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Arramakaian Eka
Tronhadar Free Guard
Minmatar Republic
559
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Posted - 2013.05.24 12:19:00 -
[31] - Quote
Shion Typhon wrote:IceStormers wrote:I dont really have issue with the overall FPS side
yes it has balance issues, damage and range needs to be addressed on most weapons, we should not have weapons as OP as the tar, its not that hard to bring them inline it was quite obvious looking at the stats how silly that weapons was going to be
The basic gun combat makes no sense though. I admit I've only just started playing but there seems to be very limited ballistics modelling (bullet drop, damage degradation, very basic cones of fires etc etc). The range of weapons is also ridiculous compared to any other FPS. It becomes a binary situation, you can see guys half way across the map but can only fight at knife fight ranges, you're usually either out of range or bunny-hopping around a guy at ranges where you can look up his nostrils. We don't want assault rifles that can act like sniper rifles but most other FPSs have a more smoothed out ballistics model where your gun's effectiveness degrades in a more complex and rational manner (and usually over longer distances). IMO optimal ranges could use a good 50% increase on almost every non-sniper weapon and max ranges could be doubled (heck even maybe tripled). Your mileage may vary.
Ranges were longer in Chromosome (build prior to launch), and those made the gameplay worse. Everyone was mid-range sniping, you couldn't cover any open areas in a scout suit without getting torn to shreds, and Heavies mowed everyone down from 50+ meters. Current ranges are fine, they have brought the confrontations to shorter ranges so you're not shooting at pinkie-sized toons on the screen.
But I agree on the weapon damage drop. It's supposed to work so that the weapon does max damage up to optimal range, with drop off to max range, and some minimal damage beyond that. Currently there's a hard clip at max range, ie. you do zero damage at max range plus 1 meter. This is supposed to be fixed soon, if not already fixed (haven't checked). |
Jenova's Witness
Red and Silver Hand
Amarr Empire
15
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Posted - 2013.05.24 12:24:00 -
[32] - Quote
2-Ton Twenty-One wrote:Jenova's Witness wrote:2-Ton Twenty-One wrote:Dust is a mini game for EVE. Both games would have to have a valid, meaningful connection for Dust to even be a mini game for EVE. They already screwed the pooch on FW by making it no better than a pub match and PC is a giant middle finger to Dust/EVE alliances since you can just use a NPC orbital. Dust is more like a pilot spinoff to a EVE right now. Maybe it'll get better in the future, maybe it won't, but I'm tired of seeing placeholders for stuff that's still on the drawing board. Yeah I was being a little generous.
Yeah, me too. I said they screwed the pooch, but I really meant they ****ed the fido. No matter how you look at it, Dust 514 wasn't ready for retail anytime soon and could have probably benefited from a few more months of beta for core issues or a year at most to produce an overall better product. Instead, that appealing released date piqued their interest and they got greedy, putting out an incomplete product. I have faith in this game and the EVE connection keeps me here for the most part, but CCP needs to get their priorities straight. There are too many issues at the games foundation that need to be addressed before they add on any more decorations. A lot of us stay here because we see the game's potential, but there's a lot of potential for failure as well. |
Panther Alpha
WarRavens
277
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Posted - 2013.05.24 12:38:00 -
[33] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:Everyone knows about the problem with the mechanics.
No one denies it.
It will be tweaked, adjusted, improved every expansion.
If you-¦re not satisfied with the current gameplay, return when it-¦s better. It may take a long time.
If you-¦re not satisfied with the current features, return when it-¦s better. It may take a long time.
If you eventually return, don-¦t complain about SP gap between players.
So; come back, play for few days, get bore, go away for few months, come back, play for few days, get bore...That looks like a terrible circle to me.
And personally, is only so many times i will do that, before i NEVER come back... I have patience.. but is not eternal. |
Muramasa Armads
Defensores Doctrina
14
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Posted - 2013.05.24 14:42:00 -
[34] - Quote
Natu Nobilis wrote:Everyone knows about the problem with the mechanics.
No one denies it.
It will be tweaked, adjusted, improved every expansion.
If you-¦re not satisfied with the current gameplay, return when it-¦s better. It may take a long time.
If you-¦re not satisfied with the current features, return when it-¦s better. It may take a long time.
If you eventually return, don-¦t complain about SP gap between players.
If I decide to stop playing Dust 514 the SP gap won't be a problem. Unfortunately, I can easily keep up with the community by buying boosters and MCC camping if I felt like it. I have 10 million SP, so I wouldn't fall behind at all if I decided to go down that route.
I'm not satisfied with the current game play or features, so I might take your advice and come back to Dust 514 at a later time.
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Shion Typhon
Intara Direct Action
Caldari State
1
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Posted - 2013.05.24 14:47:00 -
[35] - Quote
Arramakaian Eka wrote:Shion Typhon wrote:The basic gun combat makes no sense though.
I admit I've only just started playing but there seems to be very limited ballistics modelling (bullet drop, damage degradation, very basic cones of fires etc etc).
The range of weapons is also ridiculous compared to any other FPS. It becomes a binary situation, you can see guys half way across the map but can only fight at knife fight ranges, you're usually either out of range or bunny-hopping around a guy at ranges where you can look up his nostrils. We don't want assault rifles that can act like sniper rifles but most other FPSs have a more smoothed out ballistics model where your gun's effectiveness degrades in a more complex and rational manner (and usually over longer distances).
IMO optimal ranges could use a good 50% increase on almost every non-sniper weapon and max ranges could be doubled (heck even maybe tripled). Your mileage may vary.
Ranges were longer in Chromosome (build prior to launch), and those made the gameplay worse. Everyone was mid-range sniping, you couldn't cover any open areas in a scout suit without getting torn to shreds, and Heavies mowed everyone down from 50+ meters. Current ranges are fine, they have brought the confrontations to shorter ranges so you're not shooting at pinkie-sized toons on the screen. But I agree on the weapon damage drop. It's supposed to work so that the weapon does max damage up to optimal range, with drop off to max range, and some minimal damage beyond that. Currently there's a hard clip at max range, ie. you do zero damage at max range plus 1 meter. This is supposed to be fixed soon, if not already fixed (haven't checked).
I'll have to take your word on that having not played in beta, it just seems very either/or without much in between. The hard clip +1m thing is utterly disconcerting to any regular FPS player, at the very least in most FPS models you can still plink away with some limited damage in mid to long ranges. Even if optimal stayed at the way it is now, 60-70m is a VERY short range considering you can generally see that person coming from 500m away.
Most FPS's have bloom so your cone of fire expands while on full auto to clamp down on long range spraying but if you crouch, aim-down-sights and do short squirts you can manage your COF & recoil to get in some hits.
Dust just doesn't seem to have this sort of more complex mechanic (not to mention varying accuracy on movement). It seems to have COF, recoil and that's about it (other than crouching for sniper rifles). Either 100% of your bullets hit or none of them hit, much more binary than any other FPS I've played. |
Selinate deux
DUST University
Ivy League
82
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Posted - 2013.05.24 14:56:00 -
[36] - Quote
Jenova's Witness wrote:Tell us something we don't know. The MMORPG side is fine, it's the FPS mechanics that need work. I could've told you that without citing biased game reviewers. But I guess you want to feel special.
No. No it is not. It isn't even there. Dust is still COD with a fancy waiting room. |
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