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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 2 post(s) |
Galvatrona
Death Merchants Inc.
4
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Posted - 2015.02.11 09:59:00 -
[1] - Quote
I am a full time tanker, up until 1.10 I didn't use or have a dropsuit higher than min logi level 1 just to use my blueprint suit to drive. All of my points up until this point were into tanks my guns operate better. I can fit better mods with full 3 proto guns having fitting opt 5 for all turrets. As soon as there was the ability to respect I did, I eliminated the turrets that I didn't favor and used the leftover points to outfit dropsuits. I only respected to be able to avoid the tank spam when the enemy team sees my name and pulls 4 tanks to come after me or the cheesy loaded dropships. I spend the rest of the match back at the redline with my blueprint covenant sniper rifle and wait out the match.
One thing to fix the vehicle death action is to put pilot suits into play for closed in driver seats. HAV and DS of all types excluding LAV as your exposed.
I have several items to go over for this implementation.
Comparing dropsuits they are all of different sizes and speeds with different size weapons.
How much space is there really in a drivers seat?
How does a heavy that I can out run by 2X get out of a vehicle just as fast as I do?
Now how does the heavy fit in the drivers seat with a huge weapon at the ready. I seem to run faster depending on which weapon I have in my hands (not a lot of proto dropsuits to use to test with yet). how does this not play into a delay in the exit/entrance of a vehicle.
If you can't operate a 1/2 million isk tank (cheaping out is your self imposed handicap or lack of skills into vehicle upgrades or fitting optimization) Why should you get a 2nd chance in another large investment. why not let heavys have an eject button for when they hit close to death they can bust out of their almost dead heavy suit into a scout suit just because it fits inside? seems pretty stupid right.
My tank has never had 5-10 seconds of safety time for me to bail at a wall of obstacle, DS pilots had the switch seat option now just pull up before death to survive the fall as your now on top of the ship and can aim away from it. does not work if the ships too weak and I 2 shot it before the driver can respond. This tanks name is "The Dropship Special" not saying whats in it but it offers no quarter to dropships for escape, only 2 ships so far have survived from 2 direct hits from this tank, I received mail afterwards asking me what I use. Now these people target me at the beginning of the match with multiple vehicles or massive AV teams.
In my tank if I decide that I am going to ride it out and not bail I die if it hits 0HP Everyone in the DS is taking the same risk passengers included, passengers see the health of the DS and can decide when to bail on their own if not TRAPPED AND DEAD with the ship.
Here is an example of DS not working properly match starts I move in and a DS trys to sneak up behind me. I let him get so far as he/she is going to approach soon to get range on their turrets. I spin asap and nail the DS into 0 HP, The pilot and passengers use the guns on me until they fail to respond at this point they know to bail and lock on with swarms or charge the forge they have. As the pilot approaches he/she uses the bank left then right technique to empty one turret and spin to empty the other passengers turret, this sideways flying allows the pilot to survive the drop as the ship is no longer plowing into him/her. The chance of survival is even higher if I don't time the shots to not hit the front of the ship to push it up. I feel in this situation they stayed in the ship until it was no longer useful then took advantage of the 0HP action to destroy me after I fairly destroyed their ride with them in it.
Pilot suits could have 1 high, 1 low, 1 equipment and a side arm only. I have yet to see a helicopter pilot or jet pilot have more than a side arm on their person unless its in a side compartment, which they don't have when they eject unless the return back to salvage it from their wreckage. Having 1 equipment slot allows access for the driver to still assist infantry with links ammo or carry proxy remotes to set up a "follow me trap" for blaster tanks. With the limitation of slots and weapons the pilot suit could use the level of your dropsuit upgrades to make it more effective/survivable. This allowing unlimited CPU and PG on the suit to fit 1 of what you have maxed out for each slot instead of needing to include a proto pilot suit or any type of extra skills. Aside of hav/ds skills that would allow the purchase of the basic pilot suit for a minimum isk cost. Another way to put the pilot suit into users dropsuit fitting is to have it as one of the blueprint starter suits that only unlocks only once you've spent points into hav or DS skills. Including a bandwidth of 16 would allow enough room for enough remotes to either seriously injure if not destroy another tank, or enough equipment to assist not support infantry more than the realm of the tanks main job. This suit would not need a fast run speed or a low profile as it should be only mainly used with vehicles, on the other side the suits weakness should allow a low precision to see almost any suit not dampened. These stats would make the suit nothing more than a suit to run away in, killing someone would not be easy but avoiding them would be. people trying to take advantage of the low precision are reduced to less to than a glass cannon holding by onto a side arm.
I have more info on this topic which I may add later.
