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calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2297	Posted - 2014.12.15 04:12:00 - [1] - Quote I have enough ISK to last a very long time but there is a glaring problem with ISK payout. Even if you run cheap gear (25K) you will barely break even or go in the hole in some matches. There is very little left and this is the problem for new players. They want to see a return for their work. Why go out and bust your ass only to get 20K ISK in the good. Its the feeling I worked hard and I got rewarded accordingly. Vote yes or no for ISK increase. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 5067	Posted - 2014.12.15 04:25:00 - [2] - Quote Very much yes.
Heimdallr69 Nyain San General Tso's Alliance 3924	Posted - 2014.12.15 04:28:00 - [3] - Quote I don't need ISK but I don't mind getting more =ƒÿç Removed inappropriate content - CCP Logibro
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 6412	Posted - 2014.12.15 05:30:00 - [4] - Quote I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10480	Posted - 2014.12.15 05:37:00 - [5] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. And that's the problem. They haven't realized yet that they need to balance their income with their expenses. As a skilled vet for over 2 years, I have learned that if you can master lower-tier gear then you will do fine with it and often times don't feel compelled to use higher-tier gear because you're doing well while on the cheap. Especially when running ambushes which offer the highest ISK/hour rate. Ambush = For when you want to get more ISK. Skirmish = For when you want to get more SP. Domination = Fight Club PS: Daily Missions also help with getting more ISK. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
deezy dabest IMPERIAL SPECIAL FORCES GROUP 1333	Posted - 2014.12.15 05:50:00 - [6] - Quote calvin b wrote: I have enough ISK to last a very long time but there is a glaring problem with ISK payout. Even if you run cheap gear (25K) you will barely break even or go in the hole in some matches. There is very little left and this is the problem for new players. They want to see a return for their work. Why go out and bust your ass only to get 20K ISK in the good. Its the feeling I worked hard and I got rewarded accordingly. Vote yes or no for ISK increase. Yes, I am tired of hearing poor people beg. Once you give a payout raise people will just whine that they still cant afford to run their proto suits that have no cores behind them and come back begging for more. A vicious cycle indeed. HMM maybe I will change my vote NO since poor people gonna poor people. GIT GUD
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 5071	Posted - 2014.12.15 05:52:00 - [7] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. And that's the problem. They haven't realized yet that they need to balance their income with their expenses. As a skilled vet for over 2 years, I have learned that if you can master lower-tier gear then you will do fine with it and often times don't feel compelled to use higher-tier gear because you're doing well while on the cheap. Especially when running ambushes which offer the highest ISK/hour rate. Ambush = For when you want to get more ISK. Skirmish = For when you want to get more SP. Domination = Fight Club PS: Daily Missions also help with getting more ISK. The first rule about Domination, is we don't talk about Domination.
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2298	Posted - 2014.12.15 06:19:00 - [8] - Quote DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. Its not about losing the equipment. Its about the reward vs. the risk. Example: I hire you to carry light bulbs across a mine field while people randomly shoot at you. If you survive and none of the bulbs are broken you get 250K dollars. Now for every bulb broken you lose just 20K dollars. Do you think its worth it to cross and deliver any cargo across a mine field while being shot at, no. In dust your the clone that must go out and die if needed over and over while trying to win. Work hard for little pay is the reason for this thread. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
Bradric Banewolf D3ATH CARD RUST415 509	Posted - 2014.12.15 06:34:00 - [9] - Quote Hell they seem to have gotten worse not better as of late. "Anybody order chaos?"
Sequal Rise Les Desanusseurs 441	Posted - 2014.12.15 06:46:00 - [10] - Quote Bradric Banewolf wrote: Hell they seem to have gotten worse not better as of late. Yes... and yes to the OP^^ Assault, Logi, Scout, Heavy.. What do you need?

V1RONXSS X-SENSE Security 27	Posted - 2014.12.15 08:10:00 - [11] - Quote No. Currently isk payouts seems to be fair. Well i still run 60% drogonfly or raven suits and do not care about Proto, i heard there good payouts in PC matches, join and make some money if u so in need of them. Also for ppl like u CCP relised Apex. All in your hands. The "Chiki Briki v Damki" Starter Pack.
abdullah muzaffar G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 94	Posted - 2014.12.15 08:12:00 - [12] - Quote Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos.
