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Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
57
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Posted - 2013.06.05 23:50:00 -
[1] - Quote
Before people start saying that first CCP needs to focus on the core mechanics of an FPS and then add cool stuff.
I get it. I am not asking for it now. But I do want immersion sooner rather than later.
And what type of immersion? BF3 type of immersion. Now before the Dust fanboys attack by saying "Go bck 2 BF3 u noob, hurr durr" let me explain:
In BF3 every time you play you feel like you are in a war. Why? Because the game's mechanics immerses you into the game. Excellent sound quality, pretty graphics (not asking for another graphical update just saying) and infantry screaming everywhere makes it feel like you are in the heat of battle.
Dust 514 is bland in all those areas... at least not in the sound one because we have all heard background shots at sometime in battle in Dust 514. The problem with tgat sound effect is that it only happens in very close areas or to be more specific when you are inside the 3 Outposts CCP has currently for the game. While me and my friend love that sound effect it is sadening that it appears barely in all matches. Though I don't doubt that CCP is currently working around the sound effect part of the game and added those background noises to test how they work. Well CCP those background sound effects are beautifu.
On the graphics side we all can't complain much since CCP will update the graphics like every year or with every expansion.
Now. I like to call the battles on Dust 514 the "silent" battles. Why? Because even when under fire, every merc just stands there mute looking at you dead in the eye. It would be nice if in the future we could start to hear infantry men screaming on agony and begging for ammo or repairs. Now I know we are clones. We die, we re-awake in a fresh, cloned body ready for war. But this doesn't necessarily means we can't feel pain and the pain of getting blown up. Kinda creepy if you think about it. We will never "truly" die but we will always experience pain, death and morbid ways of dying to then wake up and repeat the same for the rest of eternity.
Now back to the point. Things that the mercs would be able to shout while in combat: -My shields are down! -My armour is torned up! (or) I need repears over here! -Sh*t! Friendly down! Bring a medic (or in Dust's case) Bring in the logistics trooper! -*screams of death* -*screams of getting shot at* -[place grenade name here] take cover! (or) Sh*t! [place grenade name here]
Now controlled command shouts. If you were (or always) a squad leader you would know that the only way to issue squad commands is by pressing R2 and holding while you tap R3 to go to the squad command wheel. Currently there are 8 slots in the squad command wheel but 4 are taken. What if CCP could use those other 4 slots for controlled command shouts like for example: Slot1: Ask for ammo: "I need a nanohive over here!" (or) "I need ammo!" (adding both will be great :3) Slot2: Ask for repairs: *points towards a logi* "I need repairs!" Slot3: I need a pickup: "I need a pick up!" (we all hate to waste precious ammo shooting at someones vehicle just to let them know we eant to ride with them) Slot4: Asking for help: "I need cover fire!" Slot5: Attack order: "Listen up squad. Let's attack that objective/tank/infantry/LAV/dropship" Slot6: Defend order: "Let's defend that objective/infantry/VEHICLES XD Slot7: Capture order: "Squad let's capture this [place object name here] Slot8: Rally order: Everyone rally up at this location!"
Of course squad commands shoukd be only hear-able to swuad members only but the first four should be hear-able for all in the field.
Of course as you see there is more work to he done on the sound department. I can gladly wait a yearband a half for this. But the current state of immersion in battles is rather bland. While fun at some parts, especially when an intence fire fight happens, imagine how even intence-er they would be if you would hear dying growls and screams :D |
Rachoi
HavoK Core RISE of LEGION
87
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Posted - 2013.06.05 23:54:00 -
[2] - Quote
.... this is one of the most cohesive things i've seen on it, i wish i could give you plus 10 for it, very well put.
i do hope this stuff comes down the line. we may be clones, but we still have vocal cords |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
57
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Posted - 2013.06.06 00:04:00 -
[3] - Quote
Rachoi wrote:.... this is one of the most cohesive things i've seen on it, i wish i could give you plus 10 for it, very well put.
i do hope this stuff comes down the line. we may be clones, but we still have vocal cords
Gee thanks :D This took me alot if time to put together adding the fact that I used a mobile device to crate this thread |
KOBLAKA1
Opus Arcana Orion Empire
32
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Posted - 2013.06.06 00:36:00 -
[4] - Quote
Immersion like this please |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
60
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Posted - 2013.06.06 00:41:00 -
[5] - Quote
KOBLAKA1 wrote:Immersion like this please
Like what? |
Mithridates VI
IMPSwarm Negative-Feedback
1956
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Posted - 2013.06.06 00:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
Voice chat is free now. IMO, any option-restricted system of communication is redundant given that.
