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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
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Posted - 2012.10.07 17:56:00 -
[1] - Quote
Scouts and Heavies have taken hard hits in the past but were they really essential? Shouldn't scouts be harder to hit than other suits while mobile? Shouldn't a walking tank take a decent amount of sustained fire before death? It seems like these pleas came from those who couldn't track a moving target or keep sustained fire on a slow target. While on the subject of suits i think i speak for most logis when I say a speed buff to be equal to assault speed would have been favorable to an hp increase.
Tl;dr restore the original strafe and heavy hp before this becomes assault suit 514 |
Logi Bro
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
836
|
Posted - 2012.10.07 17:59:00 -
[2] - Quote
I've said this before- Specialty Bonus.
If we give each suit something that none of the other suits have, then there will be a specific reason to use each of those suits. Basically, I agree with you, but I have a different solution. |
Tyrius Madison
97
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Posted - 2012.10.07 18:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
Here we go again...
Halo Kiddies Vs COD Kiddies round...97969567585624614756384. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
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Posted - 2012.10.07 18:06:00 -
[4] - Quote
So a bit like:
Amarr heavy, +10% armour hp per level
Gallente scout, +5% cpu per level |
Tony Calif
Seraphim Initiative. CRONOS.
2002
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Posted - 2012.10.07 18:06:00 -
[5] - Quote
I was rather expecting both infantry suit HP & Vehicle HP to be increased back to previous levels, with the rebalanced modules... |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
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Posted - 2012.10.07 18:07:00 -
[6] - Quote
Tyrius Madison wrote:Here we go again...
Halo Kiddies Vs COD Kiddies round...97969567585624614756384. And yet another idiotic troll |
Logi Bro
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
836
|
Posted - 2012.10.07 18:09:00 -
[7] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:So a bit like:
Amarr heavy, +10% armour hp per level
Gallente scout, +5% cpu per level
That's about what I was thinking, although only give bonuses to things that can't be influenced by modules, so the benefits are solely available for that suit. Like: Logistics- 10% increase to equipment efficacy or: Heavy- 10% reduction to small arms damage recieved |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.07 18:13:00 -
[8] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:So a bit like:
Amarr heavy, +10% armour hp per level
Gallente scout, +5% cpu per level That's about what I was thinking, although only give bonuses to things that can't be influenced by modules, so the benefits are solely available for that suit. Like: Logistics- 10% increase to equipment efficacy or: Heavy- 10% reduction to small arms damage recieved
What if the boosts were compensatory to the suits weakness?
Such as increasing the armor/shield of a scout and the speed of a heavy |
Logi Bro
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
836
|
Posted - 2012.10.07 18:20:00 -
[9] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:What if the boosts were compensatory to the suits weakness?
Such as increasing the armor/shield of a scout and the speed of a heavy
Well, I call them specialty bonuses because they give a boost to whatever the suit does most, like logistics spend most of their time using equipment, hence the boost to equipment efficacy, so perhaps what you are suggesting would go under a different category, call it a compensatory bonus, perhaps even give players the ability to choose which bonus they would rather have, give a greater degree of customization and variation. |
iceyburnz
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
283
|
Posted - 2012.10.07 18:20:00 -
[10] - Quote
Tyrius Madison wrote:Here we go again...
Halo Kiddies Vs COD Kiddies round...97969567585624614756384.
I don't see your point.
If you think thats whats this is about, you (ironical) should go back to playing those games.
The fact that armour tiers have been rendered flat (read: useless), is a complete game changer and seems like a clumsy fix that actually alters Dust 514 at its core. In case you don't get it, all the values armour, weapons, skills were created with the values they use to have in mind. By changing the values of armour they have altered not only the dynamics of game play, but the future economy and play style of every player.
Unless of course they are planning to add proper skill bonuses to each armour, in which case. Cool |
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.07 18:25:00 -
[11] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:Vermaak Doe wrote:What if the boosts were compensatory to the suits weakness?
Such as increasing the armor/shield of a scout and the speed of a heavy Well, I call them specialty bonuses because they give a boost to whatever the suit does most, like logistics spend most of their time using equipment, hence the boost to equipment efficacy, so perhaps what you are suggesting would go under a different category, call it a compensatory bonus, perhaps even give players the ability to choose which bonus they would rather have, give a greater degree of customization and variation.
