DUST Search - Are Vehicles Still Worth the ISK/SP Needed to Skill into them/Operat...

True Adamance wrote:

Tread Loudly 2 wrote:

Tebu Gan wrote:

Tread Loudly 2 wrote:

I have done my fair share of operating HAV's, ADS's, and even LAV's however as mentioned before the small turrets simply take to much PG/CPU, to the point that they severely impact the overall tank of any vehicle, so AV will simply rip though that vehicle if it is loaded with small turrets.

It is rather handy to raise the optimization skill of small guns. No you won't be able to fit tank for both shields AND armor, but that's kinda the trade off for the added DPS (IF you can find a gunner).

For example, with nearly max optimization skills in my large rail, shields, and small rails, I can manage to fit 2 complex shield extenders and a hardener (the FOTM of shield tanks atm), with a 20GJ particle cannon, a standard small rail, and a 80GJ particle cannon. With a CPU booster and PG booster (complex) in my lows.

And with my current skills, I need to reevaluate my fitting as I have a bit left over still. But with this fit, the only thing I'm really missing over one that isn't fit with small guns, is my armor. Even still, given how PG intensive Extenders are, I still would need to fit a PG booster to manage the 2 complex extenders, IF I wanted to put some armor on.

And no, AV does not rip through this build in the least. With a hardener up, swarm damage is minimal, forgers will need a reload, and other tanks struggle to break it. Pop 2 gunners in there and EVERYTHING dies. Don't underestimate how incredibly handy a gunner is against AV (A GOOD gunner that is).

I am a defensive tanker so my focus is on HP not DPS, mainly because DPS means that you rely on active modules which have a hefty cool down even with the proper skills.

Optimization helps but not enough as vehicles get some bonuses but nowhere near those that infantry units get which leaves a large gap to what we can and can't fit on our tanks which causes major issues when bridging the gap between being a DPS or a HP HAV which keeps HAV vs HAV in a good place while HAV vs AV is swayed heavily into the AV side of things because of the sheer number of people with FG's and Swarm launches as of right now and that number can only grow in the near future.

Yes I know any tank can take down infantry but with the nerfs that have happened to the turrets lately it is getting a lot tougher and it's something that needs looked into.

Pfffff defensive tanker..... just EHP stacking or Repper stacking...... good god I hate that CCP even allowed its player to think that was a legitimate strategy or fitting style.

