DUST Search - Ninja Nerfs/Changes? (@Rattati)

CCP Rattati wrote:

Adipem Nothi wrote:

David Spd wrote:

Mistakes =/= ninja nerfs. Would the community kindly let this crap go? Rattati has stated multiple times that "ninja nerfs" are usually just mistakes on their part and people keep thinking they're doing malicious things.

Just stop people; you're making yourselves look dense.

It is good to test and confirm that what was meant to happen did in fact happen. It is also good to test for errors and/or unintended consequences. Whether or not people think Rattati is being sneaky only adds flavor to the narrative :-)

PS: I don't think Rattati is being sneaky. I blame rogue coders. Lol

Adipem Nothi wrote:

Tested Keeriam's rotation theory as follows ...

GalLogi jumps and rotates X degrees before hitting the ground. To confirm consistency, recharged stamina fully and repeated the process 5x.

Results
> 180 degree rotation (~200 degrees) - GalLogi + 0 plates
< 180 degree rotation (~160 degrees) - GalLogi + 2 complex plates + 2 standard plates

Conclusion
The addition of plates seems to have either decreased jump height or slowed rotation speed.

* Using DS3 at 100% sensitivity.

I dont recall saying Plates shouldnt change turning speed. I said heavies shouldn't have different rotation speed than other sizes.

Also, this effect may, for all I know, always been the case, so why cry nerf? I will need videos of before and after this perceived change.

The only change done was to increase the strafe penalty of armor plates, and that was broadcast and discussed like any other change we have made. If it did have this rotation speed, then it was unintended, but something I am happy with anyway. Sometimes a cake tastes better, even if you used the wrong ingredients.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 9 post(s)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 19:05:00 - [31] - Quote Keeriam Miray wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: Ready the potato cam, Keeriam! Show us what you're seeing. Lmao, but no. I asked Duncan, video is coming (in good quality ). Disappoint, but glad to hear that Duncan's on it :-) Logging on to test as we speak ... Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 19:18:00 - [32] - Quote David Spd wrote: Mistakes =/= ninja nerfs. Would the community kindly let this crap go? Rattati has stated multiple times that "ninja nerfs" are usually just mistakes on their part and people keep thinking they're doing malicious things. Just stop people; you're making yourselves look dense. It is good to test and confirm that what was meant to happen did in fact happen. It is also good to test for errors and/or unintended consequences. Whether or not people think Rattati is being sneaky only adds to the narrative :-) PS: I don't think Rattati is being sneaky. If anyone is being sneaky, it is his coders. Adipem Nothi wrote: Tested Keeriam's rotation theory as follows ... GalLogi jumps and rotates X degrees before hitting the ground. To confirm consistency, recharged stamina fully and repeated the process 5x. Results > 180 degree rotation (~200 degrees) - GalLogi + 0 plates < 180 degree rotation (~160 degrees) - GalLogi + 2 complex plates and 2 standard plates * DS3 at 100% sensitivity. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 25	Posted - 2015.07.29 19:38:00 - [33] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: David Spd wrote: Mistakes =/= ninja nerfs. Would the community kindly let this crap go? Rattati has stated multiple times that "ninja nerfs" are usually just mistakes on their part and people keep thinking they're doing malicious things. Just stop people; you're making yourselves look dense. It is good to test and confirm that what was meant to happen did in fact happen. It is also good to test for errors and/or unintended consequences. Whether or not people think Rattati is being sneaky only adds flavor to the narrative :-) PS: I don't think Rattati is being sneaky. I blame rogue coders. Adipem Nothi wrote: Tested Keeriam's rotation theory as follows ... GalLogi jumps and rotates X degrees before hitting the ground. To confirm consistency, recharged stamina fully and repeated the process 5x. Results > 180 degree rotation (~200 degrees) - GalLogi + 0 plates < 180 degree rotation (~160 degrees) - GalLogi + 2 complex plates + 2 standard plates Conclusion The addition of plates seems to have either decreased jump height or slowed rotation speed. * Using DS3 at 100% sensitivity. I dont recall saying Plates shouldnt change turning speed. I said heavies shouldn't have different rotation speed than other sizes. Also, this effect may, for all I know, always been the case, so why cry nerf? I will need videos of before and after this perceived change. The only change done was to increase the strafe penalty of armor plates, and that was broadcast and discussed like any other change we have made. If it did have this rotation speed, then it was unintended, but something I am happy with anyway. Sometimes a cake tastes better, even if you used the wrong ingredients. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 19:49:00 - [34] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: ... I'm with you 100%, and I'm not crying "stealth nerf" or "foul play" here; the results of the above test were simply unexpected. As I understand it, Duncan should have a test video up soon. PS: Observed similar affect on Assault suit. Will also test Sentinel, Commando and Scout. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 25	Posted - 2015.07.29 19:51:00 - [35] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: ... I'm with you 100%, and I'm not crying "stealth nerf" or "foul play" here; the results of the above test were simply unexpected. As I understand it, Duncan should have a test video up soon. PS: Observed similar affect on Assault suit. Will also test Sentinel, Commando and Scout. Again, useless if there is no before and after. I honestly don't know that's not the way it always has been. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

