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Nguruthos IX
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
290
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 11:28:00 -
[31] - Quote
One feature I'd implore the dev's to consider is giving some way to control the Assault DropShip turret from first person view.
The same way that it works in third person, except without the issue of having to guess where targets are because there's a giant dropship blocking your vision looking down.
It would be dangerous enough to switch into first person for slightly better aiming.
And please for the love of god, come up with some plan to reduce the unstopable death that are RDVs |
Nguruthos IX
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
290
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 11:30:00 -
[32] - Quote
Otoky wrote:Realy hard to control the militia dropship. A new player will fall in the first minute. Price drop is a good idea tho Pretty sure it was listed in the patch notes. Except what they did instead was raise the price of each turret to like 250k ISK
lol : / |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
2840
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 14:11:00 -
[33] - Quote
The Cobra Commander wrote:. Add to that the flying now seems to allow the ship to "slide" s lot more..
Yea, the new drift is annoying, but it's not impossible to deal with. It's really thrown off my air drops though.
Also, I just wanted to say thanks to everyone in here, this thread is surprisingly civil and constructive at the moment lol. |
gbghg
L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION
1475
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 15:13:00 -
[34] - Quote
Okay tried flying a gorgon earlier, and I thought vipers felt sluggish first time I flew them. All those who choose gallente, you have my symphathy, and you have my pity. |
Azraya Veldman
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
6
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Posted - 2013.05.08 15:20:00 -
[35] - Quote
gbghg wrote:Okay tried flying a gorgon earlier, and I thought vipers felt sluggish first time I flew them. All those who choose gallente, you have my symphathy, and you have my pity. Yeah, Gallente one feels like it's powered by two sickly hamsters ....
( And DAMN YOU RDV TERRORISTS! ) |
Alan-Ibn-Xuan Al-Alasabe
Planetary Response Organisation
287
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 23:37:00 -
[36] - Quote
Nguruthos IX wrote:One feature I'd implore the dev's to consider is giving some way to control the Assault DropShip turret from first person view.
The same way that it works in third person, except without the issue of having to guess where targets are because there's a giant dropship blocking your vision looking down.
The answer seems fairly obvious to me: picture in picture. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
2843
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 23:51:00 -
[37] - Quote
gbghg wrote: All those who choose gallente, you have my symphathy, and you have my pity.
I'm a glutton for punishment.
FOR THE FEDERATION!!! |
Alan-Ibn-Xuan Al-Alasabe
Planetary Response Organisation
288
|
Posted - 2013.05.08 23:55:00 -
[38] - Quote
I stuck an afterburner on my Incubus. Seems to be doing okay. I mean, not well, I've only successfully killed one or two people over a dozen matches, but I can usually bug out if I start getting hurt too badly. |
Baal Omniscient
L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION
484
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 08:48:00 -
[39] - Quote
Noc Tempre wrote:CCP Nothin wrote:So about dropships and love.
First, there's a price cut in plans for them. We'd like to make them more affordable especially on the lower end to make them easier to get into. The learning curve can be pretty rough if you can't afford mistakes. Dropships also provide the kind of cooperative gameplay that we would like seeing more of.
Second, we're taking a look at the SP requirements for different paths overall and making sure that skill costs are appropriate for what you're getting. Progressing into being a dropship pilot (or something else, for that matter) should ultimately be a fun and rewarding endeavor, not a grind.
Third, we're aware that flying dropships as your job doesn't allow you to make a solid living right now. It's getting looked at. We want to give some more WP-reward love to the dropship pilots. You should be able to be the trucker of the skies without having to finance your job by doing other things in between :)
I know this isn't your department, but perhaps the first dropship should be the attack (no side guns perhaps?) so the pilot is more in control of his/her role from day one. I would suggest making them two completely separate skills. It's like comparing a logi with a scout suit, one is support and has more health, the other is for hit and run tactics. Let people choose one or the other without having to struggle through one just to have access to the other. Though I DO think the assault dropships should end up being 1x or 2x higher in SP cost than the standard.
And I don't do dropships btw, this is coming from someone who has been bombed by them for the last several days. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
2842
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 09:04:00 -
[40] - Quote
Azraya Veldman wrote:( And DAMN YOU RDV TOURISTS! ) Fixed. |
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VLIGHT5
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
73
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 09:24:00 -
[41] - Quote
CCP Nothin wrote:So about dropships and love.
First, there's a price cut in plans for them. We'd like to make them more affordable especially on the lower end to make them easier to get into. The learning curve can be pretty rough if you can't afford mistakes. Dropships also provide the kind of cooperative gameplay that we would like seeing more of.