Yes I feel overpowered in my tank but I deserve to be with no dropsuits and level 5 skills in vehicles and turret operations. |
Galvatrona
Death Merchants Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2015.02.11 12:13:00 -
[2] - Quote
Both the tank and dropship carry the same risk to passengers that want to deploy in their seats. They are in the hands of the driver and have accepted the risks of deploying in a vehicle instead of another link. For some reason people that deploy in my tank do not get out to assist in hacking for fear that someone else will spawn in the seat and they cannot get back in. Unlike the dropship where multiple people can spawn and have a need to drop out as a DS with filled turrets is pointless to stay in and make 0 points. There have been a few blues I have hear of waiting it out in the ship for one of the gunners to die and take his seat. In these cases an eject option could be installed. I would not mind a turret position (minimum cpu/pg cost) that was just a seat with a 30 sec auto eject. The turret spawn seat would put the person out of the back of the tank if they chose or not, coming out of the back would prevent me killing them in PC and FW where you get kicked for a day. As for the dropship eject it could be an option to kick out every passenger and one that would allow you to keep your gunners and kick the rest.
An ejection option would benefit both the tank and the dropship for recall reasons. After ejection the timer would kick in to relock the doors so you can get out and recall it.
IE we spawn mcc and wait for a few slow squad members or need to pick them up at the wrong drop point. At this point the door locks no longer apply and a blueberry gets in. You get to a roof you can safely land on and recall but the one blue doesn't get out. Either he decides wee a free ride or just doesn't like your parking job he burns up your ship in a blaze of glory at no cost to him.
In pub matches, a thief tax for dieing in a vehicle you don't own (not applied to enemy hacked vehicles) would prevent/reduce vehicle thieft as well. Can't figure out why your negative at the end of a match maybe stealing peoples expensive vehicles will do that. This tax would not apply to squad members. I don't fly but that doesn't mean I don't own a pile of dropships and have others fly them for me. With my skills I don't cheap out on the ship either. I don't wanna die in a flying coffin, seeing as I know I can drop most dropships in 2 shots.
Either way you look at the pilot eject system in any comparison, the pilot never has the amount of equipment that a ground infantry has for what ever reason. Its too much to fit or is not needed in the use of then operation of the vehicle its self and would more than likely get in the way of the operation of the vehicle. |
Galvatrona
Death Merchants Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2015.02.11 12:29:00 -
[3] - Quote
another reason I am saying that a tank is included in the closed cockpit system as I choose not to use the jump out tactic and have gotten used to fighting the ones that do bail and fire at me with a forge gun. make sure you get them low enough only when you have a side view of their tank or fire mid side of the tank so when he does get out I hit him before the tank and it takes him time to rotate to fire his hand weapon at you.
I don't particularly like having half my dropsuit mowed down by an empty lav then be shot in the back by a proto heavy wielding a proto gun, get back in his lav and ride off like it was nothing is demeaning enough to your self esteem. Now having this done to you by the same heavy type riding in a gunnlogi with a complex nitro and a particle cannon. Just because he can only hit things the size of barns with that powerful gun he rolls on you bails and whipes you out with the machine gun. How much overpowered do you need to be before you stop firing av at a tank like this?
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Galvatrona
Death Merchants Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2015.02.11 12:34:00 -
[4] - Quote
Now this is a tactic I do not employ but am seriously thinking about as it would prevent scouts from remoting me mostly but I find it cheesy and the cost per death at this point is not worth the risk.
If not a pilot suit then a weapons limitation which a driver could have after all the issue ejector seat only contains an assault rifle, not the space of lets say a swarm launcher of forge gun?
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Galvatrona
Death Merchants Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2015.02.12 01:54:00 -
[5] - Quote
I wonder if pilot suits were and are such a horrible idea then it is I wonder why they were implemented into the game with no expectations to use them. In effect are taking up space in the game that they shoulden't . removal of the option list for dropsuits would go a long way to deter having discussions about them?
I agree with the post above that states that dropships and their passengers have "special" kill/destruction requirements that other vehicles don't have.
Adding to the "crashing a dropship to deploy", If I crash my LAV into a wall hard enough I am dead on impact. Now I do see this as a bit unfair to new pilots learning to fly as they bump up against stuff gauging the power of propulsion to their safety bubble. Hmmm have yet to see any flying device in a real type situation take a body check from a building and survive. Most flying vehicles are made up of weaker metals than ground vehicles, not saying to deduce their HP but a helicopter comes close to a building the main rotor is usually done and they fall, in the case of a jet type the lose parts and have stuff ripped off by objects a lot smaller than a full sized building.
wow shoot a DS to curve its flight path to strike a building trusting that game mechanics from crashing lav's and hav's will down the ship out of like policies for vehicles, and yet the person recovers and fly's off, now I ask what is up with that. an lav hits my tank and the whole shield if not half of it are gone and the lav NEVER survives.
