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![[Veteran_Prophet ISF]](https://forums.dust514.com/themes/ccpDust514/dust-avatar-128.png "[Veteran_Prophet ISF]")
[Veteran_Prophet ISF]
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Posted - 2012.06.18 11:18:00 -
[31] - Quote
Agreed. But the spawn shield should work both ways. Can't fire in or out of it. |
[Veteran_Absolute Idiom]
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Posted - 2012.06.18 11:33:00 -
[32] - Quote
To quote myself from the other thread:
Absolute Idiom wrote:I'm not so bothered about being camped a CRU, but I am concerned that when a team has only the back-up spawn site remaining (and so have no choice about where to spawn) that they can be killed instantly.
Instead, this backup spawn site should be somewhere that the other team does not have line-of-sight access to. In Brink is was possible on some maps to be camped into the spawning area - but you'd only be killed as you tried to leave not as you spawned. And of course, this gives your team the opportunity to work together and bust your way out :). |
[Veteran_Auron Gormin]
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Posted - 2012.06.18 11:42:00 -
[33] - Quote
Prophet ISF wrote:Agreed. But the spawn shield should work both ways. Can't fire in or out of it.
Yea than what would be the point of having it?
"I just spawned, and a douche with a heavy machine gun is behind me, he opens fire and it does nothing, I return fire, it does nothing, so i run away. He fallows, and mows me down as soon as the shields goes away."
Not being able to fire back while you have the protection would be like having a car and never driving it. |
[Veteran_Orin Fenris]
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Posted - 2012.06.18 12:02:00 -
[34] - Quote
the solution from a video-game standpoint is easy. Just "randomize" the spawn points.
From a story standpoint, I like the idea of being able to select a spawn reserve and "drop in" on it, but how would this work for Ambush (TDM), or any other modes where there isn't an MCC in the air? Or clone reserves, for that matter?
Also, explain how we are spawning at the lettered objectives, where there are no CRU's? IMO Not everything can be explained, and balanced. At some point it has to stop being a space sim, and actually be a video game. IMO Balance and Fun/Flow take precedence over lore/logic. You may mock the other FPS games out there, but the fact is, CoD isn't so popular just because kids find it fun or whatever. A lot of people, including adults/women/etc. find CoD/Battlefield/Halo/etc. fun. I'm not saying DUST should be like those games, but certain aspects of those games are good fundamentals to aim for. Things that make the overall experience more simple, easier to jump in.
DUST has a different feel, and should not be easy. but I've seen GREAT ideas be shot down because "they've been done before". That is a really, REALLY bad excuse to not include a feature. IMO DUST should IMPROVE on those features, not condone them because some other series or FPS has used something like it, and made it work well.
Anyway, sorry, kinda got off topic there. I think spawning should just be randomized. I'm more concerned about the actual spawn timer. Having to wait 10 seconds AFTER you chose a spawn point is not very user-friendly IMO. I really like the idea of the timer counting UP after you suicide (bleed out). and if you wait 10 seconds, you can spawn at a CRU/letter/drop ship, if you wait ~20 seconds (or whatever the required time is, the actual time would have to be displayed, you can spawn at a drop uplink/etc. |
[Veteran_Templar Two]
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Posted - 2012.06.18 12:33:00 -
[35] - Quote
No randomization: keep the players in control.
Also true randomization in't possible (ATM in the world a true randomization algorithm doesn't exist) and there will always be a scheme behind our respawn.
Now, the best systems are: Free Spawn & Drop Points.
- Free Spawn.
Pro: is basically the ultimate anti-camping system since you can spawn wherever you like. Section 8 has it.
Cons: you can spawn wherever you like: no more need for Drop Uplinks/CRU and taking objectives will become a walk in the park.
- Drop Points
Pro: You don't' spawn directly on the grounds.
Cons: You can drop only in the radius of the Drop Point and so spawn-camping is still possible.
Drop point can become better with 2 things:
- Let me fire while falling...and we have already.
- When I fall we create a shock-wave that either kills or stun enemies; trade off = we cant' immediately shoot after that.
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[Veteran_JL Gotrocks]
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Posted - 2012.06.18 12:34:00 -
[36] - Quote
Orin Fenris wrote:the solution from a video-game standpoint is easy. Just "randomize" the spawn points.
Absolutely not.
There are only two things that they need to do to fix spawn camping(which doesn't happen to me all that often).
1) Don't have the screen fade in from black which lasts about two seconds when you spawn.Just pop into the battle.
2) Make red dots more visible when they are around your spawn.sometimes you can see them,but other times they don't show up.I'll see one guy,but there will be two other guys that didn't show up on the overhead map.
Randomizing spawn points makes no sense in a game like this where organization is critical. |
[Veteran_Templar Two]
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Posted - 2012.06.27 15:54:00 -
[37] - Quote
After playing today I can safely say that spawn-camping is becoming game-breaking.
I don't care if this doesn't' get fix in this build, or in the next, just fix this before the release CCP. |
TiMeSpLiT--TeR
Planetary Response Organisation
Test Friends Please Ignore
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Posted - 2012.06.27 18:01:00 -
[38] - Quote
Deployment should be similar to Starhawk by dropping from the sky. Just like in EVE trailer (Immortality). |
[Veteran_Templar Two]
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Posted - 2012.06.30 10:05:00 -
[39] - Quote
At this point I can't see a better solution to spawn camping than to have bunkers with "one way" shield doors.
