DUST Search - Regarding SMGs

CCP Rattati wrote:

ZDub 303 wrote:

CCP Rattati wrote:

what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo?

Assault should have a lower range than normal variant... at least according to the light weapon naming convention. Assault type is lower range and higher rof variant.

Breach would then be the opposite, higher range lower RoF.

A big complaint I have with this game is that the variant names are not consistent at all between different weapons. Its like you guys just had a design and slapped a name on it, no consistency whatsoever.

Why is the Assault Rail or Combat Rifle a lower range and high RoF variant of the original and then the Assault HMG is a long range variant? This kind of stuff confuses new players and just generally looks inconsistent and unprofessional. (imo at least)

I agree, I also dislike having basic suits, that can still be prototype, yet basic equals standard for items Ugh

. Something we can maybe fix. Please bring more of these examples to our attention.

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 2 post(s)
Cruor Abominare Horizons' Edge Proficiency V. 138	Posted - 2014.08.26 22:15:00 - [31] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: ZDub 303 wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Assault should have a lower range than normal variant... at least according to the light weapon naming convention. Assault type is lower range and higher rof variant. Breach would then be the opposite, higher range lower RoF. A big complaint I have with this game is that the variant names are not consistent at all between different weapons. Its like you guys just had a design and slapped a name on it, no consistency whatsoever. Why is the Assault Rail or Combat Rifle a lower range and high RoF variant of the original and then the Assault HMG is a long range variant? This kind of stuff confuses new players and just generally looks inconsistent and unprofessional. (imo at least) I agree, I also dislike having basic suits, that can still be prototype, yet basic equals standard for items . Something we can maybe fix. Please bring more of these examples to our attention. Here's a fantastic and novel idea. Why dont you just redirect your energies to removing basic suits form the game anyways? Is that possible without a client update? They only act as A. a sp sink and B. more dangerously a skill trap to waste sp on for our newbies because the game isn't that well documented. We've all given up on the promises from various fired and escaped CCP devs telling us that yes one day there would be a point to those skill points spent there but not yet! There are far more pressing issues out there than worrying about the relatively well balanced SMG sitting in a sea of poorly thought out sidearms that could use the love way more than the SMG.
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 3202	Posted - 2014.08.27 01:58:00 - [32] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Removing it in its entirety. Not only is it the same exact thing as the original one, but it is much better in almost every way but fitting costs. It's, also, manufactored by Ishukone. A Caldari Corp. Masters of breach-type weapons making an assault variant of a Minmatar weapon. Am I the only one seeing something wrong here?
Zindorak 1.U.P 692	Posted - 2014.08.27 01:59:00 - [33] - Quote Make an SMG that has 1 bullet and KO's on hit Pokemon master! CCP undo ScP nerf. It hurt my feering very bad
Haerr Legio DXIV 1270	Posted - 2014.08.27 13:05:00 - [34] - Quote Joel II X wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Removing it in its entirety. Not only is it the same exact thing as the original one, but it is much better in almost every way but fitting costs. It's, also, manufactored by Ishukone. A Caldari Corp. Masters of breach-type weapons making an assault variant of a Minmatar weapon. Am I the only one seeing something wrong here? This is good too. +1 This SCOTTY has Super Cow Powers.
Ryme Intrinseca 1637	Posted - 2014.08.27 13:23:00 - [35] - Quote Rusty Shallows wrote: Haerr wrote: Haerr wrote: Spademan wrote: The assault variant has no right to exist, there's just no reason for a variant to be better in every way than the base version. ^ This. +1 How would anyone feel about an Assault "Assault Rifle" that has more range and a higher RoF? Seems rather silly to have an SMG that is just that. Historically speaking the move from Battle Rifles to Assault Rifles can generally characterized by movement towards a smaller caliber ammunition, automatic fire, and larger magazines. So technically an Assault "Assault Rifle" would have less damage per shot, 3+ times the ammo, big increase in ROF, and significantly less range from the base model. /tangent Nice, though I would add that classic battle rifles like FN FAL, M14 and H&K G3 were full autos. If anything there has been a move towards burst fire mode with assault rifles though many retain full auto of course. So going back to Dust, maybe the burst AR is closest to the 'assault assault rifle' or 'assault plasma rifle'. At any rate, I don't think we have a need for yet another AR when there are only two of each of CR, RR and ScR.
