DUST Search - 400 is too low

KOBLAKA1 wrote:

Son-Of A-Gun wrote:

Should be aound 470. But now it is the exact same rpm as the breach. So, the Tac is the breach now. Actually it's what the breach should have been in the first place, but its not it's useless (the breach).

Look, it really this simple:

Lower the damage on the TARs to 72.5 and 76 set the RoF to 470. Why set it RoF to 470 you ask? Well it is simple really: because that is about as fast as a human finger can pull a trigger. Then you can say bye bye to those mod controller scrubs because there will no longer be an advantage to using a mod.

Keep the damage on the breach the same raise the magazine size to 54.

Change the RoFs on std and adv burst variant to 937.5

Extend the range of all assault rifles (excluding the TAR) to come into more close competition with the tactical variant. I said close competition I did not say exactly the same. I am unaware of the stats for AR ranges. If I had the numbers I could do the math for it but I don't.

Buff all ranges by 20 to 30 meters.

Extend damage fall off range.

Get rid of bullet instant vanish. Bullet tracers need to start off strong/vibrant and dissipate at a determined range (definitely not the current ranges though).

There, now all the assault rifles are fixed.

NEXT!

Discuss.

So only extend the range and falloff of ARs no other weapons? Seems fair...

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Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:13:00 - [1] - Quote Should be aound 470. But now it is the exact same rpm as the breach. So, the Tac is the breach now. Actually it's what the breach should have been in the first place, but its not it's useless (the breach). Look, it really this simple: Lower the damage on the TARs to 72.5 and 76 set the RoF to 470. Why set it RoF to 470 you ask? Well it is simple really: because that is about as fast as a human finger can pull a trigger. Then you can say bye bye to those mod controller scrubs because there will no longer be an advantage to using a mod. Keep the damage on the breach the same raise the magazine size to 54. Change the RoFs on std and adv burst variant to 937.5 Extend the range of all assault rifles (excluding the TAR) to come into more close competition with the tactical variant. I said close competition I did not say exactly the same. I am unaware of the stats for AR ranges. If I had the numbers I could do the math for it but I don't. Buff all ranges by 20 to 30 meters. Extend damage fall off range. Get rid of bullet instant vanish. Bullet tracers need to start off strong/vibrant and dissipate at a determined range (definitely not the current ranges though). There, now all the assault rifles are fixed. NEXT! Discuss.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 4205	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:19:00 - [2] - Quote 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:22:00 - [3] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. Well you'd be dead wrong then sir.
Lilah Silverstone The Arrow Project 56	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:22:00 - [4] - Quote Could it be, TAR QQ?
KOBLAKA1 Opus Arcana Orion Empire 29	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:23:00 - [5] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Should be aound 470. But now it is the exact same rpm as the breach. So, the Tac is the breach now. Actually it's what the breach should have been in the first place, but its not it's useless (the breach). Look, it really this simple: Lower the damage on the TARs to 72.5 and 76 set the RoF to 470. Why set it RoF to 470 you ask? Well it is simple really: because that is about as fast as a human finger can pull a trigger. Then you can say bye bye to those mod controller scrubs because there will no longer be an advantage to using a mod. Keep the damage on the breach the same raise the magazine size to 54. Change the RoFs on std and adv burst variant to 937.5 Extend the range of all assault rifles (excluding the TAR) to come into more close competition with the tactical variant. I said close competition I did not say exactly the same. I am unaware of the stats for AR ranges. If I had the numbers I could do the math for it but I don't. Buff all ranges by 20 to 30 meters. Extend damage fall off range. Get rid of bullet instant vanish. Bullet tracers need to start off strong/vibrant and dissipate at a determined range (definitely not the current ranges though). There, now all the assault rifles are fixed. NEXT! Discuss. So only extend the range and falloff of ARs no other weapons? Seems fair...
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:26:00 - [6] - Quote KOBLAKA1 wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Should be aound 470. But now it is the exact same rpm as the breach. So, the Tac is the breach now. Actually it's what the breach should have been in the first place, but its not it's useless (the breach). Look, it really this simple: Lower the damage on the TARs to 72.5 and 76 set the RoF to 470. Why set it RoF to 470 you ask? Well it is simple really: because that is about as fast as a human finger can pull a trigger. Then you can say bye bye to those mod controller scrubs because there will no longer be an advantage to using a mod. Keep the damage on the breach the same raise the magazine size to 54. Change the RoFs on std and adv burst variant to 937.5 Extend the range of all assault rifles (excluding the TAR) to come into more close competition with the tactical variant. I said close competition I did not say exactly the same. I am unaware of the stats for AR ranges. If I had the numbers I could do the math for it but I don't. Buff all ranges by 20 to 30 meters. Extend damage fall off range. Get rid of bullet instant vanish. Bullet tracers need to start off strong/vibrant and dissipate at a determined range (definitely not the current ranges though). There, now all the assault rifles are fixed. NEXT! Discuss. So only extend the range and falloff of ARs no other weapons? Seems fair... When did I say that. In fact I distinctly remember saying "NEXT!".
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 33	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:27:00 - [7] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:29:00 - [8] - Quote Lilah Silverstone wrote: Could it be, TAR QQ? No QQ, just simple arithmetic. Because I am tired of them getting it wrong.
Driftward Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 146	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:30:00 - [9] - Quote There's so much QQ, it's delicious!
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:32:00 - [10] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong And you would be wrong too. Not possible while griping a controller, or the grip of a rifle for that mater.

