i thought i would instantly get flamed for asking for a buff to the flaylock and MD
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 644	Posted - 2013.08.16 07:32:00 - [7] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: castba wrote: Why do I feel like this is a troll thread? its not, but i thought i would instantly get flamed for asking for a buff to the flaylock and MD why the ** do you want a buff to either - if youre good with the fleylock youll see its still ***** ridiculously powerful and that it should be outright removed MD is amazing where its at, borderline OP right on time. ladies and gents, "le troll" aka the ar noob. observe his brash and irrational comment, not supported by any facts.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 21:07:00 - [8] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: 8/10 Nice one. much better than usual. Unfortunately a 15% buff to MD damage results in about the same as the base buff to the armor, making the armor buff a net gain of Zero in the face of weapons that classically obliterate them. The mass driver will still obliterate armor tankers without a buff. And buffing the Mass Driver with no corresponding buff to shields will efficiently result in an unintended stealth nerf to caldari and minmatar dropsuits when there is already potentially a nerf to shields in the offing if the armor buffs are insufficient. This will truly make mass drivers Flavor of the Month as it will almost entirely eliminate the advantage shields have in a 20% resistance to explosive harm. Buffing the mass driver will result in a net loss to the game, not a net gain. the armor buffs will mean that it takes three mass driver shots to kill a gallente assault rather than two. This is hardly justification for a buff to the weapon, which is already massively efficient (some say TOO efficient) at obliterating armor tankers, especially heavies. your right. i believe your comments here are logical and quite accurate. i will edit the OP to reflect this comments reason. thank you. the idea. so, perhaps just more ammo. Having such a small amount of max ammo for a primary weapon is rediculous. However, as you have said, buffing damage will make the armor buff, pointless. i will adjust my OP accordingly.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 21:20:00 - [9] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: The MD doesn't need a buff especially when they are going to be used by everybody and their grandma after 1.4. If anything every weapon should get a damage buff not just the MD. Also the MD is performing way beyond were it is supposed to be with it doing 30% extra damage instead of 20% to armor and barely any fall off damage. its a grenade, grenades and rockets don't get fall off damage. projectiles do. think about it. if I thow a metal ball at a wall, over distance the air friction, its own rotation and gravity are all forces that work against the initial force that acted on it. so, the damage the metal ball will do to the wall at 10m will not be the same at 30m. however, if that metal ball has gunpowder and a fuse mechenism in it, the same pysics apply to the ball, but now their is still the potential energy of the explosive inside. this potential energy does not change. if I hit you with a grenade at 1m and it explodes, or throw it, it hits you and explodes at 30m will the explosion be less intense. No. so, why should explosives like MD, and flaylocks get fall off damage? also, too remember MD have a 5m lethal radius, and flaylocks have a 1m lethal radius. if this were taken literally (not suggesting it be this way) then that would be their OHK radius and out side that upto 3m would be deadly shrapnel from casing. Idk about you, but i dnt know any lethal weaponized explosives with a 1m blast radius...lol really the ARs need more fall off.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 21:48:00 - [10] - Quote shaman oga wrote: Why ask a buff on things that are fine? Flaylock is fine, you obviously don't use flaylocks. breach = useless, STD = uselss, ADV = what STD should be, proto = severly lacking pick a breach or std flaylock and see how many times it saves your life as a side arm....lol or a primary...lol Quote: if you can't kill with a MD as is now change game. its not that one can't kill with it. its that you can only get 3-4 kills out of it before you need a supply depot. with ARs you can take out way more people. lets say for instance you are playing a match with enemies that all have 500ehp. for a milita AR with no mods, thats 13 bullets to take that opponent down. in 1 clip of 48 you can take out 3 people with 8 bullets left over. since total ammo is 300, you have 6.25 total clips. if you can takeout 3 people in one clip, thats 23 people you can down.... now of course: 1. we all miss 2. not every opponent has less than 500ehp 3. hit detection 4. headshots happen 5. not all enemies are at our optimal range 6. sometimes enemies are already weakened so that 23 people is a theoretical number but in practice its anywhere between 7 (if you don't miss and hit only heavies with max 1580 ehp, in optimal range), and 18 (if you don't miss often and kill enemies with 500ehp or less, in optimal range.) MD without missing (has 6 clip, max 18. 3 clips; AMD has 8 clip 27 max ammo. 3 clips) is still lack luster at best. a standard MD does 115 damage splash (i won't include direct hit because you gotta be a noob for that) it takes 4 shots to kill someone with 500 ehp. without damage mods, etc. so, if TL;DR --milita AR ammo capacity allows for 7-18 kills total without supply depot --MD ammo capacity allows for 1.2 - 4.5 kills (5 kills if the enemy is weak) total without a supply depot. MD needs more ammo. Quote: I admit that AR have too much rounds per clip, they should have 45-48 rounds. indeed they do.