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Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 16	Posted - 2014.07.25 15:47:00 - [1] - Quote Well the simple answer is no, however there is a long list of reasons why they aren't worth the SP/ISK needed to operate them efficiently. First let's talk about our weapons - Large/small turrets as well as getting to the point where you can skill into them. Unlike infantry when we skill into our weapons there is no Bonus to skilling into the large/small turrets, where as when infantry weapons get large bonuses to skills allow them to operate that weapon more efficiently. Next will be about Vehicles vs. infantry - As of right now there are 3 ways for Vehicles to effectively engage infantry, they are - Lav's, ADS's, and HAV's with small turrets. However there are major problems with all of these because if you stop with an LAV to try and engage infantry with it you are prone to wiped out in seconds by the amount of AV always present in every game. Then if try to engage infantry with an ADS all it takes is a ADV forge to keep you at bay just because of the HP of the ads, the buff in Hot-fix Charlie may help for this problem. Then when you put small turrets on an HAV it will severely decrease your overall tank because of the high pg/cpu costs for fitting them. Another issue with Vehicles vs. Infantry is the damage any infantry unit can put out compared to a vehicle, as it stands right now a proto Gallente Sentinel can take a direct hit from a Particle cannot and survive easily, proto forge guns do more damage than proto large rail guns per shot. Then known/unknown bugs for vehicles - The list ranges from Vehicles falling through the map, Not dropping from the RDV, Invisible walls that cause any vehicle to spontaneously explode, tanks with no turrets but with MCRU kills/traps infantry that spawn on it, occasionally RDV's never make it to the drop point they simply hit the MCC and you lose what you called in, the proficiency for large turrets doesn't work, and ways to get around current over heat times on large railguns . Then lastly how I believe these problems could be fixed- Give- Large/Small Railguns a bonus of 3% reduction to heat build up per level Large/Small Blasters a 3% reduction to dispersion per level Large Missiles a 5% bonus to Blast Radius per level Small Missiles a 5% bonus to clip size per level Also add in Gallente/Caldari HAV skill books in which each of them give a 3% reduction of Pg/Cpu to their respective weapons make the Isk cost for them the same as the skill books for the Gallente/Caldari ADS Make it so Mobile CRU's will spawn units outside of an HAV if the HAV has no turrets Please give this feedback and what you think about these as well as add/remove things as you feel necessary, thanks for your time! I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!
Racro 01 Arifistan 501st Knights of Leanbox 394	Posted - 2014.07.25 15:56:00 - [2] - Quote I like these ideas. would make my vehicles much better to handle/operate. +1 *Elite Gallenten Soldier*
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 18	Posted - 2014.07.26 02:42:00 - [3] - Quote Thank you! I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!
Alena Ventrallis S0VER31GN 1497	Posted - 2014.07.26 03:08:00 - [4] - Quote I agree with your concept, but your proposed bonuses could get imbalanced fast. Something to be mindful of. Rattati has spoken. CalScout hitbox is fine. You're gun game is broken.
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 19	Posted - 2014.07.26 15:52:00 - [5] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: I agree with your concept, but your proposed bonuses could get imbalanced fast. Something to be mindful of. Which one's or all of them? I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!
Killar-12 The Exemplars Top Men. 3059	Posted - 2014.07.26 15:53:00 - [6] - Quote I like your Ideas but not some of your reasoning...fixing the PG/CPU skills as well as Armor/Shield ones might help out. I am an Idiot, and so are you!
ladwar HEARTS OF PHOENIX 2017	Posted - 2014.07.26 16:25:00 - [7] - Quote simple answer is nope. gallante ads is viable w/ rail and maxed skill. "Make it so Mobile CRU's will spawn units outside of an HAV if the HAV has no turrets" already works this way. Level 2 Forum Warrior, bitter vet. I shall smite Thy Trolls with numbers and truth doing reviews in free time, want 1?
