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Things commandos need to make them fun and viable.

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Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Striker 630	Posted - 2015.01.06 22:28:00 - [1] - Quote Things commando needs: Minor Speed and stamina increase. Additional slot per tier. Grenades, since it's often used as an AV platform and grenades are crucial to this. Minor buff to suit precision. It's ok for them to be seen, but they go toe to toe with assaults more often than not so why be blind to them? Additional durability, regen not hp. Don't want to step on sentinel toes. In terms of bonuses, commandos used to have one that buffed any defensive module fitted. It allowed them to have decent durability without increasing the slot count. Well, in theory, anyway. It was only 10% maxed out. 25% maxed might be more substantial. I'm aware that in the list above I've mentioned a slot increase, but I reckon just the one extra per tier shouldn't make them the unstoppable "heavy assaults" that were the initial concern when CCP first introduced them. Thoughts? And could really do with CPM and CCP feedback on what direction, if any, they want to take this suit. I'm aware that they might have bigger concerns to resolve right now, but a general idea of what and when would be really appreciated. Thanks. Dedicated Commando. CEO of Eridani Light Horse Strikers. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4292	Posted - 2015.01.06 22:49:00 - [2] - Quote Speed & Stamina: Yeah a bit could help. I'm pretty much obligated to fit a biotic to most of my fits to make up for poor base stats, and given the lack of slots...I'd rather not have to do that. Slots: In general I'd like to see suit types within the same frame have the same slot layout. So giving the Commando an extra slot to match the layout of their Sentinel counterpart seems intuitive. Grenade: Given all of their downsides, I think a grenade makes sense. I wouldn't mind having AV grenades on hand to finish off HAVs after cooking their shields with the PLC. Scans: I've always seen the Commando as the big brother of the Assault as they share the same role. Similar EWAR seems like common sense. Defensive Bonuses: Why not make a defensive bonus that's centric around HP regen specific to each class? Caldari: +% to Shield Recharchers Minmatar: +% to Shield Regulators Gallente: +% to Armor Repairers Amarr: Maybe +% Reduction to Armor Plate Speed Penalty? N "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1655	Posted - 2015.01.06 22:59:00 - [3] - Quote +1 I know that you put it here but I kinda wish it was in the GD but I understand . There it would get more exposure , hell people have garbage troll post up at the time ... this would be worth while and more meaty for discussion . This just needs to happen , I could see all but if you have three from these choices of suggestions it would be better because that role is not overpowering and I play it and wouldn't want it to become that because they over nerf the role then and it would never be the same . They just need an extra something about them to make them more viable . I wouldn't want to see the field cluttered with them like some roles and that's one of the reasons I play Commando , when I played logi there weren't that many . People prob had the skill and suit but only used it sparingly , now in pubs I see at least 3 or 4 and that's good and well needed as well as assaults getting in the mix but the commando is just missing something . I like stamina , they need a grenade slot ... I could do without the extra slots because that would be borderline but it the boost in CPU/PG isn't overdone , that would be a help . To be able to see is needed like the OP mentioned they are seen but really can't see that well . Yeah something that big really can't hide but why are they so blind ? Regeneration , well ... there not fast , don't have a immune bonus , can't really see and really fold like paper when fired on but I believe that has something to do with TTK and how people some don't really wanna have a fire fight . The like to OKH and three shot people . No confrontation . There in a almost good spot but to get them in a good spot their missing something a few things . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1655	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:02:00 - [4] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Speed & Stamina: Yeah a bit could help. I'm pretty much obligated to fit a biotic to most of my fits to make up for poor base stats, and given the lack of slots...I'd rather not have to do that. Slots: In general I'd like to see suit types within the same frame have the same slot layout. So giving the Commando an extra slot to match the layout of their Sentinel counterpart seems intuitive. Grenade: Given all of their downsides, I think a grenade makes sense. I wouldn't mind having AV grenades on hand to finish off HAVs after cooking their shields with the PLC. Scans: I've always seen the Commando as the big brother of the Assault as they share the same role. Similar EWAR seems like common sense. Defensive Bonuses: Why not make a defensive bonus that's centric around HP regen specific to each class? Caldari: +% to Shield Recharchers Minmatar: +% to Shield Regulators Gallente: +% to Armor Repairers Amarr: Maybe +% Reduction to Armor Plate Speed Penalty? N Now were cooking . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1655	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:06:00 - [5] - Quote Shamelessly trying to begin to give this mouth to mouth so that some might see when they come back from break and give this the well deserved blue tag . