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So AV is still the better counter to a tank.

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Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3085	Posted - 2015.03.20 17:17:00 - [1] - Quote Why? Rattati is going to reintroduce the Marauders and Enforcers, and any pilot that has a shred of hope for the tank battles of yore is praying for a return to the glory days of 10mil + ISK lost in 5 minutes. Vehicles should be their own best counter, not AV, which hasn't been touched, still doing more damage than the tanks that have recently been worked on and improved. I'd love to see explanations as to why AV shouldn't do so much damage. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
LUGMOS Corrosive Synergy 2894	Posted - 2015.03.20 17:41:00 - [2] - Quote Nope. Plasma Cannon :3 Anti-FoTM Prof. V Forum Scavenger Prof. V
Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 941	Posted - 2015.03.20 17:46:00 - [3] - Quote The only AV that's better than a tank, for killing a tank, are AV greandes and remote exposives (strapped to an LAV.) A tank will down a tank about as fast as those... Though the AV is cheaper and less fun.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3088	Posted - 2015.03.20 18:06:00 - [4] - Quote Derpty Derp wrote: The only AV that's better than a tank, for killing a tank, are AV greandes and remote exposives (strapped to an LAV.) A tank will down a tank about as fast as those... Though the AV is cheaper and less fun. Voila snackbar car = 10k damage, instant death, no fun at all. AV grenades = screaming voila snackbar, few thousand damage in 2 seconds. EZ mode, no fun. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Aikuchi Tomaru Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 2714	Posted - 2015.03.20 18:25:00 - [5] - Quote So you want to invulnerable when in a tank? And when ANTI VEHICLE is useless against vehicles... why should it exist? Sign up for Caldari FW and defeat the evil Gallente Overlords!
Bahirae Serugiusu Vendetta Reactionary Force 587	Posted - 2015.03.20 18:25:00 - [6] - Quote God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? The State will always survive.
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3090	Posted - 2015.03.20 18:26:00 - [7] - Quote Aikuchi Tomaru wrote: So you want to invulnerable when in a tank? And when ANTI VEHICLE is useless against vehicles... why should it exist? Point out where I said invulnerable and that AV should be useless against vehicles. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3090	Posted - 2015.03.20 18:27:00 - [8] - Quote Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2758	Posted - 2015.03.20 19:03:00 - [9] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because a Militia suit can still kill a full proto bear. Get gud. Home at Last <3
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3093	Posted - 2015.03.20 19:33:00 - [10] - Quote Fizzer XCIV wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because a Militia suit can still kill a full proto bear. Get gud. If the guy in PRO just stands there, yeah. Or has next to no HP and the guy in MLT finishes him off. Stop using bad arguments. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff

Thumb Green The Valyrian Mercenary Army 2172	Posted - 2015.03.20 19:39:00 - [11] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because Anti-Vehicle weapons are designed to destroy vehicles, not tickle them. Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty hipster! Rated [TV-MA]
IMMORTAL WAR HERO Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 311	Posted - 2015.03.20 19:57:00 - [12] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Why? Rattati is going to reintroduce the Marauders and Enforcers, and any pilot that has a shred of hope for the tank battles of yore is praying for a return to the glory days of 10mil + ISK lost in 5 minutes. Vehicles should be their own best counter, not AV, which hasn't been touched, still doing more damage than the tanks that have recently been worked on and improved. I'd love to see explanations as to why AV shouldn't do so much damage. huzaaa i shall once again ride my glorious sagaris into battle Frowned upon by amateurs: The object of war is not to die for your country but make the other bastard die for his. GSP
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3093	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:03:00 - [13] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because Anti-Vehicle weapons are designed to destroy vehicles, not tickle them. Why should one person hold so much power in their hands when my tank has a power supply the size of a heavy suit? Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
8213 Blauhelme E.B.O.L.A. 2155	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:10:00 - [14] - Quote I love when "tankers" complain about AV... When 3-4 people are making it their sole effort to destroy you, it's NOT OP... Blame teammates for not killing the AVers (as they are an easy kill), and don't get mad when 1/4th of the enemy team gains up on you Pubs are those pesky things that we need to get our SP.
Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens 3475	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:18:00 - [15] - Quote I don't understand why some tankers have so much nostalgia for "yeah, 10 million isk burned in 5 minutes!" Why the hell would you want a role, that is now pretty much symmetrical with Infantry, to be so freaking expensive? "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3093	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:25:00 - [16] - Quote Joseph Ridgeson wrote: I don't understand why some tankers have so much nostalgia for "yeah, 10 million isk burned in 5 minutes!" Why the hell would you want a role, that is now pretty much symmetrical with Infantry, to be so freaking expensive? Because tanks were more than worth the ISK and SP investment. Sounds like you have no clue as to the battles we used to have. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3093	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:26:00 - [17] - Quote 8213 wrote: I love when "tankers" complain about AV... When 3-4 people are making it their sole effort to destroy you, it's NOT OP... Blame teammates for not killing the AVers (as they are an easy kill), and don't get mad when 1/4th of the enemy team gains up on you It's rarely 3-4 at a time. It's often one, launching EZ mode swarms that melt armor, and AV grenades that are pocket nuclear missile bombs. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Thumb Green The Valyrian Mercenary Army 2174	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:38:00 - [18] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Thumb Green wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because Anti-Vehicle weapons are designed to destroy vehicles, not tickle them. Why should one person hold so much power in their hands when my tank has a power supply the size of a heavy suit? Because you're tank is completely immune to roughly 75% of the weapons in this game. That's 3/4th of the threats in this game you are immune to; the trade off is AV should be powerful. Don't like it? Let me do 100% damage with my SMG against tanks. Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty hipster! Rated [TV-MA]
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3093	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:54:00 - [19] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Thumb Green wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because Anti-Vehicle weapons are designed to destroy vehicles, not tickle them. Why should one person hold so much power in their hands when my tank has a power supply the size of a heavy suit? Because you're tank is completely immune to roughly 75% of the weapons in this game. That's 3/4th of the threats in this game you are immune to; the trade off is AV should be powerful. Don't like it? Let me do 100% damage with my SMG against tanks. So the same complaint that's been bandied about for years, rifles can't damage tanks. Knives do 50% damage, AHMGs do 100%. I'd ask what more do you want, but I know it's probably at least 75% efficacy for all infantry weapons against vehicles. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
The dark cloud Negative-Feedback. 4173	Posted - 2015.03.20 20:59:00 - [20] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Why? Rattati is going to reintroduce the Marauders and Enforcers, and any pilot that has a shred of hope for the tank battles of yore is praying for a return to the glory days of 10mil + ISK lost in 5 minutes. Vehicles should be their own best counter, not AV, which hasn't been touched, still doing more damage than the tanks that have recently been worked on and improved. I'd love to see explanations as to why AV shouldn't do so much damage. i dont know what stuff you smoke but armor tanks are like a rolling fortress these days. I have both Av and armor tanks at max and i have a easier time destroying a tank with another tank then trying to blow up a perma hardened madrugar. And if you are complaining that 4 guys with forgeguns sitting on a roof then you should keep in mind that it took 4 players to stop you. They say when you die you see a white light which then forms the line of: "GAME OVER! PLEASE INSERT COIN"

Joseph Ridgeson WarRavens 3478	Posted - 2015.03.20 21:37:00 - [21] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Joseph Ridgeson wrote: I don't understand why some tankers have so much nostalgia for "yeah, 10 million isk burned in 5 minutes!" Why the hell would you want a role, that is now pretty much symmetrical with Infantry, to be so freaking expensive? Because tanks were more than worth the ISK and SP investment. Sounds like you have no clue as to the battles we used to have. I do but balancing things based on how expensive they are is a bad idea. See the current issue on Prototype: people that can run it always run it and those that can't, don't. Vehicles work a little differently know. They are built like Dropsuits (I would also bet that in the next year, ALL Dropsuits are going to be like Tanks and just more CPU/PG at higher tiers). The amount of SP to get into Tanks is pretty much the same as a dropsuit. This means that tanks have become a lot more of a real role now that there is that investment. Remembering fondly back to when they cost even more than they did today is silly. Allow me to equate the money issue to an issue that you probably remember: Vehicles in Uprising pre-1.7. When one Prototype Swarm Launcher could sit on top of a roof and factor eliminate virtually any vehicle. One person is negating the entire role. I remember those days, they sucked. Now imagine what the issue would be like if tanks were made even more expensive and it was simply money that was factor eliminating an entire role. There is also the sticky balance question that comes out: "Oh, your Swarm Launcher is 50k and my Tank is 2.5 million!" Again, you have brought this up before. Balance between AV and Vehicles will always be touchy when it is such a rock and paper scenario with SP on the line. Adding in an absurd amount of isk doesn't alleviate that problem. "This is B.S! This is B.S! I paid money! Cash money, dollars money, cash money!"