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 22:11:00 - [11] - Quote Interplanetary Insanitarium wrote: The HMG would need a buff to its range or we'd need a better medium-long range weapon than the FG. Otherwise heavies are going to have a hard time dealing with MD's. And the lack of ammo shouldn't concern an MD user because they could just use a hive if they were concerned about it. MD should get more ammo. i mean really, if the gun needs flux nades, and nano hives in order to work, then it is disfunctional. grenades and equipment are supplimental dropsuit additions. they shouldn't be nessesary, for effectivity. I want more range on my HMG too, but damage, i was at first very animate about increasing HMG damage. but, i didnt realize there is a reticule glitch wth the HMG and hit detection issues that make many shots miss. if the range were increased, the dispersion reduced, and the accuracy inceased the HMG would be a stronger gun. We do have indeed high DPS. the problem is that most rounds dn't make it to the target. fixing this will make using an HMG more effective. turn speed is being fixed in1.4. so the HMG will begin feelign more powerful if these were implemented.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 23:24:00 - [12] - Quote Smooth Assassin wrote: D legendary hero wrote: i know im going to get trolled...lol things. LAWL i cant wait for MD to go down i cant wait for ARs to get nerfed
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 23:26:00 - [13] - Quote Wombat in combat wrote: I have used the mass driver exclusively since Uprising. It does not need a buff, if anything it could use a 0.5m splash radius reduction. radius is fine. ammo needs buff. period. all light weapons (save av) should be capable of getting similar results specializing in one field or another. why should an AR get 7-18 kills without need of ammo, and a MD only get 1-4?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 23:33:00 - [14] - Quote Medical Crash wrote: A Flaylock Buff.. Oh lord.... ow lawdy lawwwd. Words cannot express the stupidity of even THINKING of such a thing after they JUST got nerfed not too long ago. No, let them DIE, they deserve NOTHING. remember the HMG nerf? 12 ***** damage per shot. it had a DPS of 400. this is before any weapon got the 10% buff. so a milita AR out gunned an HMG by 25 DPS, with zero draw backs. CCP saw the error and buff its damage per shot, and gave every weapon a 10% buff (except flaylocks and Scr rifles). Flaylocks are worse than SMGs and scrambler pistols at almost all ranges. it does very pitiful damage and now is almost a direct shot weapon. flaylocks never were OP, like the HMG was never OP. its time the flaylocks got buffed to make them useful. its not a damage boost, its a radius buff of .5m, HTFU if you want to make the flaylock a direct hit weapon, give it 10 rounds per clip and a fire rate of 444 like a scrambler pistol. think for a minute!! what is the point to having a gun with a 3 round clip that does poor damage, and needs a direct hit? its gotta be one or the other bub. either high risk-high reward, OR low risk-low reward right now your ARs are low risk-high reward. low risk-high reward = OP** right now flaylocks are high risk-low reward high risk-low reward = UP
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.16 23:35:00 - [15] - Quote Interplanetary Insanitarium wrote: D legendary hero wrote: Interplanetary Insanitarium wrote: The HMG would need a buff to its range or we'd need a better medium-long range weapon than the FG. Otherwise heavies are going to have a hard time dealing with MD's. And the lack of ammo shouldn't concern an MD user because they could just use a hive if they were concerned about it. MD should get more ammo. i mean really, if the gun needs flux nades, and nano hives in order to work, then it is disfunctional. grenades and equipment are supplimental dropsuit additions. they shouldn't be nessesary, for effectivity. I want more range on my HMG too, but damage, i was at first very animate about increasing HMG damage. but, i didnt realize there is a reticule glitch wth the HMG and hit detection issues that make many shots miss. if the range were increased, the dispersion reduced, and the accuracy inceased the HMG would be a stronger gun. We do have indeed high DPS. the problem is that most rounds dn't make it to the target. fixing this will make using an HMG more effective. turn speed is being fixed in1.4. so the HMG will begin feelign more powerful if these were implemented. [quote It doesn't NEED flux nades, that's just a useful strategy for people that can't get direct hits with the MD... which seems like everyone. And nano hives help everyone on your team out. i must beg to differ Quote: And you don't even really need to increase the damage on the HMG. An increase of about 10 m to all of the HMG's and a more tighter spread after firing for a little bit so it becomes a bullet hose instead of a wall of bullets but it still requires you to aim should make all heavies happy campers. ^^i said this. and i quote myself "I want more range on my HMG too, but damage, i was at first very animate about increasing HMG damage. but, i didnt realize there is a reticule glitch wth the HMG and hit detection issues that make many shots miss. if the range were increased, the dispersion reduced, and the accuracy inceased the HMG would be a stronger gun. We do have indeed high DPS. the problem is that most rounds dn't make it to the target. fixing this will make using an HMG more effective. turn speed is being fixed in1.4. so the HMG will begin feelign more powerful if these were implemented"
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.17 06:29:00 - [16] - Quote a nerf is supposed to negate the high strengths of a weapon by increasing its weaknesses effect on the usage. the flaylocks are completely useless right now. I mean really now. NO one uses them as primaries (a good thing sort of) or as secondaries (always bad). this is stupid, the radius needs to be buffed, damage is fine. but, when you need to direct impact a person with an area od effect weapon there is a serious issue.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.18 06:20:00 - [17] - Quote Wombat in combat wrote: D legendary hero wrote: ammo needs buff. period. ... why should an AR get 7-18 kills without need of ammo, and a MD only get 1-4? I kindly disagree. Your numbers are a bit off but I get your point. The reason for this disparity is because the mass driver is designed to have this drawback. The drawback of the AR compared to the MD is you can't be damaging many at once. One of the drawbacks of using the MD is it is mandatory to carry a good nanohive with it. If you are only killing 1-4 in ~20 mass driver rounds I think you might have other problems than lacking ammo capacity on the MD. if you look at the math. im talking about killing opponents with 500 ehp, and doing only splash damage with a std mass driver. 500/115 = about 4 shots. therefore 4 shots of splash damage = 1 kill. 18/4 = 4.5 so your average opponent that has 500 ehp in your average match, if you catch them with only splash (not including the massive decrease in damage it does to shields, which is the most common type of tanking right now), you will kill 4.5 people before you need more ammo. now if you are facing milita suits that are not tanked out, with about 350. 