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Hanix Bnar
Nevec Task Force
Orbis Imperialis
4
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Posted - 2013.01.19 07:05:00 -
[1] - Quote
While I am an all around gamer and have played a few MMOs from Star Wars Galaxies, to Star Trek Online, to Star Wars The Old Republic; I've played even more first person shooters. I feel that this game is one of the most ambitious and innovative games ever made and I am really enjoying it thus far. It has a nice, futuristic feel to it and it feels like a FPS. My biggest concern however is that with it being the first ever true hybrid of the MMO and FPS type games that it might not pull in enough players to the extent that the developers of this game want. My reasoning behind this is as follows;
1. Those who play EVE are die hard MMO players and PVPers. FPS games aren't exactly their area of expertise. Not saying that there are not EVE players out there that don't branch out, but most MMO players that I know tend to stick with PC based games and don't even own a console based system.
2. FPS players tend to stick specifically to those types of games. This game might be attractive to them as it is a Halo style shooter and for those of us who love our PS3s, we can't get Halo and there is no other FPS out there that is similar to it. Dust 514 shows up and wham, at first, you'll get some FPS players. Problem will become keeping those die hard FPS players in game. This is a little out of their realm and understanding, and for those good FPS players out there that don't get a handle on it right away, they'll blame the MMO base of the game for making it hard for them to do well, taking some of the skill out of playing the game.
Now, my solution to this would be simple. The developers, in my opinion, should lean one way or the other, and I think they should lean more towards the FPS side of things. The leveling up of stats and what not is fine, and the purchasing of weapons and dropsuits is fine as well. I however think that maybe they should make make it to where you don't have to purchase a slew of back up weapons and the such. The having to constantly replenish your favorite, high powered weapon will drive some of the die hard FPS players away and hurt the overall player base; and let's face it, this game is going to appeal more to FPS players and those are the ones that CCP needs to strive to make happy if they want this game to be a success when it launches.
I know this may be my opinion, and many may not agree with it; I might even be wrong, as the game might be perfect just the way it is and hardcore FPS fans might fall in love with this game and never want to stop playing it. These are just my opinions and I was wondering if anyone else shared them. If so, why? If not, why not? |
trollsroyce
Seraphim Initiative.
CRONOS.
165
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Posted - 2013.01.19 10:23:00 -
[2] - Quote
I definitely agree on that the game still needs a ton of minimalism. In that bit I'd personally drop off war barges and merc quarters to load the substance content smoother.
As long as the market is unfunctional like currently (no sandbox), i'd prefer a slide down menu for fitting selection: pick any gun from it and it tells you how many you have and what it costs. Restock fitting should buy only the missing parts. However, this all is second priority.
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137H4RGIC
WarRavens
26
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Posted - 2013.01.19 11:20:00 -
[3] - Quote
To take away the ability to lose your weapons would hurt the market for EVE, not only that it's one of the core fundamentals for this game. If we take away the ability to lose things, then what's the point of being paid a contract to do a mission? Money will become nothing. And at which point, everyone will have their favorite gun, and this will be a buggier, watered down, futuristic version of battlefield 3. THe way that CCP has this game running is innovative and inspires players for greatness and further inspires the hardcore FPSers to take large risks to get the proverbial cheese. |
Hanix Bnar
Nevec Task Force
Orbis Imperialis
4
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Posted - 2013.01.19 16:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
I didn't say take it away all together, I just said maybe lessen the MMO feel a little bit to make the game more welcoming to the FPS player base that it is going to attract. Maybe instead of losing your armor and weaponry every time you die, you lose one if you lose the match. Also, maybe make the weapons and things a little more expensive, make us earn the right to use them. That's what every first person shooter does. I mean, I hopped on yesterday, played for maybe 25 minutes on a character that I hadn't really played since the last reset, and I got the hardest hitting sniper rifle in the game. It's too easy to get some of these weapons, so at that point I would agree with you. Still have us have the ability to lose those weapons and armor and stuff, but not on the scale it is now. Make it to where we need to buy less, but they also cost more at the same time; that's one idea I had anyways.
*Edit - I know my first post makes it sound like I was saying otherwise, and for not using the English language to it fullest and getting that across better is my fault; but that is what I indeed meant. Lessen the MMO feel a little bit so that the FPS players feel a little more at home, and then, maybe once they are used to it, begin to implement a more MMO feel and slowly integrate them into the game and the system. |
Hektor Flex
The Piddlez Legion
5
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Posted - 2013.01.20 03:21:00 -
[5] - Quote
The first fps I played was quake in 94/95. It was pc and not console. In fact most pc gamers were playing their first fps while consolers were still playing with Mario. So what is our expertise again? |
Val'herik Dorn
CrimeWave Syndicate
264
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Posted - 2013.01.20 04:46:00 -
[6] - Quote
I disagree with you wholeheartedly i have a friend who signed up for beta got accepted but rage quit because he didn't understand anything in it. He uninstalled dust never to play it again until we started talking about it a few days ago and i happened to ask him if he had thought about trying it again offering to teach him how to play. unfortunately his old ps3 died and he no longer has access but i was showing it to him now in the new build and he was basically salivating at the chance to get in on the 22nd. he is a hardcore fps fan and hates anything that isn't facemurder constantly.