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 1105	Posted - 2014.07.26 19:13:00 - [8] - Quote I remember you tread, I think. I want to say you started with tanks after 1.6, but this was back when Sica's could 3 shot everything with damage mods. That said, I don't agree with much of your above statement, as I don't have near the trouble tanking or flying. And if I do, it generally isn't just ONE guy with an AV weapon, but multiple people with an AV weapon. Before I get started here though, I want to say I do agree that tanks need more bonuses from skills and less filler. Yet on the other hand your statement that SP/ISK isn't worth it, at this time, is just DEAD WRONG. The main differences between a heavily invested tanker and a light invested tanker are rather obvious. Fitting ability (with Module efficiency thrown in on the side) That's the main thing you get from skilling deep into the tanking tree. Where a 5 mil SP tanker might be able to use a complex shield extender, they are going to have trouble fitting that with another complex extender and a hardener. Not to mention attempting to fit a pro turret, OR small guns. On the other hand, a 20 Mil invested tanker can fit 2 complex extenders, a hardener, plus a pro large turret, AND 2 small guns at no sacrifice. But a lower SP char will have to sacrifice something to make it work. And it's not just about fitting, as there are a few skills that do give you an obvious advantage over a lesser skilled tank. (Just going to work through the main skills for turrets here) Let's just take for example what I think is the more balanced of the tanking trees, Turret Operation: Turret Operation - First skill of the tree, unlocks either small turrets at level 1, or large turrets at level 5. 1x multiplier, so it's rather understandable that this wouldn't have any other bonuses associated with it. Large Turret Operation - Unlocks your various large turrets. Notice the bonus of 2% per level to CPU/PG reduction per level for large turrets. Large Rail, Missiles, Blaster operation - Unlocks your various tiers of turrets. A bonus would be nice here, but getting one to level 5 unlocks another important skill. Turret proficiency which leads to optimization. Reload and Ammo skills - While ammo might not seem important, I do run out A LOT. And reload is obviously an incredibly handy skill to have. Turret proficiency - 10% faster turret rotation speed per level. This is enormously helpful. It allows you to run circles around your opponent, out tracking their own turret rotation and denying them the ability to come close to hitting you. This skill also leads one of the most useful skills in turn. Turret Optimization - 3% reduction to PG/CPU usage of said turret. At level 5 that is a 15% reduction. Couple this with the 10% from Large turret operation for a whopping 25% reduction to CPU/PG usage of a given turret. So having a lot of SP invested can really make a HUGE difference. And this is just for one turret type. 25% less PG/CPU usage opens the doors for fitting better and better modules. Couple this with the 25% reduction to shield and armor PG/CPU usage, and if you want to use smalls, the 25% there too, the possibilities really open up. That's the difference of using all proto, or being forced to downgrade to an advanced or basic module or turret. So really, having a lot of SP into tanks DOES make a large and conceivable difference. Just not in the way some are used to or expect. This all said, there are a few skills that I would like to see bonuses added on to. Large Blaster, Missile, and Rail skills - A 1% decrease to dispersion(blaster), 1% decrease in reload time(missiles), and a 1% decrease to heat buildup(rails). Similar to what you had mentioned in your OP. Vehicle upgrades - The highest you need this is level 3, yet to use damage mods this must be at level 5. I would rather see damage mods moved to a level 3 skill. Then adding some sort of small bonus to the Vehicle Upgrades skill, like say 1% to module efficiency (for example, hardeners gain 1% to damage reduction per level or extenders gaining 1% to total health added). Vehicle Shield and Armor Systems - Currently just unlocks the tiers of modules. Would like to see it add bonuses to shields and armor, IE, each level increases the total shields and armor by a percentage. Vehicle Core Upgrades - Unlocks powergrid, CPU, and propulsion mods. Add a bonus that increases the efficiency