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Beld Errmon
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
479
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Posted - 2012.09.04 01:12:00 -
[1] - Quote
One thing i think would go a long way towards balancing out tanks would be to rethink the gunner positions on them
I've noticed that its not so much the tank that owns everyone around it, the fun is certainly powerful and the splash will take people out fairly easy, but its the 2 missile turrets that really do a lot of the work and make the tank quite hard to take down.
I've especially noticed this when i've dropped a tank to take out another tank, they might be easily matched but with one take dominating the game for a long enough time for me to consider dropping my own tank, the opposite tank will almost certainly have gunners and their missiles add up to having an extra main gun turret that fires nearly twice as quick, not to mention those missiles against AV dropsuits screw up a persons aim very well.
So the solution I would propose would be this, either remove gunner positions altogether or restrict their ability to fit missile turrets, forge and blaster turrets only would remove a lot of the OPness of tanks.
Another solution would be to up the requirements of the missile turrets and make it so a tier t2 HAV would have trouble fitting more then one of them, and perhaps consider a scaled approach to the amount of turret positions on tanks, Nub tank no turrets, tier 1 - one turret, tier 2 - two turrets.
I'd imagine some ppl are very attached to being turret gunners on vehicles and i can see the attraction, I think another vehicle should be considered for this role an APC style vehicle that sits half way between tank and LAV, but i suppose thats another discussion altogether.
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STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
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Posted - 2012.09.04 01:15:00 -
[2] - Quote
arbitrarily telling someone they cant use small missile turrets wont work and i couldnt take a small turret off my tank if i wanted to. it would always revert to the militia turret that comes with the tank. |
Eddie Boirelle
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
43
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Posted - 2012.09.04 01:18:00 -
[3] - Quote
I agree with you that missiles turrets need to be looked at, but I would rather see the,m have a much slower firing rate rather than any other nerf. |
Beld Errmon
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
479
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 01:21:00 -
[4] - Quote
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV wrote:arbitrarily telling someone they cant use small missile turrets wont work and i couldnt take a small turret off my tank if i wanted to. it would always revert to the militia turret that comes with the tank.
I agree its not a very sandbox solution to the issue, but you surely see my point that they go along way towards making the tank a very powerful tool, and if addressed would make the tanks turret and driver the real force to be reckoned. |
Skihids
Tritan-Industries
Legacy Rising
969
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Posted - 2012.09.04 02:15:00 -
[5] - Quote
Again, CCP isn't balancing tanks against the current set of weapons, it's going to do that after web mines and EM warfare, and a whole host of other toys are deployed. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
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Posted - 2012.09.04 02:26:00 -
[6] - Quote
skihids is correct
also for those who didnt play last build, you didnt know how bad it was before....they pale in comparison now. missile velocity used to be much higher and the fire rate was also higher. |
Beld Errmon
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
479
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 02:27:00 -
[7] - Quote
I can only base my opinion on what I see now, and make suggestions for the future, with what i imagine those things being like I don't think my point changes. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 02:29:00 -
[8] - Quote
thing is, a fully manned tank is scary.
on the flip side, a fully specced squad of av guys actually doing their thing will pop tanks, no matter how much the whiners dont want to admit it. no one actually uses av tho and if they do, they come one at a time or they huddle together.....bad strategy. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 02:29:00 -
[9] - Quote
eventually the marauders will have siege modules......holy ****.... |
Beld Errmon
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
479
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 02:39:00 -
[10] - Quote
And no doubt all day long you do your best to combat any suggestion that could make your wtfpwnage mobile a little less overpowered, you are after all one of the biggest tank whores in the game correct?
Currently if you spec AV the tank will shrugg at you and the first AR assault suit to see you will kill you with little trouble, from what i've seen the best way to take out a tank is with another tank. |
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Sees-Too-Much
332
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Posted - 2012.09.04 02:40:00 -
[11] - Quote
When we start seeing large scale team battles then the ability to root yourself in place in exchange for improved damage and tank will probably be very valuable. With the current metagame it's just a way to get you killed. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
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Posted - 2012.09.04 02:51:00 -
[12] - Quote
lol i knew that post was coming. anyway, no im not trying to give myself a ridiculous edge over everyone else. *****?
small missile turrets already have a 1.6 second refire and large ones have a 2.5 second refire. stop trying to balance tanks to this build when you should be thinking along the lines of how will things work with the addition of ewar.
tanks moving around so you cant get it? webbify it. then you can **** on the thing and even OS it.
tanks firing at you with all turrets? drain its capacitors. then it cant move, it cant fire its turrets, it cant repair.
orbital strikes will be MUCH more powerful next build, esp once you start getting them from eve players. |
Beld Errmon
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
479
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Posted - 2012.09.04 03:04:00 -
[13] - Quote
Atleast you don't deny your bias, nothing you've said changes my opinion, my feedback and ideas are for the devs to consider and its up to them to decide how it will fit with their vision for the future, I won't scale my opinion to a future i know little about. |
Paran Tadec
Imperfects
Negative-Feedback
902
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Posted - 2012.09.04 04:41:00 -
[14] - Quote
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV wrote:thing is, a fully manned tank is scary.
on the flip side, a fully specced squad of av guys actually doing their thing will pop tanks, no matter how much the whiners dont want to admit it. no one actually uses av tho and if they do, they come one at a time or they huddle together.....bad strategy.
