DUST Search - [Request] Reworking Repair Tools

Atiim wrote:

If you don't enjoy reading, then I suggest skipping to the TL;DR.

Currently, the only thing required to be successful with a Repair Tools is latch onto an Armor Tanker and hold on for dear life. This doesn't require much thought or user input, and makes things monotonous for those using them. Along with that, Repair Tools favor those with higher HP/s, which makes them inferior to the Focused variants.

To solve these issues, I suggest giving them a Capacitor and adjusting their HP/s accordingly. This way, those wielding a Repair Tool would have to decide when or where to use one, but still being effective.

Here's an example of what their stats would be:

Quote:

Normal Repair Tool

Uptime: 25s
Downtime: 35s
Armor Repair Rate: 80HP/s

This would be the general purpose Repair Tool. It's HP/s seems a bit much, but it can only restore a total of 6000HP before it needs to recharge, which is enough to heal an entire squad before needing to recharge

Flux Repair Tool

Uptime: 15s
Downtime: 25s
Armor Repair Rate: 60HP/s

Along with being the long range Repair Tool, it would also have an emphasis on going in an out of engagements quickly. Though with only 2400HP before depletion, using it for squad support isn't recommended.

Focused Repair Tool

Uptime: 3s
Downtime: 30s
Armor Repair Rate: 215HP/s

This would be the extreme alpha, low duration Repair Tool. It's able to yield incredible amounts of health, but only in short bursts; thus making it ideal for solo play and in situations where you need someone healed quickly.

These numbers aren't definitive, but are simply placeholders to show what their purposes would be under my idea. With that in mind, what do you think the stats should be?