of PG/CPU modules. Move propulsion to a skill of it's own (or stack it with engineering) Vehicle Electronics and Engineering - Both of these unlock tiers of modules (scanners and MCRU's respectively), and nothing more. Higher tiers of scanners offer no additional bonus aside from better CD times. So why even skill this skill high at all. And MCRU's don't work half the time. So some big changes need to come to these skills. In truth though, I think there needs to be deeper separation between a lot of these skills. For example Core upgrades would do well being a skill that unlocks access to tiers of modules. But when you move past that skill (as in get it to level 5) it should unlock additional skills that affect the efficiency of those modules you just unlocked. Making it worth it to get it to level 5 as it allows for better specialization into what you just skilled into (that being proto modules). Tanks - Balancing Turrets
CHANCEtheChAn 0uter.Heaven 621	Posted - 2014.07.26 20:02:00 - [9] - Quote Tread Loudly 2 wrote: Then lastly how I believe these problems could be fixed- Give- Large/Small Railguns a bonus of 3% reduction to heat build up per level Large/Small Blasters a 3% reduction to dispersion per level Large Missiles a 5% bonus to Blast Radius per level Small Missiles a 5% bonus to clip size per level Also add in Gallente/Caldari HAV skill books in which each of them give a 3% reduction of Pg/Cpu to their respective weapons make the Isk cost for them the same as the skill books for the Gallente/Caldari ADS Make it so Mobile CRU's will spawn units outside of an HAV if the HAV has no turrets Also add in a bonus of 3% damage per level for large turrets for the standard HAV skill Please give this feedback and what you think about these as well as add/remove things as you feel necessary, thanks for your time! Then lastly how I believe these problems could be fixed- Give- Large/Small Railguns a bonus of 1-2% reduction to heat build up per level (Eh, maybe a 1-2% per level, the whole reason for the rail heat build up Nerf was to keep the shot output down, 15% would make it basically back to 5 shots before overheat) Large/Small Blasters a 0% reduction to dispersion per level (Lets see how the new Hotfix Charlie dispersions will be fixed first) Large Missiles a 25-50% bonus to Blast Radius per level (The blast radius of these are quite pitiful, its basically like using a nullncannon sized Flaylock, and a HUGE increase to blast radius is a small step in the way of making these competitive with blasters and rails) Small Missiles a 5% bonus to clip size per level (There are small missiles?) Also add in Gallente/Caldari HAV skill books in which each of them give a 3% reduction of Pg/Cpu to their respective weapons make the Isk cost for them the same as the skill books for the Gallente/Caldari ADS (Agreed, Madrugar's have High reps so should be close range blaster but high reps to truck AV. While Gunloggis have High Resistances but longer range with rails. Because Missile turrets do not lock on as missiles do, I suggest changing them to Rockets instead and to be neither Caldari or Gallente) Make it so Mobile CRU's will spawn units outside of an HAV if the HAV has no turrets (Already does, friendlies spawn on top of tanks) Also add in a bonus of 0% damage per level for large turrets for the standard HAV skill (Negative, damages are good as is, increasing damages of turrets is too much right now, everything is nice where it is, maybe if the installation buff is too much you could do a 1% per level) Changed all the values to fit my opinions and added reasons why I believe that because there are so few skills that vehicle pilots get that distinguish them from 0 SP militia vehicle pilots, these are all nice, but don't pull a CCP and go from 0 Bonus straight to game breaking bonuses Good post +1 Closed Beta Vet/ Chromosome and Corp battle Vet/ Uprising 1.0-Now PC vet Ex D.F. Director Current Inner.Hell Director
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 20	Posted - 2014.07.26 21:42:00 - [10] - Quote ladwar wrote: simple answer is nope. gallante ads is viable w/ rail and maxed skill. "Make it so Mobile CRU's will spawn units outside of an HAV if the HAV has no turrets" already works this way. It spawns the unit inside of the HAV rather than outside it which causes the player spawning in to die if in PC or FW I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!