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 6414	Posted - 2014.12.15 10:35:00 - [13] - Quote calvin b wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. Its not about losing the equipment. Its about the reward vs. the risk. Example: I hire you to carry light bulbs across a mine field while people randomly shoot at you. If you survive and none of the bulbs are broken you get 250K dollars. Now for every bulb broken you lose just 20K dollars. Do you think its worth it to cross and deliver any cargo across a mine field while being shot at, no. In dust your the clone that must go out and die if needed over and over while trying to win. Work hard for little pay is the reason for this thread. Real life Gëá Game This is because of game balance. If CCP decided to add three zeros to payouts and three zeros to prices, would you feel better? Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
boba's fetta Dead Man's Game RUST415 896	Posted - 2014.12.15 10:59:00 - [14] - Quote abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------
Robocop Junior research lab 959	Posted - 2014.12.15 11:07:00 - [15] - Quote Yes please, just dropped 50 in skirm, minus the 60k for 5 deaths a whopping 360k profit. I can afk in ambush with uplinks and make half that for doing nothing, such bs. If strength were all, tiger would not fear scorpion.
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 15	Posted - 2014.12.15 11:18:00 - [16] - Quote I vote yes to increased payouts
DeadlyAztec11 Ostrakon Agency 6416	Posted - 2014.12.15 11:30:00 - [17] - Quote Jack the Rlpper wrote: I vote yes to increased payouts This is not a direct democracy. You do not get to vote. Put your flags up in the sky. And wave them side to side. Show the world where you're from. Show the world we are one.
G Felix Titans of Phoenix 376	Posted - 2014.12.15 11:32:00 - [18] - Quote Joel II X wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. And that's the problem. They haven't realized yet that they need to balance their income with their expenses. As a skilled vet for over 2 years, I have learned that if you can master lower-tier gear then you will do fine with it and often times don't feel compelled to use higher-tier gear because you're doing well while on the cheap. Especially when running ambushes which offer the highest ISK/hour rate. Ambush = For when you want to get more ISK. Skirmish = For when you want to get more SP. Domination = Fight Club PS: Daily Missions also help with getting more ISK. The first rule about Domination, is we don't talk about Domination. I am so angry you beat me to this. Touche sir, touche. Dust can be frustrating. (Gò»°Gûí°)Gò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+)
Starlight Burner ROGUE RELICS VP Gaming Alliance 51	Posted - 2014.12.15 11:46:00 - [19] - Quote Yes to increase payouts. Yes, I have Amar Assault APEX BPO. but I too bust my ass off and get paid ** for doing so. Either payouts need an increase or CCP needs to look at how people get paid for their efforts. This shared pool payouts is stupid as **. Thank god for CCP Rattati!! Rogue Relics is my home away from home.
Sinboto Simmons Murphys-Law General Tso's Alliance 6754	Posted - 2014.12.15 12:43:00 - [20] - Quote signing yes. Sinboto - The True Blood Minja Forum Warrior level 5 Prof 1 Born of the Brutor tribe

Mortishai Belmont G.L.O.R.Y General Tso's Alliance 283	Posted - 2014.12.15 12:59:00 - [21] - Quote Run front line suits in a few ambush matches. Or learn the magic of militia and basic fittings. G.L.O.R.Y Soldier, I'm that Amarr heavy you warn your team about <3 -Heavy/Logi/Assault/Scout-
Sequal Rise Les Desanusseurs 443	Posted - 2014.12.15 13:18:00 - [22] - Quote boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. Assault, Logi, Scout, Heavy.. What do you need?
Meeko Fent True Illuminate 2296	Posted - 2014.12.15 14:28:00 - [23] - Quote calvin b wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. Its not about losing the equipment. Its about the reward vs. the risk. Example: I hire you to carry light bulbs across a mine field while people randomly shoot at you. If you survive and none of the bulbs are broken you get 250K dollars. Now for every bulb broken you lose just 20K dollars. Do you think its worth it to cross and deliver any cargo across a mine field while being shot at, no. In dust your the clone that must go out and die if needed over and over while trying to win. Work hard for little pay is the reason for this thread. Let's say you have a magic that let's you summon any destroyed light bulb from the grave. Cause that's how starter fits work. Meeko's Guide to playing Pubs ISK efficent 1)Run Standard 2)Don't die 3)Do something for free money 4)Do those missions too 5)Skill into the special suits. Their cheaper Follow these rules and you should be easily able to go ISK positive easily. Git good scrub. I am the bluedot. And I will rise again.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10484	Posted - 2014.12.16 04:51:00 - [24] - Quote calvin b wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. Its not about losing the equipment. Its about the reward vs. the risk. Example: I hire you to carry light bulbs across a mine field while people randomly shoot at you. If you survive and none of the bulbs are broken you get 250K dollars. Now for every bulb broken you lose just 20K dollars. Do you think its worth it to cross and deliver any cargo across a mine field while being shot at, no. In dust your the clone that must go out and die if needed over and over while trying to win. Work hard for little pay is the reason for this thread. I'm sorry, but that's a bad analogy. There is a way in which you can magically get rid of the $20,000 penalty by simply running Starter Fits which are 100% free and come with every character just like how Eve Online players are all born with a free Rookie Ship and 1 unit of Tritanium. There is a way to go completely ISK positive in Dust even in matches like Faction Warfare. The trick is getting the experience and unfortunately that experience is the result of dying a lot. When you're in a weak suit, you start to learn how to pick your battles. You start to appreciate the importance of staying close to the herd even if that herd is nothing but a bunch of randoms because of the fact that there is always safety in numbers. Eventually you'll get to the point where you have become proficient with weak gear which invariably leads you to being able to have a better survival rate when you are using better and more expensive gear. I have a certain doctrine I follow as a solo player which is as follows. 