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Sandair Mulholy
Codex Troopers
42
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Posted - 2012.08.08 03:56:00 -
[1] - Quote
EVERYTHING identified as enemy: drop suits, vehicles, installations. Anything that can be killed or blown up. Of course the locking speed should be dependent in scanning radius of the target, so locking a scout would take like a minute, and locking a dropship or tank take 5 seconds (as it is now), and be nearly instantaneous to lock installation facilities. I know that notion exists already, but there are things I cannot lock on (cloning depots and dropsuits come to mind).
To counter this though, there has to be a way to cancel a lock without shooting. I regularly end up locking the MCC by mistake and "wasting" a round. |
Zero Harpuia
Maverick Conflict Solutions
422
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Posted - 2012.08.08 04:16:00 -
[2] - Quote
I'd like to weigh in on the reload feature. One of the DEVs or GMs (can't remember which) said you could 'swap weapons to save the round.' That isn't enough guys, there needs to be a normal, manual disengage button, maybe use circle?
As for the 'Locking on to anything' thing, I dunno. The only thing it CAN'T lock is a dropsuit at the moment, and I don't really know if I want to see the Swarm have that much power... |
Encharrion
L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising
104
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Posted - 2012.08.08 04:32:00 -
[3] - Quote
If it takes long enough to lock on to a dropsuit, perhaps. |
ilafey
29
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Posted - 2012.08.08 09:07:00 -
[4] - Quote
Swarm launchers used to be able to kill all but got nerfed last build |
Kincate
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
27
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Posted - 2012.08.08 12:49:00 -
[5] - Quote
ilafey wrote:Swarm launchers used to be able to kill all but got nerfed last build
Yeah because they became close combat weapons, Swarm launchers are fine mechanicaly now. Damage might need to be scaled but I do not have any personal experince with that. |
Mobius Wyvern
BetaMax.
1216
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Posted - 2012.08.08 14:13:00 -
[6] - Quote
Yeah, as someone who played the Replication build, they were changed for this one to be purely AV weapons, and that's the way they should stay. |
Sandair Mulholy
Codex Troopers
42
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Posted - 2012.08.08 14:38:00 -
[7] - Quote
ilafey wrote:Swarm launchers used to be able to kill all but got nerfed last build
That relates to unlocked firing, which indeed was way too powerful. Now unlocked firing is useless, and the only problem I have with it is that it is still there. It is so useless that this option should be removed completely; It would simplify the locking and firing of swarm launchers.
But what I am talking about is locked firing. Or more specifically the locking. It should be dependent on distance and signature, not the fact that it is a dropsuit or a jeep. So it could lock on an assault dropsuit 20m away, but it would take 45 seconds. And probably not all four missiles would hit it. And he might survive the first swarm, but not a second one.
It would certainly not be an instant kill. The target would have to stay still for a long time, in line of sight and be close enough. And you would be exposed the whole time, completely vulnerable. At least it would be an option. |
Stile451
Red Star.
76
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:09:00 -
[8] - Quote
They severely nerfed locking on CRUs already. I would like that back.
I don't really like the idea of locking on to dropsuits though. |
Iron Wolf Saber
BetaMax.
2867
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:26:00 -
[9] - Quote
Stile451 wrote:They severely nerfed locking on CRUs already. I would like that back.
I don't really like the idea of locking on to dropsuits though.
run to it point blank. open fire without locking, no more cru. |
Avenger 245
Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation
477
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Posted - 2012.08.08 15:49:00 -
[10] - Quote
Its a AV missile weapon not a AP weapon, I wouldnt want it to become OP it needs to stick to be a tool to kill tanks and dropships not an all around killing machine. All weapon should be good at their role not have verstility a meeds to beat b and b beats c and c beats a, not a beats both b and c.
however I would like to see a rocket launcher for infintry, like a a rpg that fires a single rocket that does twice the dmg of 1 swarm missile, so half the damage of the swarm launcher of all of them hit.