But dust grabbed him and hasn't let go.
This is what i think the strength of Dust514 is the fact that it is not your average shooter. Sure it may take some time to learn and you might have to stop playing it for a while but it keeps nagging at you that you didn't try it. I'm guessing that FPS gamers once they figure it out (i wish CCP would add in some tutorials to explain things a bit better) they will get hooked. It is a more addictive game than i have played in quite a while (and i usually get bored of games rather quickly) i started back in mordu's private trials before precurser even and this game has at times pushed me away (super tanks and drop ship squashing im looking at you) but the sheer scope of what this game will become has earned my money for the foreseeable future. |
0 Try Harder
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz
RISE of LEGION
116
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Posted - 2013.01.20 08:47:00 -
[7] - Quote
Val'herik Dorn wrote:he is a hardcore fps fan and hates anything that isn't facemurder constantly.
yea. Imo the isk system is fine now. If you die and waste a lot of isk without getting kills, it's your own damn fault. I mean, I can pull out and lose a militia tank every match and still make at least 100k isk. I don't think anyone's drop suit and weapons are at that level yet...
I almost quit the game after a couple minutes of playing too.
Biggest reasons why:
It's so ******* slow. It feels like I'm playing in molasses, not air. It has gotten *much* better in the new patch, but it would be much nicer if everything was faster. Vehicles, sensitivity, etc, etc. Sensitivity is one of the most annoying things for me. It sucks to play this game on a big TV. Smaller screens = high sensitivity, so if you're on a small screen you probably don't notice this as much.
I saw triangles marking enemies, and I thought it was one of the dumbest things ever. I thought that for some reason, you could see all enemy players on the map. The only reason I got around this problem and actually played the game a little is because I thought it was a bug and the devs would fix it in the next patch. Turns out the system just shows you what your squad sees. It's the same as your squad using mics. Now I really like the system, and I think it's very cool. There needs to be a tutorial or explanation about this.
Had I not been shot by some guys in proto on the first day of playing, I would have quit. The only reason I didn't quit and immediately delete dust was because my KDR was under 1.0. I'm not a kdr *****, but I didn't want to leave with a really ****** KDR. I got it up to 1.2+ in a few games, and by then I started to enjoy the game. Tutorials need to be in the game not because people don't know what to do, but to explain some of the cool features that dust has.
Honestly, I really like the isk system. It's fun to make those guys running proto and especially AUR gear lose it. Idc so much about kdr (as long as it's above 1.0 lol), and win/loss is meaningless in pubs with blue dots, but the fact that I can make someone lose something he cares a lot about and worked hard for is awesome. I love getting hate mail, and having someone spend the whole match targeting me at any cost.
I remember when I played my first mmo. I was very confused. I had no idea that people played games for friends. I always assumed they had friends in real life, and played games to win. Who the **** goes into a match and says, "I'm going to get one kill and twenty deaths because I suck, and sucking ass is fun." Anyways, people play games for different reasons. One of the reasons I enjoy FPS games is because people play to win. |
Breakin Stuff
Immobile Infantry
680
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 12:16:00 -
[8] - Quote
Murdering protobears in their prototard suits in a dragonfly suit with a militia shotgun and a bad attituse is a special feeling.
My fit costs me nothing but the AUR I spent and some insane tenacity. the payout was over five million ISK in lost **** for some other people.
You may now cheer or rage. Either way, I win. |
Crm234
Wraith Shadow Guards
166
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Posted - 2013.01.20 13:46:00 -
[9] - Quote
My biggest problem is SP effecting damage, range, Armor, and Shields that go against FPS views and more seen in RPG`s. No one loses any SP after they die so there is no lost/reward system for it. Do i want them to change that no, but it always gives that feeling in dust that your match is going to be 50/50. Either you can damage the guy or you cant and usually gives a normal FPS player that feeling either the game has got serious lag problems or the other player is cheating.
It not about tactics, because you can silently sneak around the whole map and get right behind some player and have to drill him in the back of the head with 60 perfect shots, or 100 rifle butts
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Breakin Stuff
Immobile Infantry
680
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Posted - 2013.01.20 14:02:00 -
[10] - Quote
I look at it as that guy who has been fighting for a long time.. All things being equal the guy with more experience is going to whack the crap out of a newb. Plus the skills keep the field from getting stale, because you never know what someone might pull next. Or how hard he will hit.