Second, we're taking a look at the SP requirements for different paths overall and making sure that skill costs are appropriate for what you're getting. Progressing into being a dropship pilot (or something else, for that matter) should ultimately be a fun and rewarding endeavor, not a grind.
Third, we're aware that flying dropships as your job doesn't allow you to make a solid living right now. It's getting looked at. We want to give some more WP-reward love to the dropship pilots. You should be able to be the trucker of the skies without having to finance your job by doing other things in between :)
WHERE ARE MY FIGHTER JETS!!!
|
The Cobra Commander
Bojo's School of the Trades
8
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Posted - 2013.05.09 10:02:00 -
[42] - Quote
gbghg wrote:Okay tried flying a gorgon earlier, and I thought vipers felt sluggish first time I flew them. All those who choose gallente, you have my symphathy, and you have my pity.
Lol...it is hard out there now for us Gallente. If they fix the PG then we can fit the darn things better.
I am having to practice flying sideways now to at least give my gunners a chance against those darn assault DS...forge gunners on the ground, drunk RDV pilots in the air, assault DS, and I can go 0-60 in 10 minutes....yea it's going to be a long road ahead! |
Sylwester Dziewiecki
BetaMax. CRONOS.
57
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 11:01:00 -
[43] - Quote
The Cobra Commander wrote:gbghg wrote:Okay tried flying a gorgon earlier, and I thought vipers felt sluggish first time I flew them. All those who choose gallente, you have my symphathy, and you have my pity. Lol...it is hard out there now for us Gallente. If they fix the PG then we can fit the darn things better. I am having to practice flying sideways now to at least give my gunners a chance against those darn assault DS...forge gunners on the ground, drunk RDV pilots in the air, assault DS, and I can go 0-60 in 10 minutes....yea it's going to be a long road ahead! I tried to fit my Gorgon when I had no skill to, and I need to tell that this is very difficult especially because lack of PG they have. Pilots should be able to remove turret's and all "yellow modules" as well, not just replace them with other items that take less cpu/pg. Vehicles without turrets give players more possibilities to fit them as they want, not just like game mechanics force them to do. |
Skihids
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
1251
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 15:45:00 -
[44] - Quote
I'm still flying the Viper and trying to get used to the new inertia of the ships.
I think that's what the dev notes referred to when they said that they "Added a feeling of weight to the dropship".
The added "mass" means all the ships will take more thrust to get moving and more thrust to stop moving. You have to anticipate the ships actions and take the delay into account to control the ship.
This delay means more pilots will fall prey to what real student pilots fight with: "Pilot induced oscillation".
Basically you thrust hard to get moving in one direction, then realize you are going to far so you slam the controls full opposite and hold them until the ship is flying the other way even faster. You keep this up until the ship slams into the ground or a structure and blows up.
The solution is to use smaller corrections and stop correcting as soon as the bad thing stops happening. Only after you are stable should you apply inputs to reverse effect. It takes some practice and is an issue that all student pilots have to face, most often on their first landing.
A little mass makes the ships a lot more challenging to fly. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
2852
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 15:48:00 -
[45] - Quote
Skihids wrote:A little mass makes the ships a lot more challenging to fly.
I'm actually finding the most difficult part is accurately air dropping your troops. That tiny bit of drift can really send them way off target.
If dropships weren't skill based before, they sure as hell are now. |
Skihids
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
1252
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 15:58:00 -
[46] - Quote
Another big problem is that the remote camera stops or gets hung up on structures or even small hills.
When the ship gets away from you in reverse it all too often backs into a hill or structure which stops your camera but not the ship. That results in the back of the ship climbing into your face where it obscures your entire field of view, making recovery well nigh impossible.
I've also experience it moving forward when flying under or between structures. The camera stops moving but he ship doesn't, resulting in it moving further away from the operator. This is far less deadly, but still disconcerting and immersion breaking. |
Halador Osiris
Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn
301
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 16:25:00 -
[47] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Skihids wrote:A little mass makes the ships a lot more challenging to fly. I'm actually finding the most difficult part is accurately air dropping your troops. That tiny bit of drift can really send them way off target. If dropships weren't skill based before, they sure as hell are now. I'm using a Python, so I'm not entirely sure if a Myron can pull off this maneuver, but have you tried dive bombing your troops on to the objective?
Get up to a pretty good height (at LEAST higher than the MCCs) approaching your target. Before you are over the target, get into a steep dive (although not completely vertical). Don't give the ship any upward thrust (I'm not sure whether or not you should give downward thrust), and align the ship at whatever you're dropping on. When you're stable and aligned, tell your crew to get the heck out. Once the last one is out, hold backwards on your left stick and give L1 a death grip.