Possibly a category sub skills under the dropsuit skill that only apply to that suit that covers a range of different aspects
Ps a heavy taking more large arms fire is better to me than taking more small arms fire |
Tyrius Madison
97
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Posted - 2012.10.07 18:26:00 -
[12] - Quote
iceyburnz wrote:Tyrius Madison wrote:Here we go again...
Halo Kiddies Vs COD Kiddies round...97969567585624614756384. I don't see your point. If you think thats whats this is about, you (ironical) should go back to playing those games. The fact that armour tiers have been rendered flat (read: useless), is a complete game changer and seems like a clumsy fix that actually alters Dust 514 at its core. In case you don't get it, all the values armour, weapons, skills were created with the values they use to have in mind. By changing the values of armour they have altered not only the dynamics of game play, but the future economy and play style of every player. Unless of course they are planning to add proper skill bonuses to each armour, in which case. Cool
naw, I'm good playing Dust, never cared for those two games. thanks for the suggestion though.
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Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 01:19:00 -
[13] - Quote
Bump |
crazy space
ZionTCD Legacy Rising
879
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 01:36:00 -
[14] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:I've said this before- Specialty Bonus.
If we give each suit something that none of the other suits have, then there will be a specific reason to use each of those suits. Basically, I agree with you, but I have a different solution. eve ships have bonuses, come on ccp... |
Mavado V Noriega
SyNergy Gaming
2283
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 01:49:00 -
[15] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:I've said this before- Specialty Bonus.
If we give each suit something that none of the other suits have, then there will be a specific reason to use each of those suits. Basically, I agree with you, but I have a different solution.
|
HECATONCHIRES COTTUS
Doomheim
14
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Posted - 2012.10.08 01:50:00 -
[16] - Quote
Instead of people thinking far enough ahead and eventually unlocking suits/skills for heavies/scouts and then having the ability to be multipurpose and get out different suits/fits for different situations when the resupplies give you the ability to change fits in the field.They complained that under certain circumstances there favorite fit was outmatched and so they QQ and couldnt think farther down the road when they were done with assault and wanted to try something new.
I said it before ....with each subsequent nerf/build that people were merely limiting there options and true full customization for each class. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
2866
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 01:58:00 -
[17] - Quote
Specialty Bonuses are comming just it will be a while since we only have one race of each suit. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 02:36:00 -
[18] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:Specialty Bonuses are comming just it will be a while since we only have one race of each suit.
We should have had the regardless of the suit number |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
2866
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 03:59:00 -
[19] - Quote
It more has to do with racial differences than suit numbers.
look at the HAVs one has blaster bonus the other has railgun. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 04:06:00 -
[20] - Quote
Iron Wolf Saber wrote:It more has to do with racial differences than suit numbers.
look at the HAVs one has blaster bonus the other has railgun. I never noticed that. I take a guess gallente blasters, caldari rails |
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
583
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 09:23:00 -
[21] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:Iron Wolf Saber wrote:It more has to do with racial differences than suit numbers.
look at the HAVs one has blaster bonus the other has railgun. I never noticed that. I take a guess gallente blasters, caldari rails
Actually Caldari Missiles, there is no bonus for Railguns.
As for Specialty bonuses, they should not compensate for that suits weakness (This would lead to suits becoming too similar at high levels), they should instead exemplify their specialty.
For example Scout = +5% Strafe Speed/Level Assault = +5% Shield HP/Level Logistics = +5% Repair Tool Rate/Level Heavy = +5% Armor HP/Level |
Jack McReady
A.C.M.E Corp
71
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 09:40:00 -
[22] - Quote
the only issue I have is the gap between scout and assault suit.
the speed advantage of a scout suit is marginal. just run or sprint close to an assault suit and you will see what I mean. the gap in shields, armor and fittings on the other hand is HUGE. currently there is no point using a scout suit. |
Laurent Cazaderon
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
1155
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 10:28:00 -
[23] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:I was rather expecting both infantry suit HP & Vehicle HP to be increased back to previous levels, with the rebalanced modules...
