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Jack Boost
Zarena Family
495
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Posted - 2014.11.06 11:52:00 -
[31] - Quote
Probably more arguments to consider:
1. Sci/Fi weapon can manage magnetic lense atached to ... planet ;) no weapon oneself... so planet not take to much kick 2. Sum of energy in 'closed box' is constans. Game 'physics' operate for sure in closed box. In Dust is box 5km wide and long ;) 3. If we can 'teleport' 100kg clone with full body armor and weapon at point size of small plate you can alse use your weapon like 'hose' for bulets made in hell of neautron star (where it can also kick/overheat/bounce etc freely) 4. CCP lav of physics is soon(tm) primary learning curse at Cambridge University.
CU
Not much time left...
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Operative 1125 Lokaas
True Companion Planetary Requisitions
622
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Posted - 2014.11.06 12:21:00 -
[32] - Quote
Sev Alcatraz wrote:Recoil (in fully automatic rifles) is caused from the bolt retracting picking up another round and firing again rapidly, yes the gas exiting the gun would cause a bit of kick but not much.
A railgun that uses magnetic could has no bolt (probably some inconsevable loading system we could never build) and if there is no gas exiting the the and no bolt flying back to pick up new rounds how the hell does the gun have recoil, especially if it's open rails there is literally no way it can have recoil
This just in:
Spaceships can not fly like jets either.
Reason: CCP
Boycott Black Thursday!
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Shinobi MumyoSakanagare ZaShigurui
VEHICLEBUSTERS Demolitions and Logistics Corp .
1366
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Posted - 2014.11.06 13:38:00 -
[33] - Quote
Son-Of A-Gun wrote:LOL = this thread. Poor kid. Learning something new can be embarrassing sometimes. But now you know, and knowing is half the battle. *Que G.I. Joe theme song* G.I.Joe was my $h!t growing up as a child , Caldari reminds me of COBRA , having all the tec , weapons , and looking good and all and can't fight for $h!t .. always have me wondering , " What the frack are they doing .?. they have the joes dead and then they always find a way to screw it up . "
Now I know the joes were wearing scout suits .
How did Roadblock's big ass fit in that suit ?
don't even want to think about it .
Thank you Rattati , the DEV crew and the CPM for getting the job of 1.9 done .
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John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4448
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Posted - 2014.11.06 13:48:00 -
[34] - Quote
Spectral Clone wrote:Isaac Newton wrote:First law: When viewed in an inertial reference frame, an object either remains at rest or continues to move at a constant velocity, unless acted upon by an external force.
Second law: F = ma The vector sum of the forces F on an object is equal to the mass m of that object multiplied by the acceleration vector a of the object.
Third law: When one body exerts a force on a second body, the second body simultaneously exerts a force equal in magnitude and opposite in direction on the first body. Go back 2 school kiddo. :|
Whoa... Newton plays this game? Maybe he should have been on the CPM.
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
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jace silencerww
Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic
74
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Posted - 2014.11.06 13:50:00 -
[35] - Quote
Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:As an Electrical Engineer, I disagree with your premise that you can magically accelerate something with no consequences. Not only will you have recoil from the projectile being pushed forward as the basic laws dictate, but you'll also also have to deal with the consequences of internal pressure on the rails themselves pushing at one another. There are three rails, two parallel and the required third rail nestled between the two in an orthogonal configuration, all of which will exhibit recoil. Stop reading/watching bad science fiction really? lol study up then. the rail guns use the same thing as the bullet trains. the "bullet" more like a bullet shaped piece of metal, is pulled forward "not pushed" by the electro magnets at very high speed with very little effect on the gun. no gun powder to create recoil. so no internal pressure. |
jace silencerww
Krullefor Organization Minmatar Republic
74
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Posted - 2014.11.06 13:51:00 -
[36] - Quote
Jack McReady wrote:GLOBAL fils'de RAGE wrote:Son-Of A-Gun wrote:sir RAVEN WING wrote:3, Sorry Saber, but I ask the question "Why does the AR have 0.5 recoil? (Number was a guess.) 1. Because particles (plasma) are REALLY light weight. 2. Because particles like to travel REALLY fast on there own. All you got to do is point them in the right direction/guide them. plasma would cool mid flight and more importantly plasma carries very little mass and would not hurt much. the weapon utilizes a magnetic field to fire a charge at extremely high velocity at a target. it first processes the charge and turns it into a ball of plasma, held together by a strong electromagnetic containment field. This ball is then accelerated out of the weapon by the same method as a railgun, but the containment field quickly dissipates once the ball leaves the barrel of the gun. the containment field dissipates before the high speed projectile has a chance to cool down. eve lore, deal with it. very well said. |
DeadlyAztec11
Ostrakon Agency
5855
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Posted - 2014.11.06 14:02:00 -
[37] - Quote
Newton's third law. All forces have action reaction pairs.
