DUST Search - Discussion on True Merc Corps and Planetary Conquest

Ydubbs81 RND wrote:

Zion Shad wrote:

Ydubbs81 RND wrote:

How will a merc corp take a district for another corp anyway? If they go in with 16, then that means they will be responsible for handling the clone cost and transfers. But I'm going to assume that the newly acquired district will now be in the merc's name.

I'm thinking that a merc corp will be better off just ringing 13 members (as they can only enter via squads). That way....their cost is cheaper and corps will be able to afford them more frequently. Because once you start approaching 9 figure costs, corps will not be able to use afford them. And when you think about it.....most of the corps that will utilize merc corp services will be ones who may not be able to hold their own territory (number-wise or skill-wise).

I'm thinking anywhere from $10M - $20M win or lose is reasonable. And if the mercs win, then you reimburse their gear cost on top of the agreed upon fee. I mean, listen.......any deal can be struck. It depends on the negotiating parties, tbh

Edit: Man, mercenary work sounds like much more fun :)

The ringers in Squads is the best way to go. Use your own Clones and don't pay for anyone elses. The situation I can see using Merc's for my corp would be when times arise and we might need more man power to defend. Other times would be if we feel we need a bit more of an edge on an enemy team.

Dubbs (and any one intrested) we may want to work on an unbiased Merc channel where any skilled player and Corp CEO/Director can be permitted to communicate during PC. That way negotiations and squads can be formed in real time and on a moments noticed. Get a lot of trusted admin and set chat rules so if ever a deal goes south then remove any party that backs on their deal.

Wonder what would be the going rate for individual mercs :D.

But to be honest, I'm not sure how I feel about ringers though. I think that it will ruin the allure of planetary conquest for me. If not ruin, it could definitely damper it.

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Zion Shad ZionTCD 1698	Posted - 2013.04.22 19:17:00 - [1] - Quote Looking at the cost of just a battle alone and the amount of ISK to be made daily off distric Clone sales, what will be the avg. going rate for a Merc corp? Will there even be a true place for them in PC and who plans to go this route?
trollsroyce Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 305	Posted - 2013.04.22 20:20:00 - [2] - Quote Merc corps both have the cake and eat it. Nothing is deterring mercs from owning districts and defending them for steady isk; they only make people pay their offensives if they are good enough.
Vaerana Myshtana Bojo's School of the Trades 708	Posted - 2013.04.22 20:39:00 - [3] - Quote Hmm... Well, assuming an average district has 300 clones to start with and the attacker gets a 2/1 KDR and blows up the MCC before or at the 150 defender clone mark... Attacker buys 150 clones for 80,000,000 ISK and attacks. Biomass: Defender loses 150 clones. Attacker loses 75 clones. Biomass = 225 clones * 80,000 = 18,000,000 ISK Resale: Attacker steals 40 clones and keep 75 of the original. Resale = 115 clones * 100,000 = 11,500,000 ISK Loot: Hard to quantify right now. Use it to round up to nearest 5M ISK. Total: 29,500,000 ISK (Round to 30M) So, a purely Merc corp with no districts of its own would need to charge 50M ISK for a single attack. That, of course, presumes that some form of payment could take place.
Marston VC SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 154	Posted - 2013.04.22 20:49:00 - [4] - Quote I would say 32 million is a good steady rate for merc corps. Everyone gets covered for 1 million in losses, and another million as payment. Anything they don't lose out of the first million can be looked at as a bonus payment. Not that it will matter at first though because people are going to make money based off the loot destroyed, but if we do have a say in payouts I would think a number around 32 million would be expected. Value merc corps (corps that run with like standard or militia gear) could probably pull off prices as low as 16 million but they wouldn't be as reliable.
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming EoN. 2814	Posted - 2013.04.22 21:30:00 - [5] - Quote Vaerana Myshtana wrote: Hmm... Well, assuming an average district has 300 clones to start with and the attacker gets a 2/1 KDR and blows up the MCC before or at the 150 defender clone mark... Attacker buys 150 clones for 80,000,000 ISK and attacks. Biomass: Defender loses 150 clones. Attacker loses 75 clones. Biomass = 225 clones * 80,000 = 18,000,000 ISK Resale: Attacker steals 40 clones and keep 75 of the original. Resale = 115 clones * 100,000 = 11,500,000 ISK Loot: Hard to quantify right now. Use it to round up to nearest 5M ISK. Total: 29,500,000 ISK (Round to 30M) So, a purely Merc corp with no districts of its own would need to charge 50M ISK for a single attack. That, of course, presumes that some form of payment could take place. ur price of 50M just breaks them even on the original 80M they spent on the attack ur also not factoring gear losses that would need to be reimbursed/covered as part of the fee + merc corps need to make a profit not break even or make losses. Merc work on DUST i forsee being very expensive as most top tier corps who plan to do some form of merc work will no doubt plan to use their best available gear as well, after all ur being paid to do a job so u will wanna go all out.
Knarf Black Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 601	Posted - 2013.04.22 21:47:00 - [6] - Quote I get the feeling that there will be territory involved as well as ISK. A big corp could perhaps let a talented allied merc corp have one or two relatively safe districts in exchange for their services as ringers in battle.
Zion Shad ZionTCD 1698	Posted - 2013.04.22 22:32:00 - [7] - Quote What if you (the Merc Corp) are just joining squads of the Corp that hired you? This would mean around 3 Merc of the hiring corp to bring you in the battle through squads and that would make 13 Mercs using the clones off the hiring Corp and not buying a pack for $80 mill.
Cerebral Wolf Jr Immobile Infantry 917	Posted - 2013.04.22 22:53:00 - [8] - Quote It's impossible to say considering nobody knows the gear costs post patch. The money has to, at a minimum cover the clone pack cost the merc corp will use, their gear and their reward for doing the work.
Veritas Vitae Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 124	Posted - 2013.04.23 00:45:00 - [9] - Quote Mercenary work fees will depend on the type of work hired to perform. Ringing for corps will most likely be much cheaper than full-on assault teams, but either way a good merc can still earn a pretty penny when the target is juicy enough.
Zion Shad ZionTCD 1699	Posted - 2013.04.23 02:06:00 - [10] - Quote Veritas Vitae wrote: Mercenary work fees will depend on the type of work hired to perform. Ringing for corps will most likely be much cheaper than full-on assault teams, but either way a good merc can still earn a pretty penny when the target is juicy enough. Agree. Ringers in squads for the hiring team will be most cost effective and used a lot in defending.

