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Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
4258
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:49:00 -
[31] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:There is better skill planning for that.
Luckily there is also no skill cap either. So over time you can be well geared in all roles.
However at the cheap cheap investment of 8 million skill points you should be able to be able to use base gear of everything and have max fitting and HP values to work with and being able to play the 'bare minimum' of ALL the roles. Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC? Makes no sense.... Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design
I agree Planetside 2 has no way of previewing things either so I am left wondering what the new gun I unlock is going to do, right now sitting on 1.2k cert points and have no effing idea where to spend them.
Moar militia gear needed in dust. |
Sloth9230
Reaper Galactic ROFL BROS
1372
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:49:00 -
[32] - Quote
Malkai Inos wrote:a strong specialist. Clearly he has spec'ed into QQing enough, you would think he'd have enough SP to do something else by now |
Fox Gaden
DUST University Ivy League
322
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:49:00 -
[33] - Quote
Since the start of Open Bata I have been: - A Frontline Assault with Assault Riffle. - An Assault Sniper. - Run Assault with a Mass Driver. - A Shotgun Scout. - A SMG Scout. - An Assault Swarm Launcher AV. - Run demolitions in a Logi suit with 2 types of Remote Explosives and a Nano Hive.
And I only have 6 million skill points...
You donGÇÖt need a respec, you just need to earn more skill points so you can specialise in more than one area. |
IamI3rian
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
71
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:51:00 -
[34] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote:IamI3rian wrote:Well it looks like I've got no idea what I'm talking about then, doesn't it? At least you fit right in with the majority I've come to terms with my shortcomings. = )
Gotta read that map more. 3m+ alts are good enough to try a style of play anyway... just sayin. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
4258
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:51:00 -
[35] - Quote
Malkai Inos wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:There is better skill planning for that.
Luckily there is also no skill cap either. So over time you can be well geared in all roles.
However at the cheap cheap investment of 8 million skill points you should be able to be able to use base gear of everything and have max fitting and HP values to work with and being able to play the 'bare minimum' of ALL the roles. Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC? Makes no sense.... Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design You don't seem to understand the concept of tradeoffs. You can be an average generalist or a strong specialist. Not both.
^ hence the term Omni-soldier. Its an extremely difficult and challenging play-style as you have to make up with lack of good gear with player skill and experience just to remain competitive. |
TheMarkOf22
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
161
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:51:00 -
[36] - Quote
Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC?
Makes no sense....
Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design[/quote] You don't seem to understand the concept of tradeoffs.
You can be an average generalist or a strong specialist. Not both.[/quote]
This doesn't just effect me but you as well, you think new players are going to want to be stuck with a role they choose at the get go without being able to try other things that may suit them better?
When you launch into your game and see no one on the other side, maybe then you will realize.
|
hooc order
Deep Space Republic Gentlemen's Agreement
83
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:53:00 -
[37] - Quote
Full Metal Kitten wrote:hooc order wrote:Sometimes i think CCP would have been better off picking random names out of the phone book and letting them design Dust 514. You clearly don't understand what this game is about. I wanted to dislike your post but there's no button for that.
Is the game about turning away customers?
Is the game about only appealing to Farmville in space (EvE) players who can't aim worth a crap but spend excruciating amounts of effort and time studying spread sheets hoping that one last level will magically make them a good player.
Or is the game about compelling FPS game play the rewards good FPS game play?
The choice to have an RPG style Leveling systems in an FPS MMO is Ludonarrative dissonance...the leveling systems in RPGs are supposed to tell a story but when the actual game play is a multiplayer FPS which depends on the players skill to move that story forward that story breaks down.
It also conflicts with CCP Vision. A Dust mercenaries story is about how he preforms in the battle field and what alliances he make, what districts he takes, how much isk he can accumulate...not what gun he puts spell points into. Furthermore this game is about having the player fill roles not letting the game fill those roles....you really cannot take over the players role more then letting an SP/level system do all the work for you...especially when an FPS is meant for letting the player do. |
TheMarkOf22
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
161
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:53:00 -
[38] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Malkai Inos wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:There is better skill planning for that.
Luckily there is also no skill cap either. So over time you can be well geared in all roles.