1. Always have a minimum balance as a reserve for those rainy days. 2. Always tell yourself how many times you can throw away an expensive fit before you have to switch to a cheaper one at the beginning of a match. 3. Always have a free fit standing by just in case you run out of options. 4. If the situation doesn't require using an expensive fitting, don't use it. 5. Set aside at least one day of the week to dedicate yourself to grinding Ambush matches in free or cheap gear so you can build up your minimum balance quickly. As long as I stick to this doctrine, I'm good financially. Off Topic: I have seen one Eve player beg in local for 5,000 ISK when all he had to do to get that ISK is warp to a nearby asteroid belt, kill an NPC rat, and then wait 15 minutes to collect the 5,000 ISK bounty. You often wonder what players do with their ISK if they have to beg. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5472	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:18:00 - [25] - Quote Mortishai Belmont wrote: Run front line suits in a few ambush matches. Or learn the magic of militia and basic fittings. Heck yeah! Gotta feed the best players' KDR Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5472	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:27:00 - [26] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: calvin b wrote: DeadlyAztec11 wrote: I tend to get from 275k to 375k. If I'm not running anything more than advanced then I will go positive. If I am running standard, then I will definitely go positive. I don't see an issue. The only problem is that people are continuing to field equipment that they cannot risk losing. Its not about losing the equipment. Its about the reward vs. the risk. Example: I hire you to carry light bulbs across a mine field while people randomly shoot at you. If you survive and none of the bulbs are broken you get 250K dollars. Now for every bulb broken you lose just 20K dollars. Do you think its worth it to cross and deliver any cargo across a mine field while being shot at, no. In dust your the clone that must go out and die if needed over and over while trying to win. Work hard for little pay is the reason for this thread. I'm sorry, but that's a bad analogy. There is a way in which you can magically get rid of the $20,000 penalty by simply running Starter Fits which are 100% free and come with every character just like how Eve Online players are all born with a free Rookie Ship and 1 unit of Tritanium. There is a way to go completely ISK positive in Dust even in matches like Faction Warfare. The trick is getting the experience and unfortunately that experience is the result of dying a lot. When you're in a weak suit, you start to learn how to pick your battles. You start to appreciate the importance of staying close to the herd even if that herd is nothing but a bunch of randoms because of the fact that there is always safety in numbers. Eventually you'll get to the point where you have become proficient with weak gear which invariably leads you to being able to have a better survival rate when you are using better and more expensive gear. I have a certain doctrine I follow as a solo player which is as follows. 1. Always have a minimum balance as a reserve for those rainy days. 2. Always tell yourself how many times you can throw away an expensive fit before you have to switch to a cheaper one at the beginning of a match. 3. Always have a free fit standing by just in case you run out of options. 4. If the situation doesn't require using an expensive fitting, don't use it. 5. Set aside at least one day of the week to dedicate yourself to grinding Ambush matches in free or cheap gear so you can build up your minimum balance quickly. As long as I stick to this doctrine, I'm good financially. Off Topic: I have seen one Eve player beg in local for 5,000 ISK when all he had to do to get that ISK is warp to a nearby asteroid belt, kill an NPC rat, and then wait 15 minutes to collect the 5,000 ISK bounty. You often wonder what players do with their ISK if they have to beg. But honestly, how much do you play? I have you in my contacts from when we were in PRO together two years ago. I don't think I've seen you get more than a few hundred kills a month. Solo players don't have to worry about ISK. Winning and losing doesn't matter. Squad players are expected to keep pushing for a win. A logi running free suits is hurting his squad. It really all snowballs from there. I wonder how many people go from "hey this game is fun, I'm going to join a corp and run in squads" to "F this, this is expensive" then become solo players and play sporadically if at all? Bumping payouts would be good for the game. The accelerated SP acrual made the game a bit less grindy, increased payouts will make it more fun. I also think it would have an impact on veterans by increasing competition instead of the MLT gear turkey shoots seen so often. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.