Vaerana Myshtana Bojo's School of the Trades 713	Posted - 2013.04.23 02:12:00 - [11] - Quote Knarf Black wrote: I get the feeling that there will be territory involved as well as ISK. A big corp could perhaps let a talented allied merc corp have one or two relatively safe districts in exchange for their services as ringers in battle. Yeah, this would be an example of a "renter". It's also one of the reasons to let said corp into your alliance.
Iron Wolf Saber BetaMax. CRONOS. 3634	Posted - 2013.04.23 03:00:00 - [12] - Quote /me flags thread for future reading.
Draxus Prime BurgezzE.T.F Orion Empire 234	Posted - 2013.04.23 03:05:00 - [13] - Quote why is thread only populated by corps that can affored PC
Swear-n-SC WOLF AND IRON STRIKE FORCE 1	Posted - 2013.04.23 03:47:00 - [14] - Quote I haven't discussed this with my Directors yet, but I would like to see our Corp. run as "ringers" for PC. I for one DO NOT want the heart ache of running a District. Too much BS for me. But, we're not that big (yet.) I'm a Merc pure and simple. Will keep checking on this thread to how this will turn out. "Walks off shaking head, Man Oh Man, CCP what kind a can of worms have you Opened?"
slap26 Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 562	Posted - 2013.04.23 03:52:00 - [15] - Quote or the employer covers clone packs and equipment lost on the dust side, but the big payday is handled with EVE isk
XxWarlordxX97 Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 1517	Posted - 2013.04.23 03:53:00 - [16] - Quote slap26 wrote: or the employer covers clone packs and equipment lost on the dust side, but the big payday is handled with EVE isk sounds good
VicBoss Militaires-Sans-Frontieres 208	Posted - 2013.04.23 04:09:00 - [17] - Quote trollsroyce wrote: Merc corps both have the cake and eat it. Nothing is deterring mercs from owning districts and defending them for steady isk; they only make people pay their offensives if they are good enough. awww hell ya! see you around guys
Mavado V Noriega SyNergy Gaming EoN. 2831	Posted - 2013.04.23 04:27:00 - [18] - Quote slap26 wrote: or the employer covers clone packs and equipment lost on the dust side, but the big payday is handled with EVE isk .........that u'll get to transfer sometime in 2015!
Zion Shad ZionTCD Unclaimed. 1717	Posted - 2013.04.28 15:43:00 - [19] - Quote Would you or your Corp want to become sponsored gamers through AUR and AUR items?
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 302	Posted - 2013.04.28 15:51:00 - [20] - Quote A merc corp can be easily done The ppl who will benefit most will be EVE players who have lots of ISK to blow on hitting up a planet which may make them billions in the long term The DUST alliances and corps themseleves will be self sufficent and i doubt they will hire each other to do something when they should be able to do it themselves As for prices if attacking the alliance/corp who wants it done will have to fork out for the clones - 80mil and add in equipment lost they may do a deal to cover the losses also or if the mercs fail to complete the attack and lose they could maybe cover the losses like 50% Defending wise clones is no problem, the defenders just pay for the equipment lost in battle But no profit in my examples, so just say attacking is 80mil + 50 in lost assets, they could round it to 150mil for a loss but 200mil for a win so they get a smaller profit for losing but bigger for winning Defending is generally cheaper so it could be straight 100mil Add in the ability to make equipment that may lower the price overall so the EVE corps/alliances can make what the mercs need and provide it to them Being a merc solider is harder tho, a DUST corp could screw you over easily as could the EVE corp unless you ask for so much upfront