TL;DR

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Atiim 12728	Posted - 2014.10.05 00:58:00 - [1] - Quote If you don't enjoy reading, then I suggest skipping to the TL;DR. Currently, the only thing required to be successful with a Repair Tools is latch onto an Armor Tanker and hold on for dear life. This doesn't require much thought or user input, and makes things monotonous for those using them. Along with that, Repair Tools favor those with higher HP/s, which makes them inferior to the Focused variants. To solve these issues, I suggest giving them a Capacitor and adjusting their HP/s accordingly. This way, those wielding a Repair Tool would have to decide when or where to use one, but still being effective. Here's an example of what their stats would be: Quote: Normal Repair Tool Uptime: 25s Downtime: 35s Armor Repair Rate: 80HP/s This would be the general purpose Repair Tool. It's HP/s seems a bit much, but it can only restore a total of 6000HP before it needs to recharge, which is enough to heal an entire squad before needing to recharge Flux Repair Tool Uptime: 15s Downtime: 25s Armor Repair Rate: 60HP/s Along with being the long range Repair Tool, it would also have an emphasis on going in an out of engagements quickly. Though with only 2400HP before depletion, using it for squad support isn't recommended. Focused Repair Tool Uptime: 3s Downtime: 30s Armor Repair Rate: 215HP/s This would be the extreme alpha, low duration Repair Tool. It's able to yield incredible amounts of health, but only in short bursts; thus making it ideal for solo play and in situations where you need someone healed quickly. These numbers aren't definitive, but are simply placeholders to show what their purposes would be under my idea. With that in mind, what do you think the stats should be? TL;DR The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
shady merc RisingSuns Dark Taboo 65	Posted - 2014.10.05 01:04:00 - [2] - Quote I have many times suggested a "overheat" type mechanic for them. Will edit this post later with numbers
Ripley Riley Incorruptibles 3560	Posted - 2014.10.05 02:53:00 - [3] - Quote I like this. It might make the perma-repped sentinel + logi combo a little less frequent and that is a good thing. Now if could just get an infantry shield transporter tool... My advice to you, playa...
CommanderBolt KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 1877	Posted - 2014.10.05 04:13:00 - [4] - Quote Interesting proposals. Certainly not sure on the numbers but I really like the idea in principle. (This is coming from someone that has done a lot of logi'ing and repairing in the past) If done right, it might even give the repair tools a viable window to actually repair installations and tanks etc... when in a tough spot. "Also I think knives are a good idea, big f**k-off shiny ones" "Guns for show, Knives for a pro" MY LIFE FOR AIUR!
Justin Tymes Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 760	Posted - 2014.10.05 06:40:00 - [5] - Quote I really don't like nerfing Logis. They're already have many flaws outside of their roles, and now we want to nerf them doing their job as well? Adding a cooldown on the Repair Tool would kill the EQ. There is no way you can manage the cooldown when you factor in the enemy's actions, especially with long-range weaponry making damage you take practically randomized. I'd sooner lay out more reliable Triage Hives and DPS multiply. If this is really about Logis getting more WPs, then add the WP cap like before.
Alena Ventrallis Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 1877	Posted - 2014.10.05 07:38:00 - [6] - Quote I think logis need a buff before we start touching their equipment. Honestly, other than a minlogi on a sentinel, what do logos do that scouts cannot do with better stealth and combat capabilities? Not that I'm against the idea, but not until we get other things sorted out. I will say this though, that focused til seems pretty useless. Make it 15 sec uptime. Listen to my muscle memory Contemplate what I've been clinging to Forty-six and two ahead of me
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7788	Posted - 2014.10.05 10:08:00 - [7] - Quote I have also always proposed for an overheat mechanic or something as the such for the repair tool. Even back when I use the Logi primarily. See you space cowboy...
Bright Cloud Namtar Elite Gallente Federation 373	Posted - 2014.10.05 14:11:00 - [8] - Quote How about this: NO. Bright is the opposite of dark! Who would have thought of that?!
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 947	Posted - 2014.10.05 14:21:00 - [9] - Quote Atiim wrote: If you don't enjoy reading, then I suggest skipping to the TL;DR. Currently, the only thing required to be successful with a Repair Tools is latch onto an Armor Tanker and hold on for dear life. This doesn't require much thought or user input, and makes things monotonous for those using them. Along with that, Repair Tools favor those with higher HP/s, which makes them inferior to the Focused variants. To solve these issues, I suggest giving them a Capacitor and adjusting their HP/s accordingly. This way, those wielding a Repair Tool would have to decide when or where to use one, but still being effective. Here's an example of what their stats would be: Quote: Normal Repair Tool Uptime: 25s Downtime: 35s Armor Repair Rate: 80HP/s This would be the general purpose Repair Tool. It's HP/s seems a bit much, but it can only restore a total of 6000HP before it needs to recharge, which is enough to heal an entire squad before needing to recharge Flux Repair Tool Uptime: 15s Downtime: 25s Armor Repair Rate: 60HP/s Along with being the long range Repair Tool, it would also have an emphasis on going in an out of engagements quickly. Though with only 2400HP before depletion, using it for squad support isn't recommended. Focused Repair Tool Uptime: 3s Downtime: 30s Armor Repair Rate: 215HP/s This would be the extreme alpha, low duration Repair Tool. It's able to yield incredible amounts of health, but only in short bursts; thus making it ideal for solo play and in situations where you need someone healed quickly. These numbers aren't definitive, but are simply placeholders to show what their purposes would be under my idea. With that in mind, what do you think the stats should be? TL;DR while usually i tend to agree with your ideas but this is a BAD idea.. in heavy combat with my dual beam rep tool i get finger ache from all the constant repairing i do.. AKA doing what the logi role is there to do! not just BURST reps.. and the downtimes are an eternity when engaged in a "hot zone". ps i rather use reptools instead of Rep hives as current speculation is deployables cause lag.. but they are also very vulnerable, but you have mostlikly overlooked the RACIAL bonus's to reptools / rep-hives.. you nerf reptools and players will just stack rep hives as they hit multiple targets, they last unlimited duration (for proto REP only hive) and are exempt from the triage points per minute cap (iirc) the reptool is a mobile repair tool which is limited to 1-2 targets and has a harsh PPM cap. they do NOT need nerfing any more! [[LogiBro in Training]] Level 2 Forum Pariah
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 947	Posted - 2014.10.05 14:26:00 - [10] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think logis need a buff before we start touching their equipment. Honestly, other than a minlogi on a sentinel, what do logos do that scouts cannot do with better stealth and combat capabilities? Not that I'm against the idea, but not until we get other things sorted out. I will say this though, that focused til seems pretty useless. Make it 15 sec uptime. finally a voice of reason in this mad house.. [[LogiBro in Training]] Level 2 Forum Pariah

Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 947	Posted - 2014.10.05 14:28:00 - [11] - Quote Ripley Riley wrote: I like this. It might make the perma-repped sentinel + logi combo a little less frequent and that is a good thing. Now if could just get an infantry shield transporter tool... sent+logi? meet the scout with RE! 2 for 1 special! or PLC/massdriver to facemelt them with splash as dead logi = dead sentinel [[LogiBro in Training]] Level 2 Forum Pariah
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 947	Posted - 2014.10.05 14:33:00 - [12] - Quote I am a hardcore LogiBro on 3 of my characters (out of 6) i may not be a Shayz but i can tell you this is a bad idea. as scouts already are superior to assaults.. and with dual equipment slots can even encroach on the realm of Logi's.. i would like to see a reptool nerf if it only effected the use of reptools on non-logi suits aka.. works like they do now on logi suits but has a penality when used on non logi suits.. that way it brings people back to logi role and not just slap on a retool on their commando/assault/scout ps. only dedicated logibros should comment, not just pretenders to the role. [[LogiBro in Training]] Level 2 Forum Pariah
Atiim 12748	Posted - 2014.10.05 15:46:00 - [13] - Quote There seems to be many misconceptions with this thread. I don't see how this is a nerf. Considering how it allows you to heal your targets even faster, I'd actually consider it a buff. As for a cooldown mechanic, I also fail to see how it would be a problem as you have complete control over when it cools down, and can even use it while it's in it's down state (just like the Cloak Field). You'll still be able to repair others in firefights, as 60s, 40s, and 33s is more than enough time to give triage while in a firefight. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
TechMechMeds KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 6118	Posted - 2014.10.05 15:51:00 - [14] - Quote Quick brainfart. If we are going to have cooldowns, can we have an overcharge ability that overheats the rep tool instantly but insta heals a massive amount of hp?. Maybe that is what the focused could be. It can only charge shot for a massive amount of hp and then cooldown. We could have focussed variants for vehicles that do this as well. Medics would be wanting to carry the two different variants then and tank mechanics could be a thing with that vehicle centric variant that injects maybe 2k armour+ back into a tank. And we need the fking shield rep tools already. Well that was spiffing.
TechMechMeds KILL-EM-QUICK RISE of LEGION 6118	Posted - 2014.10.05 15:53:00 - [15] - Quote Omg i am loving the idea of a charge shot heal from a rep tool Well that was spiffing.
Vell0cet Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 2334	Posted - 2014.10.05 15:58:00 - [16] - Quote Anything getting us closer to capacitors is a good thing. Ultimately we could unify all cool downs under 1 capacitor down the road (hopefully in Legion). Best PvE idea ever!
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 7790	Posted - 2014.10.05 16:11:00 - [17] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: I think logis need a buff before we start touching their equipment. Honestly, other than a minlogi on a sentinel, what do logos do that scouts cannot do with better stealth and combat capabilities? Not that I'm against the idea, but not until we get other things sorted out. I will say this though, that focused til seems pretty useless. Make it 15 sec uptime. Gallente and Minmatar Logis need more could use more speed and better innate armor repair. Amarr and Caldari Logis need more hp but keep them slow as dirt See you space cowboy...
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 2154	Posted - 2014.10.05 16:15:00 - [18] - Quote Atiim wrote: If you don't enjoy reading, then I suggest skipping to the TL;DR. Currently, the only thing required to be successful with a Repair Tools is latch onto an Armor Tanker and hold on for dear life. This doesn't require much thought or user input, and makes things monotonous for those using them. Along with that, Repair Tools favor those with higher HP/s, which makes them inferior to the Focused variants. To solve these issues, I suggest giving them a Capacitor and adjusting their HP/s accordingly. This way, those wielding a Repair Tool would have to decide when or where to use one, but still being effective. Here's an example of what their stats would be: Quote: Normal Repair Tool Uptime: 25s Downtime: 35s Armor Repair Rate: 80HP/s This would be the general purpose Repair Tool. It's HP/s seems a bit much, but it can only restore a total of 6000HP before it needs to recharge, which is enough to heal an entire squad before needing to recharge Flux Repair Tool Uptime: 15s Downtime: 25s Armor Repair Rate: 60HP/s Along with being the long range Repair Tool, it would also have an emphasis on going in an out of engagements quickly. Though with only 2400HP before depletion, using it for squad support isn't recommended. Focused Repair Tool Uptime: 3s Downtime: 30s Armor Repair Rate: 215HP/s This would be the extreme alpha, low duration Repair Tool. It's able to yield incredible amounts of health, but only in short bursts; thus making it ideal for solo play and in situations where you need someone healed quickly. These numbers aren't definitive, but are simply placeholders to show what their purposes would be under my idea. With that in mind, what do you think the stats should be? TL;DR This is a terrible idea. About as terrible as the breach swarm launcher. I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim
Zindorak G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 1032	Posted - 2014.10.05 22:20:00 - [19] - Quote Bright Cloud wrote: How about this: NO. ^ I want to have my six kin farm not nerfed with downtime uptime bs Pokemon master! Death to all Swarm scrubs CCP please buff AScR and normal AR :(
Not Jadek Menaheim Xer Cloud Consortium 134	Posted - 2014.10.06 00:04:00 - [20] - Quote @Atiim I would be more on board with not removing the ability to repair, just instead lower repair rates across the board and an implement these uber charge numbers you're discussing. Would also be nice to see the return of the healing animation to know when your logi is giving you uber charge. Try the new Planetary Conquest Mode!