Alena Ventrallis S0VER31GN 1498	Posted - 2014.07.27 01:24:00 - [11] - Quote Tread Loudly 2 wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: I agree with your concept, but your proposed bonuses could get imbalanced fast. Something to be mindful of. Which one's or all of them? Damage, mainly. That gets into OP faster than you can spit. Dispersion is a good idea, although I think dispersion recovery or dispersion buildup would be better. Rattati has spoken. CalScout hitbox is fine. You're gun game is broken.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 12258	Posted - 2014.07.27 01:28:00 - [12] - Quote Vehicles are certainly more entertaining than infantry......but not by much.....and even then are not interesting..... "Your Faith stands as a shield for the Faithful, and you are one of His Angels." - Soren Tyrhannos to Templar Ouryon
Apothecary Za'ki Biomass Positive 148	Posted - 2014.07.27 17:07:00 - [13] - Quote id just like to see separate sensitivity settings for infantry / air vehicles / land vehicles i think vehicles have a good psychological impact against hostile infantry and can help win a match but its all down to experience in a vehicle.. the SP dedicated to it.. and the fitting.. and finally squad of experienced people manning the small turrets and finally the hostile AV presence on the field.. is friendly presence doing their job and takeing out AV as primary thus setting the field to slaughter the enemy? Minmatar Logibro in training. Rusty needles anyone? No Mic and no time for "Squeekers" Nerf scout cloak+shotgun
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 22	Posted - 2014.07.28 18:32:00 - [14] - Quote Apothecary Za'ki wrote: id just like to see separate sensitivity settings for infantry / air vehicles / land vehicles i think vehicles have a good psychological impact against hostile infantry and can help win a match but its all down to experience in a vehicle.. the SP dedicated to it.. and the fitting.. and finally squad of experienced people manning the small turrets and finally the hostile AV presence on the field.. is friendly presence doing their job and takeing out AV as primary thus setting the field to slaughter the enemy? Vehicles have almost no psychological impact on infantry for 1 reason everyone has AV in some form they simply say "well cover me while I take care of this tank", because nearly anyone who runs swarms runs it on a suit that is near impossible to hit such a cal scout which means the vehicle has to run and cannot support the infantry. Or in the case of a forge which is generally easy to kill unless they are placed extremely high up on a tower or something similar (which is balanced and a tactical move on their part) I have done my fair share of operating HAV's, ADS's, and even LAV's however as mentioned before the small turrets simply take to much PG/CPU, to the point that they severely impact the overall tank of any vehicle, so AV will simply rip though that vehicle if it is loaded with small turrets. The friendly presence generally overlooks AV as well because they are not a threat to them. (the friendly presence being a blue dot) I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!
Tebu Gan Dem Durrty Boyz General Tso's Alliance 1106	Posted - 2014.07.28 19:12:00 - [15] - Quote Tread Loudly 2 wrote: I have done my fair share of operating HAV's, ADS's, and even LAV's however as mentioned before the small turrets simply take to much PG/CPU, to the point that they severely impact the overall tank of any vehicle, so AV will simply rip though that vehicle if it is loaded with small turrets. It is rather handy to raise the optimization skill of small guns. No you won't be able to fit tank for both shields AND armor, but that's kinda the trade off for the added DPS (IF you can find a gunner). For example, with nearly max optimization skills in my large rail, shields, and small rails, I can manage to fit 2 complex shield extenders and a hardener (the FOTM of shield tanks atm), with a 20GJ particle cannon, a standard small rail, and a 80GJ particle cannon. With a CPU booster and PG booster (complex) in my lows. And with my current skills, I need to reevaluate my fitting as I have a bit left over still. But with this fit, the only thing I'm really missing over one that isn't fit with small guns, is my armor. Even still, given how PG intensive Extenders are, I still would need to fit a PG booster to manage the 2 complex extenders, IF I wanted to put some armor on. And no, AV does not rip through this build in the least. With a hardener up, swarm damage is minimal, forgers will need a reload, and other tanks struggle to break it. Pop 2 gunners in there and EVERYTHING dies. Don't underestimate how incredibly handy a gunner is against AV (A GOOD gunner that is). Tanks - Balancing Turrets
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 22	Posted - 2014.07.28 20:15:00 - [16] - Quote Tebu Gan wrote: Tread Loudly 2 wrote: I have done my fair share of operating HAV's, ADS's, and even LAV's however as mentioned before the small turrets simply take to much PG/CPU, to the point that they severely impact the overall tank of any vehicle, so AV will simply rip though that vehicle if it is loaded with small turrets. It is rather handy to raise the optimization skill of small guns. No you won't be able to fit tank for both shields AND armor, but that's kinda the trade off for the added DPS (IF you can find a gunner). For example, with nearly max optimization skills in my large rail, shields, and small rails, I can manage to fit 2 complex shield extenders and a hardener (the FOTM of shield tanks atm), with a 20GJ particle cannon, a standard small rail, and a 80GJ particle cannon. With a CPU booster and PG booster (complex) in my lows. And with my current skills, I need to reevaluate my fitting as I have a bit left over still. But with this fit, the only thing I'm really missing over one that isn't fit with small guns, is my armor. Even still, given how PG intensive Extenders are, I still would need to fit a PG booster to manage the 2 complex extenders, IF I wanted to put some armor on. And no, AV does not rip through this build in the least. With a hardener up, swarm damage is minimal, forgers will need a reload, and other tanks struggle to break it. Pop 2 gunners in there and EVERYTHING dies. Don't underestimate how incredibly handy a gunner is against AV (A GOOD gunner that is). I am a defensive tanker so my focus is on HP not DPS, mainly because DPS means that you rely on active modules which have a hefty cool down