HowDidThatTaste Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2387	Posted - 2013.04.28 16:13:00 - [21] - Quote Zion Shad wrote: Would you or your Corp want to become sponsored gamers through AUR and AUR items? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=721736#post721736 Isn't this a redundant question. Why would anyone not want to get pay with aurum? You can buy suits weapons and mods with it. And you get plenty of isk as loot or salvage. So why wouldn't people want aurum seems like a silly question really.
Zion Shad ZionTCD Unclaimed. 1717	Posted - 2013.04.28 16:22:00 - [22] - Quote HowDidThatTaste wrote: Zion Shad wrote: Would you or your Corp want to become sponsored gamers through AUR and AUR items? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=721736#post721736 Isn't this a redundant question. Why would anyone not want to get pay with aurum? You can buy suits weapons and mods with it. And you get plenty of isk as loot or salvage. So why wouldn't people want aurum seems like a silly question really. Well for starters you could use the AUR to make ISK. AUR is used to get things that can't be bought with ISK for now. So all in all you're saying no one should be a Merc because they should not want to be paid?
HowDidThatTaste Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2387	Posted - 2013.04.28 16:37:00 - [23] - Quote Zion Shad wrote: HowDidThatTaste wrote: Zion Shad wrote: Would you or your Corp want to become sponsored gamers through AUR and AUR items? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=721736#post721736 Isn't this a redundant question. Why would anyone not want to get pay with aurum? You can buy suits weapons and mods with it. And you get plenty of isk as loot or salvage. So why wouldn't people want aurum seems like a silly question really. Well for starters you could use the AUR to make ISK. AUR is used to get things that can't be bought with ISK for now. So all in all you're saying no one should be a Merc because they should not want to be paid? I think if you re-read my answer you will see that it is a no brainer everyone should want to be paid in aurum.,
Zion Shad ZionTCD Unclaimed. 1717	Posted - 2013.04.28 16:42:00 - [24] - Quote HowDidThatTaste wrote: Zion Shad wrote: HowDidThatTaste wrote: Zion Shad wrote: Would you or your Corp want to become sponsored gamers through AUR and AUR items? https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=721736#post721736 Isn't this a redundant question. Why would anyone not want to get pay with aurum? You can buy suits weapons and mods with it. And you get plenty of isk as loot or salvage. So why wouldn't people want aurum seems like a silly question really. Well for starters you could use the AUR to make ISK. AUR is used to get things that can't be bought with ISK for now. So all in all you're saying no one should be a Merc because they should not want to be paid? I think if you re-read my answer you will see that it is a no brainer everyone should want to be paid in aurum., Cool Got ya
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries 1099	Posted - 2013.04.28 22:18:00 - [25] - Quote How will a merc corp take a district for another corp anyway? If they go in with 16, then that means they will be responsible for handling the clone cost and transfers. But I'm going to assume that the newly acquired district will now be in the merc's name. I'm thinking that a merc corp will be better off just ringing 13 members (as they can only enter via squads). That way....their cost is cheaper and corps will be able to afford them more frequently. Because once you start approaching 9 figure costs, corps will not be able to use afford them. And when you think about it.....most of the corps that will utilize merc corp services will be ones who may not be able to hold their own territory (number-wise or skill-wise). I'm thinking anywhere from $10M - $20M win or lose is reasonable. And if the mercs win, then you reimburse their gear cost on top of the agreed upon fee. I mean, listen.......any deal can be struck. It depends on the negotiating parties, tbh Edit: Man, mercenary work sounds like much more fun :)
