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Breach AR

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Echo 1991 WarRavens Capital Punishment. 544	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:35:00 - [1] - Quote So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM.
Blueprint For Murder Immortal Guides 212	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:37:00 - [2] - Quote I wish I could see what you guys see... I use the standard AR over it. Check out the film Flame and Citron it is amazing! Wizard Talk
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 2685	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:43:00 - [3] - Quote Hilariously it barely even out DPSes the basic AR, which is backwards imo, it needs to be slightly less, though the AR does have the notable advantage of filling the zone with more death due to the higher RPM thus appreciably easier to hit fast targets with. "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
Deus Ops Osmon Surveillance Caldari State 3	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:44:00 - [4] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. omg here it is, another cry baby. if you week everything will be op for you. buf nerf buf nerf buf nerf just be a man
G Felix 107	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:51:00 - [5] - Quote I've favored the Breach AR since very early Uprising, and it's always been very viable through the buff/nerf cycles. As long as you adhere to your range limitations and don't mistakenly pick a fight with a Rail Rifle out of your optimal it's a great weapon. Scouts can still out strafe you up close (spray and pray won't save you), and sentinels that close the distance will melt you, but if you hold your targets in the sweet spot you can hit and run with ruthless efficiency. I use it with a shield tanked/shield regen Cal Assault fit and a Breach Scrambler Pistol. I'm afraid it's going to get the nerf bat soon. Dust can be frustrating. (Gò»°Gûí°)Gò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+)
KingBabar The Rainbow Effect 2663	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:52:00 - [6] - Quote Deus Ops wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. omg here it is, another cry baby. if you week everything will be op for you. buf nerf buf nerf buf nerf just be a man Echo is a very competent player so STFU. I'd be very surprised if you do better than him on average. And also, he is a 100% right. There is a reason for so many people using it right now, and it aint nostalgia... FU and FU Dust community, you're mostly a bunch of moronic carebear crybabies. Get good.
Echo 1991 WarRavens Capital Punishment. 544	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:53:00 - [7] - Quote Deus Ops wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. omg here it is, another cry baby. if you week everything will be op for you. buf nerf buf nerf buf nerf just be a man I use the thing you idiot. Its dealing far to much damage. So please explain how I'm a cry baby.
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 2685	Posted - 2014.11.07 05:57:00 - [8] - Quote I use it because it has the most DPS out of any light weapon... Which is stupid, as the base AR should have that role. The basic AR DPS is 412, and the BrAR has a DPS of 416, these numbers need to be switched. The base AR needs to be the king of CQC. "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2050	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:00:00 - [9] - Quote KingBabar wrote: Deus Ops wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. omg here it is, another cry baby. if you week everything will be op for you. buf nerf buf nerf buf nerf just be a man Echo is a very competent player so STFU. I'd be very surprised if you do better than him on average. And also, he is a 100% right. There is a reason for so many people using it right now, and it aint nostalgia... +1 on all points. Well said.
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1668	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:06:00 - [10] - Quote Question is, what was changed that has made the BAR as potent as it is now (It's been performing this good since the Delta patch as far as I'm aware). We don't kick ass, we kick dick and we kick it hard. Join us in our Pumpkin Crushing

Joel II X Bacon with a bottle of Quafe 4392	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:07:00 - [11] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Question is, what was changed that has made the BAR as potent as it is now (It's been performing this good since the Delta patch as far as I'm aware). More damage. Nerf to the Rail Rifle CQC capabilities.
