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Faquira Bleuetta
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
482
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Posted - 2015.02.02 00:13:00 -
[31] - Quote
All Gucci wrote:Here let me brake it down nice and simple...  This is evidence to back up my claims that the amarr assault has to little speed or hp..... 460 is the base amarr Ehp so I went off that..... 460/4.0 (1% of Min health) = 115% take that number and now multiply by .0742 (1% of min speed ) = 8.533 meters per second !!!! If we amarr were following the Min health/speed ratio, we would be running at 8.533 meters per second with 460 health...  here I'll compare gal/cal to amarr 460/4.3 (1% Gal/Cal Health) =106.976 take that number and now multiply by .07 ( 1% Gal/Cal Speed ) = 7.488 meters per second!!! If we followed the Gal/Cal health/speed ratio we would be running at 7.488 meters per second with 460 health... Now lets check if my math is wrong 460/4.6 (1% Amarr Health) = 100 Take that number and multiply by .0672 (1% of amarr Speed) = 6.72 Meters per second which sounds about right Idk if its the same for every suit but I notice this with the assaults. with Min/Cal/Gal Assaults being more prominent More Data I wouldn't see no reason to look into this... thank you  I would say make both the amarr and min follow the same ratio as the Gal/Cal or make the amarrs health follow its own rule like the Min speed does... which means buff amarr health or speed slightly
i only want a - 1.4 % movement speed penalty instead of the stupid non sense - 4 % |
Ice Royal Glantix
Heaven's Lost Property
72
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Posted - 2015.02.02 00:32:00 -
[32] - Quote
All Gucci wrote:460 is the base amarr Ehp so I went off that..... 460/4.0 (1% of Min health) = 115% take that number and now multiply by .0742 (1% of min speed ) = 8.533 meters per second !!!! If we amarr were following the Min health/speed ratio, we would be running at 8.533 meters per second with 460 health...
You get an "A" for math. Calculations appear to be spot on and your method is pretty solid as well.
You get an "F" for logic. Let me just break your logic down.
The Amarr have 115% the health of the Minmatar; thus, the Amarr must need 115% of the speed too.
Now let me use my logic:
The Amarr have 115% the health of the Minmatar: thus, the Amarr should have 115% less speed.
So the calculations should be as follows:
7.42(Minmatar Speed) / 1.15 = 6.45
So by this logic the Amarr should run at 6.45 m/s.
"Don't be dead; be happy!"
Aim to please. Shoot to kill.
I watch anime for the romance and the tears.
:'(
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All Gucci
T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K
General Tso's Alliance
171
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Posted - 2015.02.02 00:52:00 -
[33] - Quote
Imp Smash wrote:OK, so you are comparing the health to speed ratio. And leaving out the slot layout which is favorable for both speed AND armor on the Am Ass. And leaving out the better PG/CPU to allow better modules in the aforementioned slot layout. What about native in built Armor rep, shield rep/delay. I mean, really, you kind of need to compare more than just those two things..... 
the slot layout isn't favorable for amarr lmfao you have to trade speed for decent hp and vice versa not to mention we have to use up a slot to have survivable armor regen... the min has the same amount of passive armor reps we do..... and despite being created dual tank...the amarr has the worst shield rep/delay... and better PG/CPU because our weapons take waaaay more fitting then a cr does..... I chose to compare the two because that's their strengths... I am only pointing out that one suits isn't getting what it truly deserves
Director / Slayer / Emperor
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One Eyed King
Nos Nothi
7572
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Posted - 2015.02.02 00:59:00 -
[34] - Quote
All Gucci wrote:Imp Smash wrote:OK, so you are comparing the health to speed ratio. And leaving out the slot layout which is favorable for both speed AND armor on the Am Ass. And leaving out the better PG/CPU to allow better modules in the aforementioned slot layout. What about native in built Armor rep, shield rep/delay. I mean, really, you kind of need to compare more than just those two things..... the slot layout isn't favorable for amarr lmfao you have to trade speed for decent hp and vice versa not to mention we have to use up a slot to have survivable armor regen... the min has the same amount of passive armor reps we do..... and despite being created dual tank...the amarr has the worst shield rep/delay... and better PG/CPU because our weapons take waaaay more fitting then a cr does..... I chose to compare the two because that's their strengths... I am only pointing out that one suits isn't getting what it truly deserves
Based upon your completely biased analysis that in no way shape or form takes into account all factors, like stamina, or all HP/Speed ratios, like Logis.