Zion Shad ZionTCD Unclaimed. 1717	Posted - 2013.04.28 23:37:00 - [26] - Quote Ydubbs81 RND wrote: How will a merc corp take a district for another corp anyway? If they go in with 16, then that means they will be responsible for handling the clone cost and transfers. But I'm going to assume that the newly acquired district will now be in the merc's name. I'm thinking that a merc corp will be better off just ringing 13 members (as they can only enter via squads). That way....their cost is cheaper and corps will be able to afford them more frequently. Because once you start approaching 9 figure costs, corps will not be able to use afford them. And when you think about it.....most of the corps that will utilize merc corp services will be ones who may not be able to hold their own territory (number-wise or skill-wise). I'm thinking anywhere from $10M - $20M win or lose is reasonable. And if the mercs win, then you reimburse their gear cost on top of the agreed upon fee. I mean, listen.......any deal can be struck. It depends on the negotiating parties, tbh Edit: Man, mercenary work sounds like much more fun :) The ringers in Squads is the best way to go. Use your own Clones and don't pay for anyone elses. The situation I can see using Merc's for my corp would be when times arise and we might need more man power to defend. Other times would be if we feel we need a bit more of an edge on an enemy team. Dubbs (and any one intrested) we may want to work on an unbiased Merc channel where any skilled player and Corp CEO/Director can be permitted to communicate during PC. That way negotiations and squads can be formed in real time and on a moments noticed. Get a lot of trusted admin and set chat rules so if ever a deal goes south then remove any party that backs on their deal.
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries 1100	Posted - 2013.04.28 23:43:00 - [27] - Quote Zion Shad wrote: Ydubbs81 RND wrote: How will a merc corp take a district for another corp anyway? If they go in with 16, then that means they will be responsible for handling the clone cost and transfers. But I'm going to assume that the newly acquired district will now be in the merc's name. I'm thinking that a merc corp will be better off just ringing 13 members (as they can only enter via squads). That way....their cost is cheaper and corps will be able to afford them more frequently. Because once you start approaching 9 figure costs, corps will not be able to use afford them. And when you think about it.....most of the corps that will utilize merc corp services will be ones who may not be able to hold their own territory (number-wise or skill-wise). I'm thinking anywhere from $10M - $20M win or lose is reasonable. And if the mercs win, then you reimburse their gear cost on top of the agreed upon fee. I mean, listen.......any deal can be struck. It depends on the negotiating parties, tbh Edit: Man, mercenary work sounds like much more fun :) The ringers in Squads is the best way to go. Use your own Clones and don't pay for anyone elses. The situation I can see using Merc's for my corp would be when times arise and we might need more man power to defend. Other times would be if we feel we need a bit more of an edge on an enemy team. Dubbs (and any one intrested) we may want to work on an unbiased Merc channel where any skilled player and Corp CEO/Director can be permitted to communicate during PC. That way negotiations and squads can be formed in real time and on a moments noticed. Get a lot of trusted admin and set chat rules so if ever a deal goes south then remove any party that backs on their deal. Wonder what would be the going rate for individual mercs :D. But to be honest, I'm not sure how I feel about ringers though. I think that it will ruin the allure of planetary conquest for me. If not ruin, it could definitely damper it.