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Striker 631	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:20:00 - [6] - Quote I appreciate your enthusiasm Shinobi, and thanks for the support and suggestions Pokey. I'll edit the OP with them as they're totally sound and make perfect sense. I've tried to strike up a dialogue about commandos before and they do get some solid ideas from other forum users, but nothing ever really comes of it after that. Which is a shame, because they're a tremendously fun suit to play but I wouldn't dare take one into a PC battle. It'd be a waste of suit. And that's what we're really missing here: competitive viability. To use one is to handicap yourself against other players running other suit classes that have been properly thought out (assaults not withstanding). They need what I've listed to just push them into the realm of "that looks quite nasty, I want to wreck face with it". Spread the word! Dedicated Commando. CEO of Eridani Light Horse Strikers. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4294	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:29:00 - [7] - Quote drools at the idea of a Gallente Commando getting +25% to armor repairers Base 3HP/s Complex Repper = 7.5 HP/s Skill Lvl 5 (+25%) = 9.4 HP/s Commando Lvl 5 (+25%) = 11.7 HP/s 3 Complex Reps...38.1HP/s A complex Energizer with a +25% bonus would increase shield recharge by 93%... Complex Regulator with +25% bonus would be a 48% reduction to recharge delay... Might have to go with a +3% a level instead of +5%....might get out of hand with the modules but we'll see. It would be really sweet if we could produce a new type of playstyle based more around regen/fast recovery. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1662	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:32:00 - [8] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: I appreciate your enthusiasm Shinobi, and thanks for the support and suggestions Pokey. I'll edit the OP with them as they're totally sound and make perfect sense. I've tried to strike up a dialogue about commandos before and they do get some solid ideas from other forum users, but nothing ever really comes of it after that. Which is a shame, because they're a tremendously fun suit to play but I wouldn't dare take one into a PC battle. It'd be a waste of suit. And that's what we're really missing here: competitive viability. To use one is to handicap yourself against other players running other suit classes that have been properly thought out (assaults not withstanding). They need what I've listed to just push them into the realm of "that looks quite nasty, I want to wreck face with it". Spread the word! I'm a heavy and only have two suits , gal sent and commando . I was thinking about making a post to guide others to this one . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1662	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:33:00 - [9] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: drools at the idea of a Gallente Commando getting +25% to armor repairers Base 3HP/s Complex Repper = 7.5 HP/s Skill Lvl 5 (+25%) = 9.4 HP/s Commando Lvl 5 (+25%) = 11.7 HP/s 3 Complex Reps...38.1HP/s A complex Energizer with a +25% bonus would increase shield recharge by 93%... Complex Regulator with +25% bonus would be a 48% reduction to recharge delay... Might have to go with a +3% a level instead of +5%....might get out of hand with the modules but we'll see. It would be really sweet if we could produce a new type of playstyle based more around regen/fast recovery. Mmmmmmmmmmmmmm ..... brains . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Striker 633	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:37:00 - [10] - Quote Gallente get bonuses on reps and adaptive hp/rep speed. Amarr get bonuses on standard plate hp and movement penalty reduction. Caldari get bonuses on shield extenders and rechargers. Minmatar get bonuses on regulators and ferroscale. Ah man that would be sweet. Dedicated Commando. CEO of Eridani Light Horse Strikers. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4298	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:43:00 - [11] - Quote At a 25% bonus to Rechargers and Energizers, 4 Complex Energizers would push the Callmando up to 136.6 HP/s. Granted that's a totally ****** fit since it would drop its shield HP by 6% per energizer, but still kinda wild. I'll do a spreadsheet later with theoretical values for each suit. "That little st Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1663	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:45:00 - [12] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Gallente get bonuses on reps and adaptive hp/rep speed. Amarr get bonuses on standard plate hp and movement penalty reduction. Caldari get bonuses on shield extenders and rechargers. Minmatar get bonuses on regulators and ferroscale. Ah man that would be sweet. If we have more and we will get more to talk and number crunch like Pokey , then will have a nice set up as long as we keep this going for the " Powers That Be " ... when they come from break . A blue tag would be nice and some chiming in from a CPM or two but all in due time . We need to change the outcome where you said it goes no where and I play commando so I wanna get in on this one . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1663	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:49:00 - [13] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: At a 25% bonus to Rechargers and Energizers, 4 Complex Energizers would push the Callmando up to 136.6 HP/s. Granted that's a totally ****** fit since it would drop its shield HP by 6% per energizer, but still kinda wild. I'll do a spreadsheet later with theoretical values for each suit. Gotta love it . As long as the parameters are acceptable then it will be nice , no need for those nay sayer's to come in and try to knock what were doing . No holes , no flaws . I love it when people come together under a common cause that's beneficial . I have a feeling about this one fella's . We could help to make a change . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .**
