Hmm interesting... Not so certain on the value of the results, we would need more tests to gather a larger sample size.

One thing I am certain about is... Blue Gatorade is awesome and definitely not OP. I'm in favor of keeping whatever the current numbers are.

Nice work on the science though.

Ps you should try it with other suits and take the average of percent change with varying levels of myos across the different suits. If that makes sense.

Wouldn't it be more accurate to measure from the ground go their feet, instead of from the ground to the top of their head?
Kirks body length might be messing with the ratios...

..........

Did we forget how to basic math..?

It wouldn't matter if the distance from the base control line (517) was to either the head or the feet. The distance from it's original position would still be the same in either case.

Let's say the feet were 100 pixels away from the control line. If he jumps, we'll say 50 pixels high for the sake of reason, then the distance would be 150 pixels.

If his head was 200 pixels away from the control line then it'd be 250 pixels high because the jump height would still be the same in either case.

Fine. I'll do the math then.
It just makes more sense to me to measure jumping by how much you can clear, not by how high your head goes, like in the Olympics.
Do you have the stills on Imgur or something?

It doesn't make any sense at all because it doesn't matter. The distance from Point A-to-Point B is still the same regardless. Measuring from the top of the head is better because it stays relatively in place during the jump animation whereas the legs bend and move around during the animation.

Well it depends on what you define as "jump height".

Personally, I define it as how high your feet come off the ground, since that it sorta the main point of jumping up anywhere. Getting your feet to a higher elevation.
I couldn't care less how high the top of my head goes in most cases.

I really want to visually explain this, because I can't quite articulate it with words, but I can guarantee you that Kirk's body length is messing with the results...

Well it depends on what you define as "jump height".

Personally, I define it as how high your feet come off the ground, since that it sorta the main point of jumping up anywhere. Getting your feet to a higher elevation.
I couldn't care less how high the top of my head goes in most cases.

I really want to visually explain this, because I can't quite articulate it with words, but I can guarantee you that Kirk's body length is messing with the results...

I SAID LIGHT BLUE, NOT BLUE!!!!

Burn the car, it's useless to me.

Interesting finds.

Obviously we're at opposite ends of the spectrum on whether or not we feel that this is balanced, I feel that it isn't for a number of reasons (namely dust was not designed with this in mind, the module being too powerful for its cost and also it really messing with my suspension of disbelief) . Even if it makes portions of my ideas wrong it is still nice to have correct answers.

Thank you for at least giving me the height of Kirk's body. I can work with that...

Now, if we go on to subtract 89p(with a 5p variance) from all of the jump heights you listed, so that we can effectively remove Kirks body length, we can extract his ground clearance from the pictures, measured in pixels.

No Myos: (79)74-84p
1 Myo: (129) 124-134p
2 Myos: (179) 174-184p
3 Myos: (271) 266-276p
4 Myos: (375) 370-380p


Let's say the base jump height of ~79p is considered 100% jump height(ground clearance) for the next part.

No Myos: 100% clearance
1 Myo: 163% clearance
2 Myos: 227% clearance
3 Myos: 343% clearance
4 Myos: 475% clearance

As you can see these numbers show a completely different story, and in my opinion, a more important one.
After all, these modules were designed to get places, not get your head to places, right? These numbers more accurately displaying the boosts to mobility these modules are providing.

4 Myofibrils are allowing you to jump up onto things 475% better than you used to be able to.
Even just the 1st one is providing a 63% boost to our ability to jump.
In fact, the numbers appear to be all over the place. They appear linear at first, at least for the first two modules, but the 3rd and 4th are providing even larger boosts than the first two, and they seem to be increasing exponentially!
Something is wrong here.

The cause of this? I have absolutely no idea.
But something IS wrong.

Actually fizzer, those numbers might not be far off from myo's providing the 75% bonus to jump height I suspected. They're not entirely out of line with how the stacking penalties work.

http://wiki.dust514.info/index.php?title=Stacking_Penalties

Holy hell, this took -way- longer than I honestly wanted it to...