Is that a militia forge gun up on that rooftop, or is it an ishukone assault forge? Will that HMG eat me? If the guy with the laser uses the basic his ass is mine, but if its a viziam...
Is that militia starter fit utilized by a cranky gentleman with maxed AR skills?
Nothing is certain. I like the unknown. |
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Firestorm Zulu
Crux Special Tasks Group
Gallente Federation
158
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Posted - 2013.01.20 14:03:00 -
[11] - Quote
Making Blue Print Copies of near all guns seems like a good solution. You if you want the same gun with isk you can buy it too but It would be lost with every death. Blue Print Copies with AUR i think are fair since you can get the gun in either way so no pay to win. It would also solve the problem of the FPS player having issue with losing a gun, what better way to attempt to make up the original asking price of an original game just by making a player purchase a weapon?
Example:
I play BF3 and have my absolute favorite guns in that game. I tend to never switch and when I do its just to get an award with another weapon. If I didn't have to buy BF3 at retail but could purchase an individual gun for 1-5$ , I would probably jump on that train. Likewise for any other weapon I enjoyed and used habitually. |
Breakin Stuff
Immobile Infantry
680
|
Posted - 2013.01.20 14:51:00 -
[12] - Quote
There are quite enough BPOs wandering about. This is a game where there are consequences.
You have to buy your gear. if you die you lose it.
If you drive a tank into a eight man subdreddit crew and they all happen to be packing flux and AV grenades I forsee you buying a new tank.
This is as it should be. |
R F Gyro
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
315
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Posted - 2013.01.20 18:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
From everything I've read or seen, CCP simply aren't interested in making "just another FPS". They truly believe that they can create an entirely new (sub-) genre here.
If this means that there are a lot of die-hard FPS players that don't like Dust so much, CCP won't be that bothered. They'd only have stuck around for a month or two before moving on anyway, and CCP are looking for players who will be around for a lot longer than that.
You might think that these players (FPS players who will stick with a game for years) don't exist, but CCP presumably believes otherwise.
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Vaerana Myshtana
ScIdama
Endless Renaissance
205
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Posted - 2013.01.21 04:25:00 -
[14] - Quote
I disagree, but I appreciate your clear articulation of what you want.
Personally, I'm a multi-year EVE player who got burnt out on the need to be on top of the game all the time.
I'm really happy to see something that melds EVE and Tribes 2. |
RolyatDerTeufel
D3ath D3alers
RISE of LEGION
1648
|
Posted - 2013.01.21 07:33:00 -
[15] - Quote
Hanix Bnar wrote:
Now, my solution to this would be simple. The developers, in my opinion, should lean one way or the other, and I think they should lean more towards the FPS side of things.
The leveling up of stats and what not is fine, and the purchasing of weapons and dropsuits is fine as well.
I however think that maybe they should make make it to where you don't have to purchase a slew of back up weapons and the such. The having to constantly replenish your favorite, high powered weapon will drive some of the die hard FPS players away and hurt the overall player base; and let's face it, this game is going to appeal more to FPS players and those are the ones that CCP needs to strive to make happy if they want this game to be a success when it launches.
Currently if you want that, you can buy militia blueprints only and NPCs do the manufacturing. No proto / advanced blueprints till it requires a industrial run with materials imo. And will that then push these players away anyways? Hope not, that's the future of dust.
If you run militia / standard gear in pubs you will make money.
if you start dying with better gear all the time, its going to need to be replaced right?
0 Try Harder wrote: Honestly, I really like the isk system. It's fun to make those guys running proto and especially AUR gear lose it. Idc so much about kdr (as long as it's above 1.0 lol), and win/loss is meaningless in pubs with blue dots, but the fact that I can make someone lose something he cares a lot about and worked hard for is awesome.
Totally agree, first time I PVP'd in EVE and killed someone and saw in killboards that there was a value in $ at the bottom, heard about PLEX being sold to get ISK I was amazed. And being months old and still killing someone that was a few years into playing EVE.
Dust costs nothing compared to EVE at all, but still that 25 cent suit that anyone runs with that's AUR advanced / proto gear, is enjoyable killing in standard gear all the time. 
I think dust needs more features for the average squad to do other then ambush and skirmish. Take minds off of slow SP and getting to their next item. And allow for larger gamemodes with the planned 6 man squads and 24 vs 24. PvE to do to get ISK from the agent mission to clear the area with / without squad. Would allow for better gear to go up in price like it will when people will sell it to you on the market.
And I was an FPS player turned into EVE nub thrown into nullsec and enjoyed it. Dust has a lot of potential and I plan to see it through for as long as it goes.  Always playing both games? No, probably not. But CCP's supported New Eden already for 10 years. |
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