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CCP, we closed beta vets are begging you.....

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tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 721	Posted - 2013.04.15 18:55:00 - [1] - Quote Please don't give in to the people demanding merc pack refunds/aurum refunds. If you must take this demand into consideration, consider this..........those who want refund get sp reset too. I heard somewhere that a full aurum refund would also involve character reset? I may be wrong, but a lot of us are at a comfortable position now in terms of skills etc, and it would be wrong to punish 90% of players because of the 10% who want this refund .
Arkena Wyrnspire Turalyon Plus 66	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:02:00 - [2] - Quote This entire thing is hugely out of proportion from what was necessary. We have a dozen threads on this already. I do agree with you, though.
Hazed2085 Bragian Order Amarr Empire 7	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:03:00 - [3] - Quote this game sbarely has any players. ive seen the op; in game and i mostly play with and against the same people every gamejavascript:if%20(typeof%20posting=='undefined'\|\|posting!=true)%20{posting=true;__doPostBack('forum$ctl00$PostReply','');}
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1128	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:07:00 - [4] - Quote Yeah, totally fair. If you want the stuff you bought, you gotta be punished. I mean hey, clearly it's the player's fault that CCP doesn't have their ** together. I just want the stuff I purchased ** me, right?
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS. 3437	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:10:00 - [5] - Quote They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying.
Chris F2112 187. 42	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:12:00 - [6] - Quote I agree completely. People complaining about this should get the choice to have all their Aurum refunded upon release as long as they forfeit all stats and SP. If I was CCP I would just make it a mandatory reset for those who bought that merc pack. That way they will get exactly what the merc pack originally stated. Lucky for them CCP is nicer than I am.
Moochie Cricket SyNergy Gaming EoN. 192	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:14:00 - [7] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying. This. +1
tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 726	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:15:00 - [8] - Quote Arkena Wyrnspire wrote: This entire thing is hugely out of proportion from what was necessary. We have a dozen threads on this already. I do agree with you, though. I know there's a dozen threads already, but they are threads demanding said refund, not pleading for ccp to ignore it.
ReGnUM Public Relations Imperfects Public Relations 121	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:16:00 - [9] - Quote Forum Vet here. I could honestly careless what they do... However, I see this situation as a win win for me. CCP breaks their legal word. I will bash them for it. CCP breaks their word to the community about a reset. I will also bash them for it. I guess that is what happens when you don't think things through, or have a general road map. Either way the next few weeks are going to be very exciting .
NIKIA BETHUNE Ill Omens EoN. 123	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:23:00 - [10] - Quote The best thing for everyone would be for ccp to reset stats not completely just the sp using active and passive boosters I think a complete reset would be drastic. I know I have spent around $200of merc packs but I don't want the aur back I know what I was buying. And I'm not mad at people for taking advantage of opportunity CCP are big boys& girl simple truth is they should not have keep that clause after the move and the last wipe. We are all adults I say they simple take responsibly for their mistake and we all drive on.

Kristoff Atruin Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 415	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:26:00 - [11] - Quote Of course it would also be quite simple to say that the move to TQ was commercial release, since anyone and everyone in the world could buy things for the game at that point. What does commercial release even mean? It's not like this is a game that will be in a box on the shelf in Walmart. When merc packs started being sold during closed beta it was assumed that we would be getting wiped again at release, as we did with every build. They had no plans at all for how to reward beta players for their contribution. It was big news when they decided that our reward would be to not get reset, but they are under no obligation at all to not reset us. That's a gift, not part of some "contract". The wording for the merc pack refunds was directly related to character resets, because we had to be assured that we would still have our space dollars after the inevitable and frequent resets. CCP could honor this agreement by wiping us all out and making us start with brand new characters, with all the merc pack items refunded along with the special event rewards. Of course that would be incredibly bad for all of us, especially those who bought BPOs before the prices went up.
ISuperstar Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 31	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:28:00 - [12] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: Yeah, totally fair. If you want the stuff you bought, you gotta be punished. I mean hey, clearly it's the player's fault that CCP doesn't have their ** together. I just want the stuff I purchased ** me, right? Yes f#ck you, self entitled prick.
