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Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1228
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:26:00 -
[1] - Quote
Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore? |
CLONE117
Planetary Response Organization Test Friends Please Ignore
114
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:27:00 -
[2] - Quote
um no.. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1228
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
I expected some negative responses to this as it's a pretty controversial but it'd be more productive for everyone if you could explain your objection at least a little. |
Forlorn Destrier
Bullet Cluster
1378
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:39:00 -
[4] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:I expected some negative responses to this as it's a pretty controversial but it'd be more productive for everyone if you could explain your objection at least a little.
This negates skill points that people spend time investing to boost shields. It is also game breaking, and should never exist. |
Arkena Wyrnspire
Turalyon 514
2486
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:42:00 -
[5] - Quote
That would immediately break shield tanking. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1228
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:54:00 -
[6] - Quote
It would certainly circumvent shield tanking but that's why it would have some pretty serious drawbacks, so not many people would use it and shield tanking would still be viable. Imagine something like an AR but with half the dps. |
Cross Atu
Conspiratus Immortalis Covert Intervention
1458
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:56:00 -
[7] - Quote
Options that can completely negate a game mechanic as broad as a type of tanking are going to wreak havoc on game balance. Much like explosive weapons do now, which it is worth noting are going to be changed so they have less of this effect. Leaving aside explosives the nearest thing we have is the Flux which cannot kill. So we can dismiss the flux since presumably this weapon would be created to actually kill a target and now we're comparing the new weapon to the Scram, LR et al. At which point the question must be asked "how do we add this new type of weapon without diminishing the roles of weapons which are already present" another way to look at this would be"what unique game play aspect could such a weapon bring"?
Simply ignoring shields isn't enough to be unique in that it is essentially a highly buffed version of weapons already present in the game. Then there's the balance issue in general, think of how potent even the STD LR would be if it applied all of its damage directly to armor completely ignoring shields. Against some fits that version of the STD LR would then be outputting more effective dps than many proto weapons, I trust the problem with that is clear.
I commend you for thinking outside the box to come up with new ideas, and I encourage you to continue, it is just that this specific idea is likely not the best addition to the game.
0.02 ISK Cross |
Doyle Reese
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
375
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:58:00 -
[8] - Quote
you know, watching the trailer for Dust (the one with the prices on everything) I saw a weapon- probably an AR- doing damage to both shields and armor at the same time, not saying that's how it should be done, but was interesting |
Ulysses Knapse
Bojo's School of the Trades
488
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Posted - 2013.08.13 16:59:00 -
[9] - Quote
Once you make a weapon that ignores shields, it gives armor tankers an impossible to balance advantage. There's no alternative. A weapon that ignores shields but not armor is far more overpowered than a weapon that ignores armor but not shields. There's no way to balance it. At all.
If you give it too many drawbacks, it won't be useful at all. If you don't give it enough drawbacks, it will rip apart shield tankers as if they were nothing. The worst part is that the two overlap. It's either useless or overpowered, or it's useless and overpowered. It just can't work. |
low genius
the sound of freedom Renegade Alliance
285
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:01:00 -
[10] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore?
|
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Jason Pearson
Seraphim Auxiliaries
2490
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
King of the Forums // Seraphim <3 Comment and like this thread about PvE, Here! Also, check out the Indirect Fire ability, Here! |
shaman oga
Nexus Balusa Horizon DARKSTAR ARMY
409
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:04:00 -
[12] - Quote
Give this power to the mass driver. All the armor tankers will laugh at the caldari and make them feel bad. |
Lillica Deathdealer
Mango and Friends
103
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:08:00 -
[13] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:It would certainly circumvent shield tanking but that's why it would have some pretty serious drawbacks, so not many people would use it and shield tanking would still be viable. Imagine something like an AR but with half the dps. Two things. 1st, half the dps of an AR is still beastly. AR has more dps than large blaster on a tank. 2nd, to begin the trolling, how about a weapon that ignores armour and immediately kills people after getting through shields? Because thats pretty much what you're saying to the shield tanked people out there. |
Forlorn Destrier
Bullet Cluster
1379
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:14:00 -
[14] - Quote
Cross Atu wrote:Options that can completely negate a game mechanic as broad as a type of tanking are going to wreak havoc on game balance. Much like explosive weapons do now, which it is worth noting are going to be changed so they have less of this effect. Leaving aside explosives the nearest thing we have is the Flux which cannot kill. So we can dismiss the flux since presumably this weapon would be created to actually kill a target and now we're comparing the new weapon to the Scram, LR et al. At which point the question must be asked "how do we add this new type of weapon without diminishing the roles of weapons which are already present" another way to look at this would be"what unique game play aspect could such a weapon bring"?
