DUST Search - Why new players quit, and why this game will fail because of it.

N1ck Comeau wrote:

Bruttuss Brutor wrote:

They Quit because there's no match making system. They start at the academy, and think this game is pretty cool. And then when they get out of the Academy, (usually after 1 match), they get crushed by all prototype gear players.

Some people will say, well that's how the game was designed. Or they don't care about the amount of new players dust gets, but I bet money CCP cares about getting new players to stick around, but they take advice from vets who have never been on the other side.

They started on a level playing field and worked there way up, side by side and now there at the top of the food chain. I'm not mad at them, there just playing the game how it was designed, but if CCP want's this game to succeed, they will have to make a match making system.

I started playing this game about 6 mounts ago, and am now around 15 million lifetime skill points, so I know what its like to have to climb that ladder. It's very very difficult and takes a long time. Me I like a challenge, so I endured and pushed forward, even though I got my a*s kicked a lot those first few months and now it was worth it, but must people play a few matches and say this is crazy.

and there right, being honest about it, cause they will just go play a different game where they don't get massickered every game. But that's the way the vets like it, so CCP for some reason doesn't change it. But if they wont this game to move forward, they must put in place a match making system of some kind.

Do you think vets would stick around if you made a few of them start over as new players and play with 90% proto players, HELL NO, they would put down the controller and say (this game needs some sort of match making system) or they just wouldn't play, just like new players, but they would never admit that because that would never happen and most of them really don't care if this game succeeds or not.

CCP- you have to do something. I really love this game and want it to succeed but if you don't do something and do it fast, its gonna fail. Nobody should have to go through all the BS just to have fun on a game, and they wont.