Missile are guided with smaller payloads and little splash Rockets are dumb with larger payloads and splash. |
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Dante Daedrik
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
97
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Posted - 2012.08.08 16:22:00 -
[11] - Quote
+1 For Manually Aimed Rockets, with tick-marks for calculating distance and gravity on the rocket. |
Sandair Mulholy
Codex Troopers
42
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Posted - 2012.08.08 21:02:00 -
[12] - Quote
Avenger 245 wrote:Its a AV missile weapon not a AP weapon, I wouldnt want it to become OP it needs to stick to be a tool to kill tanks and dropships not an all around killing machine. All weapon should be good at their role not have verstility a meeds to beat b and b beats c and c beats a, not a beats both b and c.
however I would like to see a rocket launcher for infintry, like a a rpg that fires a single rocket that does twice the dmg of 1 swarm missile, so half the damage of the swarm launcher of all of them hit.
Missile are guided with smaller payloads and little splash Rockets are dumb with larger payloads and splash.
Yes, being an AV weapon means it excels at AV, it does not mean it can't do AP. Every other weapon can do both: the Forge gun is serious stuff against dropsuits, enough people with AR can kill a tank, etc. The Swarm is almost the only one that cannot kill both vehicle and personnel (ignoring the ones that can't kill anything, like the Mass Driver).
I am not saying to make it good at it, but like the Forge, with the right circumstances, it should be able to do it. |
Knarf Black
Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore
397
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Posted - 2012.08.08 21:14:00 -
[13] - Quote
Sandair Mulholy wrote:ilafey wrote:Swarm launchers used to be able to kill all but got nerfed last build That relates to unlocked firing, which indeed was way too powerful. Now unlocked firing is useless, and the only problem I have with it is that it is still there. It is so useless that this option should be removed completely; It would simplify the locking and firing of swarm launchers. But what I am talking about is locked firing. Or more specifically the locking. It should be dependent on distance and signature, not the fact that it is a dropsuit or a jeep. So it could lock on an assault dropsuit 20m away, but it would take 45 seconds. And probably not all four missiles would hit it. And he might survive the first swarm, but not a second one. It would certainly not be an instant kill. The target would have to stay still for a long time, in line of sight and be close enough. And you would be exposed the whole time, completely vulnerable. At least it would be an option.
Dumbfiring the Swarm Launcher is still essential at times. It's the best way to stop a dropship from squishing you and is very effective against tanks in close quarters. They just nerfed the splash damage to make it useless against infantry. I'm assuming that it will be getting a massive overhaul in the next build, so any speculation as to how it will behave is academic at this point. |
Dewie Cheecham
Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation
677
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Posted - 2012.08.08 21:16:00 -
[14] - Quote
Sandair Mulholy wrote:EVERYTHING identified as enemy: drop suits, vehicles, installations. Anything that can be killed or blown up. Of course the locking speed should be dependent in scanning radius of the target, so locking a scout would take like a minute, and locking a dropship or tank take 5 seconds (as it is now), and be nearly instantaneous to lock installation facilities. I know that notion exists already, but there are things I cannot lock on (cloning depots and dropsuits come to mind).
To counter this though, there has to be a way to cancel a lock without shooting. I regularly end up locking the MCC by mistake and "wasting" a round.
No, actually they should not.
If they could, you'd have a bunch of people on the towers,with a nano hive behind them, shooting infantry with swarm launchers. In the end, everybody, and their dogs would be on the towers, shooting at each other. |
Noowb Sauce
10
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Posted - 2012.08.08 21:30:00 -
[15] - Quote
Dante Daedrik wrote:+1 For Manually Aimed Rockets, with tick-marks for calculating distance and gravity on the rocket.
Tech 2 gear could be called the al'queda special :-) lol in all seriousness this would be a good all around addition and have great potential for multiple ammo types good for AV or AP but the limiting factor is no locking/homing on the device. |
Mobius Kaethis
Planetary Response Organisation Test Friends Please Ignore
306
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Posted - 2012.08.08 23:13:00 -
[16] - Quote
I disagree with the OP, swarms should not, in their current state, be able to lock on to everything.
Now as to the suggestion that there be a different type of ammo that makes the swarm launcher into a dumb-fire rocket for AP purposes that is something that I could get behind. If this is implemented if would have to be as a single round per reload with a large blast that does moderate to low damage depending on the distance from the initial impact and the type of ammunition used.
