DUST Search - OP Forge Gun

Skoren1 wrote:

Well a few facts, one i do not have or use the forge gun so as to personally using it, i have no experience. As for tanks, I am a pretty decent tank pilot and gunner. I have got enough stuff to make me pretty scary from time to time. As for forge guns not being able to one shot, well i am sorry they do. Militia tanks can be one shotted by them, although i will admit it is rare. Most of the time it takes 2 shots to down a Militia tank. I have the first upgraded tank, the one with the higher shields i forget the name, and am working on the armored one. That tank can be three shotted by a Forge gun most of the time and two shotted other times. Yes i have been playing around with fittings and such to get the most effective set up for what I can use.

That being said, this is Beta still and they want all the feedback they can get, if you wanna call me a QQ'er then that is your problem not mine. I am seeing something that can be exploited and giving suggestions. I mean is this not part of what a Beta is for, find bugs, glitches, exploits, and other issues.

I also know that they will be adding A LOT more stuff and this is only the first Beta Weekend. I am not that stupid. Basically the Devs have three choices with my post.

1) Fix what I believe to be an exploit
2) Take only part of what I suggested to make changes
3) Ignore it and leave things as it is

I know they are taking your objections to my post into consideration when they read mine and are working the best to make a game we all can enjoy. In the long run, it is their game and we play it and if you do not like it then just do not play. I respect each of your opinions to my post because as i have fully disclosed I do not have the Forge gun and do not know the play style associated with it. All I ask is instead of saying "OH QQ more" or "Get better at the game" come out with suggestions or information that does not sound coincided. You disagree with me fine but offer alliterative or information so when someone else who feels the gun is OP comes into this tread they can be enlightened by your experiences.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 0 post(s)
Dewie Cheecham Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 677	Posted - 2012.07.03 13:42:00 - [31] - Quote Rukumin wrote: A: the tank is getting from multiple people at the same time. And yes it does happen. B: There is a bug in the damage of a forge gun to a tanks that is allowing it to sometimes do extra damage. If it is B then the development team will need to find it and correct it. If it is A well thats just people all having the same though. turn those pieces of metal into scrap. I have no idea if it was someone with a prototype forge gun and damage modifiers in all slots, or case "B", but I've had my poor Surya go from 50% shield (it really never regains 100% when in combat) to under 50% armour. that is an est 3000HP damage for a single shot. That sounds quite excessive for a hand held weapon. Most of the time though, it takes 3-4 Forge gun shots for me to get fried. As a precaution, I tend to find the exit really fast once I get attacked by a forge gunner.
Simon Havoc ZionTCD Legacy Rising 26	Posted - 2012.07.03 14:32:00 - [32] - Quote Skoren1 wrote: Well a few facts, one i do not have or use the forge gun so as to personally using it, i have no experience. As for tanks, I am a pretty decent tank pilot and gunner. I have got enough stuff to make me pretty scary from time to time. As for forge guns not being able to one shot, well i am sorry they do. Militia tanks can be one shotted by them, although i will admit it is rare. Most of the time it takes 2 shots to down a Militia tank. I have the first upgraded tank, the one with the higher shields i forget the name, and am working on the armored one. That tank can be three shotted by a Forge gun most of the time and two shotted other times. Yes i have been playing around with fittings and such to get the most effective set up for what I can use. That being said, this is Beta still and they want all the feedback they can get, if you wanna call me a QQ'er then that is your problem not mine. I am seeing something that can be exploited and giving suggestions. I mean is this not part of what a Beta is for, find bugs, glitches, exploits, and other issues. I also know that they will be adding A LOT more stuff and this is only the first Beta Weekend. I am not that stupid. Basically the Devs have three choices with my post. 1) Fix what I believe to be an exploit 2) Take only part of what I suggested to make changes 3) Ignore it and leave things as it is I know they are taking your objections to my post into consideration when they read mine and are working the best to make a game we all can enjoy. In the long run, it is their game and we play it and if you do not like it then just do not play. I respect each of your opinions to my post because as i have fully disclosed I do not have the Forge gun and do not know the play style associated with it. All I ask is instead of saying "OH QQ more" or "Get better at the game" come out with suggestions or information that does not sound coincided. You disagree with me fine but offer alliterative or information so when someone else who feels the gun is OP comes into this tread they can be enlightened by your experiences. Part of the problem is your using the word exploited. There is no unintended game mechanics being abused for a gain. The weapons do damage as intended in its current iteration. No one is causing tanks to catapult across the map, there is no grenade throw glitch making them go hundreds of feet, and there is no download for stupidity. The other thing is, there is nothing that prevents a team from spawning all heavies with swarms, and popping your tank so fast you never realized you got into it. Part of EVE is that its a sandbox. They work to balance the tools, but CCP has a hands off policy about player tactics and strategy. If you want to expose yourself to multiple players or just one, long enough for him to fire a couple of shots, well that is your own prerogative.