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1128	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:47:00 - [13] - Quote ISuperstar wrote: Baal Roo wrote: Yeah, totally fair. If you want the stuff you bought, you gotta be punished. I mean hey, clearly it's the player's fault that CCP doesn't have their ** together. I just want the stuff I purchased ** me, right? Yes f#ck you, self entitled prick. Yes. I'm entitled to get what I bought. It's a monetary transaction, that's how it works ya clown. Does it feel good White Knighting for CCP? Do you think they might have you over for tea later for defending their honor?
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1128	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:50:00 - [14] - Quote Kristoff Atruin wrote: Of course it would also be quite simple to say that the move to TQ was commercial release, since anyone and everyone in the world could buy things for the game at that point. What does commercial release even mean? It's not like this is a game that will be in a box on the shelf in Walmart. When merc packs started being sold during closed beta it was assumed that we would be getting wiped again at release, as we did with every build. They had no plans at all for how to reward beta players for their contribution. It was big news when they decided that our reward would be to not get reset, but they are under no obligation at all to not reset us. That's a gift, not part of some "contract". The wording for the merc pack refunds was directly related to character resets, because we had to be assured that we would still have our space dollars after the inevitable and frequent resets. CCP could honor this agreement by wiping us all out and making us start with brand new characters, with all the merc pack items refunded along with the special event rewards. Of course that would be incredibly bad for all of us, especially those who bought BPOs before the prices went up. But it's clearly NOT directly related to character resets, it specifically (and I assume intentionally) mentions both character resets and commercial release separately. No one needs to worry about a reset anyhow, CCP have stated already that they have a reimbursement program they will soon be rolling out to honor the contents of the Merc Pack.
Arramakaian Eka Tronhadar Free Guard Minmatar Republic 370	Posted - 2013.04.15 19:52:00 - [15] - Quote As a closed beta player, I disagree. CCP (and all game developers and publishers and businesses in general) must be held to their promises. They promised AUR refund, they must deliver. It's not the players' fault CCP can't get their marketing and PR act together.
Kristoff Atruin Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 417	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:00:00 - [16] - Quote It clearly isn't? It clearly is. Character resets refers to resets done in beta for testing purposes. We know for a fact that there were no plans to let us keep our SP and isk at release. We bugged CCP about this for months, hoping to get them to let us keep our progress. I'll repeat myself, it was huge news when they decided to let us keep our SP. The plan had been to wipe us all at release and put us on even footing with the newbie hordes. That is what the merc pack disclaimers referred to as commercial release. CCP decided to give us an extra reward for testing this game through its darkest days. That reward was to not wipe us at release. That wipe (which they now intend to not do) was the very reason that language existed on the merc pack to begin with. Another option I'd love to see is for CCP to give people the chance to reset their characters as if they'd never had any aurum. eg: figure out how much passive and active SP sans boosters would have been given, and cut back your SP to that level. Revoke the aurum items, then refund the $20 to your credit card.
Icy TIG3R Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz Noir. Mercenary Group 101	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:05:00 - [17] - Quote Baal Roo wrote: Yeah, totally fair. If you want the stuff you bought, you gotta be punished. I mean hey, clearly it's the player's fault that CCP doesn't have their ** together. I just want the stuff I purchased ** me, right? stfu, nowhere did it say that the merc pack was buy one, get one free, if you want your aur, deal with a reset.
Gunner Nightingale Internal Error. Negative-Feedback 509	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:07:00 - [18] - Quote OP i am i closed beta vet, i will simply ask if you know what happens when you assume?
Geth Massredux ZionTCD Legacy Rising 139	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:11:00 - [19] - Quote Seriously, a character reset would suck, after all the time spent, railgun sniping, blowing up people with remote explosives, skilling into the **** I never will use again, all that time spent was from closed beta and now. I could care less for a aurum refund, I put my money into this game, supporting it because its probably the best fps out there, I put my money into this game for a good reason, all I need now is that sp respec and im good, and that goes for lots of closed beta players- im sure Also even though it says aurum refund after full release(when buying a merc pack) The game isnt being fully released. Who the hell knows when it will? If uprising build is the full release somebody please tell me if thats true- If it is then i will shut up on this topic...
