|
|
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
   |
Posted - 2012.07.24 13:37:00 -
[1] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:Actually, strategy and tactics are limited to off the battlefield IMHO.
Then you have no clue what tactic and strategy are at all. Real life military experience here if you go onto.the battlefield and ignore the tactics that your enemy is using because you planned something different off the field you will die. The same is true to a certain extent in video games. Also look at sports in football if you don't change your play when it doesn't work you lose the game. Plain and simple.
Perhaps the planning of tactics and strategy take place off of the battlefield but they are executed on it.
End of story it doesn't work another way it cannot be executed anywhere else. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 13:48:00 -
[2] - Quote
Marwan2 wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:I have been seeing complaints recently, about Dust 514 not being a "True FPS". Let me define the acronym - First Person Shooter.
Now lets elaborate. What does first person mean? Well quite simply, your viewpoint is through your characters eyes. In Dust 514 your viewpoint is exactly this. First person - proven.
And to those of you who don't know what "shooter" means in relation to video games, it would be a game in which you shoot things. Be it a top-down shooter, a Third Person Shooter (TPS) or, in the case of Dust 514, a First Person Shooter.
Dust has all of the things that define what a first person shooter is, so how in the hell is it not a "True FPS"? I am sick of this "QQ to much vehicle warfare, I can't take it. Dust isn't a true FPS" or "QQ people are using remote explosives as grenades, I hate it. Dust isn't a true FPS". I have a question for you people, have you ever, possibly, just maybe, played anything in the Battlefield franchise? What are those big, armored vessels that people tend to blow each other up with? Or what about those things with the big spinning blades that people fly around in? Or the things with jet engines on the back? What are those little packets that people through on the ground and then trigger as you step over them, causing you to die oh-so-horribly? There is a game called PlanetSide, vehicles are a big part of that one too. How else are you going to travel around the continents? I'm sure you don't want to do it on foot.
My point is that vehicle warfare is not new in Dust 514, it does not take away from the experience. Throwing remote explosives around as grenades is not new in Dust 514, may it be a little bit over done, it is not new. In fact, can't you even do that in CoD? I know there are players coming from that crowd. It isn't a problem of method in Dust, it is however a problem of to much inventory. If you equip grenades, you get 3. I've read that Logi's can equip 15 RE's. That is pretty serious overkill.
Anyway, I'm done ranting. All this QQ'ing is just pissing me off, especially with this ******** statement being thrown around.
Edit: I am aware of why people are saying this, I'm just really bothered by the ignorance of the community that has gathered in this beta. I don't know why these people wouldn't think this is an FPS, but maybe what they are saying is that the shooting and movement doesn't feel like a FPS, e.g. it's too slow, clunky, hit detection is subpar, etc. Thoughts?
Quite right but crying saying that the game will fail is ignorant we know it needs work, CCP knows it needs work. Report the problem move on test something else. Give them time to fix it and remember that they have to go through Sony, which is new for them. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 13:56:00 -
[3] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:They are strategies. Not tactics. None of them will save you in a gun fight. And they are bad strategies because they don't involve capping or defending letters.
Gun game > tactics in dust.
Is this what everyone wants.
Thanks for telling me I don't get the game too. You are one of the players who thinks killing and KDR is irrelevant I'll bet.
I suppose you have some experience that would negate the actual definition of tactics then. I will repeat this for you I spent 4.5 years in U.S. Army I have fairly extensive training in military tactics and strategy. Tell me again why taking cover and returning fire is not a tactic. Or maybe how flanking isn't a tactic either because you lost me especially since a tactic is something you use to gain an advantage over your enemy. A strategy often involves using multiple tactics over period of time. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 14:01:00 -
[4] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:Bones, real life an the game play on Dust couldn't be further apart. That's my point. An in superhero games like this, tactics and strategy take a back seat to gunplay.
Here's the really brief reason.
I run across the open road. IRL I am dead as soon as I get half way. In dust I sit and regen my whole health back in about 10 seconds and carry on.
I don't really have much of a problem with it. I'll happily railgun face. Less strategy and tactics for me to worry about.
Thank you for demonstrating a tactic wait recover health/stamina run across open area. The only difference is in real life your team lays down suppressive fire. But guess what your squad leader ordered you to cross that s treet you have to cross that street. You might die but that is a soldiers job to kill and maybe die for your country. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 23:31:00 -
[5] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:Tony Calif wrote:EVICER wrote:Septem Mortuus wrote:@Veigar,
You missed a memo.