If the shot is one agent and you consider the rifle the other agent then an equal force is exerted on both of them.
Lore wise the rifle probably weighs enough that the force of gravity negates a lot of the recoil because if we assume the rifle travels directly back into the shooters shoulder then it would take the path of least resistance and go upwards. Or possibly the force is directed downwards like in the modern Vector SMG so the recoil of prolonged fire is not nearly as noted as would normally be registered because the force is eventually directed downwards somewhat negating a bit of the muzzle climb.
Put your flags up in the sky.
And wave them side to side.
Show the world where you're from.
Show the world we are one.
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ThePlayerkyle13
The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY
174
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Posted - 2014.11.06 14:30:00 -
[38] - Quote
Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:As an Electrical Engineer, I disagree with your premise that you can magically accelerate something with no consequences. Not only will you have recoil from the projectile being pushed forward as the basic laws dictate, but you'll also also have to deal with the consequences of internal pressure on the rails themselves pushing at one another. There are three rails, two parallel and the required third rail nestled between the two in an orthogonal configuration, all of which will exhibit recoil. Stop reading/watching bad science fiction
Can you be my teacher?
Don't F**K with Gamers Angry Joe style
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
4559
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Posted - 2014.11.06 14:36:00 -
[39] - Quote
I believe engineers play DUST to SHOOT ignorant people, not to educate them.
EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
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Jack Boost
Zarena Family
495
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Posted - 2014.11.06 14:39:00 -
[40] - Quote
Breakin Stuff wrote:I believe engineers play DUST to SHOOT ignorant people, not to educate them.
This is easiest way to reduce not educated ppl close to 0.
Not much time left...
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Breakin Stuff
Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group
4564
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Posted - 2014.11.06 14:41:00 -
[41] - Quote
Jack Boost wrote:Breakin Stuff wrote:I believe engineers play DUST to SHOOT ignorant people, not to educate them. This is easiest way to reduce not educated ppl close to 0. I agree! Shooting them IS the answer!
Giving a lecture on how ballistics works while you do it earns bonus points!
EVE Online is what you get when engineers attempt to create "fun" without consulting someone who comprehends the word.
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Xocoyol Zaraoul
Superior Genetics
2679
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Posted - 2014.11.06 15:42:00 -
[42] - Quote
jace silencerww wrote:Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:As an Electrical Engineer, I disagree with your premise that you can magically accelerate something with no consequences. Not only will you have recoil from the projectile being pushed forward as the basic laws dictate, but you'll also also have to deal with the consequences of internal pressure on the rails themselves pushing at one another. There are three rails, two parallel and the required third rail nestled between the two in an orthogonal configuration, all of which will exhibit recoil. Stop reading/watching bad science fiction really? lol study up then. the rail guns use the same thing as the bullet trains. the "bullet" more like a bullet shaped piece of metal, is pulled forward "not pushed" by the electro magnets at very high speed with very little effect on the gun. no gun powder to create recoil. so no internal pressure.
Hey look, an easy to ready document: http://science.howstuffworks.com/rail-gun.htm
"Repulsion: The current in each rail of a rail gun runs in opposite directions. This creates a repulsive force, proportional to the current, that attempts to push the rails apart. Because the currents in a rail gun are so large, the repulsion between the two rails is significant."
"It would be more difficult to engineer small arm rail guns, mainly because of recoil. Recoil, the backward action of a firearm upon discharge, is determined by the momentum of the escaping projectile. Multiplying a projectile's mass by its velocity yields its momentum, which for high-velocity rail gun projectiles would be considerable. A portable rail gun that fires very small bullets may be the solution. A small bullet would limit recoil but still carry enough kinetic energy to inflict serious damage."
"You see those red dots over there?
Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
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Jack Boost
Zarena Family
496
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Posted - 2014.11.07 08:06:00 -
[43] - Quote
Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:
Before this goes on any further, please provide a reasonable document explaining how a railgun would not have recoil nor exert substantial internal forces on itself creating mechanical and material stresses/pressure/repulsion/call-it-what-you-want, or citations on how to launch anything without recoil.