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Striker 634	Posted - 2015.01.06 23:53:00 - [14] - Quote GROUP HUUUUG. seriously though I need to sleep. Will be interested to see what I find here tomorrow morning. If I get spreadsheets I will be deep,y pleased :) Dedicated Commando. CEO of Eridani Light Horse Strikers. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
P14GU3 Savage Bullet 1121	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:01:00 - [15] - Quote Speed and Stamina - A must. These suits are just too big of targets not to have at least some burst speed. Slot Count - I think this is also a must. At least 1, it would give some flexability to the class. Grenades - I think this is a no go. This was the original sacrifice for the second light weapon. Tankers are already complaining about the minmando being too good at AV, this may just break it. I can imagine what a flux would do for my MD fit too. Ewar - With the addition of slot count, mandos could theoretically have decent ewar (I haven't done the math.) I think this is something we need to look into move before making a decision. Defense - Again we have to be careful about over-buffing the mando. Start with a slot count buff and see what kind of defense we start seeing. Overall, 'mandos aren't in that bad of a place. They just need a little love and they will be the DPS support they were meant to be. Logi AK.0 - Logi GK.0 - Scout GK.0 - Mando MK.0 - Masshole in every sense of the word.
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1663	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:07:00 - [16] - Quote True , true ... like I said their just missing a few something's to help there impact felt , like you and I can agree I think that we don't want them becoming OP . Fine line balance to make them viable . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4299	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:08:00 - [17] - Quote P14GU3 wrote: Defense - Again we have to be careful about over-buffing the mando. Start with a slot count buff and see what kind of defense we start seeing. be. I agree. I wouldn't give them more slots and the bonuses at the same time. Start with the slots and see where things land. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 6898	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:11:00 - [18] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: Speed & Stamina: Yeah a bit could help. I'm pretty much obligated to fit a biotic to most of my fits to make up for poor base stats, and given the lack of slots...I'd rather not have to do that. Slots: In general I'd like to see suit types within the same frame have the same slot layout. So giving the Commando an extra slot to match the layout of their Sentinel counterpart seems intuitive. Grenade: Given all of their downsides, I think a grenade makes sense. I wouldn't mind having AV grenades on hand to finish off HAVs after cooking their shields with the PLC. Scans: I've always seen the Commando as the big brother of the Assault as they share the same role. Similar EWAR seems like common sense. Defensive Bonuses: Why not make a defensive bonus that's centric around HP regen specific to each class? Caldari: +% to Shield Recharchers Minmatar: +% to Shield Regulators Gallente: +% to Armor Repairers Amarr: Maybe +% Reduction to Armor Plate Speed Penalty? N I like the idea of having one or two of those buffs but if all of them are added then they just become better versions of Assaults. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4301	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:12:00 - [19] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: Speed & Stamina: Yeah a bit could help. I'm pretty much obligated to fit a biotic to most of my fits to make up for poor base stats, and given the lack of slots...I'd rather not have to do that. Slots: In general I'd like to see suit types within the same frame have the same slot layout. So giving the Commando an extra slot to match the layout of their Sentinel counterpart seems intuitive. Grenade: Given all of their downsides, I think a grenade makes sense. I wouldn't mind having AV grenades on hand to finish off HAVs after cooking their shields with the PLC. Scans: I've always seen the Commando as the big brother of the Assault as they share the same role. Similar EWAR seems like common sense. Defensive Bonuses: Why not make a defensive bonus that's centric around HP regen specific to each class? Caldari: +% to Shield Recharchers Minmatar: +% to Shield Regulators Gallente: +% to Armor Repairers Amarr: Maybe +% Reduction to Armor Plate Speed Penalty? N I like the idea of having one or two of those buffs but if all of them are added then they just become better versions of Assaults. Well each race would get one...plus the existing racial damage bonus. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 6898	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:13:00 - [20] - Quote I think that if only EWAR were improved to be better than Assault but worse than Logistics that Commandos would be good. One thing people note is that movement and stamina isn't good, but almost no one complains about that with Sentinels. The reason is that Commandos are blind to everyone except other Commandos and can be see by everyone else. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.

Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1665	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:18:00 - [21] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I think that if only EWAR were improved to be better than Assault but worse than Logistics that Commandos would be good. Agreed , you really wouldn't expect a commando to e-war it up with mods and the fact that it's sig is so big it kinda wouldn't help but yes ... yes indeed . I like the fact that when I played Logistic I could do that and it was expected and welcomed by those who took advantage of the fact and guarded their logi's . Just cause your not in the same squad , your on the same team and a lot of people just don't get that . I loved being able to see and use my e-war mods and scanners to enhance the effect but at the same time it made me even more thin and to have people around who pay their logi's no mind didn't help . But doing that you have to pick your moments where you use a suit like that . Yeah , like you said though . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui Onikanabo Brigade Caldari State 1665	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:25:00 - [22] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: One thing people note is that movement and stamina isn't good, but almost no one complains about that with Sentinels. The reason is that Commandos are blind to everyone except other Commandos and can be see by everyone else. I play sent and cant understand why if I'm base armor , why can't I jump onto an incline .?. I mean I understand and everything but I kinda don't ... meaning , yeah if I'm at 1000 armor then I can understand but to be at base or Cal where it's 4 hundred and some od , why can't I jump onto an incline .. like making them able to jump is OP ? This is simple and should be a factor , this is suppose to be the future and bio-chem-mech mastered so ... but they need better overall stamina . Doubts are like flies and should be treated as such and crushed .
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 6900	Posted - 2015.01.07 00:29:00 - [23] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: One thing people note is that movement and stamina isn't good, but almost no one complains about that with Sentinels. The reason is that Commandos are blind to everyone except other Commandos and can be see by everyone else. I play sent and cant understand why if I'm base armor , why can't I jump onto an incline .?. I mean I understand and everything but I kinda don't ... meaning , yeah if I'm at 1000 armor then I can understand but to be at base or Cal where it's 4 hundred and some od , why can't I jump onto an incline .. like making them able to jump is OP ? This is simple and should be a factor , this is suppose to be the future and bio-chem-mech mastered so ... but they need better overall stamina . I think that CCP may have reduced the jumping ability of many suits because as a Minmatar Assault I'm no longer able to jump over ledges that I used to be able to. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1845	Posted - 2015.01.07 01:17:00 - [24] - Quote Commandos aren't terribly poorly off right now, their biggest issues are that they could use another slot (+1 low for cal, +1 high for min, +1 high for amarr & gallente) and some base stat tweaking (ewar, stamina, shield delays etc). With all that said though, I firmly feel that the minmatar need to lose the bonus they're currently getting to swarm launchers - it's really throwing off some stuff in regards to AV (+25% buff to swarms is a bit absurd for only having two damage mods, while also carrying a rifle that also get the same +25% damage buff). Hell, I'd even be okay with commando's getting a special grenade & grenade slot. As it stands right now though, commando's are only a few small tweaks and buffs away from being one of the most powerful suits in the game due to their ability to approach almost any situation with confidence and competence. Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
DDx77 The Exemplars RISE of LEGION 70	Posted - 2015.01.07 01:23:00 - [25] - Quote Great ideas. I don't think your increase regen idea should be a bonus, simply buff what's there ie: Increase Caldari: -Shield Recharge Minmatar: Shield Regulator Gallente: Armor Repairer Amarr: stamina? Also increase speed a bit I think they should also get a grenade slot despite av concerns As far as ewar, I wish there was a way to have a logi version that maybe increases everyone's precision/range that are in close proximity. This logi commando would not get this ewar benefit, only those around them. It could be slower and have two equip slots.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4305	Posted - 2015.01.07 01:30:00 - [26] - Quote DDx77 wrote: Great ideas. I don't think your increase regen idea should be a bonus, simply buff what's there ie: Increase Caldari: -Shield Recharge Minmatar: Shield Regulator Gallente: Armor Repairer Amarr: stamina? Also increase speed a bit I think they should also get a grenade slot despite av concerns As far as ewar, I wish there was a way to have a logi version that maybe increases everyone's precision/range that are in close proximity. This logi commando would not get this ewar benefit, only those around them. It could be slower and have two equip slots. Im a little confused about what you mean simply buff what's there. Just increase the base recharge rate and not give them a defensive bonus at all? What is your reasoning behind that? "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
benandjerrys NECROM0NGERS 91	Posted - 2015.01.07 06:09:00 - [27] - Quote Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui wrote: Shamelessly trying to begin to give this mouth to mouth so that some might see when they come back from break and give this the well deserved blue tag . At least you're honest.