Any additional voices added in would interfere with voice chat which is essential to team play. |
Samuel Zelik
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
0
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Posted - 2013.06.06 00:45:00 -
[7] - Quote
Utilizing squad command spaces sounds like a good idea; the four you added would make communication much easier for those without mics or in separate squads, especially in public matches. Having people spam the requests would be annoying, but that comes with the feature (unless there was a limit on how often you could request assistance). I can't say I agree with adding shouts in combat though. Having units the game constantly, even occasionally, screaming or shouting in combat while I'm trying to listen and talk to my squad would be annoying. I would have no problem if the feature was added as long as it is a separate option that I have the ability to turn on/off. |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
60
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 00:49:00 -
[8] - Quote
Samuel Zelik wrote:Utilizing squad command spaces sounds like a good idea; the four you added would make communication much easier for those without mics or in separate squads, especially in public matches. Having people spam the requests would be annoying, but that comes with the feature (unless there was a limit on how often you could request assistance). I can't say I agree with adding shouts in combat though. Having units the game constantly, even occasionally, screaming or shouting in combat while I'm trying to listen and talk to my squad would be annoying. I would have no problem if the feature was added as long as it is a separate option that I have the ability to turn on/off.
What you pointed out would be annoying to people that use headsets and not mics. But then again BF3 has screams and shouts of death and aid during every battle and they don't seem to get in the way of player performance. It all comes down if CCP wants to make the voices either really higin volume or low. |
Crash Monster
Snipers Anonymous
501
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 00:56:00 -
[9] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:What you pointed out would be annoying to people that use headsets and not mics. But then again BF3 has screams and shouts of death and aid during every battle and they don't seem to get in the way of player performance. It all comes down if CCP wants to make the voices either really higin volume or low.
It might take longer than it should but I imagine the volume control for this aspect of the game could be added as well. |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
60
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 00:57:00 -
[10] - Quote
Crash Monster wrote:Buwaro Draemon wrote:What you pointed out would be annoying to people that use headsets and not mics. But then again BF3 has screams and shouts of death and aid during every battle and they don't seem to get in the way of player performance. It all comes down if CCP wants to make the voices either really higin volume or low. It might take longer than it should but I imagine the volume control for this aspect of the game could be added as well.
Actually a good idea |
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Samuel Zelik
D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E
0
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Posted - 2013.06.06 00:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:What you pointed out would be annoying to people that use headsets and not mics. But then again BF3 has screams and shouts of death and aid during every battle and they don't seem to get in the way of player performance. It all comes down if CCP wants to make the voices either really higin volume or low.
Yup, sorry; headsets was what I meant. I'm not saying it would necessarily interfere with performance, but I don't see the need of having those sound effects be mandatory when we've played without them. I can understand the option to have them, but it's not like missing them breaks the game or anything. I think the option should be there to at least not have them if a person doesn't want them. |
iceyburnz
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
606
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 01:14:00 -
[12] - Quote
A more, eh, realistic?, soundscape would help with immersion.
The voice macros were great in planetside.
Sounds isn't the only issue. Right now we have a fancy lobby system, its arbitary and cheap and not very mmo like.
That being said there are bigger fish to fry. Such as completing the core game, which isn't done yet, even in release.
And by core game I mean, basic weapons and vehicles for all races.
I'm not sure why its not done.
I'm not sure why they only have concept art for some of the suits.
And what looks like very rough scetches for some of the vehicles.
It worked for eve I guess, they took ages to release battleships. |
Obodiah Garro
Tech Guard General Tso's Alliance
55
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 01:27:00 -
[13] - Quote
+1
I like the idea of more sounds, weapon sound effects are kinda terrible, there is no atmospheric sounds either I would love to air wind rustling around me after I drop out a DS onto a high tower. Would be great to hear grunts/sfx from our clones as well.