Thank you for your time.
Look there is creative solution from my prewious post:
1. Sci/Fi weapon can manage magnetic lense atached to ... planet ;) no weapon oneself... so planet not take to much kick
.... 3. If we can 'teleport' 100kg clone with full body armor and weapon at point size of small plate you can alse use your weapon like 'hose' for bulets made in hell of neautron star (where it can also kick/overheat/bounce etc freely)
All in picture of know psyhics rules :) 1. According to Pappus of Alexandria, Archimedes' work on levers caused him to remark: "Give me a place to stand on, and I will move the Earth."
3. portal know physics ;) with momentum
Not much time left...
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Blueprint For Murder
Immortal Guides
212
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Posted - 2014.11.07 08:34:00 -
[44] - Quote
The change was not enough the progression of the kick is so slow your target is dead long before it has any effect.
Check out the film Flame and Citron it is amazing! Wizard Talk
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Hansei Kaizen
The Jackson Five
268
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Posted - 2014.11.07 08:40:00 -
[45] - Quote
Sev Alcatraz wrote:Recoil (in fully automatic rifles) is caused from the bolt retracting picking up another round and firing again rapidly, yes the gas exiting the gun would cause a bit of kick but not much.
A railgun that uses magnetic could has no bolt (probably some inconsevable loading system we could never build) and if there is no gas exiting the the and no bolt flying back to pick up new rounds how the hell does the gun have recoil, especially if it's open rails there is literally no way it can have recoil
Forces always act on each body involved in the interaction. So I think the Kick is higher the A) higher the velocity of the projectile and B) the more mass the projectile has.
Am I wrong?
The answer to your complaint is PvE. Always.
NPE status: (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+
Casual solo
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IAmDuncanIdaho II
R 0 N 1 N
975
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Posted - 2014.11.07 08:45:00 -
[46] - Quote
Sev Alcatraz wrote:Recoil (in fully automatic rifles) is caused from the bolt retracting picking up another round and firing again rapidly, yes the gas exiting the gun would cause a bit of kick but not much.
A railgun that uses magnetic could has no bolt (probably some inconsevable loading system we could never build) and if there is no gas exiting the the and no bolt flying back to pick up new rounds how the hell does the gun have recoil, especially if it's open rails there is literally no way it can have recoil
Rail rifles and recoil: why it makes perfect sense in a game
Despite the explanations already made, even if it didn't make sense....
.....it would be OP without it. One of the things where the real-world would have to take second stage for the purposes of balance in a game. No science required :)
You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all.
~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
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Banjo Robertson
Evzones Public.Disorder.
301
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Posted - 2014.11.07 12:48:00 -
[47] - Quote
You will have to forgive my canadian friend the OP, he is a farmer with many guns and not an engineer or physicist. |
Apothecary Za'ki
Biomass Positive
1638
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Posted - 2014.11.07 12:57:00 -
[48] - Quote
Sev Alcatraz wrote:Recoil (in fully automatic rifles) is caused from the bolt retracting picking up another round and firing again rapidly, yes the gas exiting the gun would cause a bit of kick but not much.
A railgun that uses magnetic could has no bolt (probably some inconsevable loading system we could never build) and if there is no gas exiting the the and no bolt flying back to pick up new rounds how the hell does the gun have recoil, especially if it's open rails there is literally no way it can have recoil this is dust not RL and if a RR had no recoil it would be the most OP weapon ever
However there WOULD be Recail on rail tech as with a forward momentum there will always be a counter momentum
Projectile being FORCED forward at huge speed via the magnets.. the counter action of magnets on the slug coudl try push the gun backward if the force exerted on the slug was greater then a spesific threshhold and limits of acceleration of the mass of the slug.. basically like fireing a 12gague slug slug goes forward and some of the backward kick is the explosive force between slug and barrel of gun because the slug cannot accelerate faster then the laws of physics.
[[LogiBro ADV/PRO]] [[Level 1 Forum Warrior]] [[Level 2 Forum Pariah]]
All Hail our Lord and Savior CCP RATTATTI o7
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Leadfoot10
Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance
2057
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Posted - 2014.11.07 13:36:00 -
[49] - Quote
There is no escape from Newton's 3rd law of motion -- at least as far as we know at this time.
Therefore any thing that exerts force and accelerates a mass will experience a force equal and opposite in direction.
