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The lack of constructive Criticism

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Breakin Stuff Goonfeet 774	Posted - 2013.05.07 07:30:00 - [1] - Quote I have seen many try to rein in and try to calm (some try to stifle) the angry posts and encourage people to be constructive in their criticisms. The lack of communication and perception that we're not being listened to pretty much guarantees that the raging rants will never end. I don't believe anyone really thinks CCP devs pay any more attention to the constructive criticism than they do the dipstick rants that violate the EULA. Bluntly what we have here is an echo chamber of people who scream for nerfs and a few people who beg for CCP to not wreck things at random because a buncha loud goombas feel everyone is entitled to their opinions. But there is no communication. No acknowledgement of whether the DEVS think that a piece of criticism is worth watching ior if they think the poster is being a mewling CoD tryhard. No indication of what is being looked at and why, and certainly no rational explanation as to what the hell happened. This lack of communication (except with the CPM who are under an NDA gag order) is merely feeding the fire of hatred. The lack of communication is why most of us are angry. We feel that most of our words have and do fall on no ears unless someone hits the report button. We've gotten to the point where we rant and rage just to see if anyone is even paying attention. So far the answer is no. So I have no sympathy for CCP when the lack of communication means the forums turn into the Lord of the Flies. There's no adult supervision, the heaviy class started getting called piggy, and he was stabbed by the rampaging spear-chucking children. No communication is a thousand times worse than poor communication.
Jotun Hiem The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION 595	Posted - 2013.05.07 07:51:00 - [2] - Quote Nice post. I dig the literary reference. +1
Smooth Head Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic 20	Posted - 2013.05.07 07:55:00 - [3] - Quote CCP. Never apologise, never explain. Persecute those who question. I think that about covers it.
The Robot Devil BetaMax. CRONOS. 207	Posted - 2013.05.07 08:03:00 - [4] - Quote Do you want them to develop the game or spend all of their time in the forums? They need time and we should give them at least 24 hours.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet 775	Posted - 2013.05.07 08:09:00 - [5] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Do you want them to develop the game or spend all of their time in the forums? They need time and we should give them at least 24 hours. communication doesn't need to be a dev response to every little ranting nutjob here. most of those are trolls anyway. But commenting on things people think are a major problem? Explaining motivation behind decisions? hey this seems OP so we're smacking it down to see if we're imagining things? Given CCP's history in EVE it will be the next expansion in 6 months when they admit they may have made a mistake. weapons besides the AR will be re-buffed next summer's expansion. Then they'll unveil it at fanfest and tell everyone "we don't really hate you heavies." betting pool. now. I have 1 million ISK that says this is what happens.
The Robot Devil BetaMax. CRONOS. 207	Posted - 2013.05.07 08:20:00 - [6] - Quote All I am saying is that we need to give them more time. Let them look at the data and all the posts and determine what is truly broken or bugged and what is people mad that their win button is gone. No matter what we do or say it takes time and we should respect the hard work they put into this labor of love and give them what they need. I am not making excuses or trying to dissuade mercs from voicing opinions and concerns. I want balance and a fun game but we have to give them a reasonable amount of time. This is a game to us and we have lots of time to play and post but it is a job to CCP and I doubt they are on the clock 24/7. They have families and need down time to relax, let them. Imagine for one moment how you would feel if you did your job to the best of your abilities and within one hour you were told you were stupid by a bunch of people who have no idea how to do your job. Come on people let's get real and give them time to do what we want.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet 778	Posted - 2013.05.07 08:25:00 - [7] - Quote The Robot Devil wrote: Come on people let's get real and give them time to do what we want. i won't argue this point, but basically the forums are spilling over with "This build is not fun" it is a simple message. it's easy to comprehend. But we've not seen so much as an acknowledgement that we have even been heard and understood. Obedience by the devs isn't mandatory. acknowledgement would be nice though.

CCP Praetorian C C P C C P Alliance 25	Posted - 2013.05.07 08:32:00 - [8] - Quote We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed.

Olaf the Gutless DUST University Ivy League 15	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:06:00 - [9] - Quote Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol
Yay Adski Imperfects Negative-Feedback 220	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:12:00 - [10] - Quote Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol Someone didn't pay attention in class..