You have to substitute "MAG 2.0" for "True FPS" and you'll pretty much see the true complaint that lot have.
Same people, same complaints.
Wrong .... MAG had vehicles Vehicle skills, repair skills, assets, lots of things that aren't in "pure" FPS games. There are SO many mag players who were repair/medic/AV, I can't wait to see grouping in action. @Larheon AWP was just a typo. They misspelled WIN. What the hell is your definition of a "pure" FPS game? MAG was the "purest" FPS we had til Dust came around (albeit Dust is incomplete and the bigger features aren't there). MAG was a military simulator, doesn't get more pure than that if you ask me. Pure FPS means you're in first-person ALL the time, and the ONLY objective is to shoot things. So... Doom isn't a pure FPS either, because of the key-hunting expeditions. So... looking at multiplayer, I don't think we even HAVE a first-person shooter that can be called "pure" legitimately in the current generation. Battlefield gives you vehicles, and with those vehicles you leave your first-person perspective. It also gives objectives other than "shoot ALL the things" so it's not even sticking to that aspect in a "pure" sense. Military Sim Gëá Pure FPS
Well by that logic Wolfenstein 3D wasn't a pure FPS either and it was the first at least the first major title. Also quake wasn't maybe unreal but I don't have experience in that series. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.24 23:32:00 -
[6] - Quote
BAD FURRY wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:I have been seeing complaints recently, about Dust 514 not being a "True FPS". Let me define the acronym - First Person Shooter.
Now lets elaborate. What does first person mean? Well quite simply, your viewpoint is through your characters eyes. In Dust 514 your viewpoint is exactly this. First person - proven.
And to those of you who don't know what "shooter" means in relation to video games, it would be a game in which you shoot things. Be it a top-down shooter, a Third Person Shooter (TPS) or, in the case of Dust 514, a First Person Shooter.
Dust has all of the things that define what a first person shooter is, so how in the hell is it not a "True FPS"? I am sick of this "QQ to much vehicle warfare, I can't take it. Dust isn't a true FPS" or "QQ people are using remote explosives as grenades, I hate it. Dust isn't a true FPS". I have a question for you people, have you ever, possibly, just maybe, played anything in the Battlefield franchise? What are those big, armored vessels that people tend to blow each other up with? Or what about those things with the big spinning blades that people fly around in? Or the things with jet engines on the back? What are those little packets that people through on the ground and then trigger as you step over them, causing you to die oh-so-horribly? There is a game called PlanetSide, vehicles are a big part of that one too. How else are you going to travel around the continents? I'm sure you don't want to do it on foot.
My point is that vehicle warfare is not new in Dust 514, it does not take away from the experience. Throwing remote explosives around as grenades is not new in Dust 514, may it be a little bit over done, it is not new. In fact, can't you even do that in CoD? I know there are players coming from that crowd. It isn't a problem of method in Dust, it is however a problem of to much inventory. If you equip grenades, you get 3. I've read that Logi's can equip 15 RE's. That is pretty serious overkill.
Anyway, I'm done ranting. All this QQ'ing is just pissing me off, especially with this ******** statement being thrown around.
Edit: I am aware of why people are saying this, I'm just really bothered by the ignorance of the community that has gathered in this beta. Hold on let me call up CCP !!!........ Unn huh ! ya ya thats what he said ..... ok yes ok yes i will o-ok ok ill let him no ok bye ! ok that was CCP they tolled me to tell you this ... "This is not the CoD game your looking for !"
Epic like. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 00:05:00 -
[7] - Quote
Garrett Blacknova wrote:Bones1182 wrote:Well by that logic Wolfenstein 3D wasn't a pure FPS either and it was the first at least the first major title. Also quake wasn't maybe unreal but I don't have experience in that series. By the logic I gave, I can think of a few pure FPS games. Quake 3: Arena, the Unreal Tournament series, and an older game called XS, which I never played outside the demo, but it was awesome for its time. My point was that MAG is further from pure FPS than some of those other examples, but that doesn't make it less a part of the genre. Just like DUST's novelties don't make it less a part of the genre. People argued over whether to slot the original Deus Ex into the FPS genre at first, too. And have you heard of a game called Strife? It was a Doom Engine RPG/FPS, but because of the strength of the FPS elements, its RPG title got ignored by a lot of people. Really, it doesn't matter. The game isn't MMOFPS anyway. It's an economic/financial/political simulator MMO that uses FPS and RPG minigames to resolve wars which are mostly driven, won and lost by the economic and political elements to the game anyway.