CCP Rattati C C P C C P Alliance 13676	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:28:00 - [27] - Quote CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. "As well as stupid, Rattati is incredibly slow and accident-prone, and cannot even swim"

Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 5094	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:31:00 - [28] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Elaborate on that, please.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5474	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:34:00 - [29] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. I like his proposal, but I think support players would have to rely on donations from squad mates. Overall I don't think that's a bad thing though. I had a match earlier where I finished #3 at 22-8. I was solo. The blues weren't pushing so I pulled out a proto suit. I ended up losing two. Combined with losing 6 20K heavy suits I lost 620K ISK and got paid 240K ISK for a net loss of 380K. I think that's ridiculous. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10492	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:36:00 - [30] - Quote @Thor Perhaps you do have a point. In regards to me, I don't focus too much on KDR. I focus on how much I earn compared to how much I spend. Also, since I'm a dedicated nova knifer with very specific targets to chase, you should understand why my kills are not as plentiful as you think. It's been like that long before I even joined PRO. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.

Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5474	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:38:00 - [31] - Quote Joel II X wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Elaborate on that, please. SMB's proposal Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10495	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:39:00 - [32] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Simple trading would also go a long way. Since Jara Kumora, the npc market agent, doesn't give asset holders much ISK in return, perhaps we should be given a means of being able to trade with each other so we can get more ISK in return for the salvage while the buyers get a better bargain via trading as opposed to having to buy directly from the NPC market. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5474	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:42:00 - [33] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: @Thor Perhaps you do have a point. In regards to me, I don't focus too much on KDR. I focus on how much I earn compared to how much I spend. Also, since I'm a dedicated nova knifer with very specific targets to chase, you should understand why my kills are not as plentiful as you think. It's been like that long before I even joined PRO. I wasn't meaning to bash on you as a player, only pointing out that it's probably quite rare for a solo player to play in such a manner and stick with the game. To me it's far more likely for a player to get hooked with the great communication system in Dust and the amazing squad/team play. Unfortunately the incentives aren't there to support this play style for the majority of Dust. If that weren't the case then pubs wouldn't be flooded with solo players. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5474	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:44:00 - [34] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Simple trading would also go a long way. Since Jara Kumora, the npc market agent, doesn't give asset holders much ISK in return, perhaps we should be given a means of being able to trade with each other so we can get more ISK in return for the salvage while the buyers get a better bargain via trading as opposed to having to buy directly from the NPC market. I cleared a lot of inventory when this became a thing, but haven't sold anything since. I think Jara is my single dumbest AUR purchase to date. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 5094	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:44:00 - [35] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: Joel II X wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Elaborate on that, please. SMB's proposal I meant the "will not help hackers much" part. Unless I'm just being incredibly dense to something written on the link.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5474	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:46:00 - [36] - Quote Joel II X wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: Joel II X wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Elaborate on that, please. SMB's proposal I meant the "will not help hackers much" part. Unless I'm just being incredibly dense to something written on the link. Support players wouldn't generate salvage as they aren't destroying things. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 10496	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:50:00 - [37] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Simple trading would also go a long way. Since Jara Kumora, the npc market agent, doesn't give asset holders much ISK in return, perhaps we should be given a means of being able to trade with each other so we can get more ISK in return for the salvage while the buyers get a better bargain via trading as opposed to having to buy directly from the NPC market. I cleared a lot of inventory when this became a thing, but haven't sold anything since. I think Jara is my single dumbest AUR purchase to date. Heh Honestly, I only got Jara simply because I felt So Ronery in my Merc Quarters. On Twitter: @HilmarVeigar #greenlightlegion #dust514 players are waiting.
Riptalis Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 137	Posted - 2014.12.16 06:58:00 - [38] - Quote Yes for reasons! Python pilot Logistics mk.0 Assault mk.0
brett morris518 is well hung 44	Posted - 2014.12.16 07:00:00 - [39] - Quote Sequal Rise wrote: boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. Then don't complain about not having them.. Ur previous post should have read,"who would bother getting those gold, garbage-ass suits."
Sequal Rise Les Desanusseurs 453	Posted - 2014.12.16 07:12:00 - [40] - Quote brett morris518 wrote: Sequal Rise wrote: boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. Then don't complain about not having them.. Ur previous post should have read,"who would bother getting those gold, garbage-ass suits." Where did I complain about not having them? O_o They are gold garbage suit, not worth either 10M ISK+100K LP or 58k AUR XD Assault, Logi, Scout, Heavy.. What do you need?

