DUST Search - Hotfix Delta

Poonmunch wrote:

If you want to reduce redline sniping consider a few things.

1. Make more perches inside the intended combat area. I'll play them. Having said this, I don't routinely redline and I get killed lots by guys running up to me when I'm hacking or drawing a bead on a red.

2. Increase the redline timer, so people can try to hunt me if they want to. God knows if people can get close to me I'm pretty much meat on a stick because a sniper rifle has got no hipfire accuracy and I'll die too fast to a rapid fire weapon.

**********

But you have to address some things that all snipers agree are problems.

1. Crappy damage output from the low and mid-tier sniper rifles. It makes it too hard to claw your way from militia to proto. Way harder than the other weapon types.

2. Headshots with sniper rifles should kill any suit in one shot. Headshots are skill shots and should be rewarded as such.

3. Forcing us into the ck.0 commando/charge sniper rifle/3complex damage mods niche so we can function against other proto and brick tanked suits is too narrow a choice. The commando is an ok suit but it doesn't run too fast. This promotes camping. Where are the safest places to camp? Behind the redline, perchance?

4. Anyone thinking that fukking with sniper rifle range is a solution to any sniper-related problems is asking us to leave the game.

5. Please clean up the zoomed in scope. It's far too busy. A simple crosshair will do nicely. Then I can take the thread crosshair I made off of my TV. The frosted edge is cool and it can stay.

**********

I'm going to be following the upcoming sniper-related changes for hotfix delta very, very closely. I hope to hear and give good, balanced feedback.

There are legitimate concerns on both sides of the sniper scope.