Calgoth Reborn United Front LLC 237	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:26:00 - [20] - Quote tribal wyvern wrote: Please don't give in to the people demanding merc pack refunds/aurum refunds. If you must take this demand into consideration, consider this..........those who want refund get sp reset too. I heard somewhere that a full aurum refund would also involve character reset? I may be wrong, but a lot of us are at a comfortable position now in terms of skills etc, and it would be wrong to punish 90% of players because of the 10% who want this refund . I am a closed beta vet you don't speak for me so stop acting like you do and stop acting like your opinion on the subject is all that matter's because it certainly does not. I am also sure the other beta vet's would also say you don't speak for them as well so stop with the we bullshit. Does anyone else remember CCP saying it would be crazy to charge for item's during beta without giving you a refund at CR I certainly do.

Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 80	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:32:00 - [21] - Quote ReGnUM Public Relations wrote: Forum Vet here. I could honestly careless what they do... However, I see this situation as a win win for me. CCP breaks their legal word. I will bash them for it. CCP breaks their word to the community about a reset. I will also bash them for it. I guess that is what happens when you don't think things through, or have a general road map. Either way the next few weeks are going to be very exciting . Forum Vet forgets that all of that hinges on just a few simple words which are generally considered to be part and parcel of any T&C Terms and Conditions are Subject to Change without Prior Notice. Also, it is "couldn't care less", saying that you "could care less" implies that you care in the first place. TBH though, I don't really expect much in the way of mental gymnastics from you, you are, after all, Imperfect.
Maximus Stryker Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 419	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:41:00 - [22] - Quote I thought everyone was under the impression that when we made our last transition to TQ and had this past reset, that people were moving forward being careful with their SP and not wasting their AUR. Was I the only one operating as if I was not going to get a reset/respec or any of my Merc Pack items/ AUR back?
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 80	Posted - 2013.04.15 20:43:00 - [23] - Quote Maximus Stryker wrote: I thought everyone was under the impression that when we made our last transition to TQ and had this past reset, that people were moving forward being careful with their SP and not wasting their AUR. Was I the only one operating as if I was not going to get a reset/respec or any of my Merc Pack items/ AUR back? No, most of us were in the same boat as you, though the ones who thought that they'd be able to get a yacht from CCP are the ones screaming. No need for a yacht, the lifeboat we got is just fine.
Moochie Cricket SyNergy Gaming EoN. 192	Posted - 2013.04.15 21:05:00 - [24] - Quote This is an easy fix for CCP... never go into commercial release. Problem solved.
ladwar Dead Six Initiative 139	Posted - 2013.04.15 21:11:00 - [25] - Quote Moochie Cricket wrote: This is an easy fix for CCP... never go into commercial release. Problem solved. yea, that'll work.
tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 739	Posted - 2013.04.15 22:00:00 - [26] - Quote Calgoth Reborn wrote: tribal wyvern wrote: Please don't give in to the people demanding merc pack refunds/aurum refunds. If you must take this demand into consideration, consider this..........those who want refund get sp reset too. I heard somewhere that a full aurum refund would also involve character reset? I may be wrong, but a lot of us are at a comfortable position now in terms of skills etc, and it would be wrong to punish 90% of players because of the 10% who want this refund . I am a closed beta vet you don't speak for me so stop acting like you do and stop acting like your opinion on the subject is all that matter's because it certainly does not. I am also sure the other beta vet's would also say you don't speak for them as well so stop with the we bullshit. Does anyone else remember CCP saying it would be crazy to charge for item's during beta without giving you a refund at CR I certainly do. Well out of the closed beta vets I've spoken to, alot of them agree with me (and others who have the same view). Yes my opinion matters, because IM not trying to break the game because I want free aurum. If you want your aurum back then you should forfeit your current character progression and be reset back to 0. Why ruin it for the rest of us because you are too tight fisted to accept the fact there have been enough aurum refunds to date, and the move to TQ was the LAST (ad stated by the devs MANY times).
ca ronic Moffit Bros 4	Posted - 2013.04.15 22:54:00 - [27] - Quote Tired of listening to the beggars whine. Anybody really thought they would get the aurum back along with all the stuff they bought with it, yea right. I'm into this reset about a month late so it would actually work in my favor. Rather keep the points I have acquired but dont really care much anymore.
Wigglen Tallywacker ZionTCD Legacy Rising 10	Posted - 2013.04.15 22:58:00 - [28] - Quote Will people realize its not a SP reset itsa refund.
