or reducing it.

No no I have emotion, but all positive and giddy. rofl.

What i am saying by the statements seem to have tension is that your premise says

"I want to make gal the only one truly unscannable"

the problem is the move from 5% to 10% conflicts with this premise in that it allows min and amarr min/maxing to get under all scans as well. Which is what i advocate for until you can properly revisit e-war in a more comprehensive manner.

considering it's 5 seconds and has an enormous cooldown and can only hit a limited range and radius, I disagree.

If you want to be immune to a maxed out end all be all scanner from 1 suit in the game...then you will have to sacrifice.

Otherwise...put on 2 damps to get under the rest and deal with the 5 second scans from that 1 suit.

Except cal. In my estimation they could not be truly unscannable and I love that.

They are the master scanners but gave up the ability to be truly unscannable in the process.

Plus balancing for you to be Uber unscannable with only 2 lows would be difficult.

And all three aside from the cal WILL be able to choose to be unscannable, but at a cost my friend.

In 1.7 meta the focused was a tiny bit too strong but it was really close to the right place.

Just because a scout was picked up for 5 seconds is not the end of the world.

And if they don't want 2 be picked up even by that, then they can choose to make a large sacrifice to get under it.

And that if they manage to pick you up with the damn things limited range and radius in the first place.

Oh golly, listen brosef.

I disagree a cal scout should be unscannable when it only has 2 low slots. I just do.

For the reasons stated.

Currently all 4 can get under all scans if i'm correct.

and after this patch you will be able to continue getting under focused scans if you sacrifice.

Which is what we're saying will happen...are you drunk? O_O

Aside from cal scout (which sacrificed the ability to be COMPLETELY unscannable) all the rest will be able to avoid every scan.

I want my cal SCOUT unscanable
As if no then im biomassing
Only having 1 role is booring
My cal SCOUT
Will be an underpowered SCOUT, so it's not a scout but a scanner that can never be used for stealth because ccp wants to make useless for a SCOUT.
Inb4 gal scout spam.

put the nerf mjinor down before someone gets hurt

To recap and please don't derail this

Cloak Dampening 0-5-10 STD-ADV-PRO

MM, AM, GA are unscannable if PRO cloaked with additional dampeners.

what does the GA scout dampening bonus of 25% need to be reduced by so GA scouts still have an advantage as the best stealth suit, without being OP? Take into account that the 3 hp/s is also making it very OP and that may be reduced and/or eliminated as well.


Please only answer that question for the time being.

Thanks

You don't understand do you? If you went into the Caldari scout thinking you'd be unscannable then that's your fault. If you really think every single scout should be able to be unscannable then go do us a favor and go biomass.

Let me just put this

The biggest part of giving feedback is not being biased.Zatara, Moody and a fair amount of other players who play DUST at a competitive level want everything to be useable in competitive environment.

You have no idea how much of a drag it is to play PC every day. Against the same 3-4 corps. All using the same 3-4 suits. If everything was usable in a competitive environment we wouldn't see this. We'd have variety and along with that much more fun. This is why so many people loved 1.8 despite the many broken things that came along with it. We saw so much more variety on the field. So please, when you think about giving feedback in the future, forget about every single thing you're specced into it helps a lot.

*Sigh* A scout isn't necessarily about never being seen and if you're seen by a scout than so be it, you likely see him. I'm done replying to you as you completely skipped over any meaningful part of my post in order to find the one thing you can form the slightest opinion about.

pretty sure this thread was explicitly made to butcher the gall scout.

Please do the anti-thesis of whatever he just said. I really want to see em biomass over something so silly. Threatening CCP that you'll biomass if you don't get your way, LOL!

Silliness aside, should all scouts have the capacity to be immune from all forms of detection? Is it good for balance? Keep in mind that scouts are not ninjas, they're "a soldier or other person sent out ahead of a main force so as to gather information about the enemy's position, strength, or movements." There might be a good reasoning for doing it, but I haven't seen it yet. Please direct me to a good supporting argument if you know of one.

Currently scouts have the best base stats for detection and evading detection. Perhaps we should change the base stats so that we have 2 scouts good at evading scans and the other 2 scouts good at detection? Just a brain fart.

I would also like to take the time to remind CCP Rattati that balance and making people happy are two separate things. Keep up the good work, I'm loving the interaction between players and DEVs.

WTF...people still in here when we already established the pmemise of min being able to go full undetectable. -_-;;

@ Zatara
Beating scans isn't "have cake and eat it too" for a 250hp Scout; it is simply survival. A scanned Scout is a dead Scout (unless he's hp tanked).

@ Rattati
The problem is a 600+ hp Scout beating scans. The proposed nerf-package is overkill. It will not permit stealth units enough free space to perform useful function. No room for Biotics, Scans, Hacks.

Suggestion:
Lvl(5) Scout + 2 cmp damps + proto cloak (on) = *unscannable
* Exceptions: CalScout w/4 cmp precision; max GalLogi w/duvolle focused

Reasoning:
Solves the problem without creating new problems.

In summary

Overall we generally agree that
1)GA scout could fit too much because of his native dampening
2)GA scout also got a free repair module on top of that
3)GA passive scan bonus doesnt necessarily make sense for role
4)CA scouts passive scan (fondly known as wallhacking) a tad too much
5)Cloak gameplay with dampening is a key factor in fun ewar
6)The need to specialize is enforced in a big way with power graduation
7)To not force equipment selection by having built in scout bonuses for the cloak specifically (such as duration for GA)


Cloak keeps dampening, and at better rates than we originally proposed, 0-5-10 instead of 0-2.5-5
*GA scout damp bonus to 3% per level instead of 5% for a maximum bonus of 15%
*Reducing CA passive scan to 3% from 5%
*Reducing GA passive scan to 1% from 5% (I would think this gets changed to something more fitting later)
*Reducing GA regen to 1/hp from 3/hp
*Duration changes stay the same as original proposal with the same recharge ratio as the old cloak

Updated Hotfix Alpha Numbers

No changes to shared group scans
No changes to Gallogi FS, it is a very narrow scan with a limited steatlh counter by another role than CA scouts. I want to see how that plays out.
No changes so bonuses affect modules fitted (a much bigger change)


I have updated the google docs accordingly

I am going to say this now and most of you are not going to like it.

The idea of a mechanic invulnerability through ingame things should not or ever been a thing. The game of absolutions is not eve themed for the universe enough to warrant such gimmicks. While you can point to the cloak being this way in eve; you have to remember this is a long time problem along with local in null that has turned into a deadlocked feature planning on resolution.

Just because you got 0.001+ over another players counter number shouldn't account for this slight margin of error; this is the whole reason why sharpshooter was removed in the first place and weapon falloff was brought in.

Scanners and Detection should follow a similar route to eve's lock system. Greater the differences in scan vs stealth the longer it takes for one to appear on that target's radar; this will ultimately require a rebranding work on acceptable detection rates at various sizes/roles as well as sensor falloff strength for those sizes/roles as well as detection speeds expected. A heavy could be blind as a bat but if a scout stays behind him for a minute he may just get noticed. Throw damps on and you will not get seen as quickly as someone who is in the nude. Perform an action and mayhaps increase the rate of detection (firing your gun/ activating your ability) While this type of idea is likely impossible for dust 514. Don't expect the thinking of absolutions to survive into Legion.