Boot Booter Titans of Phoenix 1135	Posted - 2015.01.07 06:24:00 - [28] - Quote My feeling on commandos is this. Either 1 they are too slow 2 they don't have enough hp Or 3 they regen too slow. I use the min commando so this is what I'm basing this off of. I just can't fit the stupid thing. Yeah its great for AV but if actually try to use it in combat you'll be fairly disappointed. If you fit it for speed you'll find yourself getting insta ganked due to its large hit box. If you fit it for regen, well same story really; insta ganked. Now if you fit it for hp I've found I usually have enough to slip in a corner with some hp left, however then the regen is so astonishingly slow it'll take you a minute to return to the fight if you don't get killed in the process. Some blatantly obvious issues right of the bat is the cpu/PG limitations. When I fit my proto assault I can usually fit all proto mods and weapons If I'm following lore based fitting strategy. For my min commando however I really struggle fitting the mods I want and usually have to downgrade to adv or even basic weapons. That just won't do in a competitive environment. Anyway I'll put an end to my rambling. Initial buffs that I'd love to see... Increase slot count by one. Increase capacity (cpu/pg) I'd like to start some theory crafting for how much capacity these suits need for a competitive fit, including the added racial slot per tier. I'll take the min commando for now. It'd be great if others could chip in with the process for all the commandos. Let's put this suit on the map.
Mad Syringe ReDust Inc. 432	Posted - 2015.01.07 13:10:00 - [29] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: My feeling on commandos is this. Either 1 they are too slow 2 they don't have enough hp Or 3 they regen too slow. I use the min commando so this is what I'm basing this off of. I just can't fit the stupid thing. Yeah its great for AV but if actually try to use it in combat you'll be fairly disappointed. If you fit it for speed you'll find yourself getting insta ganked due to its large hit box. If you fit it for regen, well same story really; insta ganked. Now if you fit it for hp I've found I usually have enough to slip in a corner with some hp left, however then the regen is so astonishingly slow it'll take you a minute to return to the fight if you don't get killed in the process. Some blatantly obvious issues right of the bat is the cpu/PG limitations. When I fit my proto assault I can usually fit all proto mods and weapons If I'm following lore based fitting strategy. For my min commando however I really struggle fitting the mods I want and usually have to downgrade to adv or even basic weapons. That just won't do in a competitive environment. Anyway I'll put an end to my rambling. Initial buffs that I'd love to see... Increase slot count by one. Increase capacity (cpu/pg) I'd like to start some theory crafting for how much capacity these suits need for a competitive fit, including the added racial slot per tier. I'll take the min commando for now. It'd be great if others could chip in with the process for all the commandos. Let's put this suit on the map. I'd agree with this. The commando needs one more module and a buff in cpu/pg. I would also like to see a 50% ammo pool increase at proto (10% per level), which would make it much more versatile, since it wouldn't be mandatory to carry hives on the suit. Edit: I fit my minmando with passive scans and damage in the highs, and regen in the lows. This seems to work ok'ish.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4311	Posted - 2015.01.07 21:29:00 - [30] - Quote Ok I got the framework for the spreadsheet hammered out as well as did calcs for some of the bonuses we discussed at 2%, 3%, 4%, and 5% per level as well as how that would affect the associated stat under the assumption that all skills are at 5 and Complex modules are in use. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zUNJKnOL6LXui98cpWd3jpWCy8QaWSl--QOuN-uVx_s/edit?usp=sharing Discuss! And feel free to tell me if I fcked up the math. "That little st Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net

Leovarian L Lavitz NECROM0NGERS 1300	Posted - 2015.01.07 21:38:00 - [31] - Quote Buff Commandos O.O They are already borderline op (well, the proto) I run amarr commandos, and decimate the enemies. My people have been respeccing to it just because of how much it wrecks the opposition. Omni-Soldier Few are my equal in these specialties, none compare in all of them
