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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
John DaMarine
211
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
... I'll crack a smile if I ever see this weekend's again. Good times. |
Lyonya Spaghetti
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:47:00 -
[2] - Quote
1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? |
RolyatDerTeufel
D3ath D3alers
RISE of LEGION
1648
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:47:00 -
[3] - Quote
John DaMarine wrote:
... I'll crack a smile if I ever see this weekend's again. Good times.
lol |
GIZMO2606
80
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:49:00 -
[4] - Quote
RolyatDerTeufel wrote:John DaMarine wrote:
... I'll crack a smile if I ever see this weekend's again. Good times.
lol
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SoLJae
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
351
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:50:00 -
[5] - Quote
Good lord! Where did you hear that? If there are that many maps when this game releases, I might never stop playing!
I'm addicted to the damned Beta! And will be crying tomorrow when i need my fix and the server is offline.
Has anyone heard of a official release date? rumors? Please be soon. |
jamie deveroux
Sanmatar Kelkoons
Minmatar Republic
37
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:52:00 -
[6] - Quote
SoLJae wrote:Good lord! Where did you hear that? If there are that many maps when this game releases, I might never stop playing!
I'm addicted to the damned Beta! And will be crying tomorrow when i need my fix and the server is offline.
Has anyone heard of a official release date? rumors? Please be soon.
SoonGäó |
John DaMarine
211
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:53:00 -
[7] - Quote
SoLJae wrote:Good lord! Where did you hear that? If there are that many maps when this game releases, I might never stop playing!
I'm addicted to the damned Beta! And will be crying tomorrow when i need my fix and the server is offline.
Has anyone heard of a official release date? rumors? Please be soon.
According to the Dust 514 wiki page (and quoted from Eurogamer):
"Brandon Laurino, executive producer of Dust 514, has confirmed that there will not be a set number of maps at launch, saying "We are covering literally a universe of planets, so there's thousands of different maps and they're all available to everyone who's playing." |
TiMeSpLiT--TeR
Planetary Response Organisation
Test Friends Please Ignore
326
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:54:00 -
[8] - Quote
Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that?
For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps. |
Rhuvian Marccus
Deep Space Republic
25
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:58:00 -
[9] - Quote
TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps.
There are FanFest videos that go into great detail about how that software works. If things go the way they are intended to go according to CCP's own admission, 1400 maps is NOT unrealistic.
And by the way, that number is purely in reference to temperate planets. And this may not include underwater installations. Eventually, we will hopefully be fighting on low-G hellholes full of lava pits and the like as well. |
Lyonya Spaghetti
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2012.07.01 20:59:00 -
[10] - Quote
TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps.
As far as I know, the generator is going to select a man-built map, give it appropriate textures, weather and lighting and then place the buildings in pre-determined "building slots".
Provided that there are enough maps, the variety of this game could actually be amazing, but there won't be 1400+ unique maps. |
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Nstomper
Th3-ReSiStAnCe-SEC.0
205
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:00:00 -
[11] - Quote
Rhuvian Marccus wrote:TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps. There are FanFest videos that go into great detail about how that software works. If things go the way they are intended to go according to CCP's own admission, 1400 maps is NOT unrealistic. And by the way, that number is purely in reference to temperate planets. And this may not include underwater installations. Eventually, we will hopefully be fighting on low-G hellholes full of lava pits and the like as well.
^this
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La Fortune
Terranauts
36
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:06:00 -
[12] - Quote
Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that?
You're right... there's about 7200 temperate planets in New Eden, with possibly around 6 districts each, so about 42,000 unique battlefields. Sure a lot will share the same weather or environmental look, but every single map should be different in at least a few ways, especially concerning gameplay.
Quote:For the thousands of planets in New Eden, hear how we will populate each planet with its own terrain, outposts, surface infrastructure, and game modes.
Seeding the Universe |
Rhuvian Marccus
Deep Space Republic
25
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:09:00 -
[13] - Quote
La Fortune wrote:Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? You're right... there's about 7200 temperate planets in New Eden, with possibly around 6 districts each, so about 42,000 unique battlefields. Sure a lot will share the same weather or environmental look, but every single map should be different in at least a few ways, especially concerning gameplay. Quote:For the thousands of planets in New Eden, hear how we will populate each planet with its own terrain, outposts, surface infrastructure, and game modes. Seeding the Universe
Good man. |
Milhaus Nixon
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
6
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:32:00 -
[14] - Quote
If there were 1400 maps being planned, wouldn't there be more than one to test on I mean, even if they only made 1% of the overall maps so far, it isn't as if there would be too much given away by having two to choose from. Given the single map available and its unpolished state, I wouldn't count on seeing more than a small handful of unique maps, and maybe some reskins on top of that. |
Derek Barnes
ZionTCD
Legacy Rising
340
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:35:00 -
[15] - Quote
TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps.