Munch


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Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 135	Posted - 2014.07.10 12:22:00 - [1] - Quote this is a bit early, lol they haven't even finished charlie yet. the main thing is that it needs a buff to headshot damage, although I don't mind having to two shot tankers with my charge. (assuming headshots) as for the thales in the red line, I'm calling it now..... EXPECT a range nerf! it will be in delta.... you have been forwarned. I just hope they don't go too severe I'd like to see it just an effective range nerf. and up to 400-450m (300m will be ridiculous) also in light of needing to be closer I'd like to see the charge rifles charge time reduced by about a quarter, the tactical rifle made into a more tactical weapon so made for quicker shooting at reduced ranges. leading to both an overwatch style of sniping and a tactical style. another thing that has already been suggested elsewhere is an ammo reduction. if we go this route I'd like to see the ammo skill come into play and become at least an extra round per level. (personally I'd say per clip too, leading to players being skilled into it more lethal than those who aren't) I would also suggest that officer variants become level 4 proficiency to be able to use (level 5 even for me) this will stop players who aren't serious about sniping becoming more red line thales users. (just a suggestion) Mostly as long as I get my headshot bonus damage and the nerfs that ARE coming aren't severe pendulum swings then i'll be looking forward to delta.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 139	Posted - 2014.07.11 23:08:00 - [2] - Quote Don't get me wrong, I don't want or really agree with a range reduction but I've seen the only sniper thread that has had dev attention in the form of ccp rattati, and I'm telling you all EXPECT range reduction. and I would suggest every sniper that has an opinion should be asking now that it only effects effective range (so long distance headshots will still work but body shots just wont.) I say this because the alternative WILL be absolute range nerfs I don't particularly care what suit the sniper is fitted for but I will say that if the suit changes and I don't get a respec to suit I really won't play on dust anymore, that will be it. given that I was almost forced into using the commando suit because of it's bonus I don't think that this should be changed now. I Actually agree with lower tier sniper rifles being poor, it's kind of like being an apprentice... only those who really want to snipe will be willing to put in the effort for eventual reward, anybody not serious about sniping will "drop out". having people who are poor players and just want to have an easy mode are one of the things that really hurts snipers on dust so we need to discourage them, but not so drastically as to stop players that genuinely want to snipe I like the idea of increasing the death timer on red line ventures (it will also mean that we will see how long it takes these "red line players aren't fair" people to start abusing a mechanic placed there for them. I'm guessing not long.) I don't think that damage mods should be taken into account when looking at sniper rifles, but I can understand why they are my main issue here is that it limits options but lets be honest as a sniper the majority will always play for extra damage.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 141	Posted - 2014.07.12 14:42:00 - [3] - Quote "sniper rifles are just low risk low reward weapons" erm, no. they are not working as intended. sniper rifles are low risk weapons.. ok if you say so. I was writing out another long winded rebuttal to this statement but really I can't be bothered. if you think they are so low risk then try running around with one. the real point here is that it's agreed that the sniper rifles aren,t where they are supposed to be and that is why they are getting reviewed for delta comments such as this aren't particularly productive and are ranked up there with classics such as "fix red line snipers", etc. lets try to make something usable here for the upcoming changes. although that said this really is very early.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 144	Posted - 2014.07.13 18:37:00 - [4] - Quote [quote=Skyline Lonewolf] Nice. pay attention folks this is how to say it! "Can't say that a sniper on a tower or in the red isn't at as much of a risk" doesn't change the facts. 90% of the time in any kind of direct combat the sniper is defenceless. if a heavy or a scout, or as of Charlie an assault does get behind you whilst you are ads you lose a clone. no ifs or buts. if they jump out of a dropship whilst your defending yourself against dropships with say a swarm.. goodnight. or lets say you use a rail rifle for your second.. then they'll probably just stay in their ads when they come for you. good luck destroying those with your rifles. There are plenty of positions that I use where even a tiniest little error in judgement means dying, just getting set up! and that's without even mentioning snipers low risk indeed. what you mean to say is that they are low risk until the reds decide you are worth bothering to deal with... I'm sure there IS a reason that you haven't lost a single thales cat.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 197	Posted - 2014.07.16 18:08:00 - [5] - Quote Poonmunch wrote: If you want to reduce redline sniping consider a few things. 1. Make more perches inside the intended combat area. I'll play them. Having said this, I don't routinely redline and I get killed lots by guys running up to me when I'm hacking or drawing a bead on a red. 2. Increase the redline timer, so people can try to hunt me if they want to. God knows if people can get close to me I'm pretty much meat on a stick because a sniper rifle has got no hipfire accuracy and I'll die too fast to a rapid fire weapon. ******** But you have to address some things that all snipers agree are problems. 1. Crappy damage output from the low and mid-tier sniper rifles. It makes it too hard to claw your way from militia to proto. Way harder than the other weapon types. 2. Headshots with sniper rifles should kill any suit in one shot. Headshots are skill shots and should be rewarded as such. 3. Forcing us into the ck.0 commando/charge sniper rifle/3complex damage mods niche so we can function against other proto and brick tanked suits is too narrow a choice. The commando is an ok suit but it doesn't run too fast. This promotes camping. Where are the safest places to camp? Behind the redline, perchance? 4. Anyone thinking that fukking with sniper rifle range is a solution to any sniper-related problems is asking us to leave the game. 5. Please clean up the zoomed in scope. It's far too busy. A simple crosshair will do nicely. Then I can take the thread crosshair I made off of my TV. The frosted edge is cool and it can stay. ******** I'm going to be following the upcoming sniper-related changes for hotfix delta very, very closely. I hope to hear and give good, balanced feedback. There are legitimate concerns on both sides of the sniper scope. Munch nice poonmunch, . some great points again, I agree and will be doing likewise