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4311	Posted - 2015.01.07 21:55:00 - [32] - Quote Another direction you could go with any sort of additional bonus is giving them an offensive weapon bonus that specifically targets the racial weapons that the Assault doesnt affect, or affects in different way. Amarr: Decreased Charge Time for Laser Weapons. Caldari : Decrease Charge Time/Decreased Recoil for Rail Weapons (Whichever one the Assault doesn't end up with). Gallente: Increase Splash Radius/Projectile Speed for Blaster Weapons (Not sure sure on this one tbh since it would only affect the PLC). Minmatar: Increase Splash Radius for Explosive Weapons. As much of a fan of regen fits as I am, I'm thinking if the Commandos get a secondary bonus, that a more offensively oriented one would be the best choice. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
MINA Longstrike Kirjuun Heiian 1851	Posted - 2015.01.07 22:05:00 - [33] - Quote Problem with your amarr commando suggestion of additional low pokey: Any assault with 3 high slots beats out a commando with only 1 for damage. I really think that moving all commandos to a 3/2 or 2/3 is probably for the better (even though it flies in the face of some of the 'traditional' slot layouts). It gives the caldari commando the opportunity to actually use shield regulators (along side say a reactive plate), it allows gallente and amarr commando's to beat out their comparative racial assaults for damage (at least in the 'short term'). The minmatar commando really needs some buffing to its shield recharge value (18hp/sec, really?). Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Kirjuun Heiian. I have a few alts.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4311	Posted - 2015.01.07 22:11:00 - [34] - Quote MINA Longstrike wrote: Problem with your amarr commando suggestion of additional low pokey: Any assault with 3 high slots beats out a commando with only 1 for damage. I really think that moving all commandos to a 3/2 or 2/3 is probably for the better (even though it flies in the face of some of the 'traditional' slot layouts). It gives the caldari commando the opportunity to actually use shield regulators (along side say a reactive plate), it allows gallente and amarr commando's to beat out their comparative racial assaults for damage (at least in the 'short term'). The minmatar commando really needs some buffing to its shield recharge value (18hp/sec, really?). I'll admit I simply copied the Sentinel slot layout but did not cross check fits between them and the Assault so you raise a good point. I'd be curious to check to see what sort of relative resource cost is required for an assault to achieve what you describe. If the assault has to drop its defense below that of the Commando in order to gain more damage than the Commando, I don't see too much of a problem with that. I honestly see the two as fulfilling nearly the same role as attacking damage dealers so I'm fine with them being similar as long as one isn't clearly better than the other. And yes, considering the Minmatar in EVE typically have badass shield recharge, I have no idea why it sucks so bad in Dust. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 704	Posted - 2015.01.07 22:27:00 - [35] - Quote Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4312	Posted - 2015.01.07 22:30:00 - [36] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Megaman Trigger OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 188	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:19:00 - [37] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: At a 25% bonus to Rechargers and Energizers, 4 Complex Energizers would push the Callmando up to 136.6 HP/s. Granted that's a totally ******** fit since it would drop its shield HP by 6% per energizer, but still kinda wild. I'll do a spreadsheet later with theoretical values for each suit. I actually have a Cal Sentinel with a similar fit, but about 20HP/s less, and it can be fun as hell popping in and out of cover every few seconds to mow people down. If Commandos could do this we'd definitely see more out there more varied fits than AV. Purifier. First Class.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 704	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:22:00 - [38] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4313	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:34:00 - [39] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. The last thing we need is another class starting to push in on the Logi's territory with equipment. I'm not happy with the Scout's getting 2 as it is. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Megaman Trigger OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 189	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:42:00 - [40] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. Commandos don't need to become high HP Rep + Needle carries following a Sentinel. Purifier. First Class.