Yeah, in a gameplay video they had, they said that planets do generate themselves and then they go in and fix up anything on that planet that doesn't make sense or makes the planet unplayable and they said none of the planets will be identical |
Vetis Cato
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
250
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:38:00 -
[16] - Quote
thats just temperate planets on release. they are already planning to put in the other types in future add-ons. lava, ice etc |
Drake Lyons
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
209
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:39:00 -
[17] - Quote
If you actually have any interest in understanding how CCP plans on implementing the maps they are building, watch this video.
Otherwise, be happy with the answer that there will ultimately be an incredible variety of environments to kill each other in across thousands of planets. |
sys Ghost
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
23
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:46:00 -
[18] - Quote
It is possible to generate a fully playable map that is unique. It just requires a LOT of boundaries for the generators. For example, saying "Fill my land with terrain between -128 and 128 units high" won't work. You have to use a complex mix of calculus and greater level mathematics to generate the terrain. Think of it like saying to the map generator "You can use curve functions up to this magnitude" and then applying a certain random face generator to roughen up the curve created by the smooth function. On top of that, you also need to put in rules that separate higher terrains from lower to create valleys that allow for entry, otherwise you may end up with completely walled off sections. With plenty of restrictions in place, it IS possible to generate 14,000 maps. However, such a technology has not ever really been implemented on that high of a detailed scale. The only game to use similar restrictions is minecraft, and it does not NEARLY have the kind of generation restrictions that dust would need.
In all honesty though, just generating a playable, fully explorable map does not mean that it will be good. Think of the countless maps created in the past throughout FPS history that had MAJOR advantages towards offense or defense. Even dev created maps can be unintentionally favored to one side or the other, so if we don't even know the *formulas* for a perfectly balanced map, we can hardly create a algorithm that will produce for us a thousand perfect maps.
TL;DR : The sad truth is it is too complicated to generate truly unique terrain that is balanced for gameplay. Most likely we will just end up with randomly generated terrain, and maybe a few jumbled default turret locations. |
Lyonya Spaghetti
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:49:00 -
[19] - Quote
La Fortune wrote:You're right... there's about 7200 temperate planets in New Eden, with possibly around 6 districts each, so about 42,000 unique battlefields. Sure a lot will share the same weather or environmental look, but every single map should be different in at least a few ways, especially concerning gameplay.
I'm cautiously optimistic about that at best. It sounds too good to be true. I would not consider the same map re-skinned a different map.
Yeah, I'm rewatching it. It sounds a lot like they're going to use generic landscapes and put in different weathers, lightings, textures, etc. and call it "a different map". The way player choices can affect maps sounds pretty impressive, though. |
Noric CLONE004
3
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:55:00 -
[20] - Quote
The base maps may be unique but the installations are not unique.
Watch the seeding the universe video and he talks about small, medium and large installations. There are different kinds of installations: communication, bio, etc. and different factions. All factions will probably not be available at launch. In fact its not known what map types will be available at launch.
People will probably refer to the map type based on the installation and (eventually) the planet type. |
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John DaMarine
211
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:57:00 -
[21] - Quote
sys Ghost wrote:
Think of the countless maps created in the past throughout FPS history that had MAJOR advantages towards offense or defense. Even dev created maps can be unintentionally favored to one side or the other, so if we don't even know the *formulas* for a perfectly balanced map
As an attacker or defender, I wouldn't be too concerned if a number of maps out of thousands were weighted one way of the other. Sometimes battlefields favour one side, its that simple. Sometimes its in your favour, sometimes its not. If you can't adjust your strategy you lose. |
Rhapsodyy Darkstorm
25
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Posted - 2012.07.01 21:58:00 -
[22] - Quote
Nstomper wrote:Rhuvian Marccus wrote:TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps. There are FanFest videos that go into great detail about how that software works. If things go the way they are intended to go according to CCP's own admission, 1400 maps is NOT unrealistic. And by the way, that number is purely in reference to temperate planets. And this may not include underwater installations. Eventually, we will hopefully be fighting on low-G hellholes full of lava pits and the like as well. ^this
To note there is approx 7k temperate planets, and we will have 10-20 districts each planet. Then throw into the mix as mentioned the way ccp is going to be generating the maps. We could have way more than 1400 maps from the 7k temperate planets.