Golden Day Corrosive Synergy 1213	Posted - 2015.03.20 21:46:00 - [22] - Quote I find it absurd that I have to run away from my slaying of infantry because the swarms already took out half of my armor! That momment when CCP Frame makes a horrible joke *( -í° -£-û -í°)*
P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1369	Posted - 2015.03.20 22:28:00 - [23] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? You realize any competant AV fit takes 15-20m sp investment, while I can jump in a MLT tank with 0 SP investment and do practically the same thing, while also being immune to non-av.. Bad tanker is bad.. 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
LUGMOS Corrosive Synergy 2898	Posted - 2015.03.20 22:29:00 - [24] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? You realize any competant AV fit takes 15-20m sp investment, while I can jump in a MLT tank with 0 SP investment and do practically the same thing, while also being immune to non-av.. Bad tanker is bad.. -_- Plasma Cannon :3 Anti-FoTM Prof. V Forum Scavenger Prof. V
Ghost Kaisar Negative-Feedback 10739	Posted - 2015.03.20 22:32:00 - [25] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Derpty Derp wrote: The only AV that's better than a tank, for killing a tank, are AV greandes and remote exposives (strapped to an LAV.) A tank will down a tank about as fast as those... Though the AV is cheaper and less fun. Voila snackbar car = 10k damage, instant death, no fun at all. AV grenades = screaming voila snackbar, few thousand damage in 2 seconds. EZ mode, no fun. AV grenades also have a range of ~20m Snackbar car, I can understand. But AV grenades are fine. Give the infantry some distance. We aren't meant to be defenseless. And I will remind you of such if you get too close. Currently listening to: Max Anarchy OST Old School Scout, watch out for the knives
Outlaw OneZero Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1602	Posted - 2015.03.20 22:57:00 - [26] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Why? Rattati is going to reintroduce the Marauders and Enforcers, and any pilot that has a shred of hope for the tank battles of yore is praying for a return to the glory days of 10mil + ISK lost in 5 minutes. Vehicles should be their own best counter, not AV, which hasn't been touched, still doing more damage than the tanks that have recently been worked on and improved. I'd love to see explanations as to why AV shouldn't do so much damage. You are so clearly full of crap and have been forever. AV is specifically designed to destroy vehicles, it should be very good at it. You always like to make the claim that it should take several AV players to take out a tank, that teamwork should be a requirement to destroy a team asset like an HAV. Let me give you a different perspective that has never occurred to you. If should take teamwork to keep an HAV alive. Your infantry should be working with you to eliminate the enemy AV. A solo tanker vs a solo AV player should be an equal match and the decision should go with whoever controls the situation better. The equation should ALWAYS be 1 player = 1 player, full stop. The way you try to make it out now, it should also take teamwork to take out a logi. Their suits are more expensive and they have to invest much more SP into their role, so it is clear that 1 logi should equal at least 2 normal infantry. Put away your stupid arguments and git gud scrub. Hello, is this thing on?
Thumb Green The Valyrian Mercenary Army 2174	Posted - 2015.03.20 23:53:00 - [27] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: So the same complaint that's been bandied about for years, rifles can't damage tanks. Knives do 50% damage, AHMGs do 100%. I'd ask what more do you want, but I know it's probably at least 75% efficacy for all infantry weapons against vehicles. I'm not complaining about non-AV weapons not damaging tank, that part is fine; but you're the one that wants AV to be weak, and you got to trade something for that. Take your stinking paws off me, you damned dirty hipster! Rated [TV-MA]
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 3254	Posted - 2015.03.21 01:05:00 - [28] - Quote Yea I have to agree with some other people. If you are in a shield tank right now, you are getting REKT left and right. I for one love to smash shield tanks with my PLC. On the other hand, the Madrugar is something seriously powerful right now. The Blaster seems to be in a good place and so does the armour tank. Even with a totally maxed out Allotek PLC, I cannot do enough damage to break the Madrugars I have been seeing on the map, not even close to be honest. Granted, the PLC is anti shield weaponry, but never before has my PLC anti armour damage seemed so impotent. Vitantur Nothus wrote: Why hide a solution under frothy pile of derpa? SCV Ready!
