DUST Search - Dynamic large scale warfare

Veigar Mordekaiser wrote:

Lurchasaurus wrote:

the current plateaus map is supposedly only 1/5 of the actual map.

Oh really? So it's suppose to be larger with more installments? Hmm, missed that I guess. Though, i dont think 24 vs 24 will be enough for a map 5x that size... In fact 12 vs 12 feels... underpopulated as it is.

Arcushek Dion wrote:

I think if I remember correctly the maximum map size will be 25 square km. my memory may be off. as for doing something like you suggest in dust. I think it would be technically very difficult to do with the way the game is designed. Those types of battles worked for killzone but what was the max player count for each match?

Thats huge :o But, where did this info come from? I've been reading tons of forum post since I got into the beta, and I've been reading every announcement for the past 4 or 5 months. Not sure how i could've missed something like that. If they are planning to have maps that large, I'm going to guess their player cap is going to be far beyond 48 players.

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Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 04:38:00 - [1] - Quote I posted this in a thread titled "Killzone", but I'm not sure it would attract much attention there, as these forums are not for Killzone :P I would like to see a massive game mode, with HUGE teams, say 128 vs 128, like MAG, possibly even larger teams if CCP could make it happen (knowing them, anything is possible) The gameplay could be dynamic, it wouldn't be the same game mode through the entire match. Apparently Killzone 2 had something like this, as I read in that other post that gave me this idea. Anyway, here we are, lets hear some feedback for this! Lets say, you start out in a very large plain, with a huge wall way off in the distance. The objective would be to take control of the one gate in the wall, and gain access to... lets say, a metropolis. (And to negate anyone saying "fly a dropship over the wall?" we shall say it has some sort of plasma/forcefield shield over the city so you cant simply fly in.) The fight over the wall could consist of 2 sets of control points, say control points 1 and 2 are 1km from the gate, and control points 3 and 4 are 500m from the gate. (real distances may vary, I'm just giving numbers for the sake of description.) You would have to gain control of 1 and 2, in order to move on and fight for 3 and 4. If the attacking team takes all the control points, you move on to the actual gate. Obviously the attackers would have limited clone reserves and if they are depleted in this section of the battle, they would lose. If the attacking team successfully takes all 4 control points, they would move on to the gate, where they would battle for the controls. The battle at the gate could consist of a large indoor area, perhaps a few different rooms where there are terminals to hack. If 3/4 terminals are successfully hacked simultaneously, the gate would open and the battle would move into the city. If the attacking clone reserves are depleted, the game ends. In the actual city, the battle would become a deathmatch, the attackers fighting against the defenders, just like ambush, but on a larger scale. Each team could have something like 400 clone reserves, assuming the teams were 128 vs 128. Once either A) the attacking clones are depleted, the defending team wins, or B) the defending clones are depleted, the attacking team moves on to a large capital building, where they get inside and capture a control point. If the attackers capture it, the game would end and the city would change hand and be ruled by whatever force hired the attackers. If the attackers are depleted, there could be some sort of awesome animation depicting the slaughter of the remaining clones on the battlefield, and the destruction of the attacking MCC.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:25:00 - [2] - Quote Bump. :c
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:34:00 - [3] - Quote This is so wrong. Yes, once Dust is live we will have battles similar to that. But they won't be planned by CCP. They'll just happen because that's what battles in Dust are supposed to look like. Keep in mind Dust lives within EVE. Together and eash on its own they are persistent game worlds. Such cities as in your description will be a constant part of the Dust landscape because corporations will build them. Other corporations will be constantly trying to conquer them too. So yeah, we'll have A LOT of battles like that. But no, they won't be predesigned and they will mean something to someone. They will also cost a lot of ISK. Conquering a city takes a lot of funding. So does defending it.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:39:00 - [4] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: This is so wrong. Yes, once Dust is live we will have battles similar to that. But they won't be planned by CCP. They'll just happen because that's what battles in Dust are supposed to look like. Keep in mind Dust lives within EVE. Together and eash on its own they are persistent game worlds. Such cities as in your description will be a constant part of the Dust landscape because corporations will build them. Other corporations will be constantly trying to conquer them too. So yeah, we'll have A LOT of battles like that. But no, they won't be predesigned and they will mean something to someone. They will also cost a lot of ISK. Conquering a city takes a lot of funding. So does defending it. Actually, we wont have battles like that with the current design. Each part of that battle would be a separate district, which would be a separate map, which is a separate match. But I would like to see this all as ONE match, rather than four.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 05:52:00 - [5] - Quote I'm not so sure. Yes, we will have planetwide conquests where each section is a different battle and they may rely on each other for winning conditions. But we will also have huge maps that require you to change you advancement tactic and maybe abandon vehicles to move on etc'. That whole moving through the desert, moving into a city and then taking a command center will exist in a single section. I think that for this to really work we will need RDVs to be able to pick up vehicles and not just drop them. Otherwise nobody will want to field a tank or APC (we'll have those later I hope).
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 06:06:00 - [6] - Quote I have yet to read any type of announcement for this type of gameplay. Hence why I suggested it.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 06:26:00 - [7] - Quote Going by the announcements at the last FF, some planet sections are going to be very large. Some more than 10 KM across. These large sections could be boring if the owning corporation does nothing with them or they could provide for deadly battles if that corp invests in the land. In the end, I think, it's just all up to the players.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 07:02:00 - [8] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: Going by the announcements at the last FF, some planet sections are going to be very large. Some more than 10 KM across. These large sections could be boring if the owning corporation does nothing with them or they could provide for deadly battles if that corp invests in the land. In the end, I think, it's just all up to the players. As I recall its all going to be split into fairly small districts... Don't get me wrong, I really do hope I'm wrong and there is already something planned the likes of which I described, but I don't remember any info that would cause me to believe that... Got any links to that type of announcement?
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 808	Posted - 2012.07.17 07:39:00 - [9] - Quote the current plateaus map is supposedly only 1/5 of the actual map.
Arcushek Dion Doomheim 73	Posted - 2012.07.17 07:44:00 - [10] - Quote I think if I remember correctly the maximum map size will be 25 square km. my memory may be off. as for doing something like you suggest in dust. I think it would be technically very difficult to do with the way the game is designed. Those types of battles worked for killzone but what was the max player count for each match?

Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:05:00 - [11] - Quote Lurchasaurus wrote: the current plateaus map is supposedly only 1/5 of the actual map. Oh really? So it's suppose to be larger with more installments? Hmm, missed that I guess. Though, i dont think 24 vs 24 will be enough for a map 5x that size... In fact 12 vs 12 feels... underpopulated as it is. Arcushek Dion wrote: I think if I remember correctly the maximum map size will be 25 square km. my memory may be off. as for doing something like you suggest in dust. I think it would be technically very difficult to do with the way the game is designed. Those types of battles worked for killzone but what was the max player count for each match? Thats huge :o But, where did this info come from? I've been reading tons of forum post since I got into the beta, and I've been reading every announcement for the past 4 or 5 months. Not sure how i could've missed something like that. If they are planning to have maps that large, I'm going to guess their player cap is going to be far beyond 48 players.
Encharrion L.O.T.I.S. Legacy Rising 104	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:15:00 - [12] - Quote Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: Lurchasaurus wrote: the current plateaus map is supposedly only 1/5 of the actual map. Oh really? So it's suppose to be larger with more installments? Hmm, missed that I guess. Though, i dont think 24 vs 24 will be enough for a map 5x that size... In fact 12 vs 12 feels... underpopulated as it is. Arcushek Dion wrote: I think if I remember correctly the maximum map size will be 25 square km. my memory may be off. as for doing something like you suggest in dust. I think it would be technically very difficult to do with the way the game is designed. Those types of battles worked for killzone but what was the max player count for each match? Thats huge :o But, where did this info come from? I've been reading tons of forum post since I got into the beta, and I've been reading every announcement for the past 4 or 5 months. Not sure how i could've missed something like that. If they are planning to have maps that large, I'm going to guess their player cap is going to be far beyond 48 players. Yes, the largest maps will be 5x5 km and yes, the player cap is going to be a lot bigger. But I just can't remember where I got that info from. Maybe the dust 514 fanfest presentations on youtube?
Lurchasaurus SVER True Blood Unclaimed. 808	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:20:00 - [13] - Quote pretty sure it was all in fanfest stuff i remember hearing 64v64 being thrown around at least, but who really knows? still in testing. there is still so much more of the game that isnt even implemented for testing yet. be happy about that lol
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:23:00 - [14] - Quote I think player cap will be determined by the amount of online players over time. If, at first, Dust will only have a few hundred players online together there will be no point in 256 player maps. Maybe those would still exist for corp battles...I don't know. I really don't think player cap is technical. It's more of a way of keeping the game alive considering actual player numbers.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:31:00 - [15] - Quote Dont know how I could've missed fanfest stuff... I watched all the keynotes I'm just hoping this doesnt end up with a player cap of 48. I would really like to see massive battles that rival EVE fleet fights. Hell, lets see something with more destruction than Burn Jita :D
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:35:00 - [16] - Quote The initial player cap might be 24v24 or 48v48 but that'll grow constantly. With each update it'll grow a bit more. This is also something they'd promissed.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:45:00 - [17] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: The initial player cap might be 24v24 or 48v48 but that'll grow constantly. With each update it'll grow a bit more. This is also something they'd promissed. Links..?
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:54:00 - [18] - Quote Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: Grit Breather wrote: The initial player cap might be 24v24 or 48v48 but that'll grow constantly. With each update it'll grow a bit more. This is also something they'd promissed. Links..? Sorry, don't have any handy. But I basically got all this from the FF videos.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 08:58:00 - [19] - Quote I dont remember anything about larger player caps from the fanfest videos.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 09:05:00 - [20] - Quote I think it was from the dev Q&A after the Dust keynote.

Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 09:14:00 - [21] - Quote Oh, didn't see the Q&A stuff. I do know they hinted at something bigger than 24 vs 24, but that could be 30 vs 30, which would still not be that great.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 09:44:00 - [22] - Quote As far as I can recall, they hinted at much bigger than just a slight improvement. Can't remember the exact words though...
Farson Thrask Machetes at Midnight Ghosts of Deep Space 13	Posted - 2012.07.17 09:51:00 - [23] - Quote Here it is. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OplR4SXl2A They say they are testing 64v64 already, but it won't be in for the release.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:18:00 - [24] - Quote YAY! That is a relief, I was worried they were actually going to get stuck at the 48 player cap. 128 isn't as large as I would like to see, but hey, they are CCP after all :) It wouldn't surprise me that if they were testing 128 back in november, they will be pushing that into the beta in the next few months. Well cool, thanks for the link :)
Farson Thrask Machetes at Midnight Ghosts of Deep Space 13	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:31:00 - [25] - Quote No, they have clearly stated that it will still be 24v24 at release. But this game is gonna keep getting improved for as long as people are playing it so it's just a matter of time before we'll see 64v64 and more.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:33:00 - [26] - Quote Oh really? Hmm, I would've thought a feature like that would definitely be worth testing in beta, rather than putting into the game after launch. It would be a huge selling point I would think.
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:34:00 - [27] - Quote They're only testing 64v64 internally. That means there are days when 128 devs are busy playing instead of working on our updates. Lazy devs! Get to work on my updates!
Grit Breather BetaMax. 660	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:36:00 - [28] - Quote Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: Oh really? Hmm, I would've thought a feature like that would definitely be worth testing in beta, rather than putting into the game after launch. It would be a huge selling point I would think. That would be rather difficult. Over the past weekend I only saw aroudn 500 players max on both the US and EU servers. With such low numbers you don't have enough players to test matches with 128 players. You could only run about 4-5 matches at once. Also, with 64 player teams you really HAVE to communicate. As communication is still very buggy, I don't think the beta is ready for such battles. But I'm waiting patiently.
Farson Thrask Machetes at Midnight Ghosts of Deep Space 13	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:38:00 - [29] - Quote Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: Oh really? Hmm, I would've thought a feature like that would definitely be worth testing in beta, rather than putting into the game after launch. It would be a huge selling point I would think. Well maybe they will let us test it and then shrink it back down to 24v24 at release.
Veigar Mordekaiser Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 676	Posted - 2012.07.17 10:38:00 - [30] - Quote Grit Breather wrote: Veigar Mordekaiser wrote: Oh really? Hmm, I would've thought a feature like that would definitely be worth testing in beta, rather than putting into the game after launch. It would be a huge selling point I would think. That would be rather difficult. Over the past weekend I only saw aroudn 500 players max on both the US and EU servers. With such low numbers you don't have enough players to test matches with 128 players. You could only run about 4-5 matches at once. Also, with 64 player teams you really HAVE to communicate. As communication is still very buggy, I don't think the beta is ready for such battles. But I'm waiting patiently. I saw around 3000 people online during the first beta weekend, when they were giving out keys in PS Home. I think that was also the weekend the Merc Pack launched. Roughly 2000 of the people playing were in [US] Plateaus Skirmish.



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