Now that ive read this post and thought about it, there really is no immersion in Dust atm at all. The last great FPS I played was Bad Company 2 on PC and it was pretty near perfect a FPS can be, you actually felt you were in the war zone with the degrees of sfx/gfx smoke and flying debree and blood and everything. **** got crazy. In dust the best you can hope for is some nice fire effects after a vehicle blows up and some hurrays over coms. |
Meeko Fent
Mercenary incorperated
28
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Posted - 2013.06.06 01:46:00 -
[14] - Quote
Oh Behjezuz. People Talking? What a revolutionary Idea! Thank God for People who Break New walls for this Game to Expand.
Maybe Just Cut the Cussing, because this a Console Game, and we all know of the Annoying 12-year Olds who go "Oooohhh, You said a bad word!" Amazing That an Idea Like this Got the Deserved attention! |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
65
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 02:13:00 -
[15] - Quote
Meeko Fent wrote:Oh Behjezuz. People Talking? What a revolutionary Idea! Thank God for People who Break New walls for this Game to Expand.
Maybe Just Cut the Cussing, because this a Console Game, and we all know of the Annoying 12-year Olds who go "Oooohhh, You said a bad word!" Amazing That an Idea Like this Got the Deserved attention!
The Only Disagreement I have with you Besides what I stated Prior, Being about the Sound Design. Its a little difficult to get a good sound for something that Exists only in a Fictional World. That Might Lengthen the time it takes for now Weapons Sounds.
AHHHH, MY FAIC! MY SHIELDS ARE DOWN, GUGUGURAGGA HERK, BLEAH!
Yes, I would Scream That as My Face is melted by the Sun.
Yes I can imagine creating sound effects for things that don't exist is really hard. But I like the sounds as they are right now. Al CCP needs to dois polish them. |
Meeko Fent
Mercenary incorperated
29
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 02:19:00 -
[16] - Quote
Buwaro Draemon wrote:Meeko Fent wrote:Oh Behjezuz. People Talking? What a revolutionary Idea! Thank God for People who Break New walls for this Game to Expand.
Maybe Just Cut the Cussing, because this a Console Game, and we all know of the Annoying 12-year Olds who go "Oooohhh, You said a bad word!" Amazing That an Idea Like this Got the Deserved attention!
The Only Disagreement I have with you Besides what I stated Prior, Being about the Sound Design. Its a little difficult to get a good sound for something that Exists only in a Fictional World. That Might Lengthen the time it takes for now Weapons Sounds.
AHHHH, MY FAIC! MY SHIELDS ARE DOWN, GUGUGURAGGA HERK, BLEAH!
Yes, I would Scream That as My Face is melted by the Sun. Yes I can imagine creating sound effects for things that don't exist is really hard. But I like the sounds as they are right now. Al CCP needs to dois polish them. I'm Not Saying DONT YOU NEVER DO THIS CCP!
Just Pointing that out as to why the sounds are wimpy. Should have been fixed already. People were Complaining about this since who knows how long... Only Closed Beta Testers know the Horrors... |
Solaire Randash
One-Armed Bandits Unclaimed.
24
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 02:58:00 -
[17] - Quote
+1
Im all for immersion |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
68
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 06:44:00 -
[18] - Quote
[/quote] I'm Not Saying DONT YOU NEVER DO THIS CCP!
Just Pointing that out as to why the sounds are wimpy. Should have been fixed already. People were Complaining about this since who knows how long... Only Closed Beta Testers know the Horrors...[/quote]
If by wimpy you mean sound delays and sounds that sound wrong then yes. CCP should work on that first. |
Operative 1171 Aajli
PSU GHOST SYNDICATE DARKSTAR ARMY
21
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 06:49:00 -
[19] - Quote
Lol, immersion.
