DUST Search - LOL HAV Operation skill! )))

Outlaw OneZero wrote:

CCP Rattati wrote:

John Psi wrote:

Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left.
After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill.

GJ, CCP! )))

Working as intended

This response worries me a bit, maybe you should take a break from the forums? The trolls seem to be rubbing off on you.

There are a variety of reasons that players may have skilled into HAV operation, including the mistaken impression that a skill labeled HAV operation must have some benefit to skill to level 5 if it is possible to do so.

The real question is why take the antagonistic approach?

Skill changes have been made in the past, and skill books and SP have been refunded. It is possible and it is one fair course of action. The other being to grandfather in people who have already skilled to level 5. Deducting SP from people is an option, but it is an ex post facto approach, which is generally frowned upon in civilized society.

Please consider that not all of your players are trying to game the system, some may just be confused or make mistakes.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
John Psi Vacuum Cleaner. LLC Steel Balls Alliance 1396	Posted - 2015.03.12 11:36:00 - [1] - Quote Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Please support fair play!
Fizzer XCIV Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 2617	Posted - 2015.03.12 11:39:00 - [2] - Quote Taken from unallocated pool. Standard procedure. No free skills. Home at Last <3

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 18430	Posted - 2015.03.12 11:40:00 - [3] - Quote John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Working as intended "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

John Psi Vacuum Cleaner. LLC Steel Balls Alliance 1396	Posted - 2015.03.12 11:42:00 - [4] - Quote What is with people who did not have unallocated pool? A negative value? ))))))))))) Please support fair play!

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 18430	Posted - 2015.03.12 11:43:00 - [5] - Quote Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

shaman oga Dead Man's Game 4137	Posted - 2015.03.12 11:54:00 - [6] - Quote Then you should give negative SP to all the people who has capped some weeks ago and received additional 750k SP for no reason (somebody received something like 4 millions with boosters). What you have done with HAV skill is fine, but i think there should be the same treatment for all the players. Pimp my Barge
Outlaw OneZero Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1588	Posted - 2015.03.12 12:43:00 - [7] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Because reasons... Is there a technical reason that you decided not to refund all skill points in a skill where you changed the multiplier or is this just a case of HTFU and live with your choices? Hello, is this thing on?
Brush Master Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 1467	Posted - 2015.03.12 13:13:00 - [8] - Quote I question the implementation of a multiplier change of this scale. Auto removing SP I believe is the wrong process for changing a skill that has been untouched in a very long time and serves as a core skill for anyone that even wants to try a tank. As a veteran player I can absorb this cost but I feel for any newer player that put into this skill and now resides with negative skill points. I highly suggest that you come up with a procedure to properly refund any skill and dependent skills when a multiplier increase is made on any skill. It just makes sense and your community will be happier when we have a choice to spend the addition SP or not. Dust Veteran. June 2012 - ? True Logi. Flying DS from the start. @dustreports
Evan Gotabor Prima Gallicus 156	Posted - 2015.03.12 17:30:00 - [9] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Talking about witches, do you intend to give to this pretty expensive skill some kind of bonus ? Because it's quite harsh to spend 3 million just to unlock vehicles. Prima Gallicus diplomat Eve 21 day Trial
Captain Africa Clone1 GRIM MERCS 205	Posted - 2015.03.12 17:36:00 - [10] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Dude i have done that long ago so i don't have to do it later on ...it is a skill I hate to invest in but i did because i wanted to max HAV ...so please be clear wtf is up !!! Join the March ,see the universe , meet interesting people and kill them G£¬ http://grimmarch.wix.com/grim-march-ver1