All very true I was just trying to point out that the original benchmark for FPS games doesn't fit in the pure FPS since you had to find keys and loot.
@Tony yes multiplayer began with deathmatch and team deathmatch. But is that all you expect in an FPS game these days. I never got the chance to play MAG so I know very little about but from what I have heard I would really enjoy it. Unfortunately I think it may be difficult to squire these days. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 02:57:00 -
[8] - Quote
Now someone define AAA quality game for Tony so there is no confusion. My impression was that it refers to overall quality of the released product, including graphics, gameplay and other factors. Just my impression of it someone else can find a definition for it somewhere.
Yes I am too lazy to go look for it myself.
|
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.25 03:29:00 -
[9] - Quote
Bye bye |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 00:32:00 -
[10] - Quote
MUDMASTEI2 wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:MUDMASTEI2 wrote:I read the first 7 sentences and stopped, because I already think you're an idiot.
DUST isn't a shooter. It's playtime = dominance and that's MMO gayshit. lol. I have 3.5m SP total, and it's spread over CQC, AR, and AV skills. I only have 2 advanced items in my inventory. I consistently beat players with upwards of 10m SP with full protosuits. Playtime does not equal winning, player skill does. You just aren't using the tools you are provided properly. You're trying to tell me that playtime = dominance? . . . Really? This place hit a new low with this post.
First you have contradicted yourself. I am guessing it was an oversight and you meant to say that you are trying to tell me that playtime does not equal dominance.
Second perhaps you have misunderstood the repeated definitions of MMO. Massively Multiplayer Online. Try to be clear in your words as some of them mean something besides what you think.
Third if you don't like it don't play it bye bye have fun now. |
|
|
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 05:47:00 -
[11] - Quote
MUDMASTEI2 wrote:Bones1182 wrote:MUDMASTEI2 wrote:Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:MUDMASTEI2 wrote:I read the first 7 sentences and stopped, because I already think you're an idiot.
DUST isn't a shooter. It's playtime = dominance and that's MMO gayshit. lol. I have 3.5m SP total, and it's spread over CQC, AR, and AV skills. I only have 2 advanced items in my inventory. I consistently beat players with upwards of 10m SP with full protosuits. Playtime does not equal winning, player skill does. You just aren't using the tools you are provided properly. You're trying to tell me that playtime = dominance? . . . Really? This place hit a new low with this post. First you have contradicted yourself. I am guessing it was an oversight and you meant to say that you are trying to tell me that playtime does not equal dominance. Second perhaps you have misunderstood the repeated definitions of MMO. Massively Multiplayer Online. Try to be clear in your words as some of them mean something besides what you think. Third if you don't like it don't play it bye bye have fun now. Yes. It's more MMO than shooter. MMO's reward playtime with more powerful weapons, while FPS games do that to an extent, there's a stopping point. Not in DUST, DUST is a game where the guy with 1 hour get wrecked by the guy with 100, and the guy with 100 gets wrecked by the guy with 1,000, etc. That's stupid. I don't play it, it had a chance, but then again I overlooked that CCP is an MMO designer, not a FPS, so they're clueless at making a good shooter.
Call of Duty, MAG, and BF3 all have the basic characteristics that define MMO gameplay. End of story dude. You mean RPG character building elements perhaps but not MMO. I tried to get you figure that out on your own but I guess you missed it.
I suppose the next question is why are still on the forums if you don't want to be a part of the beat test. Just to troll because if that is the case just get lost we don't need or want you here.
Go do something you actually enjoy or better something productive.
Seriously have a nice day you can leave us dusters alone now. |
Bones1182
Circle of Huskarl
Minmatar Republic
86
|
Posted - 2012.07.26 05:54:00 -
[12] - Quote
Tony Calif wrote:Traditionally, it has been becomming more skilled in how you play. You are looking at it from an RPG point of view. It certainly attracts some people, but there we go. The protosuit is a big advantage over type 2 or even advanced. The bottom line is don't get behind the SP curve.
Edit: Most games you become a killing machine pretty quick. The whole most games make you terrible to start with doesn't wash with me. Things like knowing the levels are much more important in most FPS than being high lvl.
Did you mean knowing the maps. If so I see your point a little better than the first time I read this post. However the sheer number of maps will that impossible in Dust. 3000 planets on release and what 12 districts on each planet, and all of them will be at least a little bit different. Especially when players start placing structures and can change it every battle. |
|
|
| |
|