Dementia Maniaclease Dust 514 Elite Ops 15	Posted - 2015.03.21 02:38:00 - [29] - Quote I've actually been faring well in a soma against av in fact earlier it took 3 av guys to pop my tank.. So , ... Quit yer griping!!! I have a hard time seeing how I am doing better with a MILITIA tank than people running the more expensive versions., I am not that good of a tank driver.. Or am I?... "An enemy on the march is at its most vulnerable"- Sun Tzu
Mobius Wyvern Sky-FIRE 5853	Posted - 2015.03.21 03:49:00 - [30] - Quote I personally love how tanks in this game are like BFRs in the first Planetside. Anyone who tries to say otherwise is defending their "I WIN" button. The fact that you can have an asset that requires NO teamwork whatsoever that is more than a match for a whole squad is stupid. It's only fun for one side, and at that point it shouldn't exist. Do I think Swarms are balanced right now? No. Swarms are cheesy easymode because they are fire-and-forget ** machines that require no player skill at all to use. Do I think tanks should EVER be like Spkr seems to want them to be? ** no. That would kill Dust deader than Legion would. I support Keshava for Gallente Specialist HAV R.I.P. Kesha

P14GU3 UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 1371	Posted - 2015.03.21 04:18:00 - [31] - Quote Dementia Maniaclease wrote: I've actually been faring well in a soma against av in fact earlier it took 3 av guys to pop my tank.. So , ... Quit yer griping!!! I have a hard time seeing how I am doing better with a MILITIA tank than people running the more expensive versions., I am not that good of a tank driver.. Or am I?... Speaker is pretty well known for being one of the worst tankers in the game... 'Sault AK.0 - Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - 'Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K 527	Posted - 2015.03.21 04:20:00 - [32] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Fizzer XCIV wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? Because a Militia suit can still kill a full proto bear. Get gud. If the guy in PRO just stands there, yeah. Or has next to no HP and the guy in MLT finishes him off. Stop using bad arguments. Militia suit still has a much better chance against a full proto suit than AV has to kill a tank. But keep on trollin
Vesta Opalus T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K 527	Posted - 2015.03.21 04:22:00 - [33] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: Yea I have to agree with some other people. If you are in a shield tank right now, you are getting REKT left and right. I for one love to smash shield tanks with my PLC. On the other hand, the Madrugar is something seriously powerful right now. The Blaster seems to be in a good place and so does the armour tank. Even with a totally maxed out Allotek PLC, I cannot do enough damage to break the Madrugars I have been seeing on the map, not even close to be honest. Granted, the PLC is anti shield weaponry, but never before has my PLC anti armour damage seemed so impotent. Im not sure I'd describe armor tanks as "in a good place". I mean... from the perspective of tankers, sure, since its pretty much invulnerable if you put 2 armor reps and 2 hardeners on it, or something similar. Yeah its in a great place. From the perspective of everyone else in the game its absolute gamebreaking bullshit though.
8213 Blauhelme E.B.O.L.A. 2159	Posted - 2015.03.21 07:14:00 - [34] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: 8213 wrote: I love when "tankers" complain about AV... When 3-4 people are making it their sole effort to destroy you, it's NOT OP... Blame teammates for not killing the AVers (as they are an easy kill), and don't get mad when 1/4th of the enemy team gains up on you It's rarely 3-4 at a time. It's often one, launching EZ mode swarms that melt armor, and AV grenades that are pocket nuclear missile bombs. I'm 99.99999% certain that I have never been solo'd whilst driving a tank by a single AC merc in my entire DUST career.... AV nades are crazy OP, but what makes AV OP as a whole is the rendering issue. If I know where and what is shooting me, I'm very likely not to die. Prime example: Tonight I literally had 9/16 of the enemy team trying to AV my tank. It took them 20 minutes, but they finally got me. Now during that time, I had the option to go into my redline and recall at any moment; but as most tankers I get stubborn and still go for kills just to be a jerk. When they popped me, I wasn't upset at them. As it was 9 of them. It was kind of funny seeing them jump out of LAVs like clowns at me, or a red mass of Commandos and heavies chasing me around a socket... But I will tell you that I was upset with my teammates, because during this epic battle, they didn't take letters nor kill the AVers... Now as far as epic battles of tank v. tank of yesteryear... yes, it was the pinnacle of human chess in this game. My best memories of this game are actually comanding a tank unit for DNS that was arguably the best in the game's history (suck it FA). But that was then, this is now. The ISK risk is back for tanks, which I think is good. And I must relearn the maps, as I became lazy with the OP build donned since Uprising 1.7 So, to wrap this up. Mr. Dead, please, please, please do us all a favor and stop being so bullheaded about your HAVs. The outcome for you is always the same; mockery, logic bombing, you portrayed as insane. Pubs are those pesky things that we need to get our SP.