even with the proper skills. Optimization helps but not enough as vehicles get some bonuses but nowhere near those that infantry units get which leaves a large gap to what we can and can't fit on our tanks which causes major issues when bridging the gap between being a DPS or a HP HAV which keeps HAV vs HAV in a good place while HAV vs AV is swayed heavily into the AV side of things because of the sheer number of people with FG's and Swarm launches as of right now and that number can only grow in the near future. Yes I know any tank can take down infantry but with the nerfs that have happened to the turrets lately it is getting a lot tougher and it's something that needs looked into. I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 12293	Posted - 2014.07.28 23:26:00 - [17] - Quote Tread Loudly 2 wrote: Tebu Gan wrote: Tread Loudly 2 wrote: I have done my fair share of operating HAV's, ADS's, and even LAV's however as mentioned before the small turrets simply take to much PG/CPU, to the point that they severely impact the overall tank of any vehicle, so AV will simply rip though that vehicle if it is loaded with small turrets. It is rather handy to raise the optimization skill of small guns. No you won't be able to fit tank for both shields AND armor, but that's kinda the trade off for the added DPS (IF you can find a gunner). For example, with nearly max optimization skills in my large rail, shields, and small rails, I can manage to fit 2 complex shield extenders and a hardener (the FOTM of shield tanks atm), with a 20GJ particle cannon, a standard small rail, and a 80GJ particle cannon. With a CPU booster and PG booster (complex) in my lows. And with my current skills, I need to reevaluate my fitting as I have a bit left over still. But with this fit, the only thing I'm really missing over one that isn't fit with small guns, is my armor. Even still, given how PG intensive Extenders are, I still would need to fit a PG booster to manage the 2 complex extenders, IF I wanted to put some armor on. And no, AV does not rip through this build in the least. With a hardener up, swarm damage is minimal, forgers will need a reload, and other tanks struggle to break it. Pop 2 gunners in there and EVERYTHING dies. Don't underestimate how incredibly handy a gunner is against AV (A GOOD gunner that is). I am a defensive tanker so my focus is on HP not DPS, mainly because DPS means that you rely on active modules which have a hefty cool down even with the proper skills. Optimization helps but not enough as vehicles get some bonuses but nowhere near those that infantry units get which leaves a large gap to what we can and can't fit on our tanks which causes major issues when bridging the gap between being a DPS or a HP HAV which keeps HAV vs HAV in a good place while HAV vs AV is swayed heavily into the AV side of things because of the sheer number of people with FG's and Swarm launches as of right now and that number can only grow in the near future. Yes I know any tank can take down infantry but with the nerfs that have happened to the turrets lately it is getting a lot tougher and it's something that needs looked into. Pfffff defensive tanker..... just EHP stacking or Repper stacking...... good god I hate that CCP even allowed its player to think that was a legitimate strategy or fitting style. "Your Faith stands as a shield for the Faithful, and you are one of His Angels." - Soren Tyrhannos to Templar Ouryon
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 22	Posted - 2014.07.29 00:05:00 - [18] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Tread Loudly 2 wrote: Tebu Gan wrote: Tread Loudly 2 wrote: I have done my fair share of operating HAV's, ADS's, and even LAV's however as mentioned before the small turrets simply take to much PG/CPU, to the point that they severely impact the overall tank of any vehicle, so AV will simply rip though that vehicle if it is loaded with small turrets. It is rather handy to raise the optimization skill of small guns. No you won't be able to fit tank for both shields AND armor, but that's kinda the trade off for the added DPS (IF you can find a gunner). For example, with nearly max optimization skills in my large rail, shields, and small rails, I can manage to fit 2 complex shield extenders and a hardener (the FOTM of shield tanks atm), with a 20GJ particle cannon, a standard small rail, and a 80GJ particle cannon. With a CPU booster and PG booster (complex) in my lows. And with my current skills, I need to reevaluate my fitting as I have a bit left over still. But with this fit, the only thing I'm really missing over one that isn't fit with small guns, is my armor. Even still, given how PG intensive Extenders are, I still would need to fit a PG booster to manage the 2 complex extenders, IF I wanted to put some armor on. And no, AV does not rip through this build in the least. With a hardener up, swarm damage is minimal, forgers will need a reload, and other tanks struggle to break it. Pop 2 gunners in there and EVERYTHING dies. Don't underestimate how incredibly handy a gunner is against AV (A GOOD gunner that is). I am a defensive tanker so my focus is on HP not DPS, mainly because DPS means that you rely on active modules which have a hefty cool down even with the proper skills. Optimization helps but not enough as vehicles get some bonuses but nowhere near those that infantry units get which leaves a large gap to what we can and can't fit on our tanks which causes major issues when bridging the gap between being a DPS or a HP HAV which keeps HAV vs HAV in a good place while HAV vs AV is swayed heavily into the AV side of things because of the sheer number of people with FG's and Swarm launches as of right now and that number can only grow in the near future. Yes I know any tank can take down infantry but with the nerfs that have happened to the turrets lately it is getting a lot tougher and it's something that needs looked into. Pfffff defensive tanker..... just EHP stacking or Repper stacking...... good god I hate that CCP even allowed its player to think that was a legitimate strategy or fitting style. Explain how it's not a legitimate tactic/fitting style. It's the counter to anyone who tries to run a glass cannon aka a dps tank. I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!
Tread Loudly 2 D.A.R.K L.E.G.I.O.N D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 28	Posted - 2014.08.13 16:02:00 - [19] - Quote Bump! I Like Tanks, ADS's, and Ion Pistols!


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