350/115 = 3 shots of splash damage = 1 kill. 18/3 = 6. so, with 18 shots you can get 6 kills. your maxium killing potential is 6. if you miss, your they are shield tanking that number goes down low. if you manage to flux some people, or MD weakened enemies the number increases but these are special conditions. which other weapons don't have. As the math above shows the MD is lacking in the ammo department. MD are primary weapons they should have sufficient ammo to take out the same number of targets as all other primary weapons. it is a weapon designed to KILL. in different ways, and different strengths but still designed to kill. I mean seriously it shouldn't take up the CP/PG it does if you arent carrying that much ammo. as i showed before 13 shots from a milita AR down your average suit. so, since 13 shots from an AR = 1 kill 300/13 = 23. Your milita AR has the potential to get 23 kills without reloading. of course their are other factores to consider. but the potential is high, and realistically the number is lower. however, if you kill weakened oppnents, or flux them the number can go higher.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 650	Posted - 2013.08.18 06:23:00 - [18] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: go be a ****** elsewhere you should gladly take your own advice troll.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 651	Posted - 2013.08.18 21:55:00 - [19] - Quote Thurak1 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: KING CHECKMATE wrote: If you think commandos are For AR , you should see what one can do with Scram rifle and Mas Driver. Or absolute Long Ranged dominance with sniper rifle + Swarm launchers. But thats The 2 Light weapons talking, not the Commando suit working. As it is ANY Med frame has more HP than them, and they are supposed to be heavies (And move like heavies)...so yeah... commando bass ehp 500 milita amar medium = ehp 450 WTF? who thought it was a great idea to give the commando 500 ehp? Best part is how many skill points are required just to get into commando. I think they made commando because they realized how bad they shafted heavies with movement penalties and turning penalties and then made the hmg a giant spray and prey weapon so they said ok lets give heavies somehing they can skill into so they can feel like they didnt waste all their sp's on heavy drop suits. Thats my take on why the commando dropsuit came about anyway. But the suite is crap it doesnt have great survivability and 2 main light weapons isnt THAT big of and advantage when you sacrifice both hi power and low power slots and dont have the pg / cpu to run jack. I am betting the militia amar med also has a faster speed than commando. it does havea faster running speed. it only has two high slots and 0 low slots. but you can stack 2 milita shield extenders on their or damage mods, (although to be honest damage mods are only useful at the higher teirs of enhanced and complex). but yeah 180 base shield, 180 base armor. 360 * 50% (shield and armor upgrade skills lvl5. they are 5% per level)) = 540 ehp 584 ehp with 2 milita shield extenders. so commando with no skills in armor and shield upgrades = 500 ehp militia amar suit with skills in shield and armor upgrades lvl5 = 540 ehp. WTF? commando with skills in armor and shield upgrades gets 750 ehp... but thats still worthless. and still slower than the amar milita medium frame. price for commando std - 9000 ISK price for miltia Amar frame - 610 ISK
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 651	Posted - 2013.08.18 22:06:00 - [20] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: 6 shots on a mass driver is more than enough to do the job. Before I played heavy in beta I ran logi/massdriver as squad support. Proper use of flux + mass driver is deadly to the tune of a two shot combo if you're cooking and aiming correctly. My record was four guys in a volley. I'd love to say it was skill, but no. they were being idiots, dry-humping each other practically skin-on-skin. Right now the mass driver plays like it did in chromo. by itself, it isn't great unless you're plinking gallente/amarr. combined with flux it's deadly. If you get spotted first you're dead. Unlike an overtanked fatty, you won't have time to turn around and shoot back. six shots keep the guns from being an infinite bombspam. Eight starts taking it to ridiculous mode. More than eight and there's no reason to use any other weapon. As it stands people who take the time to figure out the arcs and how to eyeball shots correctly are butchering people in pubs and PC. People who do not know how the Massdriver works are highly offended that people can be so accurate with an explosive arc weapon and want it to be useless. Right now I put the Mass Driver as comparable to the Assault rifle in the hands of comparably skilled users. Different role/use but comparable. A Duvolle kills me about as fast as a freedom mass driver, or a creodron breach shotgun. I run heavy and gallente medium. Against caldari and minmatar the mass driver is lackluster for the most part. The weapon is meant to shine against armor because minmatar native enemy is amarr and they armor tank. the weapon is designed to butcher amarran soldiers. it is working as intended and is a ***-ton better now that they do not have a 4-shot limit they had at the start of chromosome when I swapped to fatties. TL;DR Mass driver is a support weapon not a frontline killer weapon. MAss driver is what you use to soften up an area or finish off enemies, not as a main attack tool. i can honestly agree with most of what your saying here. but remeber. 1. i am asking to increase ammo capacity not clip size.these are 2 different things. 2. I must contest this one statement, although i can agree and confirm everything else. " As it stands people who take the time to figure out the arcs and how to eyeball shots correctly are butchering people in pubs and PC. People who do not know how the Massdriver works are highly offended that people can be so accurate with an explosive arc weapon and want it to be useless." I am not saying you agree with these sentiments. but this is the problem. why do people get upset at skill? when people are good with the MD it is deadly, why nerf it because people have skill? same for flaylocks. CCP wolfman himselff said that they nerfed flaylocks becasue people were complaining (he said community) and that "in *skilled hands* it became nearly as effective as a primary weapon". basically, CCP punishes skilled weapons. the TAC was clearly OP, hands down. bu the flaylocks never got anywhere near the amount of kills people claimed. they just didn't like that someone using a "skilled shot weapon" killed them. its difficult to use these weapons. AR is literally, point and shoot. it out guns most other weapons, and requires little skil because it has no disadvantages. clearly, it is OP. but no one want that to be nerfed. but anything that "in skiled hands"becomes effective" must be nerfed? GTFO. *also, the duvolle ting is a stretch a duvolle will kill a heavy faster than any other gun save other ARs. only a forgun kills a heavy faster, not counting the charge up time. even fluxed MD doesn't kills as fast as an AR. the numbers don't lie.

