DUST Search - Yay, I just thought of another disadvantage of armor

Cat Merc wrote:

Aythadis Smith wrote:

( I am noting that I am an armor user)

Most armor suits have this tiny sliver of shield and then a nice beefy center.

Shield users have this nice pool of shield, and tiny armor.

Looking on average, shield users have 4/3 while we run 3/4

Say shield user doesnt put armor on that right side, what can he put? SPEED, HACKING, things to make his shields come back even faster. So he can pop in and out as he pleases ( or as his shields please)

Armor. Our Left side has pretty much damage mods. We are slow, we can be repped but... Lets see. We are talking repping a shield guy ( guessing about 100 armor) as for me, I'm looking at 400+ armor. So the shield guy has a gun taken off the field for a few seconds, while he who is repping me, could take an easy 30 seconds. Half the time, yes, I do dual, but we are only talking about 150 odd shield.

So...another disadvantage to armor. Longer time in removing a gun off the field for repairs.

It is sad to say but...10 to 1, shield has a definitive advantage. Only thing you can do at this point is fire at range.

All the useful mods minus damage mods are in low slots, are you blind?
And speed mods are as effective as damage mods, don't disregard them so quickly.
https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752
There, he is a full list minus the insta gibbing of why armor sucks.

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Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3389	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:21:00 - [1] - Quote Well, when I thought I covered pretty much everything, I thought of another one. Armor is extremely sensitive to explosions, that we know. But what do explosions do? They insta kill you. That means you can't get revived. Anti shield weaponry doesn't do that, and they have 30% resistance to explosives. So not only are they better alone, they are also better with a logi, because the logi is more likely to be able to pick them up. Yay. /whine off
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 1386	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:26:00 - [2] - Quote Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me
Nalhe Saldana Forsaken Immortals Top Men. 41	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:27:00 - [3] - Quote Good point, how about no deaths make you un-revivable but if you get hit again after you should stay dead. Something like a 0.3s invulnerability in between is also a good idea.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3390	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:29:00 - [4] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me I'm using both, doesn't mean I'm not extremely sensitive to those grenades as a Gallente. Just to put it into prespective, Core locus grenades do 930~ armor damage.
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5331	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:37:00 - [5] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me.
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 835	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:39:00 - [6] - Quote http://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/news.control/64862/1/damageprofiles.jpg
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 1386	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:39:00 - [7] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me. Go ahead and use shields alone, the most widely used weapon and one that people love to ***** and moan about has a bonus against it
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3391	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:39:00 - [8] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me. Can you explain? Are you talking about armor being allowed to be used alone or shields allowed to be used alone?
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 5332	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:41:00 - [9] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me. Go ahead and use shields alone, the most widely used weapon and one that people love to ***** and moan about has a bonus against it A small bonus, you mean. The AR doesn't insta gib shields like most anti armor weapons insta gib armor.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3391	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:42:00 - [10] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me. Go ahead and use shields alone, the most widely used weapon and one that people love to *** and moan about has a bonus against it One guy on the forums whines about it. Also, the AR has a 10% bonus, hardly amazing. If it had 35%, like explosives do to armor, if it insta killed you, if you had no base regeneration and had to ues module slots to restore your health slowly which means that in the end you get less eHP, if you were slow as **, and if the AR had splash damage, then we would be talking.

Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3391	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:44:00 - [11] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: http://web.ccpgamescdn.com/dust/news.control/64862/1/damageprofiles.jpg That's innaccurate and it has been proven to be false. Go ahead, go test it yourself, all explosives do 135% damage to armor. In addition to that they have splash damage, and we're the slowest, making it harder for us to evade.
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 1386	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:51:00 - [12] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me. Go ahead and use shields alone, the most widely used weapon and one that people love to ***** and moan about has a bonus against it A small bonus, you mean. The AR doesn't insta gib shields like most anti armor weapons insta gib armor. Tell me what instagibs armor, grenades that still eat through shields despite the damage reduction and will kill you either way, flaylocks maybe but those are just broken all around and kill shield opponents just as well, the SMG Ill give to you though since it eats armor like paper while bouncing off shields Seriously anyone stacking only one form of protection be it shields or armor is an idiot since they both fall quickly, shields do get a slight advantage since they recharge without having to fit any extra modules but thats it
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3391	Posted - 2013.07.20 20:55:00 - [13] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: DUST Fiend wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Why some people insist on using one style of defense and not hybridizing is beyond me Why one style of defense is allowed to be used alone while the other requires you to go hybrid is beyond me. Go ahead and use shields alone, the most widely used weapon and one that people love to ***** and moan about has a bonus against it A small bonus, you mean. The AR doesn't insta gib shields like most anti armor weapons insta gib armor. Tell me what instagibs armor, grenades that still eat through shields despite the damage reduction and will kill you either way, flaylocks maybe but those are just broken all around and kill shield opponents just as well, the SMG Ill give to you though since it eats armor like paper while bouncing off shields Seriously anyone stacking only one form of protection be it shields or armor is an idiot since they both fall quickly, shields do get a slight advantage since they recharge without having to fit any extra modules but thats it Hahahaha! You joking right? How can you even compare? Core locus grenades do 430 damage to shields and 930 damage to armor. Yeah, totally eat through shields! Also, AR's do 10% to shields, all explosives do 35% to armor, can't even begin to compare.
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 1387	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:01:00 - [14] - Quote Ive taken more damage than that on a shield stacked suit before I started running a dual set up, can you link to some proof to your claim?
First Prophet Jaguar Empire 676	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:05:00 - [15] - Quote Fully charged Scrambler rifle also instakills me. That's anti shield. But I'm scout so few things don't insta kill me. :\
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3391	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:05:00 - [16] - Quote Delta 749 wrote: Ive taken more damage than that on a shield stacked suit before I started running a dual set up, can you link to some proof to your claim? Test it. I did a field test with my friend. Core locus grenades do 70% damage to shield and 135% damage to armor.
Delta 749 Kestrel Reconnaissance 1387	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:06:00 - [17] - Quote First Prophet wrote: Fully charged Scrambler rifle also instakills me. That's anti shield. But I'm scout so few things don't insta kill me. :\ Pretty sure I could hit a scout with a pillow and he would instantly vaporize
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3391	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:09:00 - [18] - Quote First Prophet wrote: Fully charged Scrambler rifle also instakills me. That's anti shield. But I'm scout so few things don't insta kill me. :\ By insta kill means you can't get revived. Scram rifle doesn't do that. Also, you're a scout, Gallente scouts die to scrambler rifles just as easily.
First Prophet Jaguar Empire 676	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:13:00 - [19] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: First Prophet wrote: Fully charged Scrambler rifle also instakills me. That's anti shield. But I'm scout so few things don't insta kill me. :\ By insta kill means you can't get revived. Scram rifle doesn't do that. It has instakilled me though.
Aythadis Smith The Generals EoN. 77	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:24:00 - [20] - Quote ( I am noting that I am an armor user) Most armor suits have this tiny sliver of shield and then a nice beefy center. Shield users have this nice pool of shield, and tiny armor. Looking on average, shield users have 4/3 while we run 3/4 Say shield user doesnt put armor on that right side, what can he put? SPEED, HACKING, things to make his shields come back even faster. So he can pop in and out as he pleases ( or as his shields please) Armor. Our Left side has pretty much damage mods. We are slow, we can be repped but... Lets see. We are talking repping a shield guy ( guessing about 100 armor) as for me, I'm looking at 400+ armor. So the shield guy has a gun taken off the field for a few seconds, while he who is repping me, could take an easy 30 seconds. Half the time, yes, I do dual, but we are only talking about 150 odd shield. So...another disadvantage to armor. Longer time in removing a gun off the field for repairs. It is sad to say but...10 to 1, shield has a definitive advantage. Only thing you can do at this point is fire at range.

Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3393	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:25:00 - [21] - Quote First Prophet wrote: Cat Merc wrote: First Prophet wrote: Fully charged Scrambler rifle also instakills me. That's anti shield. But I'm scout so few things don't insta kill me. :\ By insta kill means you can't get revived. Scram rifle doesn't do that. It has instakilled me though. Insta killing is a bit finicky, I had that happen with an AR. But for the most part, explosives ALWAYS insta kill you, no exception.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3393	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:29:00 - [22] - Quote Aythadis Smith wrote: ( I am noting that I am an armor user) Most armor suits have this tiny sliver of shield and then a nice beefy center. Shield users have this nice pool of shield, and tiny armor. Looking on average, shield users have 4/3 while we run 3/4 Say shield user doesnt put armor on that right side, what can he put? SPEED, HACKING, things to make his shields come back even faster. So he can pop in and out as he pleases ( or as his shields please) Armor. Our Left side has pretty much damage mods. We are slow, we can be repped but... Lets see. We are talking repping a shield guy ( guessing about 100 armor) as for me, I'm looking at 400+ armor. So the shield guy has a gun taken off the field for a few seconds, while he who is repping me, could take an easy 30 seconds. Half the time, yes, I do dual, but we are only talking about 150 odd shield. So...another disadvantage to armor. Longer time in removing a gun off the field for repairs. It is sad to say but...10 to 1, shield has a definitive advantage. Only thing you can do at this point is fire at range. All the useful mods minus damage mods are in low slots, are you blind? And speed mods are as effective as damage mods, don't disregard them so quickly. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752 There, he is a full list minus the insta gibbing of why armor sucks.
First Prophet Jaguar Empire 676	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:33:00 - [23] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: First Prophet wrote: Cat Merc wrote: First Prophet wrote: Fully charged Scrambler rifle also instakills me. That's anti shield. But I'm scout so few things don't insta kill me. :\ By insta kill means you can't get revived. Scram rifle doesn't do that. It has instakilled me though. Insta killing is a bit finicky, I had that happen with an AR. But for the most part, explosives ALWAYS insta kill you, no exception. Charged SR shots are pretty consistently instakill to me. :\
STEALTH HUNTER ZERO D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 10	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:34:00 - [24] - Quote I understand shields do have alot of advantages but if you have 3 high slots I'm sure you can shield tank some as well... I run Caldari assault but I also armor tank most of my fits as heavily as I can since don't plan on being fluxxed to death like a noob.
Cat Merc BetaMax. CRONOS. 3395	Posted - 2013.07.20 21:41:00 - [25] - Quote STEALTH HUNTER ZERO wrote: I understand shields do have alot of advantages but if you have 3 high slots I'm sure you can shield tank some as well... I run Caldari assault but I also armor tank most of my fits as heavily as I can since don't plan on being fluxxed to death like a noob. Even with a complex shield extender I still only have 214 shield HP, which is not enough to stop a core locus grenade from insta killing me before I can blink. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752
Aythadis Smith The Generals EoN. 78	Posted - 2013.07.20 22:14:00 - [26] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Aythadis Smith wrote: ( I am noting that I am an armor user) Most armor suits have this tiny sliver of shield and then a nice beefy center. Shield users have this nice pool of shield, and tiny armor. Looking on average, shield users have 4/3 while we run 3/4 Say shield user doesnt put armor on that right side, what can he put? SPEED, HACKING, things to make his shields come back even faster. So he can pop in and out as he pleases ( or as his shields please) Armor. Our Left side has pretty much damage mods. We are slow, we can be repped but... Lets see. We are talking repping a shield guy ( guessing about 100 armor) as for me, I'm looking at 400+ armor. So the shield guy has a gun taken off the field for a few seconds, while he who is repping me, could take an easy 30 seconds. Half the time, yes, I do dual, but we are only talking about 150 odd shield. So...another disadvantage to armor. Longer time in removing a gun off the field for repairs. It is sad to say but...10 to 1, shield has a definitive advantage. Only thing you can do at this point is fire at range. All the useful mods minus damage mods are in low slots, are you blind? And speed mods are as effective as damage mods, don't disregard them so quickly. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752 There, he is a full list minus the insta gibbing of why armor sucks. That's what I meant. Shield uses, lows lots ( meant right not left). Typo really. Shield guys gets all this right side dependent crap. Total typo. User error, really.
Aythadis Smith The Generals EoN. 78	Posted - 2013.07.20 22:31:00 - [27] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: STEALTH HUNTER ZERO wrote: I understand shields do have alot of advantages but if you have 3 high slots I'm sure you can shield tank some as well... I run Caldari assault but I also armor tank most of my fits as heavily as I can since don't plan on being fluxxed to death like a noob. Even with a complex shield extender I still only have 214 shield HP, which is not enough to stop a core locus grenade from insta killing me before I can blink. https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=87752 That contact nades take me out before I can even blink
Provolonee Undefined Risk DARKSTAR ARMY 98	Posted - 2013.07.20 22:43:00 - [28] - Quote Shields on a galente suit > armor on a galente suit. I'm pretty sure that's how it's designed, shields are for defense. armor is for exploding, and walking slower. There is only 2 ways It can go. Fix armor, or bring back the old viziam with a dmg increase to it. That way atleast everybody dies at the same speed to there counter.
Aythadis Smith The Generals EoN. 78	Posted - 2013.07.20 22:57:00 - [29] - Quote Provolonee wrote: Shields on a galente suit > armor on a galente suit. I'm pretty sure that's how it's designed, shields are for defense. armor is for exploding, and walking slower. There is only 2 ways It can go. Fix armor, or bring back the old viziam with a dmg increase to it. That way atleast everybody dies at the same speed to there counter. So ....in a way, a SCOUT will have more shield then this suit. So...shield tank a GAL. So 3 slots for shields.For go armor. Something doesnt smell right here. I wonder, are they tuning one suit at a time? At this rate, at least I don't scout 100% of the time. Since that is the suit least used.
Kane Fyea DUST University Ivy League 1362	Posted - 2013.07.20 23:07:00 - [30] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Delta 749 wrote: Ive taken more damage than that on a shield stacked suit before I started running a dual set up, can you link to some proof to your claim? Test it. I did a field test with my friend. Core locus grenades do 70% damage to shield and 135% damage to armor. All explosives do 30% efficiency against armor not 35%. Core locus damage is 600 A 30% increase would be 780 damage A 35% increase would be 810 damage Against shields it would be 420 (-30%) Or if your right about the efficiency (Which I'm pretty damn sure your not) it would be 390 damage. Either way I don't know where your getting 930 damage against armor.



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