THIS. |
WICKED STITCHES
Algintal Core
Gallente Federation
3
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Posted - 2012.09.04 05:06:00 -
[15] - Quote
Fully manned tanks are scary. Maybe needing to have specced skills to be a turret gunner would cool them off a bit. Perhaps even a more SP intensive path to driving tanks, making them a dedicated profession with multiple LV5 skills to drive.
As they are, I can get maybe 10k sp on the ground as a medic and get shot alot, but I can man a tank gun and almost double that with no skill investment and little risk of getting killed. With SP gains directly related to combat performance, its no wonder folks flock to them. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 05:31:00 -
[16] - Quote
i am a big proponent of needing skills to man tanks. gunner skills would be nice, that way having a gunner would mean hes not only serious about protecting the tank, but he has some skills to increase his abilities.
i would also like the ability to kick someone from my tank and if someone hacks a tank or something else, that hacker should be rewarded with the entire fitting at the end of the match instead of the original pilot getting it back.
would lessen the amount of silly pilots |
Ltd HARRISON
Nagashima Heavy Industries and Shipping
Toad Migration at Dusk
10
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Posted - 2012.09.04 08:03:00 -
[17] - Quote
You forget, that the turrets aren't as "free" as they appear: The front-turret has less than 180-¦ view and the view of the top-turret is often limited to a 180-¦ of the view from the main-turret or even one side of the tank.
So it happened a lot of times to me, that there was a huge "blind-spot" that wasn't covered by any gun at all (especially during random games).
Additionally much of my missiles flew everywhere but not where i aimed at while the tank wasn't moving. I don't know if this is a bug or a matter of skilling turrets. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
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Posted - 2012.09.04 09:25:00 -
[18] - Quote
inertia inheritance for the small turrets is massive yo. |
Billi Gene
Tronhadar Free Guard
Minmatar Republic
130
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Posted - 2012.09.04 09:46:00 -
[19] - Quote
a degree of armor and shield normalisation as per what has happened to suit, would go along way.
Give vehicles more modules dedicated to buffing their weapons, and more high and low slots depending on vehicle faction origin.
then pilots can choose to what degree they want survivability or damage.
this should see heavily armored tanks moving slower by default, making them less maneuverable, whilst the faster more dangerous tanks will need to get in and out alot more.
slower tanks will allow infantry to maneuver around them, and faster tanks will have greater splash damage but will take less hits to destroy.
imho...
currently i've found the weak spot on one tank type, and hitting it with an assault forge gun took it from 20% shields to 20% armor, or there abouts.....in one hit... fairly sure it was a militia tank, I'm only just starting out on AV...and the weak spot was at the rear just inside the rear left tread (or there abouts).... so this is what i mean about maneuverability. |
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
173
|
Posted - 2012.09.04 09:54:00 -
[20] - Quote
not sure what your experience with tanks is, but a lot of what you said is already ingame somehow. adding armor increases mass and lowers speed while shield tanks are typically faster with lower reps. forges hurt shields while swarms hurt armor.
slot differences are based on the meta level of your tank, not the race. race, at least for now, doesnt seem to be as important as in eve for making fittings.
yes, tanks have weak spots....something i am surprised no one cares enough to use and something im glad i still dont have to worry about being exploited. av guys arent too smart yet....they'll get it sooner or later tho. |
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Beld Errmon
Tal-Romon Legion
Amarr Empire
479
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Posted - 2012.09.04 12:26:00 -
[21] - Quote
i'm amazed the anti tank crowd hasn't jumped on board with these ideas, not at all surprised the tank ***** crowd and their alts are very active in opposing it, if you were such an awesome tanker you'd resent the gunners stealing your kills, but i doubt that, all about easy kills anyway you can get them. |
Seran Jinkar
Sanmatar Kelkoons
Minmatar Republic
214
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Posted - 2012.09.04 12:29:00 -
[22] - Quote
STB-LURCHASAURUS EV wrote:not sure what your experience with tanks is, but a lot of what you said is already ingame somehow. adding armor increases mass and lowers speed while shield tanks are typically faster with lower reps. forges hurt shields while swarms hurt armor.
slot differences are based on the meta level of your tank, not the race. race, at least for now, doesnt seem to be as important as in eve for making fittings.
yes, tanks have weak spots....something i am surprised no one cares enough to use and something im glad i still dont have to worry about being exploited. av guys arent too smart yet....they'll get it sooner or later tho.
Sorry? How do we exploit a weak spot with "I-AIM-FOR-THE-BOTTOM"-Swarm-Missiles? Maybe with flimsy AV grenades that don't even scratch shields? Yay with a Forge Gun that has an effective range of 200m... Boy I already hear the Railgun charging ^^
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