Smooth Head Vherokior Combat Logistics Minmatar Republic 20	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:15:00 - [11] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. I don't buy that. The last time CCP asked me for feedback I was met with anger, threats and vindicitve retribution. No sir, sort your own crap out.
KatanaPT Tech Guard General Tso's Alliance 89	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:16:00 - [12] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. Please for the love of God, add a Delete All Emails :D
Another Heavy SOB TRUE TEA BAGGERS Orion Empire 60	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:17:00 - [13] - Quote Yay Adski wrote: Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol Someone didn't pay attention in class.. I know a few people that skilled Dropsuit command to lvl5........And skilled a medium frame.....
Bubba Brown Militaires Sans Jeux 36	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:18:00 - [14] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. chances are you're listing to the IRC selectively. if that's what you guys actually do. that's ok i guess just please *please always remember* the vocal irc members are mostly members of high tier corporations. they are not your entire consumer base. if you please only them, things will go very much down hill
meri jin Algintal Core Gallente Federation 26	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:18:00 - [15] - Quote Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol I try to use the new "skilltree" and mis-skill one thing, but well, its my foult.
Panther Alpha WarRavens Orion Empire 148	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:21:00 - [16] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. I hope you don't following ALL feedback closely, because most of it is just cry baby's complaining about their favorite toys. Just ignore "some" of it, please.......
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet 784	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:21:00 - [17] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. Thank you for that.
Another Heavy SOB TRUE TEA BAGGERS Orion Empire 60	Posted - 2013.05.07 09:25:00 - [18] - Quote meri jin wrote: Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol I try to use the new "skilltree" and mis-skill one thing, but well, its my foult. Actually as long as you can read the language set on your ps3 any "mistakenly" spent SP is entirely your fault. Unless the skill is broken, which will be fixed and thus was not a waste. Now if you skilled Weaponry to V thinking you were getting complex damage mods to use on your AR, that's all on you.
Tech Ohm Eaven L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION 482	Posted - 2013.05.07 10:33:00 - [19] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. Feedback? Lasers are useless versus ARs Either buff the laser range or cut the AR range. Dying from an overheated laser? ok so wheres the folks dying from an overheated AR barrel?? (yes the AR in real life overheats and gets red hot from shooting a lot of rounds) So wheres the AR overheat?? HMG?? worthless and after a days use heres a second opinion: total and absolute garbage. Assault Dropships are broken. Bad handling i.e. unable to shoot an unmoving supply depo with the front gun on the assault dropship. The things handle like drunk hippos on ice. Fixes: better stability for dropship improve camera improve front gun tracking increase the amount of time that the assault dropship can hover before needing a power boost from the engines.(increase from one second to four seconds). I hope things are fixed in a few days. Thanks. Decides to play Skyrim since really upset!!! about Uprising Dust 514 build.
Harkon Vysarii Dead Six Initiative Lokun Listamenn 222	Posted - 2013.05.07 10:50:00 - [20] - Quote Since a Dev is watching this thread the only Issue I have come across that someone has actively told me a fix in necessary for its the vehicle skills not working for them. This guy who told me is a great tanker but cant fit things as of now because the skills dont work for him. Other than that its great to see devs commenting on threads that arent just pointless complaints.