ADAM-OF-EVE Dead Man's Game RUST415 1744	Posted - 2014.12.16 07:43:00 - [41] - Quote no for isk increase because it benefits the proto users over the new guys. there are only 1 set of players losing out to low isk currently and that is the players who spam more isk than the fight is worth. its not a game issue its a player attitude issue All Hail Legion
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2307	Posted - 2014.12.16 08:26:00 - [42] - Quote ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: no for isk increase because it benefits the proto users over the new guys. there are only 1 set of players losing out to low isk currently and that is the players who spam more isk than the fight is worth. its not a game issue its a player attitude issue Its has nothing to do with proto. Its work vs. ISK payout. Like Thor said earlier and I agree. If you work hard and use the best gear to help your team win your not rewarded accordingly. Your reward should equal to your output. What is the point of playing at all if all your going to do is run starter fits. Whats the purpose of skilling into anything if your going to run the BPO you get from day one. BORING. I never get people who say run starter fits, its the same as saying I like my food bland, my drink bland, boring and safe. Well I like to live a little and if it means burning ISK than so be it. If your not burning your ISK on gear than WTF is the use of having it. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
brett morris518 is well hung 44	Posted - 2014.12.16 08:30:00 - [43] - Quote Sequal Rise wrote: brett morris518 wrote: Sequal Rise wrote: boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. Then don't complain about not having them.. Ur previous post should have read,"who would bother getting those gold, garbage-ass suits." Where did I complain about not having them? O_o They are gold garbage suit, not worth either 10M ISK+100K LP or 58k AUR XD Oh, I thought u were implying u wanted one but could t get one when u said "not all of us can buy BPO suits" anywho.. I totally feel ya.. But I think they are ok suits IF you play a suit like one of them and are skilled into the weapons/equipment it has.. Making it a lot better than a starter fit. I bought one with AUR simply because I wanted it really bad to see how it would do.. It's okay, and I will probably buy another one this week because it is almost exactly like a suit I run. I can't get them from the loyalty store so this is my only option in getting them.. Hmm... I lost my train of thought.. I think the point I was trying to make was I kinda agree.. But don't knock em till u try em
Ydubbs81 RND Ahrendee Mercenaries 3577	Posted - 2014.12.16 08:47:00 - [44] - Quote there just needs to be other way of earning ISK. If your suit costs $22K and you can't turn a profit most games, then you're playing wrong. Sure, you may lose ISK some games but you should profit mostly. Ohh, and SMB's proposal rewards only killers. Support players. having the most slots and the most ISK in their suits, won't get any. Only thing is if you add SMB's proposal on top of a dumbed down version of what we already have. > Check RND out here
ADAM-OF-EVE Dead Man's Game RUST415 1744	Posted - 2014.12.16 12:37:00 - [45] - Quote calvin b wrote: ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: no for isk increase because it benefits the proto users over the new guys. there are only 1 set of players losing out to low isk currently and that is the players who spam more isk than the fight is worth. its not a game issue its a player attitude issue Its has nothing to do with proto. Its work vs. ISK payout. Like Thor said earlier and I agree. If you work hard and use the best gear to help your team win your not rewarded accordingly. Your reward should equal to your output. What is the point of playing at all if all your going to do is run starter fits. Whats the purpose of skilling into anything if your going to run the BPO you get from day one. BORING. I never get people who say run starter fits, its the same as saying I like my food bland, my drink bland, boring and safe. Well I like to live a little and if it means burning ISK than so be it. If your not burning your ISK on gear than WTF is the use of having it. The point is the low payout is the only boundary protecting new or low skilled players from a permanent proto stomp. Pubs are the only accessible areas for all skill levels. to increase payout would not affect the lower skilled guys as much as it would the higher skilled guys who now would be racking in the cash and stomping harder. As for people saying use starter fits. Well that's not an issue. You don't need to use starter,bpo or apex suits to remain effective and still make isk. You just have play smart and not do suicide runs as a lot of proto's like to do. There are also other modes more suited to proto players like PC and faction warfare. Try these if you want better payouts for your effort. Leave the pubs for everyone not just the elitists. All Hail Legion