Sylwester Dziewiecki Doomheim 83	Posted - 2012.07.03 20:47:00 - [33] - Quote It's been said many times before, I'll say it again because I love the Forge gun . I killing most of the tanks in 2 shoots This is because at present most of them are paper(Militia). I use Type-II heavy dropsuit with 2x+10% modifer, cpu up., and Ishukone Assault Forge gun(1512dmg if I'm correct) this fiting cost me 29k(~) isk. - Weapon dmg skill bonus at 5 -15% - Forge gun specialty skill at 3 - 9% - 2x dmg mod give me 20% It give me 44% dmg mod(665,28) so I can deal 2177,28 dmg per hit. To be perfect dmg dealer I need to train my heavy suit on 5, get in to suit that have 3 medium slot and skill up my forge gune specialization to 5, and that will give me +16% dmg mod(907,2 total) with make in total 2419,2 dmg per hit on Ishukone Assault Forge gun(fit cost around 75k isk). I've never shot down a tank with one shot (even empty), but it seems to me that this is possible if someone uses speed boost modules which reduce the amount of hp armor. I had a chance encounter into three tanks where I was not able to destroyed them(the first of them was hit seven times and run away), none of them was repaired by the logistics(other vehicle or soldier). to mention about my fiting - it's pure dps running around on the roof in heavy suite I'm very easy target for snipers(despite the fact that I have no side arms) - on ground I'm just walking death.
Lucius Gabnar Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 61	Posted - 2012.07.03 21:43:00 - [34] - Quote Ignatius Crumwald wrote: Stop with the QQ. The forge gun is fine where it's at. Train some vehicle skills and git gud. I Agree.
Garl Dravon Algintal Core Gallente Federation 30	Posted - 2012.07.03 22:53:00 - [35] - Quote I play EXCLUSIVELY with the Forge Gun. I roll with Heavy Damage Modifiers, Weaponry V, and Forge Gun Proficiency IV. I use the Prototype Forge in all my loadouts. I have had the EXTREME displeasure of playing against Noc Tempre. I shot him - expecting the usual damage - and did a double-take at his shield bar as it casually shrugged off my blast. I proceeded to unload five more rounds into him before succumbing to missile fire, and I didn't even break his shields. I've encountered the same thing when dealing with other tanks: though I'm sorry to say I can't remember any other names. While militia tanks will explode in one or two hits, and dropships almost always go down in two, I've seen substantial evidence that a well-fitted tank can and will survive a Forge Gun. Don't nerf my favorite weapon even more, please. I already miss running around with a charge loaded. It's near impossible to use my gun on infantry now. Don't leave me crippled against tanks too.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.07.04 01:10:00 - [36] - Quote The only OP factor about the forge gun this patch is they give no hit indicator or bullet trail. Clearly a bug, but makes dealing with them a scary proposition, especially with good positioning.
tribal wyvern ZionTCD Legacy Rising 675	Posted - 2012.07.04 02:37:00 - [37] - Quote Skoren1 wrote: I have no problem with the infantry getting a really powerful gun, but when that one gun can take out a tank in one or two hits and a Tank with a Rail-gun has to hit the same tank 6 or more time then that gun is a little over powered. As it sits when the game goes live all you going to have a squad of guns in Heavy Armor and Forge guns just eating alive the other team. Again i think it should do a lot of damage but should be no where near the damage of a tanks Large Rail gun, maybe make it have the same damage as a tanks Small Rail gun. That is a lot more believable, seeing as it is the size of the Small Rail-gun on the Tanks it should do comparable damage. Either that or make Small Rail-guns on a the tanks do as much as the Forge Gun and the Large Turret do 3-5x's more damage. Another suggestion is keep the damage but instead of it having a total of 16 shots reduce it to 1-4 shots, it should only be use as an Anti tank/turret gun and not as a gun you fire all the time like it currently is. Logically if it is doing the same damage as the Large Rail-guns on tanks it should burn out a lot quicker due to the capacitors not being able to handle the power required for a small thing as that to do the damage it does. Please no hating i am just seeing an exploit and pointing it out. Oh here we f***ing go again! OP this gun and OP that gun. have you ever fired a forge gun?............no? I wonder why, CUZ THEY DON'T EXIST! So just how in the world do you know the forge guns are over powered????????????
TheAmazing FlyingPig Crux Special Tasks Group Gallente Federation 157	Posted - 2012.07.04 03:31:00 - [38] - Quote Tank driver here. Forge guns are fine as-is. Rock / paper / scissors. I pick rock. You pick scissors. Rock is now overpowered and needs a nerf.
Bhal Jhor Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 23	Posted - 2012.07.04 03:49:00 - [39] - Quote tribal wyvern wrote: Oh here we f***ing go again! OP this gun and OP that gun. have you ever fired a forge gun?............no? I wonder why, CUZ THEY DON'T EXIST! So just how in the world do you know the forge guns are over powered???????????? Ok, when an infantry portable weapon does more damage to vehicles and structures than the main turret weapon of a tank then I think it's ok to say that there's a problem.
Ignatius Crumwald Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 475	Posted - 2012.07.04 04:01:00 - [40] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: The only OP factor about the forge gun this patch is they give no hit indicator or bullet trail. Clearly a bug, but makes dealing with them a scary proposition, especially with good positioning. You don't say... Bhal Jhor wrote: tribal wyvern wrote: Oh here we f*ing go again! OP this gun and OP that gun. have you ever fired a forge gun?............no? I wonder why, CUZ THEY DON'T EXIST! So just how in the world do you know the forge guns are over powered???????????? Ok, when an infantry portable weapon does more damage to vehicles and structures than the main turret weapon of a tank then I think it's ok to say that there's a problem. Oh, go summon your persona. The prototype railgun does massive** damage. MASSIVE damage. There's no heavy fit in the world that can even survive the splash damage from two poorly aimed shots, let alone a direct hit. The only problem with it is that it made you follow up a Q with another Q instead of a pew x2.