Former CEO of the Land of the BIind.
Any double entendre is unintended I assure you.
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Faquira Bleuetta
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
482
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Posted - 2015.02.02 02:00:00 -
[35] - Quote
the amarr only need - 1.4 % movement speed penalty no more no less |
True Adamance
Praetoriani Classiarii Templares
Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris
16918
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Posted - 2015.02.02 02:31:00 -
[36] - Quote
All Gucci wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:All Gucci wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:Considering that the amarr assault is one of the most solid performers in the game in the hands of someone who has both thumbs intact I'm going to say "no" to your desire to run like a scout or tank like a sentinel. Thank you drive through. why do you people like to exaggerate all the time?! 1% speed boost to run like a scout.......... are you an idiot? and 15 more health to tank like a sentinel?  please keep your exaggerations to yourself and approach me with numbers.... same thing you forum warriors always say.... prove me wrong. How about this, the lack of a speed to hit point ratio is deliberate because you are ignoring the fact that fitting resources and stamina are part of the balance. Amarr suits universally have the highest stamina in the game, which I expect you to blow off as irrelevant immediately. Amarr and minmatar are counterpoints to each other not mirrors of each other. Because you are monofocusing on two attributes occludes the rest of the picture. Minmatar are faster per HP because their suits are more fragile. Their slot layout doesn't allow for specialized tank because they are able to pick either. Amarr are the slowest, but also the most durable and the weapons that synergize best with their dropsuits also obliterate shields at the rapid rate. There IS NO MATCHING HP/SPEED RATIO that you can apply. Because if you apply it to the amarr you get an unintended high point in speed to mass. Amarr pay for their higher base HP with speed but get stamina to compensate. This is not an equation, this is balancing races by strength and weakness. It never was an equation. And trying to make it an equation is ridiculous because you're trying to balance them based on only two of their attributes. The min has better stamina then the amarr there is no debate about this..... while having more hp then us (assuming you can do math... amarr trade the same amount of hp that gal/cal do with Min but take a huge speed penalty..... assuming stamina is the balance for that, why does the min stillllll have better stamina then the amarr while having more health? (Health/speed ratio wise ) don't be delusional ccp makes balance mistakes on weapons constantly.... is it hard to believe they messed up with a suit? just because our ScR ***** on you people you are so scared to see logic ???? if the suit gets a buff then the ScR will be used more and the data can be used to nerf it if it needs one.... I shouldn't be glued to using only the ScR to be effective with my amarr assault.....
Actually mate we do have the highest stamina values...... however one could suggest that with speed your stamina becomes more valuable....... but not enough to justify HP and speed buffs for the Amarr line of suits.
Seriously I suggest you ignore this insidious and down right foolish notion that when you roll amarr stuff you should stack eHP. Don't you'll be more efficient boosting your regen and speed.
This was you can run further and more swiftly, rely on your higher base armour stats, and ability to stack 3x damage modules for the ultimate hit and run assault build. Running at 8m/s, with an adaptable gun, the ability to see everything not hyper damped, 559 armour, and all the range you needs you have the Imperial Navy Slicer in a compact PG/CPU tight suit.
"This is the Usumgal boy, the exalted dragon, wreathed in the fires of heaven. He is a true symbol of God's majesty."
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Faquira Bleuetta
Fatal Absolution
General Tso's Alliance
482
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Posted - 2015.02.02 02:37:00 -
[37] - Quote
amarr need to have -10000 % penalty in speed , scr op , stamina op |
Yokal Bob
State of Purgatory
760
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Posted - 2015.02.02 03:33:00 -
[38] - Quote
Amarr assault is fine as it is. It is a strong performer on the field.