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5475	Posted - 2014.12.16 13:23:00 - [46] - Quote ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: calvin b wrote: ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: no for isk increase because it benefits the proto users over the new guys. there are only 1 set of players losing out to low isk currently and that is the players who spam more isk than the fight is worth. its not a game issue its a player attitude issue Its has nothing to do with proto. Its work vs. ISK payout. Like Thor said earlier and I agree. If you work hard and use the best gear to help your team win your not rewarded accordingly. Your reward should equal to your output. What is the point of playing at all if all your going to do is run starter fits. Whats the purpose of skilling into anything if your going to run the BPO you get from day one. BORING. I never get people who say run starter fits, its the same as saying I like my food bland, my drink bland, boring and safe. Well I like to live a little and if it means burning ISK than so be it. If your not burning your ISK on gear than WTF is the use of having it. The point is the low payout is the only boundary protecting new or low skilled players from a permanent proto stomp. Pubs are the only accessible areas for all skill levels. to increase payout would not affect the lower skilled guys as much as it would the higher skilled guys who now would be racking in the cash and stomping harder. As for people saying use starter fits. Well that's not an issue. You don't need to use starter,bpo or apex suits to remain effective and still make isk. You just have play smart and not do suicide runs as a lot of proto's like to do. There are also other modes more suited to proto players like PC and faction warfare. Try these if you want better payouts for your effort. Leave the pubs for everyone not just the elitists. This mindset has guaranteed the fates of new players and scrubby players since the inception of clone technology. The payouts are so low that it's taken the incentive completely out of winning. It's kept so many players in STD/MLT vs higher skilled and experienced, rich PC players that it completely baffles me how people like you haven't put 2 & 2 together yet. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 2822	Posted - 2014.12.16 13:40:00 - [47] - Quote brett morris518 wrote: Sequal Rise wrote: boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. Then don't complain about not having them.. Ur previous post should have read,"who would bother getting those gold, garbage-ass suits." They are garbage but its a free suit that's fitted (rather badly) and its better than starter fits, did I mention they we have infinite of them. They are free you know, even if they are terrible fits. They are nice and shiny though and we hav as any of them as we like! Did I tell you about how they cost nothing?......... On a serous note - totally worth it. I have been using the Shaman Logi and trust me I die an absolute ton in it. My crappy KDR will be even more crappy after this week but it has already paid the 10m for its self and is now into profit! :D "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
taxi bastard Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 270	Posted - 2014.12.16 13:51:00 - [48] - Quote i came back to dust after leaving for a while last night. i was messing about alot with all my XP so using new fits and abandoning my uplinks. i found that in every full battle i earned atleast 200k + mostly +/- 300k just to clarify that's pi5sing about solo not sure how much is people want?
boba's fetta Dead Man's Game RUST415 900	Posted - 2014.12.16 15:27:00 - [49] - Quote Sequal Rise wrote: boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. you can still buy them. he cliamed you cannot. i didnt say you should mearly that you can. but still not all the apex are bad.
Beren Hurin Onslaught Inc RISE of LEGION 2462	Posted - 2014.12.16 16:33:00 - [50] - Quote What if hacks increases your chance at salvage keys?

ADAM-OF-EVE Dead Man's Game RUST415 1744	Posted - 2014.12.16 17:36:00 - [51] - Quote players where never meant to proto stomp pubs yet they did and ccp allowed this because it was a huge isk sink. the fact some players have billions of isk is not a pub match issue. it was a pc issue ccp didn't bother to correct which is why a lot of players come up against proto teams who don't care about losing isk. the answer to the problem is not give them more isk so more players can join the proto stomp. the answer is give them somewhere else to waste their isk. which is what faction warfare was meant to be however even that was left in a mess because ccp didn't anticipate that a lot of players don't want to be proto stomped meaning low turnouts in fw fights. if we increase payouts for pubs all this will do is allow more players to run proto without making losses. which is wrong. pubs should be places where the noobs can train and earn isk while the protos have fun and lose isk bringing in a bit of balance. a noob cannot push any harder to get a win in a fight that is 1 sided. increasing isk does nothing for them. no players should suffer because proto players don't want to lose isk on low income fights. All Hail Legion
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5479	Posted - 2014.12.16 22:20:00 - [52] - Quote ADAM-OF-EVE wrote: players where never meant to proto stomp pubs yet they did and ccp allowed this because it was a huge isk sink. the fact some players have billions of isk is not a pub match issue. it was a pc issue ccp didn't bother to correct which is why a lot of players come up against proto teams who don't care about losing isk. the answer to the problem is not give them more isk so more players can join the proto stomp. the answer is give them somewhere else to waste their isk. which is what faction warfare was meant to be however even that was left in a mess because ccp didn't anticipate that a lot of players don't want to be proto stomped meaning low turnouts in fw fights. if we increase payouts for pubs all this will do is allow more players to run proto without making losses. which is wrong. pubs should be places