i really hope this wont happen. The difference in HP between basic and proto suits was absolutely insane. Though i agree that heavies took the HP nerf bat pretty hard after the first build. And scouts now with the movement nerf. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 21:08:00 -
[24] - Quote
Laurent Cazaderon wrote:Tony Calif wrote:I was rather expecting both infantry suit HP & Vehicle HP to be increased back to previous levels, with the rebalanced modules... i really hope this wont happen. The difference in HP between basic and proto suits was absolutely insane. Though i agree that heavies took the HP nerf bat pretty hard after the first build. And scouts now with the movement nerf. I have to disagree, for their price they should have more hp |
Chao Wolf
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
209
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 21:46:00 -
[25] - Quote
Suit bonuses
Scout 5% movement speed per lvl Logi 5% hacking speed per lvl Assault 5% light weapon damage per lvl Heavy 5% damage resistance per lvl
My 0.02 isk |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 21:48:00 -
[26] - Quote
Chao Wolf wrote:Suit bonuses
Scout 5% movement speed per lvl Logi 5% hacking speed per lvl Assault 5% light weapon damage per lvl Heavy 5% damage resistance per lvl
My 0.02 isk Not bad |
Tyrius Madison
97
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 21:52:00 -
[27] - Quote
as a Scout, I've prefer the Hacking Speed and/or Cloak/Profile dampening bonus, but thats just weird ole' me. my playstyle isn't everyone's.
maybe Logi could have a Repair Rate bonus per level.
in fact, I'd go with :
Scout - Movement + Hacking Speed Logi - Repair Rate + Nanocircuitry Output(affects Nanohives and Nanite Injectors) Assault - Light Weapon Damage + Grenade damage Heavy - Damage resistance + Heavy Weapon Damage (or accuracy) |
Chao Wolf
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
209
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 22:11:00 -
[28] - Quote
Actually Tyriuus the only reason I went with hacking for logi is cause ccp already did to a degree, but other wise those bonuses would do nothing more then improve the specialization of suits. |
Sleepy Zan
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
2047
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 22:15:00 -
[29] - Quote
Laurent Cazaderon wrote:Tony Calif wrote:I was rather expecting both infantry suit HP & Vehicle HP to be increased back to previous levels, with the rebalanced modules... i really hope this wont happen. The difference in HP between basic and proto suits was absolutely insane. Though i agree that heavies took the HP nerf bat pretty hard after the first build. And scouts now with the movement nerf. It was ridiculous in E3 build, but they do need some hp bonuses returned for each level of suit, like you said the heavy needs it most of all. |
Tyrius Madison
97
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Posted - 2012.10.08 22:17:00 -
[30] - Quote
Chao Wolf wrote:Actually Tyriuus the only reason I went with hacking for logi is cause ccp already did to a degree, but other wise those bonuses would do nothing more then improve the specialization of suits.
I wonder why they put the hacking bonus on the Logi suit instead of the Scout one.
Logi suit should have always had a Repair bonus, imo. Scout suit should have the hacking. |
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Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
583
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 22:49:00 -
[31] - Quote
Tyrius Madison wrote:Chao Wolf wrote:Actually Tyriuus the only reason I went with hacking for logi is cause ccp already did to a degree, but other wise those bonuses would do nothing more then improve the specialization of suits. I wonder why they put the hacking bonus on the Logi suit instead of the Scout one. Logi suit should have always had a Repair bonus, imo. Scout suit should have the hacking.
Eh I disagree, Logi is supposed to be the all around support character, meaning hacking fits its role in my opinion.
Scout and Heavy should represent a mix of extremes.
Scouts should either use used a very long range (Snipers) or very very close range (Shotgun/SMG) They also should have very high movement speed, well beyond any other suit because it facilitates these two extremes. In order to offset the advantage of speed, a scout needs to have the lowest EHP of any suit.
Heavies are also very long rang (Forge Gun) or short range (HMG) They should have the highest raw DPS output as well as be able to soak up the most damage. To offset the high EHP, their speed should be the slowest out of any suit class.
Assaults fill the middle ground, with moderate speed, damage, speed, and EHP.
The vast majority of a team should be Assaults, with a good mix of Logistics for support. Only a handful of Scouts and Heavies should exist because of how specialized they are. |
mikegunnz
Pink Fluffy Bounty Hunterz RISE of LEGION
425
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 23:03:00 -
[32] - Quote
Vermaak Doe wrote:Laurent Cazaderon wrote:Tony Calif wrote:I was rather expecting both infantry suit HP & Vehicle HP to be increased back to previous levels, with the rebalanced modules... i really hope this wont happen. The difference in HP between basic and proto suits was absolutely insane. Though i agree that heavies took the HP nerf bat pretty hard after the first build. And scouts now with the movement nerf. I have to disagree, for their price they should have more hp
I like the hp, nerf. It gives newbies with militia a glimmer of hope in a fight. They're still at a disadvantage, but adding back that 50ish HP (can't remember the actual number) to the proto would just compound the disadvantage they already have. With 4 high slots vs two, and higher CPU, a proto can stack four complex shield extender, vs a militia's two militia extender's. That's a difference of 176HP. Add to that a shield regulator or two, and the militia is in for some trouble. That's WITH OUT changing the HP levels back to where they were.