Paran Tadec Imperfects Negative-Feedback 973	Posted - 2013.04.15 23:00:00 - [29] - Quote tribal wyvern wrote: Please don't give in to the people demanding merc pack refunds/aurum refunds. If you must take this demand into consideration, consider this..........those who want refund get sp reset too. I heard somewhere that a full aurum refund would also involve character reset? I may be wrong, but a lot of us are at a comfortable position now in terms of skills etc, and it would be wrong to punish 90% of players because of the 10% who want this refund . sycophants.
ca ronic Moffit Bros 4	Posted - 2013.04.15 23:15:00 - [30] - Quote Wigglen Tallywacker wrote: Will people realize its not a SP reset itsa refund. Some of us see it as either / or. Keep your SP or refund aurum spent.

tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 739	Posted - 2013.04.15 23:18:00 - [31] - Quote Paran Tadec wrote: tribal wyvern wrote: Please don't give in to the people demanding merc pack refunds/aurum refunds. If you must take this demand into consideration, consider this..........those who want refund get sp reset too. I heard somewhere that a full aurum refund would also involve character reset? I may be wrong, but a lot of us are at a comfortable position now in terms of skills etc, and it would be wrong to punish 90% of players because of the 10% who want this refund . sycophants. Whatever mate, im no ass kisser or suck up, I simply do not like a$$holes who want free aurum and who are trying to f**k up this game. It's not going to stop here either, a year from now people will think of another way to beg for free aurum.
Mithridates VI DUST 411 838	Posted - 2013.04.15 23:43:00 - [32] - Quote You do realise that closed beta vets are the only ones with any possibility of a legitimate claim to merc pack reimbursement? Seems strange that you speak for all of them against it.
Alaika Arbosa Matari Combat Research and Manufacture Inc. 82	Posted - 2013.04.15 23:49:00 - [33] - Quote <-------Closed Beta Player, happy with no merc pack reimbursement.
ca ronic Moffit Bros 4	Posted - 2013.04.15 23:58:00 - [34] - Quote I think I was looking at this only through my perspective. What if someone bought a bunch of consumables with their aurum, foolish things, not caring because they thought they would be getting the aurum back. The other thread suggest returning only aurum spent on those things that were destroyed, is that even feasible though? Most of us probably put most the aurum into boosters, but maybe some have a point for wanting a refund. I just bought one merc pack and considered it the cost of the game. Spent all the aurum on boosters, and never expected anything back. When I found out I could keep the SP after commercial release that was a bonus. ya, CCP put themselves in kind of a tough spot. I'm with the other guy, just leave it in beta for the next 8 years.
Vrain Matari ZionTCD Legacy Rising 475	Posted - 2013.04.16 15:50:00 - [35] - Quote Moochie Cricket wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying. This. +1 Also +1.
Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 2517	Posted - 2013.04.16 16:06:00 - [36] - Quote tribal wyvern wrote: Please don't give in to the people demanding merc pack refunds/aurum refunds. If you must take this demand into consideration, consider this..........those who want refund get sp reset too. Or how about the closed beta vets who actually spent money in closed beta buying Merc Packs should have a say, since the terms were changed on PSN as we moved into open beta? If you bought a Merc Pack under the condition where we have reason to question what's happening, you either bought it at Gamestop (who CCP have tried to ask to change their description) or you bought it while the game was in closed beta. A large portion of the people asking for what we paid for ARE closed beta vets. Quote: I heard somewhere that a full aurum refund would also involve character reset? I may be wrong, but a lot of us are at a comfortable position now in terms of skills etc, and it would be wrong to punish 90% of players because of the 10% who want this refund . And there's been no official source cited by anyone who's claimed a character reset would be required for an Aurum reset, and I don't think they've had a single thread with a Dev or GM post that said anything more relevant to the topic than "locked for [insert reason]".