G Felix 108	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:38:00 - [12] - Quote Joel II X wrote: Thumb Green wrote: Question is, what was changed that has made the BAR as potent as it is now (It's been performing this good since the Delta patch as far as I'm aware). More damage. Nerf to the Rail Rifle CQC capabilities. I agree with this. The Breach AR has only become OP in relative terms, in that it hasn't had a balancing pass yet, and is outperforming it's counterparts. I'll still use it after it gets nerfed, and not just out of nostalgia. Hopefully the Breach is brought in line and the standard AR is slightly buffed simultaneously. Dust can be frustrating. (Gò»°Gûí°)Gò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+)
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1668	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:38:00 - [13] - Quote Joel II X wrote: Thumb Green wrote: Question is, what was changed that has made the BAR as potent as it is now (It's been performing this good since the Delta patch as far as I'm aware). More damage. Nerf to the Rail Rifle CQC capabilities. Right, I forgot about the 14% damage increase it got. Then again once it hits armor it's only doing 4% more damage than it used to. Personally I think the main thing that's changed is people are using shields more since the projectile nerf against them; at least that's what I've noticed. Though I won't argue against dialing that 14% back down a bit. The RR CQC nerf is irrelevant to how the BAR performs at killing people. We don't kick ass, we kick dick and we kick it hard. Join us in our Pumpkin Crushing
Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 320	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:50:00 - [14] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Hilariously it barely even out DPSes the basic AR, which is backwards imo, it needs to be slightly less, though the AR does have the notable advantage of filling the zone with more death due to the higher RPM thus appreciably easier to hit fast targets with. I kinda disagree. As you yourself mentioned -- the lower fire rate means that it doesn't hit faster suits as well as the regular AR. So it can do more damage to slower targets. That's it's advantage. It's weakness is faster targets in which case the regular AR does better. Yes more people are using the gun now because now the gun is competitive. But I have yet to be killed by a BrAR in a bullshit situation. Honestly having this strength and weakness relative to the standard AR makes it both competitive and fair imo. EDIT: for comparison try the BrAR vs an assault. Then try again vs a scout. Do the same thing with a regular AR. There will be one time you wish you had the BrAR in hand, and one time you will wish you had the regular AR. Seems reasonable to me. :/
calvin b Sinq Laison Gendarmes Gallente Federation 2196	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:54:00 - [15] - Quote Look it simple I am a Cal assault some times and I run RR. RR is for armor AR is for shields I am a shield player. I will die faster that is the mechanics. Like paper, rock ,scissors. You just hope to run into someone that your weapon can beat. AR and ScR melt shields therefore I would die faster against said player. I win a lot against RR and that's because I am shields. It all depends on your weapon and suit. So mix it up. Can the other voices in other peoples minds hear my voices in my head????
G Felix 108	Posted - 2014.11.07 06:54:00 - [16] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Joel II X wrote: Thumb Green wrote: Question is, what was changed that has made the BAR as potent as it is now (It's been performing this good since the Delta patch as far as I'm aware). More damage. Nerf to the Rail Rifle CQC capabilities. Right, I forgot about the 14% damage increase it got. Then again once it hits armor it's only doing 4% more damage than it used to. Personally I think the main thing that's changed is people are using shields more since the projectile nerf against them; at least that's what I've noticed. Though I won't argue against dialing that 14% back down a bit. The RR CQC nerf is irrelevant to how the BAR performs at killing people. It's not irrelevant as far as usage by the public is concerned. As weapons are nerfed and buffed cyclically, users (particularly those chasing whatever is perceived to be OP as of any given update or hotfix) gravitate towards it. That which we consider the "FOTM" is inherently driven by public perception and usage trends. A RR Nerf may not effect how the Breach AR performs in and of itself, but it changes the field of play and inevitably changes the usage of other weapon types in it's wake. If a weapon is OP and no one uses it, is it really OP? Try as we might, our observations about balance are almost never strictly mathematical, they are by their very nature anecdotal. Dust can be frustrating. (Gò»°Gûí°)Gò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+)
G Felix 109	Posted - 2014.11.07 07:09:00 - [17] - Quote Imp Smash wrote: Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Hilariously it barely even out DPSes the basic AR, which is backwards imo, it needs to be slightly less, though the AR does have the notable advantage of filling the zone with more death due to the higher RPM thus appreciably easier to hit fast targets with. I kinda disagree. As you yourself mentioned -- the lower fire rate means that it doesn't hit faster suits as well as the regular AR. So it can do more damage to slower targets. That's it's advantage. It's weakness is faster targets in which case the regular AR does better. Yes more people are using the gun now because now the gun is competitive. But I have yet to be killed by a BrAR in a bullshit situation. Honestly having this strength and weakness relative to the standard AR makes it both competitive and fair imo. EDIT: for comparison try the BrAR vs an assault. Then try again vs a scout. Do the same thing with a regular AR. There will be one time you wish you had the BrAR in hand, and one time you will wish you had the regular AR. Seems reasonable to me. :/ Couldn't agree more. Fight 10 scouts up close with the Breach AR and tell me it's all that OP. It's easy to out strafe. But if I can hold you in my optimal range, it's another story. If you get jumped by a shotgun scout the standard AR and a quick backpedal is one of your best chances. Dust can be frustrating. (Gò»°Gûí°)Gò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+)
hold that Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 351	Posted - 2014.11.07 07:10:00 - [18] - Quote breach ar is so legit it's the weapon on my slayer logi fit
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 18809	Posted - 2014.11.07 07:13:00 - [19] - Quote It is essentially a direct upgrade from the base assault variant... You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. Currently challenging CCP Rattati for the queef
LT SHANKS Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 3767	Posted - 2014.11.07 07:56:00 - [20] - Quote I don't know... I think because so many people use the BrAr, it's giving off the false impression that it's way too powerful. However, I've yet to be bested in CQC by the likes of one whilst using my RR/BP combo, and as you all know, those weapons were "supposedly" nerfed to hell. In all, overuse of something does not equate to it being overpowered.