DUST Fiend 15974	Posted - 2015.03.12 17:41:00 - [11] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Hey. That's not fair. Don't blame people for actually having faith that you guys might one day do your jobs. Not cool. Contests, Sales, Writing etc Fly Safe
John Psi Vacuum Cleaner. LLC Steel Balls Alliance 1400	Posted - 2015.03.12 18:52:00 - [12] - Quote Last 5 hours i spent around 30kk dust isk for testing the new tank system. I tested it as a coordinator (map view) located on a small rail turret on railgun tank. On a main turret - perfect tanker (Khack Nerom). At the moment, I find a new system ... gorgeous! As a sign of respect for the work of Rattati I surrender SP GÇïGÇïconfiscated from me for x8 skill. Great job! Infantry need same system. If anyone is interested in a detalies - just ask me (compilation will take some time). new system has many flaws and imperfections, but the overall rate is selected correctly. main tanker has a lot of complaints, the main of which - the cooling module must be passive. Please support fair play!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 17605	Posted - 2015.03.12 19:03:00 - [13] - Quote John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Should have read notes which told you that Vehicle Op would be an 8x skill not 4x. Raphael: I'm warning you. Do not leave me here. I will find you. Castiel: Maybe one day. Today you're my little bitch
MrShooter01 Ustio Mercenary Squadron 1471	Posted - 2015.03.12 19:06:00 - [14] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. I trained it to level 3 for the hell of it back when you announced the HAV bringback initiative and the plan to introduce UHAV and DHAV skills requiring HAV operation level 3 Now I'm at -200k unallocated skillpoints But I can use advanced HAVs so eh v0v
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 6656	Posted - 2015.03.12 19:07:00 - [15] - Quote DUST Fiend wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Hey. That's not fair. Don't blame people for actually having faith that you guys might one day do your jobs. Not cool. I agree. Partial refund to vehicle users would've been a good idea. But if that happened, there would be people complaining that the level 5 skill they had should've stayed level 5 for free, so there's that as well. Can't win them all, brochacho.
benandjerrys UNIVERSAL C.A.R.N.A.G.E 139	Posted - 2015.03.12 19:12:00 - [16] - Quote Grandfathered in or at least a title screen warning. -1 CCP Tread Locking Proficiency V
Captain Africa Clone1 GRIM MERCS 206	Posted - 2015.03.12 20:17:00 - [17] - Quote CCP Rattati well at least now I know why I have - 1 mil sp. .. Im not going to complain to much since you are such a nice guy. Its like going to a garage and buy a car for 1 mil sp ...then later on the manufacturer decides the car is worth 2 mil and not only demands an additional 1 mil sp from me....but deducts it from my bank account...and doesn't even have the decency to let me know... You know a similar thing happened in Eve a few years ago with command ships ...However CCP gave their paying player base the benefit of the doubt , because they knew the importance of player retention ...have a nice day sir Join the March ,see the universe , meet interesting people and kill them G£¬ http://grimmarch.wix.com/grim-march-ver1
Hawkin P Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 644	Posted - 2015.03.12 20:33:00 - [18] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. What did you have a skill that could be ranked up with no unlocks and no bonus? Your game is quite confusing to new players and now you mock them? Molon Labe CEO
Flint Beastgood III Dead Man's Game RUST415 1497	Posted - 2015.03.12 21:57:00 - [19] - Quote Hawkin P wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Why did you have a skill that could be ranked up with no unlocks and no bonus? Your game is quite complicated to some players and now you mock them? Mhmm. CCP mentality. Skills - https://www.facebook.com/notes/flint-beastgood-iii/list-of-trained-skills/416505058477164
Ralden Caster KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 152	Posted - 2015.03.12 22:03:00 - [20] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Working as intended I don't even tank anymore; why should I be obliged to have my SP leeched? "Death by Carbonation" -Quafe weapons