Simply ignoring shields isn't enough to be unique in that it is essentially a highly buffed version of weapons already present in the game. Then there's the balance issue in general, think of how potent even the STD LR would be if it applied all of its damage directly to armor completely ignoring shields. Against some fits that version of the STD LR would then be outputting more effective dps than many proto weapons, I trust the problem with that is clear.
I commend you for thinking outside the box to come up with new ideas, and I encourage you to continue, it is just that this specific idea is likely not the best addition to the game.
0.02 ISK Cross
Well said. |
Sinboto Simmons
SVER True Blood
983
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:15:00 -
[15] - Quote
as a minny scout with 74 armor i respectfuly oppose this idea |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1230
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:20:00 -
[16] - Quote
Lillica Deathdealer wrote:Django Quik wrote:It would certainly circumvent shield tanking but that's why it would have some pretty serious drawbacks, so not many people would use it and shield tanking would still be viable. Imagine something like an AR but with half the dps. Two things. 1st, half the dps of an AR is still beastly. AR has more dps than large blaster on a tank. 2nd, to begin the trolling, how about a weapon that ignores armour and immediately kills people after getting through shields? Because thats pretty much what you're saying to the shield tanked people out there. No need to troll - as Cross Atu noted, I'm just thinking out of the box and spitballing here. It's crazy thinking that produces some of the best things in life and games.
How about 1/4 the DPS of an AR? Or instead of completely ignoring shields, the amount of shields reduces the damage done - i.e. with 500hp shields the weapon does 1dps but with 100hp shields it does 20dps. (randomly chosen values)
This is called brainstorming and is a hell of a lot more interesting than bickering about CPMs or respecs or LAVs. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1230
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:21:00 -
[17] - Quote
Sinboto Simmons wrote:as a minny scout with 74 armor i respectfuly oppose this idea Lol, yeah, that would be killer but what about if the weapon was really tough to aim and track with? |
ALPHA DECRIPTER
M.E.R.C. Conventional Forces D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
270
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:45:00 -
[18] - Quote
This idea just makes me think "Amarr Knives" but hey, if you guys wanna stick with automatic weapons for this idea then go for it. I'll keep watching this thread as I'm curious to know if anyone will find a good balance for this. Here's hope as the idea itself, I kinda like.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST. |
Tiffany NE Shephard
Opus Arcana Covert Intervention
2
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Posted - 2013.08.13 17:56:00 -
[19] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore?
Clear shields with Flux grenades. Then you can get your kills on armor. Happy Trails |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1230
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Posted - 2013.08.13 18:40:00 -
[20] - Quote
Tiffany NE Shephard wrote:Django Quik wrote:Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore? Clear shields with Flux grenades. Then you can get your kills on armor. Happy Trails This is entirely irrelevant to this discussion. Where's that -1 button? |
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Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1231
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Posted - 2013.08.13 18:42:00 -
[21] - Quote
ALPHA DECRIPTER wrote:This idea just makes me think "Amarr Knives" but hey, if you guys wanna stick with automatic weapons for this idea then go for it. I'll keep watching this thread as I'm curious to know if anyone will find a good balance for this. Here's hope as the idea itself, I kinda like.