So the general theory is that Myrofibril Stimulants are not working as intended. Some of you have theories that the stacking penalties aren't being applied, some of you are saying that it's using the Melee Modifier instead of the intended Jump Height increase, etc. etc. The list goes on and on about the current theories as to what is going on but one thing is for certain: Community is mixed as to whether or not they're working as intended; let alone if they're balanced, I personally think they are.

But my personal bias isn't up for debate here. The science behind the modules are and I decided to put them to the test with the help of Sgt Kirk.

How We Tested It

The general idea is that Bacon + Module = Flying Bacon. Cool. But we want to know how far the module will go in making the bacon fly. So, to do that, we had Sgt Kirk design four fits that were exactly the same apart from one very important fact: The amount of myrofibrils he had equipped.

The first suit had none and this was considered our control. It would show us what the base height was whenever he jumped.
The second suit was loaded up with one complex myrofibril, the third suit with two, so on and so forth.

Once that was accomplished we needed a way to figure out exact metrics: How high he'd jump so we could effectively measure the output of each module on an individual basis. To do this we decided to find a slate wall for him to put his back to and repeatedly jump after changing suits to see how high, using a Mass Driver as a form of 'scale'. Later on, after reviewing the video, I realized this was wholly unnecessary as I decided to take a page from Game Theories' book and utilize pixel mapping from base screenshots. Given that I didn't move (at all) this would allow me to compare the pixel differences between each jump against his base jump height with little to no interference on my end.

Here's a screenshot explaining a bit more of how this works: http://i.imgur.com/BQIG6xM.jpg

With that said, we went into a Domination match for optimal red-line abuse (we didn't want to get shot while testing) and REALLY lucked out when we got the socket that we did in the redline as it offered a great comparison point when compared to pixel height and the line measurements of the Mass Driver.



Here's the video if you want to watch for yourself: https://youtu.be/4WPYQlDoieg

Surprising, to say the least. Based on number differences between the pixel distances, we can look at the numbers themselves and compare them to the intended ratios. The amount of difference in the pixel distance from the control line to the top of Sgt Kirk's head would give us true values and percentages and we could compare them against the intended percentages with his base height.



Pixel Locations of base line and top of the head
Test 1: 517 - 349
Test 2: 517 - 309
Test 3: 517 - 250
Test 4: 517 - 157
Bonus Round: 517 - 62

Base Jump Height: 168 pixels
1 Complex: 208 pixels
2 Complex: 267 pixels
3 Complex: 360 pixels
Bonus Round 4 Compelx: approximately 455 pixels (based on where Sgt Kirk shot)

Myofibril Module Jump Height intended increases:
PRO: 25% (+50% skill efficacy = 37.5%)

As a result, at least one of the myths was completely outright -BUSTED- in that without stacking penalties and an applicable skill bonus from the Hand-to-Hand Combat skill (50% at level 5) the numbers were -WAAAAY- off. So off that I'm absolutely 100% confident in saying that: Yes, without a shadow of a doubt, the stacking penalties are 100% being applied even if the module receives a skill bonus.

Without Stacking penalties and skill bonus: BUSTED
1 Complex: 37.5% (231 pixels) --- (difference of 23)
2 Complex: 89% (318 pixels) --- (difference of 51)
3 Complex: 160% (437 pixels) --- (difference of 77)

Here's the following tests that are a little bit more in the realm of believable.

Without Stacking penalties and NO skill bonus:
1 Complex: 25% (210 pixels) --- (difference of 2)
2 Complex: 56% (262 pixels) --- (difference of 5)
3 Complex: 95% (328 pixels) --- (difference of 32)

With Stacking penalties and NO skill bonus:
1 Complex: 25% (210 pixels) --- (difference of 2)
2 Complex: 52% (255 pixels) --- (difference of 12)
3 Complex: 74% (292 pixels) --- (difference of 68)

With Stacking penalties and skill bonus:
1 Complex: 37.5% (231 pixels) --- (difference of 23)
2 Complex: 82.32% (306 pixels) --- (difference of 39)
3 Complex: 121.29% (371 pixels) --- (difference of 11)

So, in closing, in a purely number-based scenario, the most likely situation that is going on with the Myrofibrils in my amateur opinion is that the modules are -NOT- receiving a skill bonus but at the same time -ARE NOT- receiving stacking penalties. However, it stands to reason that even with stacking penalties being applied, the difference in jump height would be marginal at best until you start getting extreme scenarios like four or five modules. The major difference comes in when the skill bonus applies to the module.