/{o.o}/ ---L Inflatable hammer strikes again
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All Gucci
T.H.I.R.D R.O.C.K
General Tso's Alliance
173
|
Posted - 2015.02.02 04:30:00 -
[39] - Quote
All Gucci wrote:Here let me brake it down nice and simple... This is evidence to back up my claims that the amarr assault has to little speed or hp..... 460 is the base amarr Ehp so I went off that..... 460/4.0 (1% of Min health) = 115% take that number and now multiply by .0742 (1% of min speed ) = 8.533 meters per second !!!! If we amarr were following the Min health/speed ratio, we would be running at 8.533 meters per second with 460 health... here I'll compare gal/cal to amarr 460/4.3 (1% Gal/Cal Health) =106.976 take that number and now multiply by .07 ( 1% Gal/Cal Speed ) = 7.488 meters per second!!! If we followed the Gal/Cal health/speed ratio we would be running at 7.488 meters per second with 460 health... Now lets check if my math is wrong 460/4.6 6.72 Meters per second which sounds about right Idk if its the same for every suit but I notice this with the assaults. with Min/Cal/Gal Assaults being more prominent More Data I wouldn't see no reason to look into this... thank you I would say make both the amarr and min follow the same ratio as the Gal/Cal or make the amarrs health follow its own rule like the Min speed does... which means buff amarr health or speed slightly
I will use the gal/cal base health to help people understand that no matter what base health you use the amarr take a bigger hit in speed then all the other suits do.
430/4.0 (1% of Min health ) = 107.5 multiply by .0742 (1% of min speed) = 7.97 using min/speed health ratio at 430 health gal/cal would be running at 7.97 that's more than than gal/cal and way more than amarr....
430/4.3 (1 % Gal/Cal Health ) = 100 multiply that by .07 (1% Gal/Cal Speed ) = 7 meters per second.. which sounds right. more than amarr and less then min
430/4.6(1% Amarr Health) = 93.47 Take that number and multiply by .0672 (1% of amarr Speed) =6.281
using amarr speed/health ratio at 430 hp gal/cal would run a 6.281 that's less then Gal/Cal and way less then Min..
I could do the same with min base hp but it will follow the same pattern.... Amarr - Gal/Cal - Min (From worst to best )
I'll do min and amar since that's what we will use to balance the ratios out
400/4.6 = 86.95 take that number and multiply by .0672 = 5.84 if we used the amarr health to speed ratio we would have 5.84 with 400 health....obviously way slower then what the mins actual speed is....
Either min has to much speed or amarr have to little health...
Director / Slayer / Emperor
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Imp Smash
Molon Labe.
General Tso's Alliance
610
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Posted - 2015.02.02 23:51:00 -
[40] - Quote
All Gucci wrote:Imp Smash wrote:OK, so you are comparing the health to speed ratio. And leaving out the slot layout which is favorable for both speed AND armor on the Am Ass. And leaving out the better PG/CPU to allow better modules in the aforementioned slot layout. What about native in built Armor rep, shield rep/delay. I mean, really, you kind of need to compare more than just those two things..... the slot layout isn't favorable for amarr lmfao you have to trade speed for decent hp and vice versa not to mention we have to use up a slot to have survivable armor regen... the min has the same amount of passive armor reps we do..... and despite being created dual tank...the amarr has the worst shield rep/delay... and better PG/CPU because our weapons take waaaay more fitting then a cr does..... I chose to compare the two because that's their strengths... I am only pointing out that one suits isn't getting what it truly deserves
Yes, you are correct. Amarr DO have to trade speed for decent HP and vice versa. But seeing as modules do NOT go into different slots depending on suits, EVERY suit has to trade speed for hp (and vice versa.)
Amarr have the most low slots so they can fit the most speed mods, or the most HP mods, OR the most of both. So yes, actually the Amarr have a very favorable slot layout in terms of going pure HP, pure speed, or a mix of both. And, as you yourself mentioned: The Minmatar have the same passive reps as the Amarr + the Amarr have to use a slot for survivable armor regen. So don't the Minmatar need to use a slot for survivable passive regen as you call it? Why would you list something that is true for pretty much every suit (minus caldari) as a reason for why the Amarr is lacking over Min?
But if you want to compare racial strengths -- amarr run longer. Minmatar run more often.
Again -- I fail to see how you think this is unfair.
Also the highlighted part makes no sense to me. Can you explain what you mean by that?
I mean I get your point behind why you think the Amarr is lacking. Your math is spot on and if it was the only difference between all the suits it would be a reasonable (actually almost ironclad) argument. All I, and pretty much everyone else in the thread, are saying is that when you account for the other strengths that the Amarr assault has it makes up for the Health/Speed Ratio difference. |
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