This is how they coudl work:
Bunkers contains CRU.
Bunkers have sensors that highlight enemies & remote charges in a TBD radius.
Shields doors protect anything form entering (people, bullets, explosives) once you exit the bunker you can't re-enter it.
Bunkers can be hacked externally but it takes twice then with CRU.
Of course Bunkers would be far more resistant then CRU so it won't be easier to destroy them; this should encourage Hacking far more at least. |
Zat Earthshatter
Osmon Surveillance
Caldari State
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Posted - 2012.06.30 10:10:00 -
[40] - Quote
TiMeSpLiT--TeR wrote:Deployment should be similar to Starhawk by dropping from the sky. Just like in EVE trailer (Immortality).
Judging from where your post is located -between two "veteran" posts-, you managed to live up to your name...
I fear you now
Universe implosion aside :
I would like to see a orbital shock-drop sometime in the future. I imagine a recon cruiser uncloaking at enemy system, then dropping a clone unit to set up a beachead before the main invasion. |
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Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
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Posted - 2012.06.30 10:30:00 -
[41] - Quote
OB are the ultimate anti-camping tool...too bad we need EVE players otherwise all matches will be campers free ;) |
Sylwester Dziewiecki
Doomheim
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Posted - 2012.06.30 12:28:00 -
[42] - Quote
Forums Veteran wrote:I really think Dust needs spawn shields for a couple of reasons. One reason is that when i spawn sometimes right when i actually get into the game i will be dead literally. Another reason is so that you can get out of the way if someone happens to be next of the spawn. So you guys at CCP should make at least a 5 second spawn shield.
PLEASE CONSIDER THIS!!!!! NO to spawn shield, this is not a CoD or BF, this is not a solution of problem.
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Templar Two
Villore Sec Ops
Gallente Federation
459
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Posted - 2012.06.30 12:35:00 -
[43] - Quote
^^^
Care to suggests a solution, one that we haven't already proposed? |
Taco Dropsuit
Seituoda Taskforce Command
Caldari State
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Posted - 2012.06.30 12:50:00 -
[44] - Quote
I have a new and original idea, never thought of anywhere else.
When you spawn, you'll be invisible and walking straight at some random direction, you'll lose your invisibility after a few seconds or when you try to move manually. |
Drake-696
Doomheim
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Posted - 2012.06.30 14:08:00 -
[45] - Quote
Not sure the "best" fix but something needs to be done for sure. I've been guilty a time or three of lining up shots on a spawn site since it happens to me when spawning, too; tit for tat and all that.
I especially like the idea of the active sensors within a certain radius of a spawn point or something like that. Shields I'm not sure about as I see them being abused. People refuse to leave the shielded area and use it. It would have to ONLY work for people as they spawn in and then only for a short while. If a shield bubble were in place it would be used as a hiding place.
Further, perhaps the mission commander could select from one of multiple pre-designated spots around the spawn point to be the "active" spawn location. If the enemy starts keying in on it the commander could switch it. This would mean it would be less practical to sit aiming at exactly where people spawn every time as the spawn location would be variable. |
RydogV
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Posted - 2012.06.30 14:14:00 -
[46] - Quote
Sylwester Dziewiecki wrote:Forums Veteran wrote:I really think Dust needs spawn shields for a couple of reasons. One reason is that when i spawn sometimes right when i actually get into the game i will be dead literally. Another reason is so that you can get out of the way if someone happens to be next of the spawn. So you guys at CCP should make at least a 5 second spawn shield.
PLEASE CONSIDER THIS!!!!! NO to spawn shield, this is not a CoD or BF, this is not a solution of problem.
Well pretty sure neither of those games have spawn shields  . COD has random spawn points (sorta) and BF3 allows you to spawn on your team. So not sure why you threw those games into the mix.
Killzone 3 has a very effective system of where you are impervious to enemy fire for the few seconds as you materialize into game. It is essential as Tactical Spawn Areas are fixed and without that mechanism, the enemy has too much incentive to just camp the TSA's and engage in a turkey shoot.
From what I have seen in-game so far, Dust pretty much has fixed spawn points as well. When you spawn at A, B or C...or the clone materialization units, I always seem to spawn at the same place every time. So it is pretty easy to anticipate where the enemy is going to come from once you have hacked an objective.
I have been spawn camped by snipers, tanks, heavies and drop ships already and there is no counter to it. A few seconds to get your bearings and try and react isn't too much to ask. Either that or develop multiple points around an objective to spawn into randomly.
However, we are playing on one map in one game mode...over and over...so it is no wonder that folks pick up on the spawns fairly quickly. I presume when the game goes live folks will be playing on a variety of locations and with different objectives. So without the familiarity each time, spawns may not be a big an issue. |
Rafgas first
BetaMax.
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Posted - 2012.06.30 15:26:00 -
[47] - Quote
Forums Veteran wrote:i still think the best method would be to have a drop blast from your decent (spawn) that would kill spawn campers, would act kinda like a telafrag)
This and perhaps 2, 3 or 4 of the 10 second timers would be on planet, while the drop pod dismantles around you. The pod will give you massive armor(since it needs to be able to penetrate any atmosphere) to survive lots of stuff and get some situational awareness before you gain control of the character. |
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