Being able to switch ammuntion for the swarm launcher to add some AP utility would not be a game breaker but would add some interesting versitility to the weapon.
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Ten-Sidhe
Osmon Surveillance Caldari State
414
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Posted - 2012.08.09 06:03:00 -
[17] - Quote
U.S. has a M202 flash four shoot flamethrower rocket. Fires 4 small missile with a compound similar to napalm in them. Maybe a swarm with no direct damage and the same splash, but splash damage applies every second for 15 seconds. Every suit is fast enough to leave area to avoid most of damage, and every suit could survive if undamaged and only one shot was fired. Still enough damage to make a player think about if its worth hacking something in fire or taking short cut through it. Flame animation would also act as smoke screen. Multiple users could block paths, requiring using hav to go through flames or taking a different route or sniping flame rocket users.
Gallente made rockets in EvE cause heat damage, and Rodan Shipyards make some Gallente missile ships. So Rodan Armaments made swarms could be the flame type.
RPG-7 type rockets could be made by the Minmatar, fits well I think. Rusty duct-tapped(called gaffer tape in England I think) tube fired explosives. |
John Surratt
Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic
49
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Posted - 2012.08.09 06:19:00 -
[18] - Quote
Ten-Sidhe wrote:U.S. has a M202 flash four shoot flamethrower rocket. Fires 4 small missile with a compound similar to napalm in them. Maybe a swarm with no direct damage and the same splash, but splash damage applies every second for 15 seconds. Every suit is fast enough to leave area to avoid most of damage, and every suit could survive if undamaged and only one shot was fired. Still enough damage to make a player think about if its worth hacking something in fire or taking short cut through it. Flame animation would also act as smoke screen. Multiple users could block paths, requiring using hav to go through flames or taking a different route or sniping flame rocket users.
Gallente made rockets in EvE cause heat damage, and Rodan Shipyards make some Gallente missile ships. So Rodan Armaments made swarms could be the flame type.
RPG-7 type rockets could be made by the Minmatar, fits well I think. Rusty duct-tapped(called gaffer tape in England I think) tube fired explosives.
Splash damage only weapon?
Like this RPG-7 ammo?
if it was Minmatar it'd be a contact fused propane tank stuck to a rusty model rocket with duct tape, inside a PVC pipe/potato gun. |
Sandair Mulholy
Codex Troopers
42
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Posted - 2012.08.09 15:37:00 -
[19] - Quote
Dewie Cheecham wrote: No, actually they should not.
If they could, you'd have a bunch of people on the towers,with a nano hive behind them, shooting infantry with swarm launchers. In the end, everybody, and their dogs would be on the towers, shooting at each other.
It wouldn't work because everybody would be too far, you can't even do it for tanks now. And if you want to go AP only, you will be firing only once every two minutes at best (distance+signature radius locking delay) and not even killing them with one shot. And that is assuming the target is not under cover when the missiles land. I wouldn't do it. I don't think many people would. |
Sandair Mulholy
Codex Troopers
42
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Posted - 2012.08.09 15:43:00 -
[20] - Quote
Ten-Sidhe wrote:U.S. has a M202 flash four shoot flamethrower rocket. Fires 4 small missile with a compound similar to napalm in them. Maybe a swarm with no direct damage and the same splash, but splash damage applies every second for 15 seconds. Every suit is fast enough to leave area to avoid most of damage, and every suit could survive if undamaged and only one shot was fired. Still enough damage to make a player think about if its worth hacking something in fire or taking short cut through it. Flame animation would also act as smoke screen. Multiple users could block paths, requiring using hav to go through flames or taking a different route or sniping flame rocket users.
Gallente made rockets in EvE cause heat damage, and Rodan Shipyards make some Gallente missile ships. So Rodan Armaments made swarms could be the flame type.
RPG-7 type rockets could be made by the Minmatar, fits well I think. Rusty duct-tapped(called gaffer tape in England I think) tube fired explosives.
You can't have this type of weapon in a game like Dust 514 where you have set, immobile targets that the enemy has to hack for an amount of time. People would spam the hacking points with this, and even if the damage does not kill them, it would weaken them and make them easy to kill. It is already bad with the remote explosives, and it is only a one shot deal. |
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