XxGhazbaranxX 0.P. 2	Posted - 2015.07.29 19:52:00 - [36] - Quote Sorry for the sh*t storm this thread turned into. Really am... Plasma Cannon Advocate
Keeriam Miray Nos Nothi 541	Posted - 2015.07.29 20:03:00 - [37] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Again, useless if there is no before and after. I honestly don't know that's not the way it always has been. Half second per rotation. Gal. assault with 5 proto ferro plates & 5 proto regular plates. Test 1 Test 2 EDIT: updated with videos "Call no man happy til he is dead. Happy, happy, happy, happy, happy..."
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 20:12:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: ... I'm with you 100%, and I'm not crying "stealth nerf" or "foul play" here; the results of the above test were simply unexpected. As I understand it, Duncan should have a test video up soon. Again, useless if there is no before and after. I honestly don't know that's not the way it always has been. Very well may have been the case all along; I have no idea. My understanding has been that rotation speeds since mid-Uprising were no longer affected by frame type or loadout; rather, rotation speed was derived strictly from input device sensitivity settings. This understanding (which I believe to be a common understanding) may be incorrect; looking forward to reviewing Duncan's video. (Not crying "ninja nerf" here ... just trying to better understand the mechanics in play.) TL;DR: Yes, useless. But also unexpected and very interesting. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 20:16:00 - [39] - Quote @ Keeriam, Rattati is saying that this may have been the case for a long time. Interesting as it is, we have no way of knowing whether or not this unexpected finding is old news or new news. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Keeriam Miray Nos Nothi 542	Posted - 2015.07.29 20:20:00 - [40] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Keeriam, Rattati is saying that this may have been the case for a long time. Interesting as it is, we have no way of knowing whether or not this unexpected finding is old news or new news. It happened like 2 weeks ago or so, my sentinel sniper & "heavy" assault become magically slower, can't follow my targets as before. And i started actively playing with gal. assault just two months ago, therefore i noticed changes. "Call no man happy til he is dead. Happy, happy, happy, happy, happy..."

Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 20:27:00 - [41] - Quote Keeriam Miray wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Keeriam, Rattati is saying that this may have been the case for a long time. Interesting as it is, we have no way of knowing whether or not this unexpected finding is old news or new news. It happened like 2 weeks ago or so, my sentinel sniper & "heavy" assault become magically slower, can't follow my target as before. And i started actively playing with gal. assault just two months ago, therefore i noticed change. Unbelievable. In hindsight, we should've brought all this up in a thread other than an "Attack Rattati" thread. The disposition here is all wrong. Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Ice Royal Glantix 0.P. 231	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:08:00 - [42] - Quote Wow. Just wow. I ask one simple question, get one clear answer, and apparently start a huge argument. What is with you guys? Rattati has given his word that no "ninja" changes have occurred, but everyone is calling him out on being a liar. Sometimes the community proves itself to be very ****** up. Also, at Ghaz, it was not you that spread these rumors to me, so do not take the blame. It was one of our newer members; I'm sure you know whom. Also, thank you for the hacking video. It was really nice to clearly see which one is faster. Maybe one day, the community will appreciate the amazing dev team we have. Sincerely, Glantix / Ice "Solitude is not a burden; it is a gift, for independence allows us to realize our own potential." Glantix / Ice
Nothing Certain Bioshock Rejects 1	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:14:00 - [43] - Quote My only complaint with the Dev team is that the stuff that is pissibg me off is not the same as the stuff that is pissing them off. For a while it seemed Rattati was channeling my thoughts. I want that back. Because, that's why.
Aeon Amadi Negative-Feedback. Negative-Feedback 11	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:23:00 - [44] - Quote I built an empire on the methodical creation of the best crystal in the entire south west United States.... I survived crazed drug lords, cartel operators, and DEA agents... My family left me because they couldn't understand or align to the ideals that I had formed and I cursed them all for lacking the insight to see what I have built. Bricks and bricks and bricks of cash underneath floor boards in the basement with the constant threat of danger at every turn..... .... all because this thread gave me cancer. Aeon Amadi for CPM 2 Design A SKIN 2
GeorgeN76 Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 192	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:47:00 - [45] - Quote Please dont bite the hand that feeds you! This game is currenty in the best spot its ever been - IMO - BECAUSE OF RATTATI AND HIS TEAM!! And its only getting better. If you dont like it, there are other games out there. This is my opinion and arguing with me over it would be like arguing about my favorite color. Wait......what.....I forgot what my favorite color was. Scouts and Swarms
Adipem Nothi Nos Nothi 12	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:49:00 - [46] - Quote GeorgeN76 wrote: Please dont bite the hand that feeds you! This game is currenty in the best spot its ever been - IMO - BECAUSE OF RATTATI AND HIS TEAM!! +1 Shoot scout with yes. - Ripley Riley (for CPM2)
Pocket Rocket Girl Psygod9 492	Posted - 2015.07.29 21:58:00 - [47] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: There have been no ninja changes for over a year that I can think of, except last week when I figured a last minute change wouldn't hurt anyone, added modules into the new slots on the APEX commandos, broke them by go over on pg/cpu, and then realized it would be a good idea to buff them all and align them all to the same values, like the grand plan dictates, resulting in one suit getting "ninja" nerfed. If there are more, I will freely admit to them, but perpetuating this kind of misinformation that we are always somehow being untruthful and insincere is really aggravating. What about the C-1 frame. The staff recruiter frame the pg and cpu is incorrect will that be fixedornis that as intended. ? Have garbage gun game? Throw a Core.
GeorgeN76 Condotta Rouvenor Gallente Federation 194	Posted - 2015.07.29 22:13:00 - [48] - Quote My main concern with this game is that if it gets the plug pulled instead of a port/remake. Here's to wishing it goes on! Scouts and Swarms
David Spd Caldari State 203	Posted - 2015.07.29 23:32:00 - [49] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: David Spd wrote: Mistakes =/= ninja nerfs. Would the community kindly let this crap go? Rattati has stated multiple times that "ninja nerfs" are usually just mistakes on their part and people keep thinking they're doing malicious things. Just stop people; you're making yourselves look dense. It is good to test and confirm that what was meant to happen did in fact happen. It is also good to test for errors and/or unintended consequences. Whether or not people think Rattati is being sneaky only adds flavor to the narrative :-) PS: I don't think Rattati is being sneaky. I blame rogue coders. All I'm saying is, people need to stop with the "OMG CCP RATTATI WHY YOU NERF ALL THIS THINGS" when that's not the case. Ask questions, do research, but put the tinfoil hats on the hat rack. Rattati has been a very helpful part of the community and he has never done ANYTHING to deserve suspicion or distrust. I may not love CCP as a whole, but Rattati has done the Dust players a real solid since he joined their team. --> I'm a closed beta vet; I just don't post often <-- "Other people just complicate my life." ~Solid Snake
VALCORE72 Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 337	Posted - 2015.07.29 23:45:00 - [50] - Quote ratts needs to quit ccp and go to a better company . with what hes done he can easily get hired for better pay and working conditions . BTW rat still upset no ar fix yet or bolt tone down. get yee arss back to your box lol

Al the destroyer Vader's-Fist 811	Posted - 2015.07.30 00:42:00 - [51] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: David Spd wrote: Mistakes =/= ninja nerfs. Would the community kindly let this crap go? Rattati has stated multiple times that "ninja nerfs" are usually just mistakes on their part and people keep thinking they're doing malicious things. Just stop people; you're making yourselves look dense. It is good to test and confirm that what was meant to happen did in fact happen. It is also good to test for errors and/or unintended consequences. Whether or not people think Rattati is being sneaky only adds flavor to the narrative :-) PS: I don't think Rattati is being sneaky. I blame rogue coders. Adipem Nothi wrote: Tested Keeriam's rotation theory as follows ... GalLogi jumps and rotates X degrees before hitting the ground. To confirm consistency, recharged stamina fully and repeated the process 5x. Results > 180 degree rotation (~200 degrees) - GalLogi + 0 plates < 180 degree rotation (~160 degrees) - GalLogi + 2 complex plates + 2 standard plates Conclusion The addition of plates seems to have either decreased jump height or slowed rotation speed. * Using DS3 at 100% sensitivity. I dont recall saying Plates shouldnt change turning speed. I said heavies shouldn't have different rotation speed than other sizes. Also, this effect may, for all I know, always been the case, so why cry nerf? I will need videos of before and after this perceived change. The only change done was to increase the strafe penalty of armor plates, and that was broadcast and discussed like any other change we have made. If it did have this rotation speed, then it was unintended, but something I am happy with anyway. Sometimes a cake tastes better, even if you used the wrong ingredients. MMMMMMMM CAKE! Vader's-Fist an army like no other! MH will burn...all of it!
TIGER SHARK1501 Savage Bullet RUST415 310	Posted - 2015.07.30 00:57:00 - [52] - Quote jett it wrote: Great words there Rattati, thumbs up! ^ Plus love all the new updates hope there are many more to come :) We need quafe weapons tradable next plz, pretty plz, pretty pretty plz.... Indeed!!! I want to haz Quafe Plasma Cannon.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 02:24:00 - [53] - Quote Rattati, while I appreciate your responses here I don't feel that you should have to justify yourself to people who are wrong and approaching things in such an aggressive manner. I mean idiots love to be wrong, and they particularly love to be wrong in the face of actual evidence that contradicts their position. I've gotten involved in wonderful arguments where people still insist that you were wrong/lying about calscout hitbox, and arguments about how all stacking penalties were removed and such, usually its just a long parade of horrible logical fallacies and failures of critical thought. Unfortunately a lot of this does stem from lack of player access to information (in particular accurate information), or people being given misinformation, people failing to do their research, or people outright lying about things cause dunning-krueger or other needs for a scapegoat. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 10	Posted - 2015.07.30 06:13:00 - [54] - Quote Forge gun projectile hasn't changed on my end. Visual glitch with rendering? WoW has taught me that Purple means Legendary. This means Quafe suits are the optimal loadout for killing all of you.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 07:11:00 - [55] - Quote For as long as I have been playing this game, the suit classes turn at a speed corresponding with their size. I.E with my old KB/M I could max out sentinel turning speed quite easily and it felt restrictive. Scouts and medium suits have always been faster than heavies at turning. I remember at the end of chrome I think it was, this all of a sudden became apparent. "Madness how we turned our common-ground into a battle-ground.." - Essa