Jathniel G I A N T EoN. 237	Posted - 2013.05.07 11:00:00 - [21] - Quote Yeah, we need a another reset. Like yesterday. OMG we so need a reset. If for nothing else but the broken skills.
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. Interstellar Murder of Crows 159	Posted - 2013.05.07 11:41:00 - [22] - Quote Bubba Brown wrote: CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. chances are you're listing to the IRC selectively. if that's what you guys actually do. that's ok i guess just please *please always remember* the vocal irc members are mostly members of high tier corporations. they are not your entire consumer base. if you please only them, things will go very much down hill This is "ok" how? How would you feel if any other company you received goods/services from only listened to a small fraction of their consumers? There are many ways of polling info out of us. All opinions deserve to be heard and acknowledged, though acknowledged doesn't necessarily mean implemented. Anything less would potentially lead to a creep of social elitism into the Dev process and we all know what happens then. Please CCP, be more open and engaged with the playerbase and I am not talking about just the good ol' boys/girls of the IRC channel.
BlG MAMA Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 65	Posted - 2013.05.07 11:44:00 - [23] - Quote its the chinese paid "forum fanboys" or you can call them TDCS -"The Damage Control Squad" that dont like constructive criticism
Hawk Steel1 The Walking Targets 4	Posted - 2013.05.07 11:54:00 - [24] - Quote All i want for my birthday is my HMG back to normal. Please.
Jammer JAMS Department of Defence Planetary Response Force Eternal Syndicate 2	Posted - 2013.05.07 12:05:00 - [25] - Quote #1Posted: 2013.05.07 12:01 \| Report \| Edited by: Jammer JAMS To be Honest about a lot of things I have played eve since 2007 This patch was quite a let down There is a lot of shiny new things in this patch here is a list of things done right and wrong please add to it people so CPP get the message Things done right. 6 person squad Voice on all channels Shiny new colors Working on Re balance Things to fix New spawn Menu should have used same keys X to select default and x to start like always Re Balance is messed up you have Nerfed all the weapons way to much there should have been some done to Laser, Sniper, Maybe a little less damage on a heavy and Forge Gun The suit fittings are all messed up now as far as PG/ CPU You have taken away what we had before and not replaced it with skills Changing all the skills was a bad Idea now most people have chosen skills that do not relate or work The HUD does not work well can't see who needs a medic Medics needles don't work anymore Nano-hive is useless now Way to little ammo Logistics can't re-spec to a use full medic A lot of the default suit fitting are fit wrong and don't give you what is needed to be a default player in that role Players are getting stuck, Map is freezing. When you die get rid of the screen that shows you who killed you you want to see what is going on. You have messed with the core of what DUST was. All you had to do was some balancing and new shinny stuff. There is probably a lot that I have not seen yet so please add to it people. In a nice way to get it fixed a list of what you like and what needs to be fixed Jammer JAMS
Charlotte O'Dell Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 296	Posted - 2013.05.07 12:12:00 - [26] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. while we're at it, can we have more than a 5 degree barrel depression on HAVs bc this is just stupid...
Tech Ohm Eaven L.O.T.I.S. RISE of LEGION 482	Posted - 2013.05.07 14:32:00 - [27] - Quote Bump of justice.
GOTDUST F U C C P 8	Posted - 2013.05.07 14:54:00 - [28] - Quote HERE'S THE SOLUTION!!!!! Allow players to respend their SP as much as they like. Moving it from one skill to another if it don't work for them. The little SP we do have will make no differnce either way. The fact that this update was released a few days before launch is INSANE!
Thor Odinson42 Planetary Response Organization 157	Posted - 2013.05.07 15:11:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. My tone is instantly changed. I will back off now. Thanks
DUST Fiend OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 2823	Posted - 2013.05.07 15:13:00 - [30] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. ::cough cough:: dropship WP ::cough cough::