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 234	Posted - 2014.08.02 15:01:00 - [6] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Just so we'll be clear, I am against snipers being able to kill non stupid targets (I.E targets that don't stand still and don't cross open fields under sniper fire) while at the same time being impossible to kill without another sniper or an assault dropship. If I can use stealth to get close and pump a shotgun into your face, I do not care if you can one shot my scout or two shot my assault. That's still me leaving the frontlines just to kill you. Wasting time that could be used on taking a point to kill specifically you. So... yeah, fair's fair. So you think that snipers are impossible to kill until you get them with your shotgun. Erm.. Slight contradiction there. You should of stopped at I am against snipers. That is the truth. You clearly want to say that you think that snipers should not be a part of dust and so lost all credibility here. As to them being a waste of your time to go deal with... Would you say the same of any other tactical decision? Eg changing to av to destroy enemy vehicles? As for not losing any Thames, i'd stop saying that if I were you. You are advertising that no enemy has ever bothered to hunt you down even when you use a thales! That's not a good thing.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 236	Posted - 2014.08.02 20:56:00 - [7] - Quote The headshot damage is not right when a sniper rifle does less damage on a headshot than a pistol! stop using excuses to keep snipers down, nobody here is saying that we want to be sniping from the red line. (i'm getting really tired of saying this on every bloody sniper thread. somebody else start now ) what we are saying is that there needs to be range and decent positions for snipers. we don't want them to be inside the red line, we didn't design the maps or the red line mechanics. when there are positions that are not in the red line that are usable they are much better and are standard go to places, but there are maps where there are no options. Snipers are a joke right now and it is time to fix it.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 240	Posted - 2014.08.03 16:42:00 - [8] - Quote So now then shall we get back to topic folks? i doubt that there is any point in asking for realistic ballistics on snipers, that would require new game mechanics. it would also mean that for balance, we would need to add it to all weapons. and with it being a rail gun, i doubt that we even know the realistic ballistics, even then after all that. the modern day snipers can hit something hand sized from 600-800 meters if they know what they are doing. so lets not worry too much about realism right now. so what would you like them to change for us? 10 things i personally would like 1 the head shot damage to be improved 2 the rendering issues to fixed 3 the charge rifle noise to be changed 4 the charge rifles base damage to increase slightly 5 a reduction in the charge time 6 damage mods to not be included in creating the profiles for sniper rifles 7 a scan/tag system to be introduced for snipers 8 adjustable scopes 9 a greater difference between the charge, normal, and tactical sniper rifles. 10 for the ammo skill to be changed into a skill that is actually worth putting points into. This may seem like alot to ask for, but that really depends on how much of it you expect to actually get... so go ahead folks, lets see some lists.
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 244	Posted - 2014.08.04 23:25:00 - [9] - Quote Symbioticforks wrote: You call nerfing damage mods balance? Snipers lost 10-12% damage from that change not too long ago. That change had nothing to do with snipers. A minimum of a 10% damage increase to snipers is something they likely deserve. (Meaning the 10% bonus from Caldari Commando at prototype would be an actual bonus. Instead of damage retainment.) amongst other things like an increased headshot multiplier, which also won't help red line snipers.. not that they're important, because honestly you're deceiving yourself if you think they're an issue. too true.... we "gained" a 10% buff "if" we use a calmando suit at the exact same time as we lost at least 10% on sniper fits therefore losing the ability to chose our own suits and fit outs to keep roughly the same level of damage at the around this time armour mods got a good buff and ttk went up. this was effectively a nerf make no mistake there is one and only one decent sniper fit. and even then it only has a choice of two rifles to be effective. unless its for p.c in which case it's only one rifle which you cannot buy. all this happened after various other stealth nerfs, one of which was the removal of vantage points inside maps non red line areas. (at that time it was pointed out this would lead to worse red line activity)
Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 253	Posted - 2014.08.06 17:24:00 - [10] - Quote Bumping back to the top, and please folks try to keep it constructive.

Snake Sellors Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 265	Posted - 2014.08.08 14:21:00 - [11] - Quote The other issue is the fact that most people who cry about the red line snipers really mean that they don't like snipers. even if we completely removed the red line they would still spout bs about snipers. I completely agree with you symbiotic if you reduce the ranges on sniper rifles, head glitching, red line sniping etc will all get worse because the sniper in the red line will be able to maintain their position whilst watching the counter sniper trying to get into range, every time. which will in turn mean that very few will bother to counter snipe at all and the guy who is head glitchin on a hill in the red line will be free to do as he choses. as for the people who think that snipers should be ground units, etc. that would be the work of marksmen rifles which are basically the sr and lr in dust. (accurate, mid-long range and deadly if used right.)