LUGMOS Corrosive Synergy Rise Of Legion. 2914	Posted - 2015.03.21 07:48:00 - [35] - Quote 8213 wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: 8213 wrote: I love when "tankers" complain about AV... When 3-4 people are making it their sole effort to destroy you, it's NOT OP... Blame teammates for not killing the AVers (as they are an easy kill), and don't get mad when 1/4th of the enemy team gains up on you It's rarely 3-4 at a time. It's often one, launching EZ mode swarms that melt armor, and AV grenades that are pocket nuclear missile bombs. I'm 99.99999% certain that I have never been solo'd whilst driving a tank by a single AC merc in my entire DUST career.... AV nades are crazy OP, but what makes AV OP as a whole is the rendering issue. If I know where and what is shooting me, I'm very likely not to die. Prime example: Tonight I literally had 9/16 of the enemy team trying to AV my tank. It took them 20 minutes, but they finally got me. Now during that time, I had the option to go into my redline and recall at any moment; but as most tankers I get stubborn and still go for kills just to be a jerk. When they popped me, I wasn't upset at them. As it was 9 of them. It was kind of funny seeing them jump out of LAVs like clowns at me, or a red mass of Commandos and heavies chasing me around a socket... But I will tell you that I was upset with my teammates, because during this epic battle, they didn't take letters nor kill the AVers... Now as far as epic battles of tank v. tank of yesteryear... yes, it was the pinnacle of human chess in this game. My best memories of this game are actually comanding a tank unit for DNS that was arguably the best in the game's history (suck it FA). But that was then, this is now. The ISK risk is back for tanks, which I think is good. And I must relearn the maps, as I became lazy with the OP build donned since Uprising 1.7 So, to wrap this up. Mr. Dead, please, please, please do us all a favor and stop being so bullheaded about your HAVs. The outcome for you is always the same; mockery, logic bombing, you portrayed as insane. Amen to arrr ob dis. Plasma Cannon :3 Anti-FoTM Prof. V Forum Scavenger Prof. V
Ghosts Chance Intara Direct Action Caldari State 3027	Posted - 2015.03.21 07:51:00 - [36] - Quote best AV in the game is a sica with 3x dmg mods and 1x heat sinq with a particle cannon Minmatar is Winmatar Creed of the Minja - "I'm a leaf on the wind" I am Chances Ghost
nelo kazuma Da Short Buss Driving School 51	Posted - 2015.03.21 08:04:00 - [37] - Quote when a tank can charge directly into infantry and fear nothing and escape faster than infantry can give chase yea u dont see issue there. me and 4 other peopl with proto swarms and grenades could not kill a proto madruguar because he could use hardners endlessly. i for one would like to see tanks only be allowed the use of one hardener and i bet it will happen. the reason tanks keep getting nerfed is because tanker most likely like u who abuse systems in place.
Mejt0 Dead Man's Game RUST415 1131	Posted - 2015.03.21 08:13:00 - [38] - Quote Buddy, you know that double hardened madrugar with 2 reps is immune to any kind of AV while hardeners are on? One hardener + 3 reps is also viable. Caldari Hero Loyal To The State Mejt0 Sale List
The dark cloud Negative-Feedback. 4176	Posted - 2015.03.21 10:39:00 - [39] - Quote To the armor tankers that say "swarms and AV nades are OP!" You obviously dont use hardeners and need to stop whatever you are doing. They say when you die you see a white light which then forms the line of: "GAME OVER! PLEASE INSERT COIN"
Cypher Nil Fireteam Tempest 90	Posted - 2015.03.21 10:57:00 - [40] - Quote Can we just say what the REAL issue is. We need the pilot suit with decent bonuses that boost tanks to a reasonable place. End of story +20 Million SP Merc Caldari Loyalist Of course we won, now when do I get paid?

H0riz0n Unlimit Dead Man's Game 535	Posted - 2015.03.21 14:23:00 - [41] - Quote Tanks are not OP at the moment, good tankers are OP, i can still destroy an Hav solo but it is harder than before and this is good but 1.2 milion "pro" tanks are not as good as the amount of isk can make you think Alt of The KTM(FOTM) DuKe. 34 milion SP in vehicles//59 milion SP in infantry. Pagl1u M is not my director
Racro 01 Arifistan Simple Minded People Pty. Ltd. 519	Posted - 2015.03.21 14:46:00 - [42] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: Yea I have to agree with some other people. If you are in a shield tank right now, you are getting REKT left and right. I for one love to smash shield tanks with my PLC. On the other hand, the Madrugar is something seriously powerful right now. The Blaster seems to be in a good place and so does the armour tank. Even with a totally maxed out Allotek PLC, I cannot do enough damage to break the Madrugars I have been seeing on the map, not even close to be honest. Granted, the PLC is anti shield weaponry, but never before has my PLC anti armour damage seemed so impotent. gunnlogis and sicas have 5 high slots. theres no reason why they should be getting wrecked. 2 hardners shielkd extender 2 left over highs for choice/preference. makes sence the PLC doisnt hurt armour much. a gunnlogi with 1 hardner on will take a few PLC rounds. but when its running 2 harders it should reduce the PLC damage adequelty for it to resit the damage. anyone who complains the gunnlogi/sica struggle with current av and tank balance in my opinion has not comprended the fact that with 5 high slots to use you can make many different fittngs.....then again with 5 highs why wouldnt a sica /gunni want 2 shield hardners. *Elite Gallenten Soldier*