Tectonic Fusion Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 2	Posted - 2013.05.07 15:16:00 - [31] - Quote Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol Same but I had enought to upgrade my weaponry to lvl 5 and get prototype assault rifle and sniper. I sure am glad
Medic 1879 The Tritan Industries RISE of LEGION 223	Posted - 2013.05.07 15:19:00 - [32] - Quote Tectonic Fusion wrote: Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol Same but I had enought to upgrade my weaponry to lvl 5 and get prototype assault rifle and sniper. I sure am glad Lol doesn't weaponry not provide a bonus anymore so if your using only light weapons theres no point skilling past lvl3?
Odiain Suliis The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 147	Posted - 2013.05.07 15:21:00 - [33] - Quote Tectonic Fusion wrote: Olaf the Gutless wrote: Skill reset would be handy. Was a complete noob and used my SP up lol Same but I had enought to upgrade my weaponry to lvl 5 and get prototype assault rifle and sniper. I sure am glad I thought you don't need weaponry to 5 to use proto AR's?
RedBleach LeSanglant Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 167	Posted - 2013.05.08 04:48:00 - [34] - Quote That is why there should be a skill reset. This is still, apparently, a beta. We've done some more testing. Given some feedback, and now need to move on with the knowledge we have gained as a playerbase and for the knowledge given to the creators. As a nod of appreciation some form of skill reset would be appreciated.
Summer-Wolf Planetary Response Organisation 28	Posted - 2013.05.08 04:54:00 - [35] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. NO!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!! you didnt release any details to us?!!?! and broke everything in this build?!?!?! you didnt listen to us before and now you gonna pretend you are?!?! BULL**** no!!!! you ban people for negative criticism but you dont take ANY from us!!! you wanted us to help you test the game for a year and this is suppose to be the fruit of our testing?! Is this a bad joke? NO. You played with most of us enough. You went back on legal terms, changed your mind at the last second before a patch and you are now scrambling to fix whatever is left with your reputation with Sony. You are listening to us? Then what the hell is this?! You are a clone of Gearbox. All talk, then just cowards.
Cosgar The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 532	Posted - 2013.05.08 04:56:00 - [36] - Quote While your at it, can we get a full patch notes including all the ninja nerfs with some kind of footnote on reasoning behind the change. I'd like to know why almost everything that wasn't an AR took a damage nerf. You know, to debunk any favoritism theories.
Summer-Wolf Planetary Response Organisation 28	Posted - 2013.05.08 04:59:00 - [37] - Quote Cosgar wrote: While your at it, can we get a full patch notes including all the ninja nerfs with some kind of footnote on reasoning behind the change. I'd like to know why almost everything that wasn't an AR took a damage nerf. You know, to debunk any favoritism theories. I want a patch notes of their screw ups and an apology from them. Not a "hey we looking at your comments on the forums and working on stuff". Thats what we did for a year to get to release.
NeoWraith Acedia Fraternity of St. Venefice Amarr Empire 219	Posted - 2013.05.08 05:02:00 - [38] - Quote GOTDUST wrote: HERE'S THE SOLUTION!!!!! Allow players to respend their SP as much as they like. Moving it from one skill to another if it don't work for them. The little SP we do have will make no differnce either way. Stick to local chat.
Deluxe Edition TeamPlayers EoN. 139	Posted - 2013.05.08 05:18:00 - [39] - Quote Summer-Wolf wrote: CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. NO!!! ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!! you didnt release any details to us?!!?! and broke everything in this build?!?!?! you didnt listen to us before and now you gonna pretend you are?!?! BULL**** no!!!! you ban people for negative criticism but you dont take ANY from us!!! you wanted us to help you test the game for a year and this is suppose to be the fruit of our testing?! Is this a bad joke? NO. You played with most of us enough. You went back on legal terms, changed your mind at the last second before a patch and you are now scrambling to fix whatever is left with your reputation with Sony. You are listening to us? Then what the hell is this?! You are a clone of Gearbox. All talk, then just cowards. They listened in all honesty. Everyone complained about the range of almost every weapon, so they got rid of sharp shooter. Most everyone agreed that HMG's where overpowered when they speced heavily into sharp shooter. All these changes have been based on our feedback. They went a little hard on the heavies range I agree they could use a 10% bump in range along with the AR, but everything else feels right. You can't snipe everyone from across the map with most every weapon anymore, and for some that destroyed the way they used to play and they now need to adapt. For example people who where good at ranging people with AR should switch to TAC, while cqc focused assaults might consider the breach or stay with the standard AR. A note to heavies: Logi's now heal for over 100 HP/s.... Armor is win, and you are now that unpenetrable fortress when teamed with a skilled logi so qq less please.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 2780	Posted - 2013.05.08 05:20:00 - [40] - Quote CCP Praetorian wrote: We are monitoring these discussions actively, and we are extremely grateful for all of the feedback. Our teams are actively working on stabilizing, fixing and improving things, and following the forums helps them do their job better. So, please keep the feedback coming. It does not get un-noticed. That's nice to say, but it would be nicer if we were seeing evidence of our feedback being noticed. More posts like the acknowledgement of the vehicle PG skill issue - but preferably with ACTUALLY CLEAR LANGUAGE USED. Don't just tell us "PG skill on vehicles is broken, we'll fix it". Tell us "Vehicle Engineering is applying a CPU cost reduction for PG modules when the description says it gives an increase to PG. Description to be amended to reflect actual effect" or "Vehicle Engineering is applying a CPU cost reduction when the description says it gives an increase to PG. Will be corrected so PG increase is applied". Saying "there's a problem with X, we'll fix it" isn't helpful. Explain WHAT the problem is, and HOW you're going to fix it. Also, with that specific example, there are people who spent SP we don't have to spare on our characters, some of which will go to waste even if the skill is fixed because we had to over-spend to find out the skill wasn't working. Giving a straight answer to the currently-much-requested "can we get another respec because I got screwed by X?" question should be a pretty high priority. Also, there have been numerous threads locked ove the Merc Pack issue, and there's at least one still floating around with an actually valid solution where you guys have offered an unfair change to the terms you agreed to, so an answer to the fact that there are still plenty of legitimate complaints about that would be nice as well.



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