DUST Search - Scouts should not have a light weapon slot

Onesimus Tarsus wrote:

Pokey Dravon wrote:

I feel the same way about this as I do Logistics. Scouts are for all intensive purposes a support class, much like Logistics. Granted they are probably more combat focused than Logistics, but support nonetheless. Indirect Combat should be part of the 'Support' Role, or in the Scout's case using speed and stealth to attack enemies from the flank or behind, rather than head on like a Heavy or Assault might.

That being said, reducing the Logistics or Scouts to Sidearm Only severely gimps them in that role of combat support, thus reducing the usefulness of their overall role on the battlefield. You might have a case if you wanted to remove their sidearm like the Logistics, but I feel removing their light weapon is a really poor idea.

Don't get me wrong, I think some additional changes need to be made to tweak the Scout's ability for direct head on combat, but removing the light weapon is not the proper way to go about doing that.

Yes, it is. Wow, it is easy to counter with an empty negative, I should do it more often.

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Duke Noobiam S.e.V.e.N. General Tso's Alliance 116	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:07:00 - [1] - Quote At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes How do you kill that which has no life?
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 2184	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:08:00 - [2] - Quote ... OR, crazy thought, make Assaults actually good at their role. Just spitballing here. We don't need lazy fixes. "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
Not Jason Pearson 68	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:09:00 - [3] - Quote Scout with Heavy Weapon. Not King of the Forums
Jack 3enimble Vengeance Unbound Dark Taboo 54	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:30:00 - [4] - Quote Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes Ehmm.. no
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2343	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:45:00 - [5] - Quote Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes It should always have been thus: Light suits: one light weapon, sidearm optional Scouts: one sidearm Medium suits: one light, one side Logis: one light, sidearm optional Assaults: two light slots, side optional in either Commandos: one heavy, one light, side optional in either, light optional in heavy slot Heavies: two heavies, lights optional, no sidearm option Sentinels: two heavies, no light options, no sidearm option Alas, the designers were bad baby-sitters, plying everyone with candy, and they couldn't say 'no' to piling weapons on everything. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6384	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:47:00 - [6] - Quote Totally 100% against this... Useful Links Aeon Amadi for CPM1
Luis rules 1st Valor Coalition Red Whines. 26	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:53:00 - [7] - Quote This is the perfect example why I don't usually read the forums.... There will always be some dumb idea out there waiting. "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe."
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2343	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:56:00 - [8] - Quote Luis rules 1st wrote: This is the perfect example why I don't usually read the forums.... There will always be some dumb idea out there waiting. "Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity; and I'm not sure about the the universe." You're telling us. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Scar Scrilla Escrow Removal and Acquisition Dark Taboo 304	Posted - 2014.07.22 14:57:00 - [9] - Quote Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes How would that help balance dropsuits? "Si tacuisses, philosophus mansisses" " ... or grab a shotgun and REs." - UN1TE
Duke Noobiam S.e.V.e.N. General Tso's Alliance 116	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:01:00 - [10] - Quote Scar Scrilla wrote: Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes How would that help balance dropsuits? I was against it at first, but think about it. 1. Scouts are the EWAR kings. They see every other suit on their tacnet and they are invisible to every other suit. Add cloaking to this and if you are not a newb you can move around without being seen. 2. Scouts have a tiny hit box. They are very hard to hit when they are straffing. 3. Scouts have a huge speed advantage. 4. Scouts do have fewer EHP than other classes, but the small hitbox makes this of little consequence. 5. Few people use the assault suits, because if you want to run around and slay (which is what the assault class is supposed to specialize in) you are much better off running a Scout. So how do we leave all those advantages to the scout yet make the assault attractive? Simple answer is to reduce the scout's firepower. Now the assault suit looks attractive again. Specific balance issues that this will address... 1. Scouts won't be able to sneak up on a group with a shotgun and get 3 one-shot kills before they start getting fired on. 2. This will enforce the idea that in war, you should be able to out-run what you can not outgun, and outgun what you can not outrun. How do you kill that which has no life?

Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 2448	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:18:00 - [11] - Quote I feel the same way about this as I do Logistics. Scouts are for all intensive purposes a support class, much like Logistics. Granted they are probably more combat focused than Logistics, but support nonetheless. Indirect Combat should be part of the 'Support' Role, or in the Scout's case using speed and stealth to attack enemies from the flank or behind, rather than head on like a Heavy or Assault might. That being said, reducing the Logistics or Scouts to Sidearm Only severely gimps them in that role of combat support, thus reducing the usefulness of their overall role on the battlefield. You might have a case if you wanted to remove their sidearm like the Logistics, but I feel removing their light weapon is a really poor idea. Don't get me wrong, I think some additional changes need to be made to tweak the Scout's ability for direct head on combat, but removing the light weapon is not the proper way to go about doing that. Like my ideas? Pokey Dravon for CPM1
Aeon Amadi Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 6386	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:33:00 - [12] - Quote Duke Noobiam wrote: Specific balance issues that this will address... 1. Scouts won't be able to sneak up on a group with a shotgun and get 3 one-shot kills before they start getting fired on. 2. This will enforce the idea that in war, you should be able to out-run what you can not outgun, and outgun what you can not outrun. Why is that functionality bad, exactly..? Useful Links Aeon Amadi for CPM1
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2343	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:38:00 - [13] - Quote Pokey Dravon wrote: I feel the same way about this as I do Logistics. Scouts are for all intensive purposes a support class, much like Logistics. Granted they are probably more combat focused than Logistics, but support nonetheless. Indirect Combat should be part of the 'Support' Role, or in the Scout's case using speed and stealth to attack enemies from the flank or behind, rather than head on like a Heavy or Assault might. That being said, reducing the Logistics or Scouts to Sidearm Only severely gimps them in that role of combat support, thus reducing the usefulness of their overall role on the battlefield. You might have a case if you wanted to remove their sidearm like the Logistics, but I feel removing their light weapon is a really poor idea. Don't get me wrong, I think some additional changes need to be made to tweak the Scout's ability for direct head on combat, but removing the light weapon is not the proper way to go about doing that. Yes, it is. Wow, it is easy to counter with an empty negative, I should do it more often. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Pokey Dravon OSG Planetary Operations Covert Intervention 2448	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:40:00 - [14] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Pokey Dravon wrote: I feel the same way about this as I do Logistics. Scouts are for all intensive purposes a support class, much like Logistics. Granted they are probably more combat focused than Logistics, but support nonetheless. Indirect Combat should be part of the 'Support' Role, or in the Scout's case using speed and stealth to attack enemies from the flank or behind, rather than head on like a Heavy or Assault might. That being said, reducing the Logistics or Scouts to Sidearm Only severely gimps them in that role of combat support, thus reducing the usefulness of their overall role on the battlefield. You might have a case if you wanted to remove their sidearm like the Logistics, but I feel removing their light weapon is a really poor idea. Don't get me wrong, I think some additional changes need to be made to tweak the Scout's ability for direct head on combat, but removing the light weapon is not the proper way to go about doing that. Yes, it is. Wow, it is easy to counter with an empty negative, I should do it more often. No sure if you're being sarcastic or... Like my ideas? Pokey Dravon for CPM1
Duke Noobiam S.e.V.e.N. General Tso's Alliance 119	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:44:00 - [15] - Quote Aeon Amadi wrote: Duke Noobiam wrote: Specific balance issues that this will address... 1. Scouts won't be able to sneak up on a group with a shotgun and get 3 one-shot kills before they start getting fired on. 2. This will enforce the idea that in war, you should be able to out-run what you can not outgun, and outgun what you can not outrun. Why is that functionality bad, exactly..? #1 is bad because it's imbalanced. #2 is how you achieve balance in these types of games. If you do not have balance, then 90% of the player base will use the best suit and the game suffers from a lack of diversity. How do you kill that which has no life?
Xocoyol Zaraoul Superior Genetics 2188	Posted - 2014.07.22 15:47:00 - [16] - Quote Would players still use a suit though if the only function was to "see" other non-scouts, and to (in the minnie case) hack? That much of a disadvantage in a gunfight means you now have a suit that won't be able to defend itself most of the time, and almost nobody is going to play that in an FPS. Stealth hacking is even impossible given the whole letter flashes like crazy while being hacked. "You see those red dots over there? Go and shoot them until you see a +50 on the screen" - Arkena Wyrnspire
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2343	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:03:00 - [17] - Quote Xocoyol Zaraoul wrote: Would players still use a suit though if the only function was to "see" other non-scouts, and to (in the minnie case) hack? That much of a disadvantage in a gunfight means you now have a suit that won't be able to defend itself most of the time, and almost nobody is going to play that in an FPS. Stealth hacking is even impossible given the whole letter flashes like crazy while being hacked. Fine. Scout suits won't get picked for combat... who cares? My Lord, it's like people pick the scout suit and then go, "What? Light and stealthy? Noooo!! Why can't this be like real life, where pickup trucks are sports cars are mini vans?" K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Cody Sietz SVER True Blood Dark Taboo 3666	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:05:00 - [18] - Quote Sure. Just as soon as you restrict heavies to heavy weapons and Logis to sidearm. Unless you wanna have the shotgun reclassified to a sidearm. "I do agree with you there though. shudders" -Arkena Wyrnspire
taxi bastard jihad taxi co. 160	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:07:00 - [19] - Quote It would make a lot more sence for the logi to have a side arm only, but both are bad idea's.
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4341	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:07:00 - [20] - Quote No no no! This guy is right yo! Scouts should not have a light weapon slot..... we should have a heavy weapon slot! Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!