For rifles, this is the kick. |
John Demonsbane
Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics
4453
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Posted - 2014.11.07 15:03:00 -
[50] - Quote
Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:jace silencerww wrote:Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote:As an Electrical Engineer, I disagree with your premise that you can magically accelerate something with no consequences. Not only will you have recoil from the projectile being pushed forward as the basic laws dictate, but you'll also also have to deal with the consequences of internal pressure on the rails themselves pushing at one another. There are three rails, two parallel and the required third rail nestled between the two in an orthogonal configuration, all of which will exhibit recoil. Stop reading/watching bad science fiction really? lol study up then. the rail guns use the same thing as the bullet trains. the "bullet" more like a bullet shaped piece of metal, is pulled forward "not pushed" by the electro magnets at very high speed with very little effect on the gun. no gun powder to create recoil. so no internal pressure. Hey look, an easy to read document: http://science.howstuffworks.com/rail-gun.htm"Repulsion: The current in each rail of a rail gun runs in opposite directions. This creates a repulsive force, proportional to the current, that attempts to push the rails apart. Because the currents in a rail gun are so large, the repulsion between the two rails is significant." " It would be more difficult to engineer small arm rail guns, mainly because of recoil. Recoil, the backward action of a firearm upon discharge, is determined by the momentum of the escaping projectile. Multiplying a projectile's mass by its velocity yields its momentum, which for high-velocity rail gun projectiles would be considerable. A portable rail gun that fires very small bullets may be the solution. A small bullet would limit recoil but still carry enough kinetic energy to inflict serious damage." Cannons have recoil, Catapults have recoil, lasers have recoil (Though admittedly rediculously small, every laser is pushing itself backwards, exerting a pressure on the target, and trying to spin every lens it goes through), bows have recoil and are a great example you can try out yourself that have no gunpower as you will feel the bow pushing against your arm back towards your body as you release the draw. There is no such thing as a free lunch in physics. You can push, or pull, and it will have consequences. Before this goes on any further, please provide a reasonable document explaining how a railgun would not have recoil nor exert substantial internal forces on itself creating mechanical and material stresses/pressure/repulsion/call-it-what-you-want, or citations on how to launch anything without recoil.Thank you for your time.
It's hard being a scientist sometimes....
(The godfather of tactical logistics)
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Vyuru
Algintal Core Gallente Federation
57
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Posted - 2014.11.07 15:34:00 -
[51] - Quote
Quote:Recoil (in fully automatic rifles) is caused from the bolt retracting picking up another round and firing again rapidly, yes the gas exiting the gun would cause a bit of kick but not much.
A railgun that uses magnetic could has no bolt (probably some inconsevable (inconceivable) loading system we could never build) and if there is no gas exiting the the and no bolt flying back to pick up new rounds how the hell does the gun have recoil, especially if it's open rails there is literally no way it can have recoil
So lemme ask ya something. If recoil is caused from the bolt retracting to pick up another round and firing again rapidly....
Muzzle loaders have no recoil?
What about bolt action rifles?
Ohhh, lever actions?
How's about shotguns?
Revolvers!
I can't tell if this is a masterful troll thread or not.
Now I need to find something like a bolt action elephant rifle that weighs 2 lbs for the OP to shoot, for ***** and giggles, and ya'know, no recoil. |
Iron Wolf Saber
Den of Swords
17654
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Posted - 2014.11.07 20:21:00 -
[52] - Quote
Vyuru wrote:Quote:Recoil (in fully automatic rifles) is caused from the bolt retracting picking up another round and firing again rapidly, yes the gas exiting the gun would cause a bit of kick but not much.
A railgun that uses magnetic could has no bolt (probably some inconsevable (inconceivable) loading system we could never build) and if there is no gas exiting the the and no bolt flying back to pick up new rounds how the hell does the gun have recoil, especially if it's open rails there is literally no way it can have recoil So lemme ask ya something. If recoil is caused from the bolt retracting to pick up another round and firing again rapidly.... Muzzle loaders have no recoil? What about bolt action rifles? Ohhh, lever actions? How's about shotguns? Revolvers! I can't tell if this is a masterful troll thread or not. Now I need to find something like a bolt action elephant rifle that weighs 2 lbs for the OP to shoot, for ***** and giggles, and ya'know, no recoil.
breech loaders too! I mean if you breach loaded a weapon you already dealt with all the recoil right?
CPM 1
Omni-Soldier, Forum Warrior
\\= Prototype Forge Gun=// Unlocked
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