Alex-ZX Valor Coalition Red Whines. 129	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:44:00 - [41] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: Things commando needs: Minor Speed and stamina increase. Additional slot per tier, to bring them in line with sentinel slot layout. Grenades, since it's often used as an AV platform and grenades are crucial to this. Minor buff to suit precision. It's ok for them to be seen, but they go toe to toe with assaults more often than not so why be blind to them? Additional durability, regen not hp. Don't want to step on sentinel toes. In terms of bonuses, commandos used to have one that buffed any defensive module fitted. It allowed them to have decent durability without increasing the slot count. Well, in theory, anyway. It was only 10% maxed out. 25% maxed might be more substantial. I'm aware that in the list above I've mentioned a slot increase, but I reckon just the one extra per tier shouldn't make them the unstoppable "heavy assaults" that were the initial concern when CCP first introduced them. Caldari: +% to Shield Recharchers Minmatar: +% to Shield Regulators Gallente: +% to Armor Repairers Amarr: Maybe +% Reduction to Armor Plate Speed Penalty Thoughts? And could really do with CPM and CCP feedback on what direction, if any, they want to take this suit. I'm aware that they might have bigger concerns to resolve right now, but a general idea of what and when would be really appreciated. Thanks. Minmatar comando needs a tweak in its delays and a little buff in shield recharge, cus it is supposed to be shield tanked, but its shield sux in every way, just my opinion. Alex's modified ZX-030 HMG Luis' modified VC-107 CR Alex's modified VC-107 SMG *Owner of this beasts*
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 706	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:51:00 - [42] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. The last thing we need is another class starting to push in on the Logi's territory with equipment. I'm not happy with the Scout's getting 2 as it is. So pull that 2nd off the scouts, problem solved. Stupid they got it in the first place. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4313	Posted - 2015.01.07 23:53:00 - [43] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: So pull that 2nd off the scouts, problem solved. Stupid they got it in the first place. Well ok, but this thread isn't about Scouts ^_^ "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 706	Posted - 2015.01.08 00:07:00 - [44] - Quote Megaman Trigger wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. Commandos don't need to become high HP Rep + Needle carries following a Sentinel. meh, anyone playing like that will deserve the prolapse they'll be left with when the match ends. No rep bonus+ denial of combat bonus b/c too busy repping = DumbDeadMando. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 706	Posted - 2015.01.08 00:09:00 - [45] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: So pull that 2nd off the scouts, problem solved. Stupid they got it in the first place. Well ok, but this thread isn't about Scouts ^_^ Agreed, though I didn't bring them up. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Megaman Trigger OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 189	Posted - 2015.01.08 00:28:00 - [46] - Quote el OPERATOR wrote: Megaman Trigger wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Unless you're giving it a second equipment slot (and the cpu/pg/bw to use it) my MinMando would appreciate being left alone, thanks. It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. Commandos don't need to become high HP Rep + Needle carries following a Sentinel. meh, anyone playing like that will deserve the prolapse they'll be left with when the match ends. No rep bonus+ denial of combat bonus b/c too busy repping = DumbDeadMando. Or something that would make the current rep-train on a Sentinel issue worse, since a Commando has better thank (in theory) than a Logi while able to offer better fire support. Purifier. First Class.
el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 706	Posted - 2015.01.08 00:45:00 - [47] - Quote Megaman Trigger wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Megaman Trigger wrote: el OPERATOR wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: It's ok, you don't have to put anything in your extra high slot if you don't want to ^_^ I'd rather put it in a 2nd equipment slot or not risk "rebalancing" at all. Commandos don't need to become high HP Rep + Needle carries following a Sentinel. meh, anyone playing like that will deserve the prolapse they'll be left with when the match ends. No rep bonus+ denial of combat bonus b/c too busy repping = DumbDeadMando. Or something that would make the current rep-train on a Sentinel issue worse, since a Commando has better thank (in theory) than a Logi while able to offer better fire support. If that were the case though, it'd be the case now since Commandos have a slot to pack a repper in already. And, while I'm obviously not in every game all of the time, I see RepMandos very rarely. They tank, yes, but have nowhere near the mobility, profile or hitbox to be more than a casual exercise at running beams and an EZ target all the while. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
IREK Ladybox Holdfast Syndicate Amarr Empire 0	Posted - 2015.01.08 05:49:00 - [48] - Quote Everything in the op is mostly along the lines of what the suit needs. Except for the bonus. It needs to stay right were it is. Giving those kinds of bonuses would immediately get it labelled OP, and rightfully so. Then it being nerfed into complete uselessness.
Kierkegaard Soren Eridani Light Horse Striker 643	Posted - 2015.01.08 08:01:00 - [49] - Quote The bonuses suggested were what the suit originally had; an efficiency bonus to all defensive modules equiped, and it was largely worthless becAUSE it only maxed out at 10% and, back then, an ADV commando had a whopping two slots to play with. The theory behind it, however, was sound; low slot count compared to other suits in order to limit it's fitting flexibility but high module efficiency to make certain tank and regen modules quite potent. It's a way of keeping the commando alive in combat without turning it into a fat assault. Thanks for all the feedback so far. Pokey, 4% seems to be the sweet spot for module bonuses to me. Thanks for working all of that out man. Dedicated Commando. CEO of Eridani Light Horse Strikers. "He who can destroy a thing, controls a thing."