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 653	Posted - 2013.08.19 00:25:00 - [21] - Quote Cosgar wrote: MD doesn't need anything except for the Chromosome grenade physics and maybe the breach to have a better RoF, but that's negotiable. Flaylock could use some work though. I still use it, it's still good, but I'd rather see it have higher damage with a lower RoF and higher fitting costs. The nerf didn't really address what I felt were the biggest issues: availability and spam-ability. honestly the fittning specs are perfect. its a trick shot its not really good at being used as a primary like SMGs, it falls more on the Scr pistol side. and it fits in with lore because minmintar have low fitting items like that. it just needs a larger blast radius. increasing it by .5m per level will help compensate for the horrible hit detection and make it effective. perhaps the damage was too high... but giving me 3 shots of lo damage ammo and telling me that I have to get a direct hit with it is bull **** and everyone knows it.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 653	Posted - 2013.08.19 00:32:00 - [22] - Quote Cosgar wrote: FLAYLOCK Steve wrote: Three shots per clip isn't spam It is when it's easier to fit than the SP or SMG and you got into CQC situations where everyone would just unload the damn thing. but it still isn't spam because you have to reload regardless. if it works in CQC thats what its supposed to do. what your saying is basically. it fits on a suit, and someone might use it where they are supposed to. thats OP... thats like saying, Shotguns need more CPU/PG because someone might get in CQC and use them. that isn't spam thats using it as intended. actually, SMGs can be spammed better than any side arm. they do more DPS than my AHMG...lol (literally, 25 per shot @ 1000rpm, vs 13 per shot @ 2000 rpm) SP are kinda weak, but with head shots you can kill a heavy with 1580 ehp in 2-3 shots max. it has a 4x headshot multiplier. with suffiecent skill points in them you can wipe out most suits, especially with a breach scrambler pistol. those psitols still need a slight buff though.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 653	Posted - 2013.08.19 00:42:00 - [23] - Quote that because aim assist will make it hit people. the funny part is that i will dread 1.4 because aim assist wil make all the spray and pray AR noobs become deadshots with perfect accuracy upto 75m.... it'll be like TAC ARs all over again. we need MD to get 50% more ammo. with no arming distance flaylocks to get .5m extra blast radius per level* HMGs to get a tighter retecule cone, before the spooling is complete, and pinpoint accuracy when it is. Lazers to do more damage at a farther range to be useful again. SCr to have a Ascr variant at STD level ARs to do less dps i dnt understand why i can't get .5m, its just **** 1/2 a ***** meter!!!!!