However at the cheap cheap investment of 8 million skill points you should be able to be able to use base gear of everything and have max fitting and HP values to work with and being able to play the 'bare minimum' of ALL the roles. Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC? Makes no sense.... Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design You don't seem to understand the concept of tradeoffs. You can be an average generalist or a strong specialist. Not both. ^ hence the term Omni-soldier. Its an extremely difficult and challenging play-style as you have to make up with lack of good gear with player skill and experience just to remain competitive.
lol player skill in a game with ONE hit box, is laughable. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
4258
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:56:00 -
[39] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote:
This doesn't just effect me but you as well, you think new players are going to want to be stuck with a role they choose at the get go without being able to try other things that may suit them better?
When you launch into your game and see no one on the other side, maybe then you will realize.
But you see the other side on the field all the time. You learn to recognize them what threats or values those other specializations bring in. One day you see a scout get into your mass of a squad and ninja everyone to death and think that is so awesome to the point you try to be like that guy and you start prepraring to make changes to your skill plans, make adjustments add a second or third specialization you want or need to your rosters while having your first love always there reliable. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
4258
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 18:57:00 -
[40] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote:
lol player skill in a game with ONE hit box, is laughable.
You have to admit that getting near the top of score boards while stuck in militia gear in a field full of prototype level gear is rather impressive. |
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Malkai Inos
The Vanguardians Orion Empire
67
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:00:00 -
[41] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote:Malkai Inos FTFY wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:
Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC?
Makes no sense....
Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design
You don't seem to understand the concept of tradeoffs. You can be an average generalist or a strong specialist. Not both. This doesn't just effect me but you as well, you think new players are going to want to be stuck with a role they choose at the get go without being able to try other things that may suit them better? When you launch into your game and see no one on the other side, maybe then you will realize. This does affect me especially since i'm sitting on a mere 2.2m and i have to constantly balance between further specilization and getting some more options.
I have no clue what your last sentence is supposed to mean, so i just leave it at that. |
hooc order
Deep Space Republic Gentlemen's Agreement
83
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:01:00 -
[42] - Quote
The new ad campaign.
Dust 514: The game you have to wait 5 months watching an arbitrary number go up before you can actually start playing.
Fun for the whole family.
Disclaimer: CCP takes no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary numbers incorrectly...just wait another 5 months. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
4259
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:03:00 -
[43] - Quote
hooc order wrote:The new ad campaign.
Dust 514: The game you have to wait 5 months watching an arbitrary number go up before you can actually start playing.
Fun for the whole family.
Disclaimer: CCP takes no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary numbers incorrectly...just wait another 5 months.
You can be rather effective day 1 characters, any vet around here can attest that for the ones that have been fully reset to fresh can tell you the are just as capable of destroying the entire field as they where when they got 8-12 million sp more. |
Fox Gaden
DUST University Ivy League
322
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:04:00 -
[44] - Quote
New players can specialize to become competitive one the battlefield quickly.
Quickly means in a short time, like 6 months. Right now we are all new players.
Old players will have the skill points to specialise in several areas. Earning the skill points to try something new is what will keep it interesting for older players.
I want to fly Drop ships, but I donGÇÖt expect to put any points into vehicles for another 6 months at least.
This is New Eden. Start thinking long term! |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
3090
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:05:00 -
[45] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:You can be rather effective day 1 characters, any vet around here can attest that for the ones that have been fully reset to fresh can tell you the are just as capable of destroying the entire field as they where when they got 8-12 million sp more.
I've been doing sadly well for 0 infantry skills with militia BPOs only |
Bones McGavins
TacoCat Industries
190
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:05:00 -
[46] - Quote
You CAN do versitile play styles. You just cant really do vehicles unless you focus on them. But if you get your core skills up and weapons to like level 3, you can compete and switch **** up.
I mean if you dont need your proto gear to have fun or be effective. ive never used anything beyond advanced and ive only started using advanced drop suits this week. |
TheMarkOf22
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
161
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:08:00 -
[47] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:hooc order wrote:The new ad campaign.
Dust 514: The game you have to wait 5 months watching an arbitrary number go up before you can actually start playing.
Fun for the whole family.
Disclaimer: CCP takes no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary numbers incorrectly...just wait another 5 months. You can be rather effective day 1 characters, any vet around here can attest that for the ones that have been fully reset to fresh can tell you the are just as capable of destroying the entire field as they where when they got 8-12 million sp more.
Every time iv'e seen you, you've never been effective on any level...
|
Malkai Inos
The Vanguardians Orion Empire
67
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:10:00 -
[48] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote: Every time iv'e seen you, you've never been effective on any level...