Final Statements:
- Myofibril Stimulants DO NOT give the melee bonus to jump height, for a certain fact.
- Myofibril Stimulants MAY NOT receive a skill bonus.
- Myofibril Stimulants MAY NOT have stacking penalties applied.
- IF THEY DO NOT HAVE STACKING PENALTIES, than we can say without a shadow of a doubt that they do not receive skill bonuses from Hand-to-Hand Combat.

What suit was being tested?

What suit was being tested?

Actually, you are right!
The 3rd and 4th module data almost perfectly lines up with the stacking penalty. Close enough that the 5p leeway could easily be responsible...
The 1st and 2nd modules seem a bit off, but some of that could be leeway as well... The rest? Again no idea. These modules seem all kinds of messed up though, so it could be anything.

However..
I think we might have just discovered what is actually happening.

The Myofibrils are, by my observations:

1.) Providing the melee damage boost to jump height.
2.) Affected by the skill.
3.) Affected by stacking penalties.

At least roughly...

Now you're making stuff up and grasping at straws.

You realize that if these things were applying the melee bonus AND the skill bonus itd be a 75% increase...? I -just said- that it was a 50% increase using your hackneyed 'bottom of the feet" math but again this does not explain the GROSS discrepancy of why the numbers originally posted were within reasonable parameters and not something so crazy as 50-75%.

Figure out why that is and I'll buy into this tin foil. If you can explain why the distance from the control line to the top of the head is within 25% margins but the control line to the feet is 50-75% then Ill start to listen. Until then, Im calling tin foil until I can get home and figure it out myself.

The thing is though aeon, that it doesn't really matter where the head goes in a jump because the 'clearance' of a jump isn't defined by head height, but rather by the height of your feet when trying to get onto something.

I think that investigating the position of feet at apex of jump might be the avenue that adds to some of the most correct answers.

Final Statements:
- Myofibril Stimulants DO NOT give the melee bonus to jump height, for a certain fact.
- Myofibril Stimulants MAY NOT receive a skill bonus.
- Myofibril Stimulants MAY NOT have stacking penalties applied.
- IF THEY DO NOT HAVE STACKING PENALTIES, than we can say without a shadow of a doubt that they do not receive skill bonuses from Hand-to-Hand Combat.

Very informative. I wonder how Mr. Ratburn will take this information.

A question I'd like to ask since you seem so willing to do the research:

how does a running start affect overall jump height?

what 'real' abilities do these mods translate to? (For example, how many blues would you need to jump over a shipping crate, or over a wall? What is the highest object a full blue, running scout could jump onto?

I think one important factor in all this is what sort of actual mobility does this all translate to, as defined by what structures are now "jumpable"

Also: Very nice work. Thank you for your research and effort.

Has anyone tried to see if the hep metabolics effect this jumping business...? Seeing as how you can stack them on the other side..?

A question I'd like to ask since you seem so willing to do the research:

how does a running start affect overall jump height?

what 'real' abilities do these mods translate to? (For example, how many blues would you need to jump over a shipping crate, or over a wall? What is the highest object a full blue, running scout could jump onto?

I think one important factor in all this is what sort of actual mobility does this all translate to, as defined by what structures are now "jumpable"

Also: Very nice work. Thank you for your research and effort.

One point to consider is that there will be error due to the perspective of the camera. You would get more error at higher jump heights because the angle of the "eye" to the target is greater at higher heights. At least I think that's right. Thanks for putting in the considerable effort to do all of this.

Another point to try and see what's going on would be to get data for basic & adv myo's