Fat Axel Sanmatar Kelkoons Minmatar Republic 21	Posted - 2012.07.04 04:11:00 - [41] - Quote in one the dev videos they said that team work would be necisary to take down most vehicles..... like how they said it would be best to have a scout throw a web grenade at a drop ship so a heavy could smash it with a forge gun.. i feel like this should make a more noticeable presence in the game, like make forge guns do massive shield dmg and make swarm launchers do massive armor damage, that way both could be effective against vehicles, and against the right tank they could be demolishing, but all in all the only true way to take a tank would be a person with each, or just a few extra shots with ur forge gun against an armor tank or vice versa for swarms
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.07.04 05:46:00 - [42] - Quote Ignatius Crumwald wrote: Noc Tempre wrote: The only OP factor about the forge gun this patch is they give no hit indicator or bullet trail. Clearly a bug, but makes dealing with them a scary proposition, especially with good positioning. You don't say... Yes. I feel sorry for your future victims. I only got a double whammy so still playing (yes heard you on comms last game Monday morning)
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 583	Posted - 2012.07.04 09:05:00 - [43] - Quote If you're able to one shot a tank, it was probably Militia with a horrific fit. Any decent tank is not going to go down that easily. I run a Surya, which is the Gallente Marauder in case you don't know. On the Fit I'm currently running with I have the best armor repair, the best 120mm armor plating, and 3 damage reduction modules that vary between -23%-25% damage each, and those are just my low slots. This puts me at 5k-6k Armor HP before skills, and a damage reduction of well over 50%, meaning even if your forge gun is hitting for 2,000 HP a second, you're going to have to shoot me at the very least 6 times. At best you're firing at what, once every two seconds? Mean you have to shoot me without my armor rep going for at least 12 seconds. Unless I'm an idiot, you'll either be dead, or I'll be long gone by the time you make me worried. I've never lost a marauder before, but the only times I've really gotten into deep **** is when I get surrounded and have multiple people beating on me for an extended period of time. Moral of the story, no, the Forge Gun is not OP, and no, a single person is not going to be able to take on a Marauder by himself and win. Also Noc, I'd like to have a discussion with you at some points about the pro/cons between the Sageris and Surya, still deciding on what I want to do in the main game and I'm curious on what sort of fit/effective HP you have on your tank.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.07.04 09:25:00 - [44] - Quote Surya's make good bricks, that's for sure. Although I warn you to pay forge guns more respect, you are very lucky at this point not to have lost a marauder, and some particular people I know will give you a serious run for your money solo. Shop talk like specific fits is easier on the IRC. Be sure to get on and I'd be happy to tell you why the Sagaris is greatly superior
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 583	Posted - 2012.07.04 09:36:00 - [45] - Quote Noc Tempre wrote: Surya's make good bricks, that's for sure. Although I warn you to pay forge guns more respect, you are very lucky at this point not to have lost a marauder, and some particular people I know will give you a serious run for your money solo. Shop talk like specific fits is easier on the IRC. Be sure to get on and I'd be happy to tell you why the Sagaris is greatly superior Oh dont get me wrong, Forge Guns scare the **** out of me, especially at range when I have issues dealing with them. Im just making a point that the forge gun wont go around popping Marauders in 2 shots either. I'll also jump on IRC right now if you're still available EDIT: Looks like I've neglected to register for the NDA protected IRC, looks like our discussion will have to wait unless you're willing to talk via other means.
Noc Tempre Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1170	Posted - 2012.07.04 09:51:00 - [46] - Quote Looking into getting you fast-track access, make sure you register the nick now. In other news, the forums could do with a PM system.


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