How do they call this again? |
TheMarkOf22
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
164
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:10:00 -
[49] - Quote
Malkai Inos wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:Malkai Inos FTFY wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:
Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC?
Makes no sense....
Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design
You don't seem to understand the concept of tradeoffs. You can be an average generalist or a strong specialist. Not both. This doesn't just effect me but you as well, you think new players are going to want to be stuck with a role they choose at the get go without being able to try other things that may suit them better? When you launch into your game and see no one on the other side, maybe then you will realize. This does affect me especially since i'm sitting on a mere 2.2m and i have to constantly balance between further specilization and getting some more options. I have no clue what your last sentence is supposed to mean, so i just leave it at that.
with only 2.2 mill sp, you have know idea what your talking about and are still relatively new to the game, but congrats on putting your 2 cents in on something you know nothing of... |
TheMarkOf22
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
164
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:13:00 -
[50] - Quote
Locking players into a specific path with no way out other then "grinding" in a game that is "forever changing" is probably one of the biggest mistakes CCP has made, with all you nerd calling for nerfs/buffs why should I be stuck with a weapon no longer viable or a weapon that just doesn't feel the same? |
|
hooc order
Deep Space Republic Gentlemen's Agreement
83
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:14:00 -
[51] - Quote
hooc order wrote:The new ad campaign.
Dust 514: The game you have to wait 5 months watching an arbitrary number go up before you can actually start playing.
Fun for the whole family.
Disclaimer: CCP takes no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary numbers incorrectly...just wait another 5 months.
CCP also take no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary point correctly then suddenly nerf the class you were spending those arbitrary points you were earning....just wait another 5 months. |
Malkai Inos
The Vanguardians Orion Empire
67
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:15:00 -
[52] - Quote
TheMarkOf22 wrote:Malkai Inos wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:Malkai Inos FTFY wrote:TheMarkOf22 wrote:
Why would I spread myself thin on a main account, while being a major part of our corps PC?
Makes no sense....
Also with no ability to test/try things out without major investment is just plain awful game design
You don't seem to understand the concept of tradeoffs. You can be an average generalist or a strong specialist. Not both. This doesn't just effect me but you as well, you think new players are going to want to be stuck with a role they choose at the get go without being able to try other things that may suit them better? When you launch into your game and see no one on the other side, maybe then you will realize. This does affect me especially since i'm sitting on a mere 2.2m and i have to constantly balance between further specilization and getting some more options. I have no clue what your last sentence is supposed to mean, so i just leave it at that. with only 2.2 mill sp, you have know idea what your talking about and are still relatively new to the game, but congrats on putting your 2 cents in on something you know nothing of... So you are speaking for the new players by telling us how they feel about the skill system and then reject my reply because i am a new player. Or is it perhaps because i disagree with you? |
Byozuma Kegawa
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
38
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:15:00 -
[53] - Quote
I've seen Iron Wolf Saber play, they used nothing but what looked like starter fits and militia vehicles. And they kicked much arse. I was duly impressed. While I wish I could play that well, I can't. I can only play how I can and be happy with it. For me, prototype gear would probably be wasted ISK so I don't really try to chase it. I will make one exception but that should probably be a distant goal as I've gotten comfortable with the advanced Amarr logstics suit and will probably not need that third equipment slot for a while (or until October). I would not discount ability over equipment. Even I can sometimes drop someone in a prototype suit with my militia assault rifle and I suck. |
Banned From Forums
Shining Flame Amarr Empire
0
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:16:00 -
[54] - Quote
IamI3rian wrote:There's an alt for that.
Alts are too much hassle to maintain. Having a respect system would be nice. However a cost factor should be associated with it. Most RPGs I play the cost increases after every respect.