If you want realistic battlefield immersion then all you would hear is ringing in your ears and maybe a faint large explosion due to real rifle and artillery noises blasting out your eardrums. In a dropsuit you would probably only hear the comms. Why would you need to hear screams and other minor sounds in a dropsuit. I'd much rather have system alert sounds from your dropsuit reporting activity like Jarvis from ironman. |
Doyle Reese
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
81
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 07:10:00 -
[20] - Quote
It's a great plan in theory, but in practice you are just going to have the Wilheim scream everywhere |
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Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
68
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 07:21:00 -
[21] - Quote
Doyle Reese wrote:It's a great plan in theory, but in practice you are just going to have the Wilheim scream everywhere
That would be f*ucking hilarious! XD |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
68
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 07:26:00 -
[22] - Quote
Operative 1171 Aajli wrote:Lol, immersion.
If you want realistic battlefield immersion then all you would hear is ringing in your ears and maybe a faint large explosion due to real rifle and artillery noises blasting out your eardrums. In a dropsuit you would probably only hear the comms. Why would you need to hear screams and other minor sounds in a dropsuit. I'd much rather have system alert sounds from your dropsuit reporting activity like Jarvis from ironman.
True. Very true. BUT I never asked for a realistic immersion. I asked for a BETTER immersion.
And your last sentence made actually a little sense on why the battlefields of Dust are so quiet. But then again you would still be able to hear the sounds of your teammates shooting and them screaming. Oh wait, we already have that one. (not meant to sound sarcastic)
When I play BF3 (about once or twice every month) I feel adrenaline rush do to the immersion it has. In Dust the only time I get adrenaline rush is when a heavy is chasing me throughout the game... Especially if he has Nova Knifes. It's like a fat ninja.
DEADLIEST. SOLDIER. EVER! |
ladwar
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
583
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 08:21:00 -
[23] - Quote
Mithridates VI wrote:Voice chat is free now. IMO, any option-restricted system of communication is redundant given that.
Any additional voices added in would interfere with voice chat which is essential to team play. just went though 5 matches, complete silence(yea I got bored and went forge sniping in the last match). immersion isn't there and the supply depot is the worse one that parts. breaks any immersion. |
RoundEy3
Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation
29
|
Posted - 2013.06.06 14:28:00 -
[24] - Quote
Great topic.
I thought about putting the discussion of sound effects and environmental sound improvements in the new player experience thread.
Yes, the sounds need much revision. The sounds put you even further in the game, they are one of you senses meshing you with the game environment. Firstly approach sounds from what you know about the factors your merc and the planets. Everything should have kind of a compressed or buffered sound to it. Hearing things through your suit and within the planets' atmospheres. The sound of debris blowing and brushing up agianst you, the crunching and foot patter as you run over different surfaces. Weapon sounds should be deeply looked into. Not jsut for the shooter but from the target's end too. Not even the AR shoots standard bullets, these weapons should sound foreign, impressive, and lethal. The sound of a laser burning air molecules as a beam sweeps around you, the scorching, burning and piercing sounds of different objects and surfaces around you being shot.
Various explosions should sound extreme. I mean we have weapons that are tearing through advanced metal and shields, it should be a horrific clash of matter with a sound to match.
There should be soo many more audio layers that would make the feeling of playing this game intense.
Another idea that I think would be kind of cool would be to apply in game voice over effects to your voice comm. Like a few predifined effects so when you talk you sound kind of robotic or digital, or like your voice is being filtered through your suits comm system. |
RoundEy3
Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation
33
|
Posted - 2013.06.07 13:18:00 -
[25] - Quote
Deserved bump
Please put "making this game sound better" somewhere on the to do list. With the attention the Suns and Moons thread is getting it seems relevant to look into this aspect as well. Sounds combined with visuals are great ingredients for any fps. |
Cyrius Li-Moody
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
137
|
Posted - 2013.06.07 13:30:00 -
[26] - Quote
I love this idea so much. |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
71
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 01:28:00 -
[27] - Quote
RoundEy3 wrote:Great topic.
I thought about putting the discussion of sound effects and environmental sound improvements in the new player experience thread.