Atiim 12762	Posted - 2014.10.06 00:19:00 - [21] - Quote Not Jadek Menaheim wrote: @Atiim I would be more on board with not removing the ability to repair, just instead lower repair rates across the board and an implement these uber charge numbers you're discussing. Would also be nice to see the return of the healing animation to know when your logi is giving you uber charge. Even during it's "downtime", you'd still be able to repair people, but once you stop repairing that person, you have to wait until it's downtime is over, just like how with cloaks you can still use it during it's downtime, but once you uncloak you have to wait until it finishes recharging. But yes, I'd also love for the repair animation to return. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
Vulpes Dolosus Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 2223	Posted - 2014.10.06 00:31:00 - [22] - Quote Quote: Currently, the only thing required to be successful with a ~~Repair Tools~~ swarm launcher is latch onto a Tanker and hold ~~on for dear life~~ R1. This doesn't require much thought or user input, and makes things monotonous for those using them. Hmm... Anyway, it's not a bad idea. I think capacitor mechanics would be great in other areas of the game as well. Dust was real! I was there! Dear diary, Rattati senpai noticed me today~
Billy Jr Kameira Lodge Amarr Empire 14	Posted - 2014.10.06 00:50:00 - [23] - Quote Atiim wrote: Not Jadek Menaheim wrote: @Atiim I would be more on board with not removing the ability to repair, just instead lower repair rates across the board and an implement these uber charge numbers you're discussing. Would also be nice to see the return of the healing animation to know when your logi is giving you uber charge. Even during it's "downtime", you'd still be able to repair people, but once you stop repairing that person, you have to wait until it's downtime is over, just like how with cloaks you can still use it during it's downtime, but once you uncloak you have to wait until it finishes recharging. But yes, I'd also love for the repair animation to return. So I could have a 215 HP/S rep tool as long as I don't lose my lock without taking into account the MinLogi bonus? That won't cause an uproar at all.
Inmortal Slayer Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 1	Posted - 2014.10.06 13:49:00 - [24] - Quote Some one remove this thread. I got my scout forum account banned ( a 'Wildly ' inaproprite link said ccp, I swapped the link withing 3mins ( 6veiws or so ) to cute pokemon pics and I got banned till 10th ) I dont know where that was going nkw XD But as a logi alt with a swarmie min logi punching guys when I have to I think this Idea is amazing - ly the stupidist idea ever who the hell wants a rep tool that last 3secs just imagine a really derpy blues voice Quote: look at me derp derp I got a expensive cuddle beam. Derpy derpy derp... JIMMY JOLLOCORS RADIOACTIVE MAN that heavy is in trouble! Derpy walk derpy walk * rep activate * MUM GET THE CAMERA THERE ARE NUMBERS ON THE SCREEN INSTED OF RED LINES!!!! Hey my cuddle beam stopped and that guy died...... Have you seen my base ball? 0.o Then he pulls a sniper and trys quick scopeing and trickshotting proto heavys -_- No one wants your idea...
John Demonsbane Unorganized Ninja Infantry Tactics 4130	Posted - 2014.10.06 14:36:00 - [25] - Quote It's not a bad idea, necessarily. Personally, I think your cooldowns might be too long, but the main issue with making a change like this right now is that the logi's are the last suit class not to get reworked and are in a 'meh' state for the most part. Assuming CPM is able to get echo to be a 'logi' fix, then maybe after that gets straightened out you can play with things like this, but for now it might be a little too radical a rework. Unless.. I guess if you tried to introduce it as a variant first (even LP store specialist variant or something) then you could see how it worked without running the risk of mangling logi's. I know I'd give it a try. I've always been too aggressive for my own good and less of a "long walk on a leash" guy than a "lets top everyone off and get back into it" or "time to bum rush them and break their lines." It's the Amarrian way. (Also summarizes my corp's MO... blow everything the f*ck up and see what happens) A short-duration/high-intensity tool might be a good fit for me, tbh. (The godfather of tactical logistics)