How does a dropship crush a tank into death by weight. Lets say some form of reality would be put into the though of vhehicle composition. An aluminum flying device meets a steel plate armored vehicle, any way you put it the armored vehicle is going to shred the aluminum flyer to pieces sheerly on strength of the vehicles outer hull. With some moving I ruin the guys dropship, the explosion damages my tank, now buddy gets out throws a remote on me and pulls out a swarm launcher, kamakazi tactics should be met with kamakazi results for failure and they don't unles your in a LAV.
To the point of blueprint LAV's being too over powered, if your using your militia swarms you deserve to be meet with failure. Those swarms in advanced and lower are like elmo tickle me dolls twerking up against me vehicle. I load my lav's for survival, they are capable of taking a full clip from a proto swarm launcher but it takes timimg and isk to achieve this. double light shield boosters and a light armor repair unit, I park outside of a door and let buddy swarm me, get killed by a squad mate and just wait for him to return. you think after dieing this way several times he'd give up instead of dieing in frustration until at the end of the match I get hate mail for being buddys bait. Like said in my first post here I was "strictly a ground vehicle driver up until 1.10", so techniques to get AV killed and discourage them to find someone else to shoot at is what I am looking to do to save my vehicles.
I have also found that in some matches the hate for my tank is higher than half of the enemy teams will to want to win the match. load up a cheapo with blueprint parts and and go be target practise for them. As an added benefit I now know who can and can't hit a moving barn and are dead next time they don't have a fleet of tanks/dropships/AV to fight me.
A blueprint starter suit that's dedicated to vehicle usage would cost NO ONE any ISK or EXTRA SP. It would be considered a requirement for driving a closed cockpit. Including advantageous skills on the pilot suit removes the visiual ability I have when deciding which tanks to pick out of first to destroy out of their advancing triple team of tanks.
Someone mentioned a heavy needing a driver to heavy taxi, LAV'S are not closed cockpit. Need proof park somewhere and lets see if I can head shot you with a militia sniper rifle. I am referring to JUST closed cockpit type vehicles to require a pilot suit.
In the case of it being too weak to be on the battle field, what thief is going to spawn out in a pilot suit intending to steal a vehicle with the risk of being shot too easily or be seen in a pilot suit and not call a vehicle, thief labeled now instead of waiting for him to steal my ride to find out.
Still something needs to be done that addresses more than just 1 point of vehicle usage, DS kills is not a lone subject when thieft, proper door locks, pilot suits and vehicle mechanics effects all vehicle types and overlaps in various ways.
I have always found it unfair that a flying bus has more ability to protect its passengers unless you waste your shots trying to shoot out the passengers. In my tank people cannot shoot out my passengers but they have just as or more likeyness to die when the tank is gone.
I also agree with the item that passengers should be taking damage from the exploding ship, again they took the risk of spawning there and not a ground link where they are in control, YOU ACCEPT THE RISKS OF SPAWNING WHERE YOU SPAWN. When you get spawn killed on the field do you blame the person that put down the link for not staying to babysit it while you spawned, NO! Its your fault for showing up there and no one elses. You spawn on a ship that's being shot and now goes down with you in it, loss accepted don't blame the pilot just because you wanted a free ride to the other side of the map. Risk taken and accepted where ever you decide to show up. I spawn camped a link in a field that was owned by a remoter who didn't get it. He hate mailed me for camping his own link, is this my fault or his stupidity to spawn there more than 5 times, die, write hate mail and try again. After a while it got boring but hilarious to see him die, I receive mail right afterwards and just do it over again. |
Galvatrona
Death Merchants Inc.
4
|
Posted - 2015.02.12 02:37:00 -
[6] - Quote
dieing at 0/0 is acceptable, but the debate on that one is that there is or is not a penalty to turret operators. After all they are not just passengers but are holding onto a piece of hardware attached to the dropship and would also feel the 0/0 explosion. In a tank the everyone dies at 0/0, although there are no extra passenger spots. Allowing the gunners to bail boils down to the fact that they are in a position to shoot and kill people and may be designated players part of a squad thus still enabling the destruction and immediate revenge options the pilot had before the 0/0 death. In this case it would only be fair to have the tanks passengers the same get out of death card the dropship turret operators do.
This proposal brings up the need/want for passenger only options for turret spaces on tanks would it not Dropships could use them to add more survivability to their hp. This making passenger safety the priority and the ds is only a infantry support and drop off vehicle, a true flying bus, no more fighting tanks or turrets but offers the ability to take more of a pounding during retreat situations.
Like I said before you take the risk of spawning where you spawn, your always in someones hands unless you show up at an installation CRU from here on out, then you can blame CCP if you get spawn camped.
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