Derpty Derp Dead Man's Game 903	Posted - 2015.03.12 22:04:00 - [21] - Quote -900 unallocated sp... Just as I intended. Specced everything I wanted before the patch, lol. Thanks for the loan.
Aoena Rays Bragian Order Amarr Empire 592	Posted - 2015.03.13 03:30:00 - [22] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Working as intended :D Would be cool to add these changes to the patch notes too (in client) so people like this don't come to forums and scream at you at all times. Story of your life
Jade Dragonis GRIM MERCS 426	Posted - 2015.03.13 09:42:00 - [23] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Because we believed CCP when they said it would be usefull in the future. So I invested into it as a precurser to the Proto tanks. So for being forward thinking I am now being punished? Ouch. Follow me on Youtube
Operative Mechcondrid New Age Empire. 1	Posted - 2015.03.13 10:20:00 - [24] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Working as intended So you intended to **** over those who had almost every hav skill to at least 3 ? I now have a negative of 800k+ in skill points because of this idiocy. It would have been one thing to increase the skill cost multiplier and removed the skills the char didn't have enough for in a linear progression, but putting people into sp debt is bullshit. You have essentially made people in my situation have to PAY you to fix YOUR screw up!!! That or play for 2 or 3 weeks if not more just to not be in a position of being stuck and unable to upgrade or change any skills for whatever period of time it takes that person to get out of sp debt. If you guys insist on not fixing this properly, then you need to give those who you put in major so debt a free code for a skill tree reset at the absolute minimum.
Outlaw OneZero Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1594	Posted - 2015.03.13 12:22:00 - [25] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Working as intended This response worries me a bit, maybe you should take a break from the forums? The trolls seem to be rubbing off on you. There are a variety of reasons that players may have skilled into HAV operation, including the mistaken impression that a skill labeled HAV operation must have some benefit to skill to level 5 if it is possible to do so. The real question is why take the antagonistic approach? Skill changes have been made in the past, and skill books and SP have been refunded. It is possible and it is one fair course of action. The other being to grandfather in people who have already skilled to level 5. Deducting SP from people is an option, but it is an ex post facto approach, which is generally frowned upon in civilized society. Please consider that not all of your players are trying to game the system, some may just be confused or make mistakes. Hello, is this thing on?
Operative Mechcondrid New Age Empire. 2	Posted - 2015.03.13 12:40:00 - [26] - Quote Outlaw OneZero wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: John Psi wrote: Before hotfix ECHO i invest SP to HAV Operation skill, have around 2kk unnalocated SP left. After hotfix my green pool automatically reduced on account of this skill. GJ, CCP! ))) Working as intended This response worries me a bit, maybe you should take a break from the forums? The trolls seem to be rubbing off on you. There are a variety of reasons that players may have skilled into HAV operation, including the mistaken impression that a skill labeled HAV operation must have some benefit to skill to level 5 if it is possible to do so. The real question is why take the antagonistic approach? Skill changes have been made in the past, and skill books and SP have been refunded. It is possible and it is one fair course of action. The other being to grandfather in people who have already skilled to level 5. Deducting SP from people is an option, but it is an ex post facto approach, which is generally frowned upon in civilized society. Please consider that not all of your players are trying to game the system, some may just be confused or make mistakes. The part that gets me in a twist the most is that they ever thought this would be a fair solution. Its like they are saying " hey we want this skill to cost more but since you already paid the old sp cost we'll just take the remainder out of your account, if you dont have it then oh well" its tantamount to holding a character hostage in a lot of cases; such as mine with the near 850k sp debt. And as for being "generally frowned upon in civilized society" no its actuallly illegal in most societies and if this was a bussiness selling a product i could actually sue them Also as for the Dev being antagonistic it might help if they hired someone that actually understands and speaks english fluently to mediate between the community and (what's left of) the Dev team, because just from the few post from him in this forum that I've seen he doesn't necessarily have the best grasp of how English is written
Proto Annihilator 16 Vandals 687	Posted - 2015.03.13 13:05:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. The in depth tutorial on skill progression offered to new players. World of hurt
Outlaw OneZero Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1594	Posted - 2015.03.13 19:43:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Why was it possible to skill Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonuses? Why does Vehicle Command have no bonuses? CCP Rattati wrote: Working as intended So I guess this is the final decision on the matter? Disappointing... To be clear, it doesn't matter to me at all, I only had level 1 so I was able to easily absorb the extra SP cost. I just don't feel its the right way to go about this. Hello, is this thing on?
Minion Max Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 24	Posted - 2015.03.13 19:50:00 - [29] - Quote Yes I have Level 5 Command and was working on the other levels for all Turrets, most are level 2 and 3. I went from +117,00 SP to -930,000. It is not worth the next month of what time I can play to get back to 0 SP. CCP Rattati wrote: Why did someone have Vehicle Command to 5 with no unlocks and no bonus. Semper Fi. Cpl, 87-95


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