Mike Poole Kirkinen Risk Control Caldari State 140	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:33:00 - [11] - Quote The ROF should have been dropped to at least 350, 400 is still too high. NO idea where you pulled a 470rpm from as being a standard for a semi automatic. For firing with any degree of accuracy the rate of fire for a semi-auto is like 45-60rpm. It doesn't matter if theoretically a human finger could flex faster than that because you're limited by the mechanics of the weapon and even if you could your accuracy would be shot to hell.
RECON BY FIRE Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 189	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:34:00 - [12] - Quote Lol, no. All of your ideas suck. I would take the time to retort, but I am sure it would be in vain. IMO 400 is still too high a ROF for the TAC. Its supposed to be the sniper version of an AR which means high damage and long range but really low ROF.
Hana-Maru TeamPlayers EoN. 125	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:35:00 - [13] - Quote damage on TARs is fine. the RoF needs to be set around 180 RPMs. Mag size need to be dropped to 20 OR increase reload time. TARs are meant to be medium-to-long range encounter weapons, these changes will be keeping with that spirit and force their usage in such a manner.
Full Metal Kitten Chatelain Rapid Response Gallente Federation 690	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:39:00 - [14] - Quote I agree with Recon. Also, OP isn't encouraging discussion. He is telling you he has the answers and everyone else is wrong. These type of threads are best left to trolling. No serious discussion required. It won't go anywhere.
XERRAN Rakari Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:41:00 - [15] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I got 50 clicks prer 10 secs...
Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 70	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:43:00 - [16] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong Fanning a double trigger on a paintball gun doesn't count.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:46:00 - [17] - Quote Mike Poole wrote: The ROF should have been dropped to at least 350, 400 is still too high. NO idea where you pulled a 470rpm from as being a standard for a semi automatic. For firing with any degree of accuracy the rate of fire for a semi-auto is like 45-60rpm. It doesn't matter if theoretically a human finger could flex faster than that because you're limited by the mechanics of the weapon and even if you could your accuracy would be shot to hell. Dude have you ever even fired an assault rifle before? Because I own several, and have also fired many fully auto rifles as well. 45 - 60 rpm now that is a joke. I'll tell you what go get a TR-3 Assault Scrambler Pistol and test fire it. It has a RoF of 468.7. See how offten you can hit the ceiling of the RoF. I do it fairly often. Maybe 1 in 30 or 40 trigger pulls. The TAR already has massive recoil. Which does quit nicely to simulate the inaciracy you discribed.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 14:55:00 - [18] - Quote Hana-Maru wrote: damage on TARs is fine. the RoF needs to be set around 180 RPMs. Mag size need to be dropped to 20 OR increase reload time. TARs are meant to be medium-to-long range encounter weapons, these changes will be keeping with that spirit and force their usage in such a manner. ALSO: Make the damn sight clear! There is no resin to limit the RoF on the TAR, outside of limiting it to a reasonable RoF achievable by a human being. The weapon must already be manually fired, and to add to this there is a massive recoil. Do you even use the weapon at all.
KOBLAKA1 Opus Arcana Orion Empire 29	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:04:00 - [19] - Quote Thought this would be a heavy thread about base hp, found TAR QQ guess I should've known better...
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 33	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:04:00 - [20] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Dexter307 wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong And you would be wrong too. Not possible while griping a controller, or the grip of a rifle for that mater. Well I can do it so your wrong

Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 33	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:05:00 - [21] - Quote Terra Thesis wrote: Dexter307 wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong Fanning a double trigger on a paintball gun doesn't count. I was pressing R1 with one finger
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:09:00 - [22] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Dexter307 wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong And you would be wrong too. Not possible while griping a controller, or the grip of a rifle for that mater. Well I can do it so your wrong Terra Thesis wrote: Fanning a double trigger on a paintball gun doesn't count.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:11:00 - [23] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Terra Thesis wrote: Dexter307 wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: 470 rounds per minute is almost 8 shots per second, I doubt anyone can really fire that fast without a modded controller Having it that high would be pointless. I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong Fanning a double trigger on a paintball gun doesn't count. I was pressing R1 with one finger Proof (while griping the controller) or it didn't happen.
Sev Alcatraz The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION 268	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:18:00 - [24] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Should be aound 470. But now it is the exact same rpm as the breach. So, the Tac is the breach now. Actually it's what the breach should have been in the first place, but its not. it's useless (the breach). Look, it's really this simple: Lower the damage on the TARs to 72.5 and 76 set the RoF to 470. Why set it RoF to 470 you ask? Well it is simple really: because that is about as fast as a human finger can pull a trigger. Then you can say bye bye to those mod controller scrubs because there will no longer be an advantage to using a mod. Keep the damage on the breach the same raise the magazine size to 54. Change the RoFs on std and adv burst variant to 937.5 Extend the range of all assault rifles (excluding the TAR) to come into more close competition with the tactical variant. I said close competition I did not say exactly the same. I am unaware of the stats for AR ranges. If I had the numbers I could do the math for it but I don't. Buff all ranges by 20 to 30 meters. Extend damage fall off range. Get rid of bullet instant vanish. Bullet tracers need to start off strong/vibrant and dissipate at a determined range (definitely not the current ranges though). There, now all the assault rifles are fixed. NEXT! Discuss.
TEBOW BAGGINS GHETTOSTAR GALACTICA 578	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:23:00 - [25] - Quote i was expecting this to be a buff thukker/fused locas thread, i leave feeling cheated
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 4	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:25:00 - [26] - Quote TEBOW BAGGINS wrote: i was expecting this to be a buff thukker/fused locas thread, i leave feeling cheated Man, people have such expectations for my thread.
Thanos Warpfiend HongKong n Shanghai Merc Corp 8	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:41:00 - [27] - Quote Yes QQ more about the TAR
Obodiah Garro Tech Guard General Tso's Alliance 47	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:42:00 - [28] - Quote 400 to low? id settle for 350
Vethosis Purgatorium of the Damned League of Infamy 99	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:43:00 - [29] - Quote IT ALSO HAS A GOOD SIGHT ON THE GUN AND YOU CAN STILL SHOOT FASTER THAN A BREACH ASSAULT RIFLE AND IT SHOOTS FARTHER THAN A BREACH
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 33	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:47:00 - [30] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Dexter307 wrote: Terra Thesis wrote: Dexter307 wrote: [quote=KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf] I can shoot semi autos faster than 831 RPM so your wrong Fanning a double trigger on a paintball gun doesn't count. I was pressing R1 with one finger Proof (while griping the controller) or it didn't happen. Ill upload a video when I get back to my house in a few hours, but it'll be recorded with my phone. I'll be holding the controller with both hands and pressing R1 with one finger

Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 5	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:51:00 - [31] - Quote This is not QQ. It is about making the TAR a viable weapon. As it stands now it is nothing more than a powerful breach with a very short clip, and I imagine it will quickly fall into disuse again. I have already switched over to useing the burst and std. The idea is to make all the weapons fun to use, while keeping them competitive. Man to can tell that there are a lot of people on this thread that got killed way to many times with the Tac while it was over buffed and now just want to see the weapon on back to the graveyard. Nothing left but sheer irrational heat for the weapon now I guess.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 5	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:53:00 - [32] - Quote Vethosis wrote: IT ALSO HAS A GOOD SIGHT ON THE GUN AND YOU CAN STILL SHOOT FASTER THAN A BREACH ASSAULT RIFLE AND IT SHOOTS FARTHER THAN A BREACH You can't shoot faster than the breach. They have the same RoF. It's physically impossible.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 5	Posted - 2013.06.05 15:57:00 - [33] - Quote @Dexter307 Measured by what standard. Not that I have faith in this video to come.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 33	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:24:00 - [34] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: @Dexter307 Measured by what standard. Not that I have faith in this video to come. Based off the fal and m14 from cod:zombies. With the double tap perk its firecap is either 781 or 831 and if you shoot faster than that the gun jams
Terra Thesis HDYLTA Defiant Legacy 71	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:27:00 - [35] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: I was pressing R1 with one finger ah, sorry, i thought you were making a comparison with RL. what does it matter how fast you can press the DS3 controller? this isn't track and field. do we really want the game to be designed to give you game-breaking dps if you have freakish finger vibration capabilities? I'd rather it be about aiming, tactics, loadouts, logistics, politics, etc.
KEROSIINI-TERO Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 411	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:28:00 - [36] - Quote To those saying having RoF limit is the solution for making autofire TAC equal to manual TAC, that just isn't true. It will always be easier for autofire users to use it. So that's never equal. The key is to make autofiring on maximum impractical: that's where the kick kicks in (pun intended=). Having to resort to bursting in order to not waste most shots balances nicely and requires also different kind of skill.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 5	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:31:00 - [37] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: @Dexter307 Measured by what standard. Not that I have faith in this video to come. Based off the fal and m14 from cod:zombies. With the double tap perk its firecap is either 781 or 831 and if you shoot faster than that the gun jams Remember. Full grip on the controller with your thumb on the right stick, to simulate battle conditions. I can't wait to see this video.
Dexter307 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 33	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:36:00 - [38] - Quote Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Dexter307 wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: @Dexter307 Measured by what standard. Not that I have faith in this video to come. Based off the fal and m14 from cod:zombies. With the double tap perk its firecap is either 781 or 831 and if you shoot faster than that the gun jams Remember. Full grip on the controller with your thumb on the right stick, to simulate battle conditions. I can't wait to see this video. Ill shoot zombies WHILE breaking the fire cap!
Paran Tadec Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1095	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:48:00 - [39] - Quote Delish tears after your crutch has been removed. Feel bad for dropping cash on controller or macromouse now dont we?
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 5	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:52:00 - [40] - Quote Paran Tadec wrote: Delish tears after your crutch has been removed. Feel bad for dropping cash on controller or macromouse now dont we? I don't use a mod. But if you had actually read what I wrote you would know that.

Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 5	Posted - 2013.06.05 16:55:00 - [41] - Quote Dexter307 wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: Dexter307 wrote: Son-Of A-Gun wrote: @Dexter307 Measured by what standard. Not that I have faith in this video to come. Based off the fal and m14 from cod:zombies. With the double tap perk its firecap is either 781 or 831 and if you shoot faster than that the gun jams Remember. Full grip on the controller with your thumb on the right stick, to simulate battle conditions. I can't wait to see this video. Ill shoot zombies WHILE breaking the fire cap! That's great just as long as I can see your hand on the controller, and the gun jamming on the screen at the same time. And then the stats stating that the RoF is what you say it is.
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 4904	Posted - 2013.06.05 17:09:00 - [42] - Quote Behold http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLk1v5bSFPw
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 7	Posted - 2013.06.05 17:21:00 - [43] - Quote Iron Wolf Saber wrote: Behold http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLk1v5bSFPw Let's do some math: 12 shots 2.99 seconds - the second and a half it took him to reload = 8.053 rounds/sec 470 rpm divided by 60 (seconds in a minute)... Wait for it... = 7.833 Yup sounds about right to me.
Son-Of A-Gun 3dge of D4rkness SoulWing Alliance 7	Posted - 2013.06.05 17:33:00 - [44] - Quote Yahp, thanks for sending my thread to the junk yard. Not like it was an important subject or anything.


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