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 655	Posted - 2013.08.19 06:26:00 - [24] - Quote after 1.4 the only usable weapon will be ARs because you can't beat an ar with aim assist...lol i tried to use the Scr rifles i really did. they work but arent effective. how so? 1. full auto ARs do almost their max damage at the range i can really use my scrambler rifle, 2.with the glitchy aiming and the faster than humany possible movement speed make hitting targets an arduous task with minimal rewards at best. 3. its an assist machine. 4. CQC is decent but the over heating combined with the fact that everything else has higher dps just nicks that in the bud 5. over heat damage will kill you, more than you think and is almost unpredictable. an Ascr variant at STD is nessesary to compete. this is a buff MD and flaylock thread. but i did want to point this out somewhere. idk why these flaylocks and MD cant get these buffs, or why Scr can't get buffed. thats why this^^ is related to the topic. because for some reason anything that isnt an AR must instantly be nerfed. CCP seriously, why did you put all these guns in the game if you are going to make them useless.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 655	Posted - 2013.08.19 06:28:00 - [25] - Quote but, this is exactly why CCP doesn't want to give respecs....lolol because they know if they gavfe everyone respecs everyone would just spec into ARs and caldari assault or logi suits. and that would be the entire game ruined.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 665	Posted - 2013.08.19 20:07:00 - [26] - Quote Yeeeuuuupppp wrote: I COMPLETELY disagree with the mass driver part. It should be left alone. I feel like flaylock Pistols Should Have The Blast Radius At 2m for the std, 3m for the adv, 3.5m for the proto. And The Splash Damage at 140hp for the std, 150hp for the adv, 155 for the proto. I know most people are going to ***** about how " Op" it will be if they do this but keep in mind, most people are mostly running Caldari Logi & Assault with 400+ shields. thats cool too. but i think having the current damage with a .5m increase in radius per level will make the weapon useable. giving the numbers you put would work too however.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 665	Posted - 2013.08.19 22:54:00 - [27] - Quote Charlotte O'Dell wrote: No. The MD is perfect. It can compete with the AR in CQC and in elevated positions over the AR. We need a hit detection fix so other weapons can get on our (and FG) level. Also need draw distance increase so snipers can hit at their max range. thats why this MD buff has nothing to do with a performance buff. its an ammo increase. Flaylocks still need the extra .5m radius buff. or even an extra meter! 1m radius is just too small to be effective and with such low damage output its ineefective as a side arm.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 678	Posted - 2013.08.22 17:29:00 - [28] - Quote bump flaylocks desperately need a buff to be working again. I'm tired of having level 5 skills in weapons that then get nerfed to oblivion. the HMG is worthless (except of course on milita suits... and still thats laughable) flaylocks were next. Flaylocks need to be buffed by .5m to 1m extra radius per level, MD need the ammo buff.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 678	Posted - 2013.08.22 17:47:00 - [29] - Quote TunRa wrote: Yeah buff the flaylock after the nerf so we can go back to flaylock 514... no, instead lets nerf everything even more so we can keep playing AR514 like we always have been. thats brilliant, lets make an AR have 60 rounds, be able to kill 7 heavies with 1600 ehp without needing a supply depot, kill poeople out to 75m with negligble damage fall off, and have Dps that is just high or higher than an HMGs damage ooohh wait... we all ready have that at the STD level... but flaylocks are OP? GTFO ar noobs
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 748	Posted - 2013.08.28 14:11:00 - [30] - Quote bumprific

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 750	Posted - 2013.08.28 14:33:00 - [31] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: Oh so necro'd hey man whats up?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 751	Posted - 2013.08.28 15:23:00 - [32] - Quote ChromeBreaker wrote: Saw a D legendary thread n thought id better take a look lol ... Nothing really new... skilling into DS's, as ive come into some isk lol 0.5m blast increase isnt going to make much of a differance to anyone who can shoot straight... And the mass driver thing is just mad, but everyone in this thread seems to have picked up on that so not really bothered by that either... the extra .5m does make a difference. If someone sucks with a flaylock it won't work. but, trust me anyone who is good with this thing, knows that that extra radius makes the difference between life and death. even oyu must admit nerfing damage and radius is a horrible idea. how is giving the mass drive more ammo mad? you can get on average 14-17 kills with a milita AR if you are good.* but with a MD using only splash at best you can get 5 kills.* *against suits with 450-500 ehp. not including the use of flux grenades
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 751	Posted - 2013.08.28 15:24:00 - [33] - Quote Fire of Prometheus wrote: Mass drivers don't need more ammo, this is what makes them balanced. If they get more ammo than they will definitely be OP. As for flaylocks, I haven't used them enough to become knowledgable on the subject. what makes them balanced is the low RoF, low damage to shields and the Arc it follows.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 787	Posted - 2013.08.30 20:44:00 - [34] - Quote bump
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 789	Posted - 2013.08.31 01:16:00 - [35] - Quote how would an Ammo increase be OP? how would a .5 meter radius increase by OP? you can't answer it because it isnt OP. you know what is OP? the fact that A GEK can kill a max skill heavy in 2.5 seconds. yep, thats 1591 ehp gone in 2.5 seconds. not even an Assault forgun has the dps a GEK does. but MD is OP? GTFO