Anmol Singh G0DS AM0NG MEN General Tso's Alliance 840	Posted - 2014.08.27 13:33:00 - [36] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: ZDub 303 wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Assault should have a lower range than normal variant... at least according to the light weapon naming convention. Assault type is lower range and higher rof variant. Breach would then be the opposite, higher range lower RoF. A big complaint I have with this game is that the variant names are not consistent at all between different weapons. Its like you guys just had a design and slapped a name on it, no consistency whatsoever. Why is the Assault Rail or Combat Rifle a lower range and high RoF variant of the original and then the Assault HMG is a long range variant? This kind of stuff confuses new players and just generally looks inconsistent and unprofessional. (imo at least) I agree, I also dislike having basic suits, that can still be prototype, yet basic equals standard for items . Something we can maybe fix. Please bring more of these examples to our attention. For Assault, reduce it's range 10% of from the normal SMG, increase it's damage or RoF 10% from normal SMG and reduce it's clip 10% so it only has 72 bullets. *Sagaris lover!!!* Commando <3
Ghost Kaisar Fatal Absolution General Tso's Alliance 6738	Posted - 2014.08.27 13:34:00 - [37] - Quote Cruor Abominare wrote: Fizzer XCIV wrote: CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? RoF: 1500 Damage: 18 Magazine size: 24 Range: Same Something like this? Oh yea everyone be signing up for an smg with a damage per clip of 432, especially with smg's longer reload times. He's not getting the pure stats right, but his idea is sound. Give it a much higher ROF, but smaller clip size to compensate. It would have a higher DPS, but lower DPC Current stats for the Six Kin give it base 385 DPS and 1848 DPC New Stats would then be RoF: 1500 Damage: 23.1 Mag: 35 Which gives it 577 DPS and 808 DPC. It will quickly drop a single target in CQC. On the Min Assault, it will gain offensive power, giving it a better DPC of around 1016 Sound good? FA's Stabber Extraordinaire Minmatar Enthusiast Explosions and Bulletstorm? Count me in!
Fox Gaden Immortal Guides 4095	Posted - 2014.08.27 15:11:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Model the Assault SMG on the Assault HMG. Give it less damage but a longer range. As far as Naming Conventions, while the SMG should use the same naming convention as the HMG, the term GÇ£AssaultGÇ¥ seems to have a completely different meaning for machine guns in DUST than it has for Rifles. Would GÇ£TacticalGÇ¥ be a better description for the long range, lower damage variant? I know that Tactical Rifles are semi-automatic, but they are also longer range, and a machine gun would not have a semi-automatic variant, so I think long range would be enough of a defining factor. I think the standard HMG/SMG should be the GÇ£AssaultGÇ¥ variant to be better in line with the Rifles. I would also not be against removing the Assault version of both the SMG and HMG and giving the Breach version more range. (Would have to create a Breach version of the HMG.) Then the Breach would fill the role of the current Assault and be in line with the Rifle naming convention. I would not mind seeing a Burst SMG based on the mechanics of the Burst HMG (not the mechanics of the Burst Combat Rifle). The Magsec SMG should be to the Assault SMG (or whatever we call the long range SMG) what the Scrambler Rifle is to the Tactical Assault Rifle. Hand/Eye coordination cannot be taught. For everything else there is the Learning Coalition.
Pseudogenesis Subdreddit Test Alliance Please Ignore 380	Posted - 2014.08.27 21:00:00 - [39] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Keep high fire rate and clip size, reduce the damage. Assault variants sacrifice damage for attack speed, and so their role should be "finisher" style weapons where guaranteeing the final hit on the enemy is given priority over high DPS. Stabby-stabber extraordinaire
OZAROW Opus Arcana Covert Intervention 1521	Posted - 2014.08.29 06:01:00 - [40] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? No and don't listen to these whinners your going to inadvertently nerf the minmatar assault especially if you do the same to the cr eventually. SHIELDS suck, a scr can wreck 600 shields faster than any smg, so everyone armor tanks and smg us a high rof weapon ment to rip armor after a laser weapon rips shield. Buff everything else , smgs have been nerfed , you reduce the mag and the minmatar bonus barely beings the ammo to what it is now, thats not fair and makes the min assault bonuses useless. Unless you buff all sidearm to smg effectiveness or make the minmatar bonuses be to all minmatar weapons please don't change the smg, this is a serious problem that would create more problems and indirect nerfs. Yes, you just got rocked by a guy with a BOLT PISTOL and a pair of knives! !

Imp Smash Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 215	Posted - 2014.08.29 06:37:00 - [41] - Quote CCP Rattati wrote: what should we do with the Assault SMG, reduce the clip? Massive burst damage, but very limited ammo? Seems reasonable -- but I hesitate because, well, burst HMG. You yourself said that's a tad OP. So wouldn't what you are saying cause that problem among all suits?
Jakkal Shoobah Direct Action Resources 2	Posted - 2014.08.29 15:16:00 - [42] - Quote Haerr wrote: Haerr wrote: Spademan wrote: The assault variant has no right to exist, there's just no reason for a variant to be better in every way than the base version. ^ This. +1 How would anyone feel about an Assault "Assault Rifle" that has more range and a higher RoF? Seems rather silly to have an SMG that is just that. I for one would love to have an assault assault rifle. You know 1500 rpm. 35 damage a shot. optimal range of 80 meters and max range of 120. Yeah . sounds right and completely justifiable (sarcasm) REMOVE ASSAULT SMGS. Jakkal "Jammal" Shoobah, The friendly/pissy Gallente Commando/Assault Assault Rifles til I get stomped to the ground


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