where the noobs can train and earn isk while the protos have fun and lose isk bringing in a bit of balance. a noob cannot push any harder to get a win in a fight that is 1 sided. increasing isk does nothing for them. no players should suffer because proto players don't want to lose isk on low income fights. Please link all these statements CCP has made about proto, not anticipating proto in FW, etc. Thanks Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5483	Posted - 2014.12.17 12:54:00 - [53] - Quote boba's fetta wrote: Sequal Rise wrote: boba's fetta wrote: abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. faction warfare is that way <------ 10M Isk+ all the isk lost during the FW battles + all the time spent in the merc quarter waiting for a battle, in order to buy a bad fitted suit which is crappier than any standard suit? No thanks. you can still buy them. he cliamed you cannot. i didnt say you should mearly that you can. but still not all the apex are bad. I have the min scout and min assault and I think they are great. I do run out of ammo a lot with the assault though! Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
7th Son 7 United Logistics Division 9	Posted - 2014.12.17 22:44:00 - [54] - Quote yea a slight increase would cool, I vote yes
Jadd Hatchen KILL-EM-QUICK 730	Posted - 2014.12.17 22:47:00 - [55] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. Please don't get stuck in another one of your CPM "group-think" bad decisions... I can see many bad possibilities and only a some moderately better ones. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupthink
Thokk Nightshade Montana Militia 764	Posted - 2014.12.17 23:08:00 - [56] - Quote I'm all about the increased payouts. Here is an example of two matches I had today Domination. 10 Kills, 9 deaths, 875 WP, I believe 8th place. I got paid 86k ISK. Next match was a Domination: 4 kills, 8 deaths, 400 or so WP. I got 126k ISK. The first match, even if I was running a 10k suit, I lost money. The second, where I had lower WP, I got an extra 50 k payout. Then I ran an ambush where we got Nyain San stomped. I had like 1 kill and 6 deaths, but I was running logi so I had 350-400 WP. I got 250k ISK. WTF? Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
Thokk Nightshade Montana Militia 764	Posted - 2014.12.17 23:16:00 - [57] - Quote Gonna leave this here. This is something I typed up for another discussion with a couple variants. THE NUMBERS ARE JUST OUT THERE FOR DISCUSSION'S SAKE. Here is something I've been kicking around for a while. Set it so each "position" on the end of match killboard has a set ISK amount. Then use a multiplier with WP to come to a total figure. The highest 4 members of the team are (likely)pretty equal contributors so they deserve the same baseline payout. The next 4 contributed but not to the same level of the top 4. From there down, it digresses quickly to the last place player. 1st place. 120 k 2. 120 k 3. 120 k 4. 120 k 5. 100 k 6. 100 k 7. 100 k 8. 100 k 9. 90 k 10: 90 k 11: 80 k 12: 70 k 13: 60 k 14: 50 k 15: 40 k 16: 25 k Then take the individual's WP's and multiply them by "x" and then multiply that with the total payout. For example, for an Ambush match, I'll use .0025. I am on top of the board after the match and I get 1500 WP. We take 1500 WP X .0025 = 3.75. 3.75 X my first place baseline payout of 120k = 450000 2nd player gets 1100 WP. 1100x.0025 is 2.75 X 100k = 330000 6th player for example makes 740 WP 1100 x .0025 is 1.85 x 100k = 185,000 Just to look at it, 9th place player gets 400 WP. 400 x .0025. He is making 90k. Anyone who has less than 400 WP would go into the negative, so their payout would be less than their basepay. So we set it so basepay is the MINIMUM anyone will be paid. If the top player goes apeshit and puts up 4000 WP or more, that is where we have some issues that need to be worked out. We have 4000 x .0025 for 10 X 120k is 1.2 Million ISK. However, we are not seeing 4000 WP put up in Ambush (Normally). So what I would do is adjust the multiplier on the type of match. Ambush are the quickest so they will not have as high WP totals as a Dom or skirmish. So for Dom and Skirm, we change the multiplier to say .0015. 4000 WP * .0015 is 6 x 120k is a 720,000 ISK payout. Right in what I believe is a sweet spot. Not too ridiculous but enough to make it worth the person's while. Those matches where you have one person putting up 6000 WP is cracking a million at 1,080,000 People who are AFK'ing are going to be sitting there making a total of 25k ISK (not worth it) and those trying to help the team will be rewarded. Even in the stomp-matches, those who have the most WP overall will be rewarded for the effort. These #'s are just theoretical and could be moved/adjusted. Honestly, if we wanted to just set the baseline at 120K for all slots I would be fine with it. I just feel like 120k is enough of an incentive to make AFK'ing worth their while. There would be another option I just thought of to fix that. To make sure the player is participating, just have a holder in place stating that in order to get paid, the individual needs to have any of the following 3 things: 1 Kill, 1 Death, 200 WP. If none of those are met, then the person is obviously AFKing and deserves no pay. Any thoughts/comments? EDIT After doing some more math stuff, I think we should set the baseline for all places at 120k. As long as one of the 3 parameters are met (Kill, death, WP), you get a minimum of 120k. At 8th place for 875 WP (in Domination or Skirmish), we are talking 157,500 payout at a 120k baseline. Thokk Kill. Thokk Crush. Thokk Smash.