Her Chosen Grade No.2 29	Posted - 2014.11.07 08:24:00 - [21] - Quote I don't feel its that's bad. Its not so over the top of any other gun. The RR hits just as hard, and can do it from 100m. Is as bad as the RR pre-nerf? Is it as bad as the flaylock was? The laser? The bolt? Not even close. Its a viable option for a weapon, but its has counters and balance compared to other weapons. I'd say less than 50% of my deaths are from ein Breach AR. Basic HMGs that can level any suit in the game within 45m is worse. SGs on undetectable scouts are worse. People camping on a roof top 80m away with RRs are worse. REs are worse.
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 2353	Posted - 2014.11.07 08:34:00 - [22] - Quote KingBabar wrote: Deus Ops wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. omg here it is, another cry baby. if you week everything will be op for you. buf nerf buf nerf buf nerf just be a man Echo is a very competent player so STFU. I'd be very surprised if you do better than him on average. And also, he is a 100% right. There is a reason for so many people using it right now, and it aint nostalgia... Haha, underlined bit made me laugh. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8251	Posted - 2014.11.07 08:37:00 - [23] - Quote Her Chosen wrote: I don't feel its that's bad. Its not so over the top of any other gun. The RR hits just as hard, and can do it from 100m. Is as bad as the RR pre-nerf? Is it as bad as the flaylock was? The laser? The bolt? Not even close. Its a viable option for a weapon, but its has counters and balance compared to other weapons. I'd say less than 50% of my deaths are from ein Breach AR. Basic HMGs that can level any suit in the game within 45m is worse. SGs on undetectable scouts are worse. People camping on a roof top 80m away with RRs are worse. REs are worse. This is very much right. People complain about it but the weapon isn't like the other "FoTM" Does it wreck, yes. Does it Wreck in it's intended range? Yes. Does it do as well outside of it's intended Operation Area? No Does it have Counters? Yes As opposed to other things that are OP which would have been: Yes, Yes, Yes, No. At the most a slight Falloff range nerf but that's it. The Alpha Damage allows it to be slightly more effective than the Plasma Rifle so scale it to where the Breach Plasma and Regular Plasma do about the same DPS per meter. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.
Sequal Rise Les Desanusseurs 178	Posted - 2014.11.07 10:10:00 - [24] - Quote Everybody who say it's not OP never really play with this weapon. As I saw many (many many) players using it, I had to try it. At first sight, it looks pretty good and balanced. But then I realised something... I am a Scrambler and CR player, so I had this "instinct" of spaming R1 when shooting. And here I found the OPness of the Breach AR! You can actually increase the RoF of the weapon by bursting it by spamming R1 really fast! You'll see how effective it is, and not intended at all. Now, I see all rapidfire modded controller using it because of this x) Take out all forms of scans and you'll see how great Dust can be. Scrubs will cry, good players will love it.
Fizzer XCIV Heaven's Lost Property 856	Posted - 2014.11.07 11:12:00 - [25] - Quote Cut its magazine size and carried ammo by a bit. That's the main reason it is better than the regular AR. I has a massive damage per mag stat and ammo effieience in comparison. Drop it to 32 rounds per magazine and 256 total ammo. Swag-suit4lyfe!