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 794	Posted - 2013.08.31 08:09:00 - [36] - Quote Burntface man112 wrote: If this ever happens i will play something else, my corporation fell apart because 60 members quit the game because of flaylockers in 1.2 through 1.3. in a months span; 60 players left Dust 514 and when i contacted them again to play the game after is patch, they refused. Most saying its splash damage game without precision so they went back to battlefield 3. The infantry weapons are fine now, and flaylock is suppose to be a sidearm which means its use is in last stand situations or set ups. well then battlefeild and its 1 shot kills everything at any range can have them... my corporation fell apart after TAC ARs killed tanks. After chromosome this game lost too many people. When HMGs, lazers, MD got nerfed, this game lost 25% of its players total players. then, when TAC ARs ruled this game lost 50% of its players. there are only a couple of thousand people world wide playing dust now. their were 10,000+ in chromosome. now, there is about 5,000 - 6,000 players. why? because people like the 60 in your corp, want to turn this game into battle field and cod, were 2-3 shots kill and your can spray and pray and dnt actually have to work for your kills. where is the precision in ARs if you are going to use them like bullet hoses close range? flaylocks only killed people in close range like most explosives work! snipers never complained because they stayed in their range. HMGs, MD, lazers and all other weapons that weren't AR or SMG were nerfed. the only usable weapon against ARs in CQB were flaylocks and now they are nerfed. people like you ruined this game. and the best part? is that you are all running back to CoD and battlefield after ruining this game, you aren't even going to stick around.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 794	Posted - 2013.08.31 13:50:00 - [37] - Quote demonkiller 12 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: demonkiller 12 wrote: D legendary hero wrote: castba wrote: Why do I feel like this is a troll thread? its not, but i thought i would instantly get flamed for asking for a buff to the flaylock and MD why the ** do you want a buff to either - if youre good with the fleylock youll see its still ***** ridiculously powerful and that it should be outright removed MD is amazing where its at, borderline OP right on time. ladies and gents, "le troll" aka the ar noob. observe his brash and irrational comment, not supported by any facts. ~~by the fact that the flaylock can stil OHK and the fact that mass driver is only good in certain situations~~ flaylocks never could OHK bro. * If I use my rpimary to get your shields and armor low, and then switch to a secondary to finish you off in CQC thats not a OHK. flaylock was a CQC weapon and a skilled shot weapon. by nerfing the damage and radius, its become subpar to the AR in CQC and its supposed to be better than the AR in CQC. the AR is not a CQB weapon so, why does it beat CQC weapons in CQC? people complained that this game would become a splash damage game, instead of a skilled shot game but all those people were the ones uning bullet hose spray and pray ARs, and SMGs.... not a single one used breach ARs or TAC ARs. this game has turned into a chip damage spray and pray battle of whos got the better AR and dropsuit. any signs of efficacy outside of caldri dropsuits with ARs is considered OP. (unless we are talking about milita and STD scout suits. but for those same suits a militia AR can kill in 5 shots, and a GEK in 3 shots. remember, flaylocks direct damage was 200+, a militia AR does 467 dps so a scout suit with 200 ehp dies in .6 seconds to a milita AR without damage mods, proficiency or getting headshots*)
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.01 22:31:00 - [38] - Quote this is what happens when I try to use flaylocks after the nerf...lol
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 799	Posted - 2013.09.02 18:16:00 - [39] - Quote Spec Ops Cipher wrote: Flaylocks are fine atm. I use them on almost all my fits, easy to kill with, needs a nerf if nothing else. But atm its the mass driver in the spotlight, and rightly so. Hopefully it gets fixed soon. ok... flaylocks need extra radius damage is fine. MD are perfectly fine. and actually need a buff in ammo ARs are over powered because they out dps forguns, do the most damage of any handheld weapon up to 75m. lets face the facts ARs are OP. they need a nerf.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 897	Posted - 2013.09.09 19:16:00 - [40] - Quote lets make it happen

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1018	Posted - 2013.09.13 17:17:00 - [41] - Quote So, its ok for the AR to remain OP, but nothing else can be buffed? whats it going to be? everyone says "don't nerf ARs, buff everything else" now im proposing a balanced buff and its a problem? no! its one or the other, either nerf the AR or buff other guns. starting with flaylocks and MD. then scr, shotguns, HMGs,
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1022	Posted - 2013.09.14 05:40:00 - [42] - Quote the flaylocks need either a buff in damage and splah damage, keeping the current radius... OR an increase per level by .5 meters in splash radius.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1036	Posted - 2013.09.15 08:21:00 - [43] - Quote D legendary hero wrote: the flaylocks need either a buff in damage and splah damage, keeping the current radius... OR an increase per level by .5 meters in splash radius. not letting it die
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 04:17:00 - [44] - Quote there is still hope. till 1.5
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 16:27:00 - [45] - Quote Valerie Viever wrote: MD should be left be. Flaylock pistol I agree with 100 percent. Now that hit detection has been fixed, you need that blast radius to compete with the smg. 1+ signed
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 16:51:00 - [46] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: The flaylock should never have got a radius nerf IMO, only the damage should have been nerfed exactly. CCP should just buff this in a hotfix, or in 1.5 because its not used by anyone anymore. for the past 3 weeks the only people that have used it were myself and a friend. for hours of matches over the course of 3 weeks.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 19:24:00 - [47] - Quote nukel head wrote: D legendary hero wrote: D legendary hero wrote: the flaylocks need either a buff in damage and splah damage, keeping the current radius... OR an increase per level by .5 meters in splash radius. not letting it die No one has thought for a second that you would let it die. If you browse through the forums you see the same names over and over pushing the MD agenda and dogging "AR noobs". The bottom line is that any grenade or rocket launcher type of weapon is and will always be the the real noob tube. They require very little accuracy and very little skill to use. PERIOD. The fact that certain players have formed their whole playstyle around these weapons and learned to be even more effective with them only compounds that issue. In those cases I have found that the AR is outmatched because it REQUIRES LINE OF SIGHT AND ACCURACY to get kills with. No dropsuit in the game can be killed just by slashing across it with random fire from an AR. In my experience in attempting to counter excessive MD usage the only thing that is effective