Hynox Xitio Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 1887	Posted - 2014.12.18 02:29:00 - [58] - Quote I approve. I want to turn even more of a profit when I proto-stomp. The horror! The horror! ( -íº -£-û -íº)
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 5486	Posted - 2014.12.18 02:50:00 - [59] - Quote Hynox Xitio wrote: I approve. I want to turn even more of a profit when I proto-stomp. There's no doubt this would be possible for certain players. The biggest difference would be the ability of your foes to run better gear to counter you. Only4-5KDRpubbiesCanRunADV24/7\|PCplyrsRunPRO&smashSTD/MLTplyrs24/7. ThisIsHowIt'sAlwaysBeen,ThereforeMustStayThisWay.
Heimdallr69 Nyain San General Tso's Alliance 3955	Posted - 2014.12.18 03:36:00 - [60] - Quote I just got 122k for a Dom. Yeah I'm going to afk now. 122k for 20 minutes? That's great. Removed inappropriate content - CCP Logibro

Kayla Michael Tactical Logistics and Cargo 61	Posted - 2014.12.18 03:53:00 - [61] - Quote I vote "Yes" because it'll give those cute nooblets something to fight back. And personally I think it will create a balance. I eat drahp uplink, me thinks this isn't a cookie. `~`
TIGER SHARK1501 Savage Bullet 77	Posted - 2014.12.18 03:55:00 - [62] - Quote No. Run a militia fitting with maxed out skills. Its free and feelks great when you can kill proto suits with militia fittings
TIGER SHARK1501 Savage Bullet 77	Posted - 2014.12.18 03:56:00 - [63] - Quote Also grind on ambush. Its quick isk.
TIGER SHARK1501 Savage Bullet 77	Posted - 2014.12.18 03:59:00 - [64] - Quote abdullah muzaffar wrote: Yes. Not everyone can buy bpos. You know those militia fittings? Yeah they don't run out. They're even free! Believe it or not its true.
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2311	Posted - 2014.12.18 07:08:00 - [65] - Quote Ya I have BPO's as well, you know what that means, even someone kills me they get very little to nothing for their work, why because I am RUNNING A F***** BPO. Stop advocating BPO's, if everyone ran BPO's you would earn little to nothing for your work on the field. Now think on that one for a moment. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
Jack the Rlpper Fearless Infinity 16	Posted - 2014.12.18 07:41:00 - [66] - Quote calvin b wrote: Ya I have BPO's as well, you know what that means, even someone kills me they get very little to nothing for their work, why because I am RUNNING A F***** BPO. Stop advocating BPO's, if everyone ran BPO's you would earn little to nothing for your work on the field. Now think on that one for a moment. not to be an arse but if the rich would help the poor become sorta rich then more people could do what the rich do and stop complaining about it if you have bpos some dont some cant do what you can drop like 10mil on thier lap if they need it help them become rich like you to many arses now a days not enough people sharing
LT Dans Legs Random Gunz RISE of LEGION 536	Posted - 2014.12.18 08:22:00 - [67] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: CPM SirManBoy is advocating an increased Salvage method that is based on your contribution. Will not help hackers much but it might be something worth exploring. So there are hackers? Huh? To Live Is To Die
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2314	Posted - 2014.12.18 20:18:00 - [68] - Quote Jack the Rlpper wrote: calvin b wrote: Ya I have BPO's as well, you know what that means, even someone kills me they get very little to nothing for their work, why because I am RUNNING A F***** BPO. Stop advocating BPO's, if everyone ran BPO's you would earn little to nothing for your work on the field. Now think on that one for a moment. not to be an arse but if the rich would help the poor become sorta rich then more people could do what the rich do and stop complaining about it if you have bpos some dont some cant do what you can drop like 10mil on thier lap if they need it help them become rich like you to many arses now a days not enough people sharing I have become angry because players are advocating BPO's to offset the crappy ISK payout. I just got angry is all. I do have the ISK not to worry and I have given ISK to other players to help them. This was why this thread was made, it was made to bring awareness to the ISK disparity in this game. More ISK means less redline campers is my opinion. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????


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