Myron Kundera The Generals 97	Posted - 2014.11.07 16:48:00 - [26] - Quote The Breach AR is not OP, it-¦s only effective at what it was designed to do, deal high damage at CQC, and still get outperformed by HMG, SG-Scout, CR, ARR, and pretty soon ASCR. You "think" it-¦s OP cause more people are using it, and since NO ONE was using it a few months ago, you are thinking "it must be OP if so many people are using it now"...wrong... the fact that more people are using them does not make it OP, it means that people are favoring CQC high alpha based damage weapons over range, cause RR got nerfed in CQC hence losing its status as "god gun". It really makes me sad to see people that use the Breach AR and consider it OP, cause, if you-¦re using it and it gets the nerf hammer (cause it will get hammered) it will go back to uselesness once again, leaving us with no good AR to compete (AR, Burst AR and TAR are crap, lol if those are my options). "Greed, the forgotten mental disease" "Spray and pray makes my day" "Will use proto gear in self defense"
JUDASisMYhomeboy xCosmic Voidx Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 141	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:48:00 - [27] - Quote I remember when we were discussing the buff and devs were talking an 18% damage increase. was that the final number? I thought it was decent back then and have been using it since. Personally i don't think it is op mainly because its outranged by every other rifle. Methinks rail rifle users are mad that their weapon isn't the be all end all
Mahal Daj Mahal Tactical Enterprises 94	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:52:00 - [28] - Quote OP: I think you're experiencing something different than you may expect. The Breach AR is a very different weapon from the AR, and it takes a different handling style to use. Those that prefer this handling style are typically more experienced in the game, which equates to smoother kills. See my Post on Crashes: https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2413361#post2413361
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 1662	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:54:00 - [29] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. its fine.. its still nowhere as OP as Rail rifle was.. AR max range is 71m effective of maybe 0-30m Railrifle max range was 101m and effective range was 0-100m but now its been nerfed its more effective at like 20+ Meters unless you use ARR [[LogiBro ADV/PRO]] [[Level 1 Forum Warrior]] [[Level 2 Forum Pariah]] All Hail our Lord and Savior CCP RATTATTI o7
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 8262	Posted - 2014.11.07 17:55:00 - [30] - Quote Myron Kundera wrote: The Breach AR is not OP, it-¦s only effective at what it was designed to do, deal high damage at CQC, and still get outperformed by HMG, SG-Scout, CR, ARR, and pretty soon ASCR. You "think" it-¦s OP cause more people are using it, and since NO ONE was using it a few months ago, you are thinking "it must be OP if so many people are using it now"...wrong... the fact that more people are using them does not make it OP, it means that people are favoring CQC high alpha based damage weapons over range, cause RR got nerfed in CQC hence losing its status as "god gun". It really makes me sad to see people that use the Breach AR and consider it OP, cause, if you-¦re using it and it gets the nerf hammer (cause it will get hammered) it will go back to uselesness once again, leaving us with no good AR to compete (AR, Burst AR and TAR are crap, lol if those are my options). Exactly. The Assault Rifle was the first Assault Rifle in the game for a long time and it's the one CCP gets you the most familiar with because it [was] on virtually every starter suit. So naturally people have this weapon skilled more than others might have. But it's been terrible compared to other weapons for a long time so people put them away. Now that at least one AR variant is viable people are actually brushing the DUST off it again and wrecking at Close ranged combat. (Which means it shines in Domination, which means you'll see it used a hell of a lot more since Dominations is the most Popular Game mode currently.) Tactical Assault Rifle however is not terrible, It's just a weapon that takes more thought than most weapons. Which means pub noobs will not pick it up as much as someone who has some discipline. CCP holds the Caldari's hand so this doesn't happen again.