This maneuver will keep you out of enemy fire for the most part, however you will not be able to stay and give overhead fire support without looping back around. The team will land in a very tight group (after a very long fall), but you're gonna have to work on it a bit to get your accuracy up. You might lose a few dropships doing this as well, the ground is not forgiving at these speeds.
The python is preferable to the myron as it has superior maneuverability and can climb far faster. This means you will arrive at an optimal altitude faster, and your chances of pulling out of the dive are higher. |
DUST Fiend
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
2855
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 16:29:00 -
[48] - Quote
I personally prefer fly by drops instead of dive bomb drops, as you can easily fly past an objective and keep on going. They must have done something with the physics for Uprising though because people go waaaaaaaaaay further than they used to, so it's taking a bit of practice to get down.
Dive bombs are easier for getting your guys on target, but I feel it makes you more vulnerable because you have to go higher, you take a little longer getting away from the objective, and you run the risk of screwing up and crashing into stuff.
That's just me though in my Prometheus, they're not incredibly responsive lol. |
howard sanchez
Zumari Force Projection Caldari State
522
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 17:11:00 -
[49] - Quote
Great thread and i am happy to see it drifting into pilot to pilot discussion instead of incessant requests to CCP
Some have described the dropship flight physics as flying a brick on top of ice. When considering inertia on a single plane this feels accurate. But one thing that seems much more pronounced in Uprising is the stall mechanics.
I feel this much more in a Python because of my tendency to over compensate sending my DS off level.
I think of my DS in flight as resting upon a vertical tower of pressure that keeps me aloft. Whenever the craft tilts i begin to lose lift and elevation. So tightly banked turns are losing me speed and elevation more rapidly than I have been used to.
I also believe that, once we master this new flight model, we will be able to use these physics features to our advantage to pull off great maneuvers that a less skilled pilot ( or forge gunner) will marvel at.
We just have to get CCP to allow us a viable gameplay role in order to grow that skill base. |
gbghg
L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION
1496
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 17:25:00 -
[50] - Quote
If your using a python and want to add style, you can backflip into the dive. It's actually a pretty good way of starting a dive as it kills most if your forward momentum, and instakicks you into the forward flight mode(you know, when your engines are horizontal and you get the wind effect) |
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Skihids
The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION
1254
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 17:52:00 -
[51] - Quote
howard sanchez wrote:Great thread and i am happy to see it drifting into pilot to pilot discussion instead of incessant requests to CCP
Some have described the dropship flight physics as flying a brick on top of ice. When considering inertia on a single plane this feels accurate. But one thing that seems much more pronounced in Uprising is the stall mechanics.
I feel this much more in a Python because of my tendency to over compensate sending my DS off level.
I think of my DS in flight as resting upon a vertical tower of pressure that keeps me aloft. Whenever the craft tilts i begin to lose lift and elevation. So tightly banked turns are losing me speed and elevation more rapidly than I have been used to.
I also believe that, once we master this new flight model, we will be able to use these physics features to our advantage to pull off great maneuvers that a less skilled pilot ( or forge gunner) will marvel at.
We just have to get CCP to allow us a viable gameplay role in order to grow that skill base.
You are balancing on thrust. This flight model was introduced way back in Precursor.
The vertical component of thrust holds you up and the horizontal component moves you across the map. Your throttle controls the total amount of thrust and the ship's orientation determines how much of that is in the vertical plane. The more you tilt (in any direction), the more thrust is shifted from holing you up in the sky and consequently the more altitude you will lose.
Tilt ten degrees and you won't notice much, tilt ninety degrees and you have zero vertical thrust.
The increased inertia exacerbates the loss as you need time to cancel your downward momentum before you can begin regaining altitude. |
Ted Nugget
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
93
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 17:56:00 -
[52] - Quote
I just find it freaking annoying that I get shot down so easily by something that costs a fraction of the ship. |
gbghg
L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION
1496
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 18:07:00 -
[53] - Quote
Economics of war ted, it's like that in real life too. Multi-million pound aircraft get shot down by missiles which cost -ú50,000. There's always a cheap counter to an Expensive weapon. |
Garrett Blacknova
Codex Troopers
2870
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 18:11:00 -
[54] - Quote
Ted Nugget wrote:I just find it freaking annoying that I get shot down so easily by something that costs a fraction of the ship. Actually, your Dropship costs infinitely more than my AV Starter Fit. Not even exaggerating when I say "literally". |
Nguruthos IX
Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy
298
|
Posted - 2013.05.09 18:16:00 -
[55] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Ted Nugget wrote:I just find it freaking annoying that I get shot down so easily by something that costs a fraction of the ship. Actually, your Dropship costs infinitely more than my AV Starter Fit. Not even exaggerating when I say "literally". lol yup |
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