Atiim 12791	Posted - 2014.10.06 17:54:00 - [26] - Quote Billy Jr wrote: Atiim wrote: Not Jadek Menaheim wrote: @Atiim I would be more on board with not removing the ability to repair, just instead lower repair rates across the board and an implement these uber charge numbers you're discussing. Would also be nice to see the return of the healing animation to know when your logi is giving you uber charge. Even during it's "downtime", you'd still be able to repair people, but once you stop repairing that person, you have to wait until it's downtime is over, just like how with cloaks you can still use it during it's downtime, but once you uncloak you have to wait until it finishes recharging. But yes, I'd also love for the repair animation to return. So I could have a 215 HP/S rep tool as long as I don't lose my lock without taking into account the MinLogi bonus? That won't cause an uproar at all. That 215HP/s would be balanced by having a capacitor. Sure you can repair people at an insane rate, but only for a very short period of time. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
postapo wastelander Wasteland Desert Rangers 188	Posted - 2014.10.11 18:02:00 - [27] - Quote Atiim wrote: If you don't enjoy reading, then I suggest skipping to the TL;DR. Currently, the only thing required to be successful with a Repair Tools is latch onto an Armor Tanker and hold on for dear life. This doesn't require much thought or user input, and makes things monotonous for those using them. Along with that, Repair Tools favor those with higher HP/s, which makes them inferior to the Focused variants. To solve these issues, I suggest giving them a Capacitor and adjusting their HP/s accordingly. This way, those wielding a Repair Tool would have to decide when or where to use one, but still being effective. Here's an example of what their stats would be: Quote: Normal Repair Tool Uptime: 25s Downtime: 35s Armor Repair Rate: 80HP/s This would be the general purpose Repair Tool. It's HP/s seems a bit much, but it can only restore a total of 6000HP before it needs to recharge, which is enough to heal an entire squad before needing to recharge Flux Repair Tool Uptime: 15s Downtime: 25s Armor Repair Rate: 60HP/s Along with being the long range Repair Tool, it would also have an emphasis on going in an out of engagements quickly. Though with only 2400HP before depletion, using it for squad support isn't recommended. Focused Repair Tool Uptime: 3s Downtime: 30s Armor Repair Rate: 215HP/s This would be the extreme alpha, low duration Repair Tool. It's able to yield incredible amounts of health, but only in short bursts; thus making it ideal for solo play and in situations where you need someone healed quickly. These numbers aren't definitive, but are simply placeholders to show what their purposes would be under my idea. With that in mind, what do you think the stats should be? TL;DR Oki and if my team is in middle of crossfire?! By this i basicaly cant fix them all and i pushed to sacrifice someone who will need my support too. Yesterday i was with group of five and enemy flank us, we was lucky u had droplinks and i fix everyone who made it to cever, With this upgrade, i+» ll be pushed to make decisions who will and will not receive healing. Honestly not good for me, like for proper logi. "Ultimate Loggi since 2012 and Pirmatar Yaaaaaargh."
Atiim 12891	Posted - 2014.10.11 18:10:00 - [28] - Quote How so? You'll still be able to heal everyone before the capacitor runs dry, and even if it does you'll still be able to continue healing until it reaches 0. The 1st Matari Commando -HAND
XxGhazbaranxX Eternal Beings Dark Taboo 1745	Posted - 2014.10.11 18:32:00 - [29] - Quote I like this idea. I also think that there are possible unbalancing issues but the idea seems solid for a capacitor based REP tool. More capacitor pool = less reps per second but more constant reps Less cap = more boost less consistency Logi suits could be reworked to modify this mechanic. Gallente cap amount, Minny cap recharge, amarr cap depletion, Caldari frequency modulation to rep shields instead of armor. Ever suit is viable in their own way, specially caldari for their ability to rep shields. BAM new interesting and engaging system that rewards payers for how they rep and not just who and how long they rep for. Plasma Cannon Advocate Dust 514 Survivor
Terry Webber Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 450	Posted - 2014.10.11 22:29:00 - [30] - Quote Will the repair tool recharge before the timer runs out and still be usable? If that's true then I might get behind the idea. Stating this might also alleviate any misconceptions people are having.



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