Zion Shad ZionTCD Unclaimed. 1717	Posted - 2013.04.28 23:55:00 - [28] - Quote Not me, plus it be nice to open the door of communication for those corps that are trying to get out there and have not been around as long as you and I. Free Beers had an idea sometime back about Mercs paying an insurance that might be a good idea now. IGÇÖd have to chat with him about it again because I see this as something that will take off. Might as well get started now.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 309	Posted - 2013.04.29 10:09:00 - [29] - Quote Ydubbs81 RND wrote: Zion Shad wrote: Ydubbs81 RND wrote: How will a merc corp take a district for another corp anyway? If they go in with 16, then that means they will be responsible for handling the clone cost and transfers. But I'm going to assume that the newly acquired district will now be in the merc's name. I'm thinking that a merc corp will be better off just ringing 13 members (as they can only enter via squads). That way....their cost is cheaper and corps will be able to afford them more frequently. Because once you start approaching 9 figure costs, corps will not be able to use afford them. And when you think about it.....most of the corps that will utilize merc corp services will be ones who may not be able to hold their own territory (number-wise or skill-wise). I'm thinking anywhere from $10M - $20M win or lose is reasonable. And if the mercs win, then you reimburse their gear cost on top of the agreed upon fee. I mean, listen.......any deal can be struck. It depends on the negotiating parties, tbh Edit: Man, mercenary work sounds like much more fun :) The ringers in Squads is the best way to go. Use your own Clones and don't pay for anyone elses. The situation I can see using Merc's for my corp would be when times arise and we might need more man power to defend. Other times would be if we feel we need a bit more of an edge on an enemy team. Dubbs (and any one intrested) we may want to work on an unbiased Merc channel where any skilled player and Corp CEO/Director can be permitted to communicate during PC. That way negotiations and squads can be formed in real time and on a moments noticed. Get a lot of trusted admin and set chat rules so if ever a deal goes south then remove any party that backs on their deal. Wonder what would be the going rate for individual mercs :D. But to be honest, I'm not sure how I feel about ringers though. I think that it will ruin the allure of planetary conquest for me. If not ruin, it could definitely damper it. Going rate for an individual merc will vary greatly Take me for example Vehicle pilot, both dropships, both LAVs and both HAVs upto the top with perfect support skills and the best turrets My standard HAV fit is 1mil, but if i use the Surya/Sagaris it tends to rise to about 2.2-2.5mil Now ther is 2 way this could be done, you could pay me a lump sum say 25mil for 1 battle, in that battle you will cover all my equipment expenses aswell and we can have an agreement on how hard i should push for the win so that could mean me dropping 10HAVs or even more but only on the basis that you will cover the expenses - of course you could shaft me after the battle but then as a merc i cannot really take revenge except blacklisting you and your corps name and send out a warning to any and all merc/merc corps and alliances that you are not to be trusted and you will not honor the deal/agreement The 2nd way is that you pay me a lump sum 25mil but this time you will only cover equipment expenses to 10fits, so i can bring in 10 HAVs but no more because it would cost me so if i did use all 10fits i then will run around in free fits until the end of the match, if i dont use all 10fits then its cheaper to you but if we did win it would be a nice bonus if you did pay out 10fits instead of 6 for example - of course you could shaft me after the battle but then as a merc i cannot really take revenge except blacklisting you and your corps name and send out a warning to any and all merc/merc corps and alliances that you are not to be trusted and you will not honor the deal/agreement The only way a merc can get paid is if he gets paid upfront at this moment, even asking for equipment coverage they can still shaft him so in that case essentially as a merc i would ask for ISK upfront but tbh if i was a corp member i wouldnt shaft a merc/merc corp as the bad publicity is still publicity but also if you need help you cant hire because no one will touch you except for scrubs maybe because of previous actions
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries 1102	Posted - 2013.04.29 11:56:00 - [30] - Quote Mercs can deddfinitely shaft you as well...if paid up front. They can make a deal with you and at the same time, accept a contract from the opposition. "Whatever he's paying you, I'll double it".



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