Alena Ventrallis Ahrendee Inc. Negative-Feedback 2768	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:31:00 - [43] - Quote Shield hardeners need to be buffed to 50-60%. Then shield tanks will be viable again. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:45:00 - [44] - Quote The dark cloud wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Why? Rattati is going to reintroduce the Marauders and Enforcers, and any pilot that has a shred of hope for the tank battles of yore is praying for a return to the glory days of 10mil + ISK lost in 5 minutes. Vehicles should be their own best counter, not AV, which hasn't been touched, still doing more damage than the tanks that have recently been worked on and improved. I'd love to see explanations as to why AV shouldn't do so much damage. i dont know what stuff you smoke but armor tanks are like a rolling fortress these days. I have both Av and armor tanks at max and i have a easier time destroying a tank with another tank then trying to blow up a perma hardened madrugar. And if you are complaining that 4 guys with forgeguns sitting on a roof then you should keep in mind that it took 4 players to stop you. 4 forge guns = alpha damage = dead tank. Bad argument Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:49:00 - [45] - Quote Golden Day wrote: I find it absurd that I have to run away from my slaying of infantry because the swarms already took out half of my armor! Not even an argument, sounds like you've never been in a tank. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:51:00 - [46] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? 80k 5mil SP suit vs 1mil ISK 60mil SP tank. Why does that pittance cost of a suit do so much damage against a huge investment of a tank? You realize any competant AV fit takes 15-20m sp investment, while I can jump in a MLT tank with 0 SP investment and do practically the same thing, while also being immune to non-av.. Bad tanker is bad.. Where are you getting 15-20 mil from? I'd love to know this. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:54:00 - [47] - Quote Outlaw OneZero wrote: AV is specifically designed to destroy vehicles, it should be very good at it. Letting the game aim for you is not "very good." Nuke tipped missiles and baseballs make it exceedingly easy. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:58:00 - [48] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: So the same complaint that's been bandied about for years, rifles can't damage tanks. Knives do 50% damage, AHMGs do 100%. I'd ask what more do you want, but I know it's probably at least 75% efficacy for all infantry weapons against vehicles. I'm not complaining about non-AV weapons not damaging tank, that part is fine; but you're the one that wants AV to be weak, and you got to trade something for that. There's nothing left to trade. You took everything away from us, that's why 1.7, then 1.8 came around. It's also why we lost the Marauders. You had tanks nerfed from 1.7 to 1.8 because we were able to make a few different fits; some against infantry, some against vehicles. That got nerfed due to smart fitting. Rattati has FINALLY given something back to vehicles. Before that, it was take take take take take take away from vehicles and pilots. Don't you see? Echo FINALLY gave something back to us. It was nerf nerf nerf for years before Echo. If there's anything we could "give," we'd be right back at square one, with vehicles being useless. Besides, if vehicles get made weaker to compensate for weaker AV, how has anything changed? Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 15:59:00 - [49] - Quote CommanderBolt wrote: Yea I have to agree with some other people. If you are in a shield tank right now, you are getting REKT left and right. I for one love to smash shield tanks with my PLC. On the other hand, the Madrugar is something seriously powerful right now. The Blaster seems to be in a good place and so does the armour tank. Even with a totally maxed out Allotek PLC, I cannot do enough damage to break the Madrugars I have been seeing on the map, not even close to be honest. Granted, the PLC is anti shield weaponry, but never before has my PLC anti armour damage seemed so impotent. That's because we can fit a hardener now, and they're actually substantial. Problem is, shield and armor are never balanced. One is always on top over the other. If they could get balanced, then we'd have some good variety. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:01:00 - [50] - Quote Dementia Maniaclease wrote: Or am I?... Lol I'm going with this. I'm seeing far, far more AV than tanks. Used to have 4-5 on both sides the first 2 or 3 days, now it's cooled down. I keep tanks due to superior piloting in the face of AV. If some smiling joker like you comes around a corner and there's 2 Minmandos waiting for you, you're not surviving. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff

Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:03:00 - [51] - Quote Mobius Wyvern wrote: I personally love how tanks in this game are like BFRs in the first Planetside. Anyone who tries to say otherwise is defending their "I WIN" button. The fact that you can have an asset that requires NO teamwork whatsoever that is more than a match for a whole squad is stupid. It's only fun for one side, and at that point it shouldn't exist. Do I think Swarms are balanced right now? No. Swarms are cheesy easymode because they are fire-and-forget ** machines that require no player skill at all to use. Do I think tanks should EVER be like Spkr seems to want them to be? ** no. That would kill Dust deader than Legion would. "More than a match for a whole squad." Let's see..... One person with Packed Lai Dai does about ~5000 damage against unhardened armor. With two people, that's ~10,000, 3 people is ~15,000, etc. No, your statement does not hold up against that. A single logi could put down a proxy mine field and very easily destroy a tank (solo). And what on Earth are you talking about with this Do I think tanks should EVER be like Spkr seems to want them to be? line? Where have I said I want tanks to be invincible to anything but another tank? Point that out. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:04:00 - [52] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Dementia Maniaclease wrote: I've actually been faring well in a soma against av in fact earlier it took 3 av guys to pop my tank.. So , ... Quit yer griping!!! I have a hard time seeing how I am doing better with a MILITIA tank than people running the more expensive versions., I am not that good of a tank driver.. Or am I?... Speaker is pretty well known for being one of the worst tankers in the game... LOLWUT With what evidence do you simians make this claim? Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:06:00 - [53] - Quote Vesta Opalus wrote: tears You mean to tell me that armor finally not being useless, after over a year of it, is gamebreaking? Please, go to Call of Duty. It's about damn time armor was made viable again. Do I like how it's far superior to shield? No, but still, it's about damn time armor is in a good place again. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:11:00 - [54] - Quote 8213 wrote: AV nades are crazy OP, but what makes AV OP as a whole is the rendering issue. If I know where and what is shooting me, I'm very likely not to die. What makes AV grenades insanely OP is the incredible amount of damage 3 separate objects that have to be thrown do so fast, all while having a homing warhead that makes aiming obsolete. That has nothing to do with rendering. Prime example: Tonight I literally had 9/16 of the enemy team trying to AV my tank. It took them 20 minutes, but they finally got me. Now during that time, I had the option to go into my redline and recall at any moment; but as most tankers I get stubborn and still go for kills just to be a jerk. More than half the enemy team against you? Next you're going to tell me that they had the objective. When they popped me, I wasn't upset at them. As it was 9 of them. It was kind of funny seeing them jump out of LAVs like clowns at me, or a red mass of Commandos and heavies chasing me around a socket... But I will tell you that I was upset with my teammates, because during this epic battle, they didn't take letters nor kill the AVers... Oh what a surprise, you lost. So, to wrap this up. Mr. Dead, please, please, please do us all a favor and stop being so bullheaded about your HAVs. The outcome for you is always the same; mockery, logic bombing, you portrayed as insane. So I should bend on my defense of vehicles when we were finally given something after over a year of vehicles being useless and pilots being treated like second class citizens? No, I shall not waver in my defense of vehicles. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:14:00 - [55] - Quote nelo kazuma wrote: abuse systems in place. Yet it's perfectly fine when scouts throw REs 20ft in front of them and use that as their primary weapon. You guys throw this "abuse" word around as if it was a bottle of water. You guys should check out what you do and how you do it before you accuse us of "abusing" anything. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:16:00 - [56] - Quote Mejt0 wrote: Buddy, you know that double hardened madrugar with 2 reps is immune to any kind of AV while hardeners are on? One hardener + 3 reps is also viable. Immune? You must be going against MLT AV. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 7698	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:17:00 - [57] - Quote I was gonna say something, but there's nothing I can add to this thread to make it seem dumber. It's like there was a built in self-destruct on the whole conversation. AV
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3097	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:20:00 - [58] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: I was gonna say something, but there's nothing I can add to this thread to make it seem dumber. It's like there was a built in self-destruct on the whole conversation. You don't have anything substantial to add anyway. You never do. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 7698	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:23:00 - [59] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: I was gonna say something, but there's nothing I can add to this thread to make it seem dumber. It's like there was a built in self-destruct on the whole conversation. You don't have anything substantial to add anyway. You never do. Why should I have to? You do all the work for me, all I have to do is drop an occasional fact and watch you explode and demolish your own case. Thanks for the help. Couldn't have done it without you. AV
Spkr4theDead Red Star. 3098	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:35:00 - [60] - Quote Breakin Stuff wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: I was gonna say something, but there's nothing I can add to this thread to make it seem dumber. It's like there was a built in self-destruct on the whole conversation. You don't have anything substantial to add anyway. You never do. Why should I have to? You do all the work for me, all I have to do is drop an occasional fact and watch you explode and demolish your own case. Thanks for the help. Couldn't have done it without you. What fact? You're a spreadsheet warrior, you don't play the game. You don't have any facts because you don't know any through experience. You especially don't know anything about vehicles. Maybe if you spent more time playing and less time deciding strategy on Google Docs, pilots will consider what you have to say. Nope. Confirming that pilot input is not, and never was, valued. - Breakin Stuff

Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 5450	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:38:00 - [61] - Quote Bahirae Serugiusu wrote: God do tankers ever stop complaining about AV? AV demands to be able to kill tanks in a 1v1 environment, but doesn't want to take the same monetary risk as a tank. So, no. And they shouldn't. Usually banned for being too awesome.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 7698	Posted - 2015.03.21 16:45:00 - [62] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Spkr4theDead wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: I was gonna say something, but there's nothing I can add to this thread to make it seem dumber. It's like there was a built in self-destruct on the whole conversation. You don't have anything substantial to add anyway. You never do. Why should I have to? You do all the work for me, all I have to do is drop an occasional fact and watch you explode and demolish your own case. Thanks for the help. Couldn't have done it without you. What fact? You're a spreadsheet warrior, you don't play the game. You don't have any facts because you don't know any through experience. You especially don't know anything about vehicles. Maybe if you spent more time playing and less time deciding strategy on Google Docs, pilots will consider what you have to say. I find it hilarious that the only method you have for proving someone else wrong is to make dumbass accusations about them. Your posts truly are magical. Keep up the good work. AV
The dark cloud Negative-Feedback. 4177	Posted - 2015.03.21 17:28:00 - [63] - Quote Whats the point here? That lai dais are op? Did you ever used them? Their homing radius and throwing distance is pathetic and if you stand still long enough for a single guy to lob 3 of those at you then its your fault for getting blown up. Yeah proto tanks are overpriced but you can still do very good with a STD and advanced tank and dont loose a fortune when you got blown up. Another thing is HAV's are again a force multiplyer in PC on open maps (for example bridge map). You either bring aswell a HAV to counter or you bring 2-3 guys with AV. You have to remember when 3 guys change out to AV then its 3 players basically taken off from point defense. And dont tell me that a sidearm is enough to defend yourself vs super strafing assaults and bricktanked heavys. So lets see what AV we got: -swarms= you are basically telling the whole opposition where you at cause you can trail swarms back to your original location -Forgeguns= lower DPS and because swarms are better at applying damage vs armor tanks not really viable -PLC= requires you to get up close and pesonal, if you are a assault or commando just forget it cause vehicle scans are more then likely to pick you up. -Proxy mines= they are a joke cause they can be scanned and every vehicle makes a warning sound when getting to close. -Av grenades= same issue as with the PLC you have to get close and only morons sit around and watch you throw 3 AV nades in a row. They say when you die you see a white light which then forms the line of: "GAME OVER! PLEASE INSERT COIN"
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK Rise Of Legion. 3256	Posted - 2015.03.21 18:30:00 - [64] - Quote Vesta Opalus wrote: CommanderBolt wrote: Yea I have to agree with some other people. If you are in a shield tank right now, you are getting REKT left and right. I for one love to smash shield tanks with my PLC. On the other hand, the Madrugar is something seriously powerful right now. The Blaster seems to be in a good place and so does the armour tank. Even with a totally maxed out Allotek PLC, I cannot do enough damage to break the Madrugars I have been seeing on the map, not even close to be honest. Granted, the PLC is anti shield weaponry, but never before has my PLC anti armour damage seemed so impotent. Im not sure I'd describe armor tanks as "in a good place". I mean... from the perspective of tankers, sure, since its pretty much invulnerable if you put 2 armor reps and 2 hardeners on it, or something similar. Yeah its in a great place. From the perspective of everyone else in the game its absolute gamebreaking bullshit though. Do you really feel that armour tanks are that powerful right now? I have only been using PLC so I totally accept that I am only going to deal supplemental damage to Madrugars, I have yet to actually use a Forge gun to try and take on armour tanks and I have never really used swarms so I cannot comment on that. Vitantur Nothus wrote: Why hide a solution under frothy pile of derpa? SCV Ready!
Iron Wolf Saber Den of Swords 18961	Posted - 2015.03.21 18:49:00 - [65] - Quote Project Universe of HAVs Basically world of Tanks inside new eden no infantry but the occasional orbital strike that is earned over time and kills. Tank vs Tank warfare is brutal as modules can be damaged and different shells are needed to penetrate various defenses of the enemy tanks. Artillery, Scout, Repair, Assault, Heavy and Main battle tanks are used as the classes. A lucky hit can instantly kill the entire crew or permanently disable to the tank effectively killing it. Tanks will have effective armor and shieldings afforded to it. Comes with arcade mode which has third person view, a fairer hit model, and autospotting and marking crew with indicators for hit over long distances to account for bullet drop. And simulator mode where its frist person only, realistic hit models, and you have to use your mk1 eyeball to id hostiles and make best judgement on hitting them. Kick starter cost would be 5 million. CPM 1, Secretary Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior \\= ADV HAVs =// Unlocked


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