Forever ETC Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 704	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:15:00 - [21] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: No no no! This guy is right yo! Scouts should not have a light weapon slot..... we should have a heavy weapon slot! Imagine a scout with forge gun, if he doesn't break his back from picking up the gun, he will surely fly over 300m after letting off the round. "Your forefathers fought alongside the Empire, it is your choice to follow them or not." Captain Dante to "Forever".
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4344	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:20:00 - [22] - Quote Forever ETC wrote: Bojo The Mighty wrote: No no no! This guy is right yo! Scouts should not have a light weapon slot..... we should have a heavy weapon slot! Imagine a scout with forge gun, if he doesn't break his back from picking up the gun, he will surely fly over 300m after letting off the round. We lift weights bro Fear the cloaked HMGers.... Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!
wiseguy12 Ancient Legion 42	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:22:00 - [23] - Quote This thread is in the wrong section and should be moved. *Eye of the Reaper*
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 6660	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:24:00 - [24] - Quote Is it possible to take someone's posting abilities away for being too idiotic? see you space cowboy...
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4344	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:27:00 - [25] - Quote Sgt Kirk wrote: Is it possible to take someone's posting abilities away for being too idiotic? If so, this forum would be reduced to twenty people Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2343	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:44:00 - [26] - Quote Bojo The Mighty wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Is it possible to take someone's posting abilities away for being too idiotic? If so, this forum would be reduced to twenty people And everyone here thinks they'd be among those twenty. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!
Bethhy Ancient Exiles. General Tso's Alliance 2269	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:45:00 - [27] - Quote Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes I KNOW HOW TO FIX DUST. WE JUST NERF EVERYTHING. How about we try something else? How about we buff things up to a base level... instead of being a complete tool. Being able to customize any suit into anything is a hard concept for the people literally born into the CoD era. But that is what makes this game great. The ability to customize with near endless combinations. Everything else in this game is offered better on other games.
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution 6662	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:49:00 - [28] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes I KNOW HOW TO FIX DUST. WE JUST NERF EVERYTHING. How about we try something else? How about we buff things up to a base level... instead of being a complete tool. Being able to customize any suit into anything is a hard concept for the people literally born into the CoD era. But that is what makes this game great. The ability to customize with near endless combinations. Everything else in this game is offered better on other games. I honestly believe the CoD era gamer is exactly what's wrong with the gaming industry today, see you space cowboy...
Bojo The Mighty Spaceman Drug Cartel-Uno 4350	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:50:00 - [29] - Quote Onesimus Tarsus wrote: Bojo The Mighty wrote: Sgt Kirk wrote: Is it possible to take someone's posting abilities away for being too idiotic? If so, this forum would be reduced to twenty people And everyone here thinks they'd be among those twenty. No exception Just as long as the dice keep rollin, the hoes keep hoein, and the money keeps flowin!
Onesimus Tarsus Company of Marcher Lords Amarr Empire 2343	Posted - 2014.07.22 16:54:00 - [30] - Quote Bethhy wrote: Duke Noobiam wrote: At first I didn't like this idea, but the more I think about it, the more I think this is the way to fix both the Scout and the Assault classes I KNOW HOW TO FIX DUST. WE JUST NERF EVERYTHING. How about we try something else? How about we buff things up to a base level... instead of being a complete tool. Being able to customize any suit into anything is a hard concept for the people literally born into the CoD era. But that is what makes this game great. The ability to customize with near endless combinations. Everything else in this game is offered better on other games. That's why every suit should be a light suit with infinite slots and pg/cpu, right? See, at some point, it becomes ridiculous fiddling and redundancy. K/D(r) WP/D(r) matchmaking fixes the whole game. Period. Beh!



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