`Sigh. Just another fun game of DUST . Hmm, interesting point - why would a knife or any melee weapon be affected by shields? Maybe there could be certain types of nova knives that negate shields? |
Tiffany NE Shephard
Opus Arcana Covert Intervention
5
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Posted - 2013.08.13 19:20:00 -
[22] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Tiffany NE Shephard wrote:Django Quik wrote:Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore? Clear shields with Flux grenades. Then you can get your kills on armor. Happy Trails This is entirely irrelevant to this discussion. Where's that -1 button?
It's completely relevant - I see you wanting to be lazy and use shield penetrating weapon that deals strictly armor damage to kill. You should ask CCP to remove shields instead. |
Spademan
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
231
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Posted - 2013.08.13 19:23:00 -
[23] - Quote
Django Quik wrote:Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore?
I just thought of a way to incorporate in using lore. Maybe. Probably not. But lets have at it. To my understanding, Amarr can utilise wormhole technology, correct? So what if the shots fired travelled through a wormhole at the end of the gun, with the opening of it being just inside the shield of the target, thereby negating the shield. Very stupid but hey, I tried. |
Doshneil Antaro
Dem Durrty Boyz
109
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Posted - 2013.08.13 20:02:00 -
[24] - Quote
Overall, I'd say that this idea is bad, but on the right track to balance shield vs armor weaponry. Their needs to be a MD that decimates shields and still be able to damage armor. Basically just flip the stats on the damage/bonus. Also Flaylock the same. Then change flux to be opposite of the locus and be able to kill as well. |
General Erick
Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION
57
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Posted - 2013.08.13 20:05:00 -
[25] - Quote
Just no |
Talos Alomar
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
1405
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Posted - 2013.08.13 21:40:00 -
[26] - Quote
i'll plus one this, but it seems we're outnumbered.
I'd like to see a crossbow or dart gun of some sort that fired a flechette that pierced shields, low DPS all around but coupled with a headshot it's the perfect weapon for silent/stealthy approaches.
Dealing a percent of damage through shields could also be the bonus of a certain ammo type too. |
Alena Ventrallis
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
63
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Posted - 2013.08.13 21:51:00 -
[27] - Quote
I propose a knife with low damage that ignores shields. This requires you to be up close, It wont wreck armor tankers, and it still has the unique functionality. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1232
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Posted - 2013.08.13 22:13:00 -
[28] - Quote
Finally getting some actual discussion on this rather than just people unproductively trying to shut down idea threads. I particularly like the thought of a crossbow type weapon - the rate of fire would be abysmal but if you use it right, you can still make a decent attack. Imagine a scout being able to be a proper silent assassin. |
Django Quik
Dust2Dust. Top Men.
1233
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Posted - 2013.08.13 22:32:00 -
[29] - Quote
Tiffany NE Shephard wrote:Django Quik wrote:Tiffany NE Shephard wrote:Django Quik wrote:Maybe there could be some sort of weapon that penetrates shields and only affects armor. i.e. shields would be left totally intact but armor would be damaged.
It would obviously have to have serious drawbacks like very very low DPS or very difficult to use.
What are your opinions on this idea? What sort of form do you think such a weapon could take? How could the mechanics be explained using reasonable New Eden lore? Clear shields with Flux grenades. Then you can get your kills on armor. Happy Trails This is entirely irrelevant to this discussion. Where's that -1 button? It's completely relevant - I see you wanting to be lazy and use shield penetrating weapon that deals strictly armor damage to kill. You should ask CCP to remove shields instead. No. What you've said is a method to deal with shields so you can then attack the armor. That is not what this thread is discussing. This thread is not asking to remove shields from the game; it's talking about a new special weapon type and whether it could fit into this game in any form. There have actually been some good ideas come out of it that could potentially work. |
NOAMIzzzzz
BIG BAD W0LVES Eternal Syndicate
12
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Posted - 2013.08.13 22:35:00 -
[30] - Quote
-1 |
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