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 235	Posted - 2013.04.16 17:00:00 - [37] - Quote Its a really simple and easy option for CCP Option A - Those who want the merc pack refunds and all ther AUR have to go through a full chara reset, so they lose all the items/SP and ISK they have acquired and start at square 0 Option B - Those who do NOT want a merc pack refund can keep all the SP/ISK and items acquired and carry on as usual Im a closed beta vet who bought the merc packs to use - i havnt been cheated, i got all my items and AUR and have put them to use to buy boosters and obtain 8.5mil in SP which are in tanks, i vote for option B
Osiris Ausare Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 31	Posted - 2013.04.16 17:04:00 - [38] - Quote I'm an open beta player, and when I bought my merc packs I wasn't expecting a refund, I spent my money, I received exactly what I wanted and I'm happy. And like a lot of other mercs I will continue to buy merc packs, not only for the aur and items, but also to support CCP. It seems like a lot of people have forgotten that CCP is still a business and money needs to be generated to support their products. The gift we have all received is not having a monthly fee nor an initial purchase of the game. In fact, you can play Dust without ever having to spend any money, however, production and up keep of the game requires funding and that is where the merc packs come in. If we had a full refund, not only will CCP be loosing money, but no one will be buying merc packs for the foreseeable future causing a massive decline in profit, and a potential failure of the game. Remember, games are not made for free, especially ones that are so detailed (yes I know the graphics suck, and there are bugs, however the constant evolution of the game requires capital). Unfortunately this is not a charity, its a for profit company that is providing us with a product that is created on the money we spend. Instead of going in circles, constantly complaining that you lost money, or you want a refund, think about what it would do to the state of the game, but as I've noticed over the last two months this community loves to complain and QQ. That is all I have to say and I will reiterate my above statement, I don't want a refund and I will continue to buy merc packs. I support the vets on this topic and hopefully we don't ruin this game. Osiris.
Nguruthos IX Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 210	Posted - 2013.04.16 17:05:00 - [39] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying. yup
Ninjanomyx Imperfects Negative-Feedback 29	Posted - 2013.04.16 17:27:00 - [40] - Quote There are too many variables to consider when proposing a "Partial Reset". SP gained from Active/Passive Booster(s) being the least complicated, & WP/SP/KDR/WLR gained by lesser skilled Players using AUR Equips to circumvent the necessary Skill Allocation(s) being the most complicated to guage. Thus the proposition is invalidated since an AUR Reset would essentially promote "Pay-2-Win" as you would get all of said AUR/Gear previously used to gain an Advantage, thus essentially doubling said Advantage. This is especially apparent for those who deployed a significant amount of "Wallet Spam" when the Merc Pack was 1/2 Price, essentially Quadrupling the Return on Investment. TL;DR: I saw a Commercial for DUST 514 on TV, the Game is Open to the Public, Commerce was/is/will be made. They "Released" a "Commercial"........Commercial Release condition satisfied, Reset happened, move along.

Garrett Blacknova Codex Troopers 2518	Posted - 2013.04.16 17:31:00 - [41] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying. Just coming back to this while it's still being quoted... Last wipe = last "character reset" as referred to in the Merc Pack product description. It was also clearly stated that this was NOT "commercial release", which was also referred to - INDEPENDENT OF WIPES/RESETS - as a point at which Merc Pack contents were to be credited back. Just to be clear, it was clearly stated that there was one of the Merc Pack's conditions still yet to be fulfilled.
Mobius Wyvern BetaMax. CRONOS. 1286	Posted - 2013.04.16 18:19:00 - [42] - Quote KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying. Amen, brother. Alaika Arbosa wrote: <-------Closed Beta Player, happy with no merc pack reimbursement. Same here.
Baal Roo Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 1153	Posted - 2013.04.16 20:04:00 - [43] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf wrote: They got what they paid for, the AUR items weren't defective. We were informed that the move to Tranquility would be the last wipe planned, if they wasted their items despite that, then it is their fault. Nitpicking at language and playing internet lawyer is annoying. They should stop trying to ruin everything for the rest of us; its really annoying. Amen, brother. Alaika Arbosa wrote: <-------Closed Beta Player, happy with no merc pack reimbursement. Same here. But the "last wipe planned" has absolutely nothing at all to do with commercial release, and we were never once informed in any way that the terms of the Merc Pack were changed. I'm still using my Merc Pack gear and AUR under the assumption that it will be refunded to me at commercial release. That's what I have sold and CCP have not yet, once, anywhere, at all, said otherwise.
GeneralButtNaked ZionTCD Legacy Rising 335	Posted - 2013.04.16 20:50:00 - [44] - Quote Osiris Ausare wrote: I'm an open beta player, Then none of this applies to you, as you didn't buy a merc pack with the conditions the rest of us are talking about. Thanks for your opinion, but please don't take this the wrong way when I say that it is irrelevant. This matter does not concern you. In fact that applies to everyone who did not buy one of the affected merc packs. You don't get a say in a contract dispute between the buyers and CCP.


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