Now, I'm all for there being an imbalance. A militia suit is cheap, vs a high-end proto suit being 300,000+ isk... so there should be an advantage to using proto gear, but you have to temper that with the fact that the game needs to be accessible to new ppl who fire up the game, 6months after the vets have started.
IF there is going to be a change, I'd rather see the proto suits be made cheaper, rather than buffing their HP back up to prior levels.
Edit* Forgot to mention my original thought. I agree about the scout needing it's strafe speed back, and heavy needing it's HP back. |
Bosse Ansgar
47
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Posted - 2012.10.08 23:24:00 -
[33] - Quote
How about Suit bonuses that reward you for playing your role on the battlefield??
Scout 5% SP bonus for CQB & Sniping kills per lvl
Logi 5% SP bonus for tool usage and hacking per lvl
Assault 5% SP bonus for light weapon and grenade kills per lvl
Heavy 5% SP bonus for heavy weapon and AV vehicle kills per lvl |
Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
583
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 23:29:00 -
[34] - Quote
Bosse Ansgar wrote:How about Suit bonuses that reward you for playing your role on the battlefield??
Scout 5% SP bonus for CQB & Sniping kills per lvl
Logi 5% SP bonus for tool usage and hacking per lvl
Assault 5% SP bonus for light weapon and grenade kills per lvl
Heavy 5% SP bonus for heavy weapon and AV vehicle kills per lvl
Nah, I'd rather the suit get better at doing what it does best, rather than making what it does best more rewarding...if that makes sense. |
Chao Wolf
Imperfects Negative-Feedback
209
|
Posted - 2012.10.08 23:43:00 -
[35] - Quote
Pokey we're on the same page on that. Give players more of a reason to specialize. On a side note I don't think there are any skills that boost sp gain so why should our suit skills boost sp gain? |
DUST Fiend
Immobile Infantry
1902
|
Posted - 2012.10.09 00:01:00 -
[36] - Quote
Logi Bro wrote:I've said this before- Specialty Bonus.
If we give each suit something that none of the other suits have, then there will be a specific reason to use each of those suits. Basically, I agree with you, but I have a different solution.
This, and I think you should have class specific mods for each kind of suit, to really flesh them out. |
Sleepy Zan
Internal Error. Negative-Feedback
2047
|
Posted - 2012.10.09 00:09:00 -
[37] - Quote
DUST Fiend wrote:Logi Bro wrote:I've said this before- Specialty Bonus.
If we give each suit something that none of the other suits have, then there will be a specific reason to use each of those suits. Basically, I agree with you, but I have a different solution. This, and I think you should have class specific mods for each kind of suit, to really flesh them out. this |
Pokey Dravon
OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention
583
|
Posted - 2012.10.09 03:40:00 -
[38] - Quote
Chao Wolf wrote:Pokey we're on the same page on that. Give players more of a reason to specialize. On a side note I don't think there are any skills that boost sp gain so why should our suit skills boost sp gain?
I think EVE at one point actually had a skill to boost SP accrual, but it was removed some time ago. Like I said before I think suits should have skills which amplify their natural advantage. If they added that for say strafing speed on Scouts, I would have no issue with the current base value if I had the ability to increase it.
Honestly the most skills this game has the better, basically all weapons and suits should pretty much suck ass at first, and you can train specific skills to boost differnt aspects of them. Options breeds diversity which is what makes the EVE universe great.
I think in a way thats what they were going with by making all the dropsuits have the same base HP but more emphasis on th emodules, it makes the base similar but gives higher level suits more options, instead of just "Here, its better because it has more HP" you know? Leave the options in the hands of the players instead of creating guidelines for builds simply based off of base stats.
I mean for me I'd heavily invest SP to train up Gallente Scout to get my strafe speed back, but some people may instead spend that SP to get decreased sensor profile in order to be a sneaky sniper. I'd very pleased to see so many skills in the game already, it gets that "OMG WTF SHOULD I TRAIN NOW?!" feel that I know and love from EVE. |
Vermaak Doe
SVER True Blood Unclaimed.
385
|
Posted - 2012.10.17 01:11:00 -
[39] - Quote
Bump |
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Pages: 1 2 :: [one page] |