is another MD. I have skilled into the EX0-5 because that is the only effective counter against players who are spamming explosions as a "skilled tactic". Strangely enough, with my very limited skill using the weapon, I have been able to effectively kill and eliminate MD squatters many times with the spray and pray tactics you MD users accuse everyone else of. But, what do I know. I only use ARs, SMGs, HMGs, Forge guns, SCRs, and sniper rifles on occasion. The only one that makes me feel like a douche is the MD or Flaylock. Guess I'm just a noob with no real skills and I'm jealous because I can't play at the elite level of explosion spamming. I'm so jealous... Go ahead don't let it die. But if you succeed, Dust might very well be what dies. Bro. i understand your concern. because you mostly likely played CoD and battle field (not calling you a noob), and in those games, yes splahs fro rockets and grenades are instant kills. grenade launchers as well. however, in this game there is alot more involved. i'm not going to bore you with details unless you request them. but, think about the following 2 things: since patch almost no one uses MD, or any explosives other than locus grenades really (forguns dnt count) 80-90% of all kills in the killfeed are milita AR, std AR, GEK, and duvolle assault if the AR is such a skilled weapon why is it that almost 90% or higher of the player bass is using them? there are skilled things you can do with an AR getting a headshot, on an enemy 88m away is skill. but, most players dnt do that. buffing MD ammo will encourage people to use them more, since ammo is a big issue with MD, and supply depot are rare on the new maps. Flaylocks need the extra .5m radius to compete with SMG now that hit detection makes SMG secondary ARs.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 20:18:00 - [48] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Mass Driver is fine. Flaylock had it's blast radius nerfed - it doesn't need a buff when it was nerfed for balance in the first place. they nerfed every aspect of the gun and absolutely no one uses it anymore. the problem was the fire rate, and they nerfed instead everything else. it wasn't nerfed for balance. It was nerfed because noobs like you don't know how to play to the ARs actual strangths which are: the ability to engage CQC weapons at mid range the ability to engage longrange weapons in CQC most people charged flaylockers in close range with ARs and expected to win.... then got pwnd and wanted it nerfed.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1042	Posted - 2013.09.16 20:23:00 - [49] - Quote nukel head wrote: I believe that most of the players of Dust DO NOT want to see more mass drivers being used. I am all for weapon diversity and more options. I completely welcome it and would love to see it. Just not grenade launchers or rocket launchers. I can even accept that ARs could use more recoil and possibly even less hip fire accuracy, but using them as the measuring stick to buff mass drivers or flaylocks would be very bad. Be careful what you wish for. I'm not asking for a radius or damage buff for the MD. just an ammo increase. its a primary weapon. the flaylock ONLY needs a radius increase of .5m to keep in line with SMGs, and scrambler pistols. serious, the MD with direct impract and splash have less dps than a milita AR. milita AR dps = 425 (467 with 10% buff) MD dps= 200+/115 [direct impact/splash] SMGs have much higher dps that flaylocks... infact...lol. even nova knives have higher dps than flaylocks. IDK why everyone is scared of explosives...lolol any suit in the game can by killed in 1 second or at max 3 seconds by a milita AR upto 66m away. but you scared of a MD?
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1044	Posted - 2013.09.18 05:11:00 - [50] - Quote good bump

D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1053	Posted - 2013.09.18 20:20:00 - [51] - Quote me too...
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1057	Posted - 2013.09.19 03:14:00 - [52] - Quote flaylock blast radius needs that .5 meter radius buff. the 1/2 meter buff will make a significant difference for pros but ppl who spam won't notice the difference.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1061	Posted - 2013.09.20 07:08:00 - [53] - Quote nukel head wrote: D legendary hero wrote: nukel head wrote: I believe that most of the players of Dust DO NOT want to see more mass drivers being used. I am all for weapon diversity and more options. I completely welcome it and would love to see it. Just not grenade launchers or rocket launchers. I can even accept that ARs could use more recoil and possibly even less hip fire accuracy, but using them as the measuring stick to buff mass drivers or flaylocks would be very bad. Be careful what you wish for. I'm not asking for a radius or damage buff for the MD. just an ammo increase. its a primary weapon. the flaylock ONLY needs a radius increase of .5m to keep in line with SMGs, and scrambler pistols. serious, the MD with direct impract and splash have less dps than a milita AR. milita AR dps = 425 (467 with 10% buff) MD dps= 200+/115 [direct impact/splash] SMGs have much higher dps that flaylocks... infact...lol. even nova knives have higher dps than flaylocks. IDK why everyone is scared of explosives...lolol any suit in the game can by killed in 1 second or at max 3 seconds by a milita AR upto 66m away. but you scared of a MD? Yes. My enemy would have to hold concentrated fire on me for 3 seconds to kill me, which is not going to be easy. I don't get killed very often at that kind of range by ARs (unless I get stupid and run out into the wide open). At that same distance, I have easily killed AR users with a mass driver with point and click ease. I didn't have to be accurate because I had plenty of rounds to splash them to death. Had to have taken you about 5-6 shots. 4 best. which is 4-6 seconds. MD dps = damage per round because it fires 1 round every second. No matter how you put it ARs are better than MD. In fact increased distance from the MD user makes it easier to take them out with a MD. Quote: The reason I skilled into mass drivers was because I was tired of being on the other side of that. I have held off entire squads before solo with a mass driver. The only thing that gave them any chance to move in and take me down was that I had to reload. I absolutely disagree with giving it more ammo to make it more powerful. If you held off entire squads using the MD. You probably weren't facing people using ARs. But, if this (which i beleive you didnt actually do) is true that still doesn't make the MD OP. It is an 'area denial" weapon. so, if you supressed a squads advance then you only accomplished what its designed to do. But if any of them were shield tanking and rushed you with ARs you would have been dead in less than 2 seconds