For example the first respect could be a 1 million ISK. The second one could be 10 million ISK and so on and so forth. |
Fox Gaden
DUST University Ivy League
322
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:18:00 -
[55] - Quote
hooc order wrote:Full Metal Kitten wrote:hooc order wrote:Sometimes i think CCP would have been better off picking random names out of the phone book and letting them design Dust 514. You clearly don't understand what this game is about. I wanted to dislike your post but there's no button for that. Is the game about turning away customers? Is the game about only appealing to Farmville in space (EvE) players who can't aim worth a crap but spend excruciating amounts of effort and time studying spread sheets hoping that one last level will magically make them a good player. Or is the game about compelling FPS game play the rewards good FPS game play? The choice to have an RPG style Leveling systems in an FPS MMO is Ludonarrative dissonance...the leveling systems in RPGs are supposed to tell a story but when the actual game play is a multiplayer FPS which depends on the players skill to move that story forward that story breaks down. It also conflicts with CCP Vision. A Dust mercenaries story is about how he preforms in the battle field and what alliances he make, what districts he takes, how much isk he can accumulate...not what gun he puts spell points into. Furthermore this game is about having the player fill roles not letting the game fill those roles....you really cannot take over the players role more then letting an SP/level system do all the work for you...especially when an FPS is meant for letting the player do. DUST will appeal to:
- EVE players who want player skill to have a greater role in a battleGÇÖs outcome.
- FPS players who want more complexity and persistence. Who want all the work they put into a game to still have meaning in 5 years, rather than resetting to 0 every time a new game comes out.
- MMO players who want good PVP and the FPS experience without giving up the meta game.
People will get board and stop playing DUST. Then they will get board with the next game and it will occur to them that their DUST Mercenary has been collecting skill points all this time, and log back in to find the game has expanded immensely while they were away. |
TheMarkOf22
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
165
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:21:00 -
[56] - Quote
Banned From Forums wrote:IamI3rian wrote:There's an alt for that. Alts are too much hassle to maintain. Having a respect system would be nice. However a cost factor should be associated with it. Most RPGs I play the cost increases after every respect. For example the first respect could be a 1 million ISK. The second one could be 10 million ISK and so on and so forth.
this is a good idea, and possibly ISK spent could go towards a prize pool in PC or something... |
hooc order
Deep Space Republic Gentlemen's Agreement
83
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:25:00 -
[57] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:hooc order wrote:The new ad campaign.
Dust 514: The game you have to wait 5 months watching an arbitrary number go up before you can actually start playing.
Fun for the whole family.
Disclaimer: CCP takes no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary numbers incorrectly...just wait another 5 months. You can be rather effective day 1 characters, any vet around here can attest that for the ones that have been fully reset to fresh can tell you the are just as capable of destroying the entire field as they where when they got 8-12 million sp more.
LOL vets.
Want to make an alt and play some academy with me?
We can then see how effective these vet skills are.
And yes i have gone against you with your 10 million Sp while I have 2 million.
Bad aim, slow reactions vulnerable to flanks (do you even look at the map?)
I was not impressed.
Also being effective 5 months ago when everyone only had 4 to 5 million SP is not anything like like having 2 million SP and going against someone with 10 million....and that is not even considering all the changes which now requires even more SP to get anywhere near competitive.
By definition a "vet" does not know crap about starting the game now. |
Jin Robot
Polar Gooks
466
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:30:00 -
[58] - Quote
hooc order wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:hooc order wrote:The new ad campaign.
Dust 514: The game you have to wait 5 months watching an arbitrary number go up before you can actually start playing.
Fun for the whole family.
Disclaimer: CCP takes no responsibility if you spend those arbitrary numbers incorrectly...just wait another 5 months. You can be rather effective day 1 characters, any vet around here can attest that for the ones that have been fully reset to fresh can tell you the are just as capable of destroying the entire field as they where when they got 8-12 million sp more. LOL vets. Want to make an alt and play some academy with me? We can then see how effective these vet skills are. And yes i have gone against you with your 10 million Sp while I have 2 million. Bad aim, slow reactions vulnerable to flanks (do you even look at the map?) I was not impressed. Also being effective 5 months ago when everyone only had 4 to 5 million SP is not anything like like having 2 million SP and going against someone with 10 million....and that is not even considering all the changes which now requires even more SP to get anywhere near competitive. By definition a "vet" does not know crap about starting the game now. I am a vet and I started an alt, went to battle academy with 500k SP. I am having no problem dealing with the newbies. |
Knarf Black
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
761
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:33:00 -
[59] - Quote
Is there some way that Mark and Hooc can cancel out eachothers' trolling and explode ala. matter/antimatter? |
Jason Pearson
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
1144
|
Posted - 2013.05.17 19:34:00 -
[60] - Quote
lolno.
I like the feeling that if I put all my time, effort and SP into a single class, I have a chance of being one of the best. Respec allows players to just go into different roles with no consequences. |
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