Fibo Gjenn UNIVERSAL BANDAGE 8	Posted - 2014.11.07 18:12:00 - [31] - Quote Can't do anything than echo Echo, I'm doing way to good with the BA, for it to be anything but OP. it will be a sad day when they nerf it. Although it feels like people may be shifting somewhat to armor tanking after the RR nerf, so it's brutal efficiency might be setting. "Time will tell." (Blodstrupmoen)
Bax Zanith Sinfonia1898 212	Posted - 2014.11.07 18:16:00 - [32] - Quote I was using the breach AR before it was cool... They didn't die from the cold without They died from the cold within. - James Patrick Kinney
Meisterjager Jagermeister Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 481	Posted - 2014.11.07 18:23:00 - [33] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. No. It is doing the exact same damage it has been doing since 3 hotfixes ago. No one complained back then, why the sudden tears now? AKA - StarVenger
Meisterjager Jagermeister Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 481	Posted - 2014.11.07 18:26:00 - [34] - Quote KingBabar wrote: There is a reason for so many people using it right now, and it aint nostalgia... And that is because of the RR cqc nerf. If they didn't tweak the RR we wouldn't be having tis conversation. AKA - StarVenger
Commander Noctus Gallente Loyalist 103	Posted - 2014.11.07 18:52:00 - [35] - Quote Let's stop for a second and think for a second of the Gallente line of rifles in general. The Assault/Plasma Rifle line of weapons are meant for what range? -Short to Mid (aka, "CQC") Outside of their range, are the Assault/Plasma Rifle specialized variants as effect as their other racial counterparts? -No (aside from Assault variants) the racial variants far outdo the Gallente iterations (Combat dominates our Burst AR) Now, with that in mind, let's ask ourselves a few questions regarding the Breach variant. What is it this gun is meant to do? -Deal the most damage at CQC per bullet Does this CQC oriented weapon destroy at farther ranges that make it comparable to the Rail Rifle, it's closest competitor? -No, it does not. The Rail Rifle is clearly superior in that aspect, from Mid and beyond. Moving on to one final topic, regarding why people suddenly think it's apparently so OP. Why do I want this gun nerfed? -If your answer is "Because I'm totally wrecking with it, so it must be OP!", then ask yourself the next question. ----At what range are you "totally wrecking with it"? ---------If the answer to THAT is "Close to mid range", then your argument is invalid, as THAT'S THE RANGE IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE GOOD AT. ---------If the answer to that is Mid to Far, please attempt using the Rail Rifle at the same range and notice how much MORE you wreck with that gun instead. Granted, I find it odd that the Breach has a higher DPS than the Assault, I don't believe it is in need of a nerf. At all. Especially considering many posting here I've personally seen using ranged weapons to keep Gallente users far, far away from them, rendering them comparatively ineffective. Gallente User since Jan. 28th, 2013. Touched on every Gallente role since.
hold that Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 351	Posted - 2014.11.07 19:00:00 - [36] - Quote Her Chosen wrote: I don't feel its that's bad. Its not so over the top of any other gun. The RR hits just as hard, and can do it from 100m. Is as bad as the RR pre-nerf? Is it as bad as the flaylock was? The laser? The bolt? Not even close. Its a viable option for a weapon, but its has counters and balance compared to other weapons. I'd say less than 50% of my deaths are from ein Breach AR. Basic HMGs that can level any suit in the game within 45m is worse. SGs on undetectable scouts are worse. People camping on a roof top 80m away with RRs are worse. REs are worse.
CUSE WarLord KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 55	Posted - 2014.11.07 19:04:00 - [37] - Quote KingBabar wrote: Deus Ops wrote: Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. omg here it is, another cry baby. if you week everything will be op for you. buf nerf buf nerf buf nerf just be a man Echo is a very competent player so STFU. I'd be very surprised if you do better than him on average. And also, he is a 100% right. There is a reason for so many people using it right now, and it aint nostalgia... compared to all the other OP weapons in dust the BAR is average right now. so a nerf post is a bit of crying no matter who the player is.
Boot Booter Capital Acquisitions LLC General Tso's Alliance 1035	Posted - 2014.11.07 19:11:00 - [38] - Quote OK as I pointed out to Rattati before it got buffed, it will perform slightly better than the basic AR due to higher alpha, less dispersion, higher damage per clip, and less recoil. Dps wise they are about the same. I don't think either are OP but I'd like the breach to be different rather than a slightly better basic AR. My suggestion was to give it lower dps and higher range than the basic AR to match the Caldari (breach) style variation in rifles.
Vesta Opalus Bloodline Rebellion Capital Punishment. 165	Posted - 2014.11.07 19:49:00 - [39] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: So yeah, this gun needs toning down. Its doing far too much damage ATM. Its not as good as you seem to think it is.
Thumb Green Raymond James Corp 1676	Posted - 2014.11.07 20:03:00 - [40] - Quote Boot Booter wrote: OK as I pointed out to Rattati before it got buffed, it will perform slightly better than the basic AR due to higher alpha, less dispersion, higher damage per clip, and less recoil. Dps wise they are about the same. I don't think either are OP but I'd like the breach to be different rather than a slightly better basic AR. My suggestion was to give it lower dps and higher range than the basic AR to match the Caldari (breach) style variation in rifles. Perhaps give the regular AR more range cause with breach in the name it implies the BAR is meant purely for CQC. Of course I have no clue if there might be some lore explaining that breach weapons are longer ranged. We don't kick ass, we kick dick and we kick it hard. Join us in our Pumpkin Crushing



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