DUST Search - Review for ADS post delta

Adipem Nothi wrote:

BrotherofHavok wrote:

Adipem Nothi wrote:

BrotherofHavok wrote:

I know that ADS were originally too fast for swarms which is why the swarms got the buff that they did. However, currently the ADS are at a huge disadvantage. Their inability to heavily tank means that the ADS are far more likely to go down to a single swarm launcher.

Maybe it's just me, but if you see swarms they're guaranteed to hit you no matter what kind of evasive flying you do. Pythons are unable to resistance the missiles or forge enough and incubus may be able to armor rep tank enough to survive but chances are slim especially if there are multiple av users.

A single swarmer will consistently crash a Python only if said Python lingers after being hit 3x while the Swarmer reloads (idiot pilot) or if the Python is hit by a second AV source (teamwork).

Are you sure? A few times that my python was taken own was due to a single swarm launcher and i'm not sure if he/she had to reload. As for being an idiot and sitting there i might be accused of doing so but that's only for the first shot. Most of the time the swarm launcher player and the swarms themselves won't become visible (latency issues) until after they hit me and they'll usually do about 1000 points of damage or more to my shields with just the 1 set of 4 swarms. The 2nd set is sure to hit me because i'm just pulling away and the 3rd set is almost sure to hit as well as long as there isn't any kind of lock on issues plaguing the enemy player.

No offense intended. The "idiot" in this scenario is the pilot who gets hit with an entire clip then lingers about which the swarmer reloads, relocks and proceeds to place a 4th volley. The majority of Pythons I've encountered require 4+ volleys. Whether or not all Pythons require 4+ volleys I cannot say.


Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 5 post(s)
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3129	Posted - 2014.09.24 17:45:00 - [1] - Quote Heat increase? Dear God why? As far as only being able to get two swarms to kill themselves it's a nerf to give you a chance, not automatically make using buildings instantly successful. I'm glad that they are working to reduce the incoming fire. Your point about pythons and incubi being differently tanked is a bit misleading. Even though you can fit more HP on the Incubus, both ADS still require the same number of shots to terminate. In my case, that's three shots for both vehicles. I have found no exceptions to this rule.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3139	Posted - 2014.09.25 09:39:00 - [2] - Quote Kallas Hallytyr wrote: Ive put up loads of numbers on the small railgun... Though I dunno how useful that actually has been numbers are always useful. Detailed observations are useful. Video is also useful.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3147	Posted - 2014.09.25 15:59:00 - [3] - Quote Fear should be present in all vehicles, all dropsuits. There are only two reasons why one should have no fear of ISK LOSS: 1: Your crap is OP and therefore it's in line for a nerf. Then you will cry a lot. 2: You give precisely zero f**ks about the cost because the raw amount of havok you intend to wreak justifies any cost. I ascribe to #2. I die a lot. I also do hilarious amounts of damage, destroy HAVs, deny ADS kills for entire matches, and often kill them. Does this rampant disregard for anything but the sheer joy of slaughter ISK efficient? No. But my objective isn't efficiency. My objective is to rip your ass off and wear it around the battlefield as a hat. If I get to explode your HAV, LAV or crash your dropship in the process? I call that winning.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3149	Posted - 2014.09.25 16:26:00 - [4] - Quote GVGMODE wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: GVGMode, you can spot an ADS from a long distance, but you need a vehicle of your own to keep up with one or get in range of one. Swarms have a pitifully short lock range, and the forge is still a far superior AV. There is an obvious difference from what AV should do, I believe the AV player main goal is to vehicle lock a part of the map and that going around the map chasing phantoms makes him useless if there are several vehicles users, given that in most maps there are hight positions that could be impossible to reach without a dropship and that are able to cover the air space of several objectives. The lock range may be short but swarms will follow you unlike forge gun shots. Just my opinion about the matter, And yet the forge shots and the locking swarms can be lethal though it isn't assured. If lethality isn't present the tool fails to pass muster to be called a weapon. Plasma cannon testing time.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3151	Posted - 2014.09.25 16:58:00 - [5] - Quote You can kill the swarm gunner.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3153	Posted - 2014.09.25 17:07:00 - [6] - Quote Something requiring skill or not is not a balance consideration. Does it work yes/no Does it always work without fail? Yes/no Does it have an effective counter? Yes/no This elitist BS about only tactics that require "skill" being valid ones is crap. If it works it should be used. Just because you're butthurt about fire and forget does not invalidate it as a tactical or balance consideration. Skill is relative and subject to extremes of one's opinion. Numbers matter. Your assessment of skill does not.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3154	Posted - 2014.09.25 17:14:00 - [7] - Quote Then go do it.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3175	Posted - 2014.09.25 21:28:00 - [8] - Quote Test 1, ADS TTK complete: Findings posted at this thread: Wisdom, B**ches
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3204	Posted - 2014.09.26 15:37:00 - [9] - Quote Minor Treat wrote: Soraya Xel wrote: Minor Treat, swarms needed a buff because they were ineffective. ADS needed a nerf because they were globally too effective. Swarms were ineffective I can agree with this. but ADS were only too effective because of the stacking bonus as I explained in the previous post. Its my theory that the data collect on ADS is inaccurate due to the skill stacking of sidegunners, not the pilots themselves. When shooting down ADS I have found three-man ADS to be DEEPLY in the minority. You can count the bodies that fall out while the ADS crashes.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3211	Posted - 2014.09.26 16:28:00 - [10] - Quote Plasma cannon is bonused for shields.

Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3211	Posted - 2014.09.26 16:35:00 - [11] - Quote THEPIMP NAMED SLICKBACK wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Plasma cannon is bonused for shields. Have you ever seen some use a plasma cannon for av Have you SEEN how the plasma cannon works now??? It's amazing!
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3213	Posted - 2014.09.26 16:55:00 - [12] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: THEPIMP NAMED SLICKBACK wrote: Breakin Stuff wrote: Plasma cannon is bonused for shields. Have you ever seen some use a plasma cannon for av Have you SEEN how the plasma cannon works now??? It's amazing! Unless you're shooting it at infantry. Used to be, you could adjust aim such that arc would account for target distance. Now, it either hits the target or whizzes by him. I aim at the ground, not the suit.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3254	Posted - 2014.09.27 19:20:00 - [13] - Quote Adipem Nothi wrote: BrotherofHavok wrote: Adipem Nothi wrote: BrotherofHavok wrote: I know that ADS were originally too fast for swarms which is why the swarms got the buff that they did. However, currently the ADS are at a huge disadvantage. Their inability to heavily tank means that the ADS are far more likely to go down to a single swarm launcher. Maybe it's just me, but if you see swarms they're guaranteed to hit you no matter what kind of evasive flying you do. Pythons are unable to resistance the missiles or forge enough and incubus may be able to armor rep tank enough to survive but chances are slim especially if there are multiple av users. A single swarmer will consistently crash a Python only if said Python lingers after being hit 3x while the Swarmer reloads (idiot pilot) or if the Python is hit by a second AV source (teamwork). Are you sure? A few times that my python was taken own was due to a single swarm launcher and i'm not sure if he/she had to reload. As for being an idiot and sitting there i might be accused of doing so but that's only for the first shot. Most of the time the swarm launcher player and the swarms themselves won't become visible (latency issues) until after they hit me and they'll usually do about 1000 points of damage or more to my shields with just the 1 set of 4 swarms. The 2nd set is sure to hit me because i'm just pulling away and the 3rd set is almost sure to hit as well as long as there isn't any kind of lock on issues plaguing the enemy player. No offense intended. The "idiot" in this scenario is the pilot who gets hit with an entire clip then lingers about which the swarmer reloads, relocks and proceeds to place a 4th volley. The majority of Pythons I've encountered require 4+ volleys. Whether or not all Pythons require 4+ volleys I cannot say. You're going to get variance based on skill levels, and what modules the pilot has to sacrifice to make his playstyle viable. ALMOST all pythons take 4 shots from pro swarms. Just like ALMOST all ADS take three shots from an assault forge proto, PERIOD.
Breakin Stuff Goonfeet Special Planetary Emergency Response Group 3255	Posted - 2014.09.27 20:17:00 - [14] - Quote a brackers wrote: Ok try this on for size. The reason the ads was nerfed was because whatever bugged numbers rattati and the cpm were using, they apparently (although suspiciously these are the only numbers I've ever seen ccp witheld) ads's are AN ORDER OF MAGNITUDE more COST EFFECTIVE and PROFITABLE than ANY other role. Please get in an ads or ask anyone who has flown one. They are not in any way profitable or cost effective. FULL STOP The reason was 2 second TTK on brick sentinels is too fast. That makes killing regular infantry trivial. More later. But if it was orders of magnitude more profitable he would have raised the hull cost, not lowered.