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4318	Posted - 2015.01.08 15:31:00 - [50] - Quote Personally I'd suggest a slight increase to speed and stamina, the addition of the extra slot (MINA raises a good point about modified slot layouts), and the addition of a grenade slot. Hold off on modifying any sort of bonuses before we see where the cards land. Again as fun as regen bonuses would be, they could get overpowered quickly. I think that if any sort of bonus is added it might be best to look more at alternate weapon support skills, but again hold off on that until initial changes are made. Oh and I'd tweak the minmatar shield regen rate up a bit, it's pretty dismal given that they're typically supposed to be shield tanked "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net

el OPERATOR Capital Acquisitions LLC Bad Intention 711	Posted - 2015.01.08 18:18:00 - [51] - Quote Kierkegaard Soren wrote: The bonuses suggested were what the suit originally had; an efficiency bonus to all defensive modules equiped, and it was largely worthless becAUSE it only maxed out at 10% and, back then, an ADV commando had a whopping two slots to play with. The theory behind it, however, was sound; low slot count compared to other suits in order to limit it's fitting flexibility but high module efficiency to make certain tank and regen modules quite potent. It's a way of keeping the commando alive in combat without turning it into a fat assault. Thanks for all the feedback so far. Pokey, 4% seems to be the sweet spot for module bonuses to me. Thanks for working all of that out man. Disproven theories tho, ie RegenBonusMando=BestMando, are exactly that: Disproven Theories. They looked good on paper, but in practice weren't really viable so not really worthwhile. The current setups, while not neccessarily the best for all circumstances, have definitley led to more Mandos being used more regularly, more often, more successfully. At least thats been my observation. Open-Beta Vet. Drunk Night Tree Burner. This is my Main and Original. DUST514 is WARFARE, not WAR-FAIR.
Vitantur Nothus Nos Nothi 1570	Posted - 2015.01.08 23:30:00 - [52] - Quote @ Minmando Shield Regulator Bonus Quicker recharge delay would be swell if my recovery rate was higher (18 hp/sec). I'd have to ran regs + energizer or recharger to get any mileage out of that perk; methinks this suit doesn't have enough slots for shield tanking. Maybe it would with +1 high slot, but definitely not with the current 2/2.
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 4414	Posted - 2015.01.18 20:33:00 - [53] - Quote Vitantur Nothus wrote: @ Minmando Shield Regulator Bonus Quicker recharge delay would be swell if my recovery rate was better than 18 hp/sec. Would have to run regulator + energizer or recharger to get any mileage out of this perk ... that's 50% of the suit's slots. Totally agree, Minmatar shield regen is too damn low, especially since the Commando lacks slots to properly boost it up. Honestly I've been kicking around the general concept that Caldari have the short delay but slower regen so they're a slower but more constant recharge, whereas the Minmatar have a longer delay but a faster recharge rate. "That little s**t Pokey..." --CCP Rattati, Biomassed Episode 032 Dust514 // Podcast www.biomassed.net
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 533	Posted - 2015.01.19 02:32:00 - [54] - Quote I was told that commandos have the worst locating Ewar in the game. Blinder than heavies. Is this true? If so it would seem that that is a major obstacle to their ability to fight.
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 5600	Posted - 2015.01.19 05:26:00 - [55] - Quote Speed, stamina, and scans buff I'm all for. They're designed as an Assault's best friend being behind them covering their backs with constant fire. Without speed, they can't catch up (i thought they were stripped of all their excess armor. Shouldn't they be faster than they currently are?). And scans should at least be at Sentinel level. Or, have THE worst profile, but assault precision and Sentinel range. This might make things interesting. I don't really feel as if they need more slots, neither do I think a change of bonuses would be a game changer. What if you just increase the suits' innate racial tank and call it a day? More armor for Amarr, more reps for Gallente, etc.
Lahut K'mar Royal Uhlans Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2015.01.19 12:30:00 - [56] - Quote Commando suits have all the strength of a sentinel, but aren't weighed down by copious armour, right? So what if we made commandos capable of throwing stuff (like 'nades) further and gave them more stamina? They would still be whiter than assaults; heavy frame has higher torque but lower speed like a tractor, so speed and jump height will still be lower. However the commando can run for ages since neither clone nor exoskeleton even notices the exertion. This is three buffs (stamina buff, +1 grenade slot and throwing boost) though, so maybe it's a bit much. To balance, drop commando's CPU and PG and leave the mod slots as is. Or better yet allow the equipment slot to have grenades too. A non-heavy suit can equip a second grenade of the same type for up to 4 grenades. Or 10 IMO, commando is just a different flavour of assault. Salt uses mods to get a terrain advantage while habanero is ready for whatever the reds throw at him. Keep them as rival means to the same end and I'll be happy. Horrifying? That's a strange way to spell "romantic". FIX THE WHEEL, CCP!


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