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 25	Posted - 2015.07.30 08:04:00 - [56] - Quote Mina Longstrike wrote: Rattati, while I appreciate your responses here I don't feel that you should have to justify yourself to people who are wrong and approaching things in such an aggressive manner. I mean idiots love to be wrong, and they particularly love to be wrong in the face of actual evidence that contradicts their position. I've gotten involved in wonderful arguments where people still insist that you were wrong/lying about calscout hitbox, and arguments about how all stacking penalties were removed and such, usually its just a long parade of horrible logical fallacies and failures of critical thought. Unfortunately a lot of this does stem from lack of player access to information (in particular accurate information), or people being given misinformation, people failing to do their research, or people outright lying about things cause dunning-krueger or other needs for a scapegoat. This will be my definitive and only response on ninja nerfs. Sometimes you need to stamp out the rumors, because ignoring them gives them credence. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"


CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 25	Posted - 2015.07.30 08:04:00 - [57] - Quote Keeriam Miray wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Keeriam, Rattati is saying that this may have been the case for a long time. Interesting as it is, we have no way of knowing whether or not this unexpected finding is old news or new news. It happened like 2 weeks ago or so, my sentinel sniper & "heavy" assault become magically slower, can't follow my targets as before. And i started actively playing with gal. assault just two months ago, therefore i noticed changes. No "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Vell0cet OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 3	Posted - 2015.07.30 14:56:00 - [58] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Mina Longstrike wrote: Rattati, while I appreciate your responses here I don't feel that you should have to justify yourself to people who are wrong and approaching things in such an aggressive manner. I mean idiots love to be wrong, and they particularly love to be wrong in the face of actual evidence that contradicts their position. I've gotten involved in wonderful arguments where people still insist that you were wrong/lying about calscout hitbox, and arguments about how all stacking penalties were removed and such, usually its just a long parade of horrible logical fallacies and failures of critical thought. Unfortunately a lot of this does stem from lack of player access to information (in particular accurate information), or people being given misinformation, people failing to do their research, or people outright lying about things cause dunning-krueger or other needs for a scapegoat. This will be my definitive and only response on ninja nerfs. Sometimes you need to stamp out the rumors, because ignoring them gives them credence. 100% agree. I've heard that you have a higher drop rate of BPO's from lockboxes if you stand on one foot with a bagel on your head while you open them BTW. You might want to look into that. Best PvE idea ever!
Balistyc Farshot MONSTER SYNERGY 322	Posted - 2015.07.30 19:35:00 - [59] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Keeriam Miray wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: @ Keeriam, Rattati is saying that this may have been the case for a long time. Interesting as it is, we have no way of knowing whether or not this unexpected finding is old news or new news. It happened like 2 weeks ago or so, my sentinel sniper & "heavy" assault become magically slower, can't follow my targets as before. And i started actively playing with gal. assault just two months ago, therefore i noticed changes. No, keep this up and I will nerf your main weapon into the ground!!! Then I will nerf it one more time. And unlike a ninja I will not hide my nerfs. I will boldly slk about FTFY Rattati Wheaton! "Dying with your rep tool out - the logi-flasher!" Who hasn't been caught by a cute little female scout doing this?
Squagga Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 1	Posted - 2015.07.30 19:49:00 - [60] - Quote I've noticed similar things. Almost positive it's a real thing Shields, the silent killer.



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