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1088	Posted - 2013.09.20 23:55:00 - [54] - Quote lets do this
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1095	Posted - 2013.09.21 19:20:00 - [55] - Quote ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote: D legendary hero wrote: i know im going to get trolled...lol MD: 50% increase in ammo, 0% increase in damage (after 1.4 patch) flaylocks: .5m increase in blast radius for all variants. EDIT: i changed the damage increase from 15% to 0%. the comment by breakin' stuff is logical. i must agree an increase to damage could have an adverse effect on non-armor users and unforseen consequences. I still stand firm by my belief that the MD needs more ammo. its a primary weapon. having such limited ammo isn't justified. the MD hs plenty of draw backs: .the possibility of suicide .slow fire rate .slow reload time .trajectory calculations (if your not good at this you will die fast) .elevation considerations .weak against shields (so, flux grenades are nessesary for functionality as without them you will waste more limite ammo and die faster) having limited ammo limits its use as an AD weapon, which is stupid. Flaylock: Hate 'em but they could use either a direct damage buff or a splash range buff. Either is ok with me as they are now more of a skill weapon. MD: It is a AoE weapon that has a high damage output per round and has splash damage. It's low ammo count is to keep it from being OP and that is barely working (I've never once ran into a MD user that had no ammo). If anything needs more ammo it's the dam Plasma Cannon (have you ever tried using one of those? It's UP even with it's OHK) I have used the MD once to see the ammo situation and yea, speccing into Nano hives is a must OR always stay within range of a logi. `Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. thank you, the voice of reason... its music to my ears. the flaylocks need either (NOT BOTH): a damage increase (direct AND splash) OR a radius increase (by .5 meters). the MD needs more ammo, simly beacuse as you stated you need nano hives. Primary weapons are supposed to be self contained, namely they function properly without the aid of any other item. the equipment is meant to enhance what you already have not be a nessesary compotent to its functioning. Suppression weapons are designed to by AoE or Spray with tons of Ammo so they can suppress. im not suggesting giving the MD 50 extra rounds, but a 25% increase in ammo capacity (rounded up to the nearest round) wouldn't hurt.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.23 18:15:00 - [56] - Quote KA24DERT wrote: ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote: I've noticed that the majority of MD users are Logi or Assault and if I'm correct I believe both classes usually keep a nanaohive on hand anyway. This make it less of an issue but I suppose if you insist on an ammo increase we can find a compromise. How about give all versions an extra clip but reduce there resupply rate so that it is unwise to resupply while in the open. This also means that the user will have to spec into a higher quality hive or rely on an ally to give a decent amount of ammo. IDK, but I always like to find the solution that works for everyone as apposed to just saying "NO, stupid" or "This guy's got it, everyone else is stupid". `Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. I exhaust my nano hives if I don't die during a round of 50 clone ambush. That's an issue. But you're saying that while resolving that issue, that the MD nanohive resupply rate should be nerfed harder than the TWO rounds per cycle it's currently at? Should nanohives supply ONE round per cycle? What sort of compromise is that? And why is a compromise even needed? The MD is one of the lowest DPS weapons in the game, and the amount of damage carried in terms of ammo comes out to about 4860 damage, while the Duvolle AR carries 11220. The solution to the MD's lack of battlefield longevity is to give it 6 extra rounds to start with, and there is no point to a compromise. You do have a point. I think its also important to note that the MD has on of the slowest fire rates among single fire weapons as well. so, giving it extra ammo won't make it OP. now i still want the extra .5m radious for those flaylocks because they are kinda pathetic right now. I find it appalling tat CCP would give ARs AA but nerf flaylocks radius. MD and flaylocks dnt get AA. the flaylocks need this buff to stay competitive.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.23 20:04:00 - [57] - Quote Atiim wrote: Yeah MDs only have 12 rounds and the first 6 in the clip (18 total) and the ammo skill only gives you 1 extra round They definitely need more ammo. But yeah here come the trolls & AR users saying that MDs need a nerf precisely that is pathetic for a primary. forguns get less ammo but they have greater effect in their use vs vehicles and infantry. MD are weaker vs vehicles and weaker vs infantry so proportionally they should get more ammunition. and again 1m blast radius at 100 damage? is pathetic, you almost have to get a direct hit with the flaylock for it to work, and its not designed for direct hits. its designed to be a splash weapon. thats why it requires more SP than any other side-arm. if it were meant to be direct hit then it should be a hit scan like the scrambler and have the same ammo and properties... weapons with low ammo in the clip normally have either extreme range (no side arm should have that), or splash all weapons that are not hit scan weapons in this game have splash. forguns have 2m splash, MD have great splash, porportionally flaylocks need slightly more splash radius to be useful. a .5m radius increase is nessesary.
D legendary hero THE WARRIORS OF LEGEND 1101	Posted - 2013.09.24 00:00:00 - [58] - Quote Atiim wrote: nukel head wrote: Yes. My enemy would have to hold concentrated fire on me for 3 seconds to kill me, which is not going to be easy. I don't get killed very often at that kind of range by ARs (unless I get stupid and run out into the wide open). At that same distance, I have easily killed AR users with a mass driver with point and click ease. I didn't have to be accurate because I had plenty of rounds to splash them to death. The reason I skilled into mass drivers was because I was tired of being on the other side of that. I have held off entire squads before solo with a mass driver. The only thing that gave them any chance to move in and take me down was that I had to reload. I absolutely disagree with giving it more ammo to make it more powerful. Yeah I don't know what your using (unless their dumb enough to get close to you) but MDs arc so long distance kills are hard to do (sometimes) which increases the TTK

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