Oh and there 50k total planets in New Eden.....
So yeah start doin the maths, could be crazy numbers and there could be more added over time.
Check out Dust514 Seeding the Universe vid from fanfest this year. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pNmCRti9dFM |
The2 Holgg
BetaMax Beta
47
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Posted - 2012.07.01 22:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
Seen the video. what I got from it is that we will have a random generated ( this will only be done once) environment whit infrastructure sockets so we will have some of the same buildings but hole different environment to play on all 7200 planets. And the placement of the buildings will be different from planet to planet.
Neat if you ask me =D |
Vetis Cato
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
250
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Posted - 2012.07.01 22:58:00 -
[24] - Quote
also there was talking about including station based battles too!! |
Lyonya Spaghetti
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2012.07.01 23:08:00 -
[25] - Quote
The2 Holgg wrote:Seen the video. what I got from it is that we will have a random generated ( this will only be done once) environment whit infrastructure sockets so we will have some of the same buildings but hole different environment to play on all 7200 planets. And the placement of the buildings will be different from planet to planet.
Neat if you ask me =D
The actual landscape will be hand crafted. The weather, textures, lighting or the occasional plants will be determined by a map generator that generates these things based on the information about the planet. The placement of buildings will be determined by players who control the territory. They could be destroyed by an attacker and rebuilt differently, so they may change. |
Dewie Cheecham
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
677
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Posted - 2012.07.01 23:11:00 -
[26] - Quote
TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:1400+ maps is an unrealistic expectation. Weren't they basically going to make a few maps and then give them different textures and stuff like that? For what I heard that they are going to make a program that generates its own maps.
It has a name: Procedural generation or Procedural content generation
The idea is to use a set of algorithms and rules, and pseudo random variables, meaning that with the same variables, the output will be the same. It is fairly complex, but unless I'm mistaken, it is something the Cell CPU in the PS3 is uniquely well suited for. |
Dewie Cheecham
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
677
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Posted - 2012.07.01 23:13:00 -
[27] - Quote
Rhapsodyy Darkstorm wrote:Oh and there 50k total planets in New Eden.....
And those planets often have moons that are also suitable for combat... |
Rhuvian Marccus
Deep Space Republic
25
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Posted - 2012.07.01 23:15:00 -
[28] - Quote
Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:The2 Holgg wrote:Seen the video. what I got from it is that we will have a random generated ( this will only be done once) environment whit infrastructure sockets so we will have some of the same buildings but hole different environment to play on all 7200 planets. And the placement of the buildings will be different from planet to planet.
Neat if you ask me =D The actual landscape will be hand crafted. The weather, textures, lighting or the occasional plants will be determined by a map generator that generates these things based on the information about the planet. The placement of buildings will be determined by players who control the territory. They could be destroyed by an attacker and rebuilt differently, so they may change.
The placement of turrets will be determined by a Corp. The large installations are static. |
The2 Holgg
BetaMax Beta
47
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Posted - 2012.07.01 23:19:00 -
[29] - Quote
Lyonya Spaghetti wrote:The2 Holgg wrote:Seen the video. what I got from it is that we will have a random generated ( this will only be done once) environment whit infrastructure sockets so we will have some of the same buildings but hole different environment to play on all 7200 planets. And the placement of the buildings will be different from planet to planet.
Neat if you ask me =D The actual landscape will be hand crafted. The weather, textures, lighting or the occasional plants will be determined by a map generator that generates these things based on the information about the planet. The placement of buildings will be determined by players who control the territory. They could be destroyed by an attacker and rebuilt differently, so they may change.
hmm well so the part in the video about the sockets for infrastructure and how they where programing a soft-where that was going to generate new map for every planet was wrong or did I misunderstand it? |
Lyonya Spaghetti
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
8
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Posted - 2012.07.01 23:32:00 -
[30] - Quote
The2 Holgg wrote:hmm well so the part in the video about the sockets for infrastructure and how they where programing a soft-where that was going to generate new map for every planet was wrong or did I misunderstand it?
The players should get to determine what is built in each socket, if I understood correctly. And the generator will generate a new map for each territory, but it's entirely possible for it to generate two identical maps. Basically, it picks an area from a hand-crafted territory and then assigns it weather, lighting, etc. in a way that would make sense.
This was how I understood it. I may have misunderstood it. If so, feel free to correct me. |
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