Yes, the sounds need much revision. The sounds put you even further in the game, they are one of you senses meshing you with the game environment. Firstly approach sounds from what you know about the factors your merc and the planets. Everything should have kind of a compressed or buffered sound to it. Hearing things through your suit and within the planets' atmospheres. The sound of debris blowing and brushing up agianst you, the crunching and foot patter as you run over different surfaces. Weapon sounds should be deeply looked into. Not jsut for the shooter but from the target's end too. Not even the AR shoots standard bullets, these weapons should sound foreign, impressive, and lethal. The sound of a laser burning airborn molecules as a beam sweeps around you, the scorching, burning and piercing sounds of different objects and surfaces around you being shot.
Various explosions should sound extreme. I mean we have weapons that are tearing through advanced metal and shields, it should be a horrific clash of matter with a sound to match.
There should be soo many more audio layers that would make the feeling of playing this game intense.
Another idea that I think would be kind of cool would be to apply in game voice over effects to your voice comm. Like a few predifined effects so when you talk you sound kind of robotic or digital, or like your voice is being filtered through your suits comm system.
This sounds pretty good. I like it. 1+ for you |
Buwaro Draemon
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
71
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 01:29:00 -
[28] - Quote
RoundEy3 wrote:Deserved bump
Please put "making this game sound better" somewhere on the to do list. With the attention the Suns and Moons thread is getting it seems relevant to look into this aspect as well. Sounds combined with visuals are great ingredients for any fps.
I did said that graphics will forever be updated. But a sounds immerse you more than graphics. |
Jathniel
G I A N T EoN.
446
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 01:57:00 -
[29] - Quote
lol I love immersion. +1
One could argue that all those shouts in BF3 are brought on by fear and anxiety from being on a battlefield. People, generally don't like pain, but they don't FEAR it. Pain is a self-preservation mechanism... likely genetically-modded OUT of clone bodies. Likewise, fear is a self-preservation mechanism. Fear of what? Fear of Death. When you are Immortal, you don't fear dying, much the same like you don't fear dying if you're playing a game of Mario Bros.
So how can we introduce shouts and screams for an immersive experience, while also recognizing these facts?
Instead of making the clone soldiers scream in fear and agony, give them anger and hatred instead. They should more or less scream in child-like frustration, throw violent tantrums, and go into fits spewing profanity as they spew blood... They should laugh as well. Laugh maniacally and insultingly if they kill or get killed. Like this: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vgUI5OMI1pk
BF3 has reactions from normal soldiers. They are people. Mortal. They are normal...
...immortal soldiers are NOT.
A clone army is an unstoppable demonic army filled with crazy people that delight in violence because it's a toy to them now. When two clone armies meet in combat, they don't kill each other. They simply mindlessly engage in violence and annihilate each other's matter over and over and over again, until every natural and available resource is consumed. The carnage is far worse for a clone soldier. A normal soldier from BF3 would lose his mind, and inevitably his life, on a Dust battlefield... |
Avallo Kantor
DUST University Ivy League
16
|
Posted - 2013.06.08 02:38:00 -
[30] - Quote
I was under the impression that our suits were atmospherically sealed, to the degree that we could fight in airless environments. In that case, our suits are soundproof, and we only hear sounds through external sensors that relay them to our minds without bothering to go through the ears. On the other end, sounds we make don't make it out side of our suit, but instead are transmitted via sub-vocalization. I think that was the lore reason of not being able to hear people talking through proximity, because it would literally be impossible to hear them unless you are hooked up to the same communication network as them.
As for shouts of pain, I am (70%) sure that the bodies we use are 1) Artificially manufactured to be peak physical condition, 2) Drugged up like you wouldn't believe, not even counting additional drugs you can equip. Furthermore, until we actually die, no shots are actually causing bodily harm. They are either being absorbed by shields or armor. Every weapon we have is utterly fatal to the human body. When we are shot by a beam of concentrated plasma we MELT. The only way we are even still able to be revived is because nanite injectors shoot us full of nanomachines that basically reanimate us (and ruins any hope that body had of seeing another day)
I do think however that non-light suits should have an audio cue for footsteps, and that weapon sound effects should travel further. I'd also be in favor of more sounds from the din of combat. I'm just parroting what lore explanations I have heard. In many ways drop suits have less in common with modern armor and more in common with a submarine. (which is somewhat comical since EVE ships are often compared to handling like a sub) |
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