your welcome

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Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 4	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:00:00 - [1] - Quote They Quit because there's no match making system. They start at the academy, and think this game is pretty cool. And then when they get out of the Academy, (usually after 1 match), they get crushed by all prototype gear players. Some people will say, well that's how the game was designed. Or they don't care about the amount of new players dust gets, but I bet money CCP cares about getting new players to stick around, but they take advice from vets who have never been on the other side. They started on a level playing field and worked there way up, side by side and now there at the top of the food chain. I'm not mad at them, there just playing the game how it was designed, but if CCP want's this game to succeed, they will have to make a match making system. I started playing this game about 6 mounts ago, and am now around 15 million lifetime skill points, so I know what its like to have to climb that ladder. It's very very difficult and takes a long time. Me I like a challenge, so I endured and pushed forward, even though I got my a*s kicked a lot those first few months and now it was worth it, but must people play a few matches and say this is crazy. and there right, being honest about it, cause they will just go play a different game where they don't get massickered every game. But that's the way the vets like it, so CCP for some reason doesn't change it. But if they wont this game to move forward, they must put in place a match making system of some kind. Do you think vets would stick around if you made a few of them start over as new playes and play with 90% proto players, HELL NO, they would put down the controller and say (this game needs some sort of match making system) or they just wouldn't play, just like new players, but they would never admit that because that would never happen and most of them really don't care if this game succeeds or not. CCP- you have to do something. I really love this game and want it to succeed but if you don't do something and do it fast, its gonna fail. Nobody should have to go through all the BS just to have fun on a game, and they wont.
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2424	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:11:00 - [2] - Quote paragraphs or TL;DR please Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 2085	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:13:00 - [3] - Quote i'd advise you to edit this, as a wall of text like this one can be quite a pain to read. judging by the thread's title though, i'm willing to bet it's nothing we haven't heard a million times already. Anime > EVERYTHING
P14GU3 The Southern Legion Final Resolution. 601	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:14:00 - [4] - Quote CCP is working on it we've been told. They are atleast aware of this issue. Use the search function, there are many threads already made about this exact subject. Yeah, i run an Amarr logi with a mass driver.. what are YOU going to do about it?
N1ck Comeau Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 2555	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:14:00 - [5] - Quote Bruttuss Brutor wrote: They Quit because there's no match making system. They start at the academy, and think this game is pretty cool. And then when they get out of the Academy, (usually after 1 match), they get crushed by all prototype gear players. Some people will say, well that's how the game was designed. Or they don't care about the amount of new players dust gets, but I bet money CCP cares about getting new players to stick around, but they take advice from vets who have never been on the other side. They started on a level playing field and worked there way up, side by side and now there at the top of the food chain. I'm not mad at them, there just playing the game how it was designed, but if CCP want's this game to succeed, they will have to make a match making system. I started playing this game about 6 mounts ago, and am now around 15 million lifetime skill points, so I know what its like to have to climb that ladder. It's very very difficult and takes a long time. Me I like a challenge, so I endured and pushed forward, even though I got my as kicked a lot those first few months and now it was worth it, but must people play a few matches and say this is crazy. and there right, being honest about it, cause they will just go play a different game where they don't get massickered every game. But that's the way the vets like it, so CCP for some reason doesn't change it. But if they wont this game to move forward, they must put in place a match making system of some kind. Do you think vets would stick around if you made a few of them start over as new players and play with 90% proto players, HELL NO, they would put down the controller and say (this game needs some sort of match making system) or they just wouldn't play, just like new players, but they would never admit that because that would never happen and most of them really don't care if this game succeeds or not. CCP- you have to do something. I really love this game and want it to succeed but if you don't do something and do it fast, its gonna fail. Nobody should have to go through all the BS just to have fun on a game, and they wont. your welcome If you run cloak and shotgun, you're a scrub Don't brick tank that scout, come on, get good. Proud member of RND*
Mike De Luca Storm Wind Strikeforce Caldari State 20	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:16:00 - [6] - Quote Now waiting for the lovely circular arguement of...."We don't have the player base to support that." "But we need it so people stick around!" "But.....we don't have the playerbase to support that."
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 4	Posted - 2014.04.27 15:28:00 - [7] - Quote N1ck Comeau wrote: Bruttuss Brutor wrote: They Quit because there's no match making system. They start at the academy, and think this game is pretty cool. And then when they get out of the Academy, (usually after 1 match), they get crushed by all prototype gear players. Some people will say, well that's how the game was designed. Or they don't care about the amount of new players dust gets, but I bet money CCP cares about getting new players to stick around, but they take advice from vets who have never been on the other side. They started on a level playing field and worked there way up, side by side and now there at the top of the food chain. I'm not mad at them, there just playing the game how it was designed, but if CCP want's this game to succeed, they will have to make a match making system. I started playing this game about 6 mounts ago, and am now around 15 million lifetime skill points, so I know what its like to have to climb that ladder. It's very very difficult and takes a long time. Me I like a challenge, so I endured and pushed forward, even though I got my a*s kicked a lot those first few months and now it was worth it, but must people play a few matches and say this is crazy. and there right, being honest about it, cause they will just go play a different game where they don't get massickered every game. But that's the way the vets like it, so CCP for some reason doesn't change it. But if they wont this game to move forward, they must put in place a match making system of some kind. Do you think vets would stick around if you made a few of them start over as new players and play with 90% proto players, HELL NO, they would put down the controller and say (this game needs some sort of match making system) or they just wouldn't play, just like new players, but they would never admit that because that would never happen and most of them really don't care if this game succeeds or not. CCP- you have to do something. I really love this game and want it to succeed but if you don't do something and do it fast, its gonna fail. Nobody should have to go through all the BS just to have fun on a game, and they wont. your welcome Thanks
ThePlayerkyle13 The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 114	Posted - 2014.04.27 16:26:00 - [8] - Quote TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote: i'd advise you to edit this, as a wall of text like this one can be quite a pain to read. judging by the thread's title though, i'm willing to bet it's nothing we haven't heard a million times already. It's not a Wall of Text, if he spaced them out in paragraphs
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 12784	Posted - 2014.04.27 16:29:00 - [9] - Quote ThePlayerkyle13 wrote: TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote: i'd advise you to edit this, as a wall of text like this one can be quite a pain to read. judging by the thread's title though, i'm willing to bet it's nothing we haven't heard a million times already. It's not a Wall of Text, if he spaced them out in paragraphs When Biscuit posted that it was still in wall of text format, without spaces. Notice the 'edited' tag on the OP's post. OP has a point. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. Oh, forums
LEHON Xeon Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 468	Posted - 2014.04.27 16:56:00 - [10] - Quote Well, I was someone who came from the bottom and worked my way up. Granted I had a much longer Academy time than new players do now. What is now is ridiculous, with only 1200 WP or whatever it was. When I first arrived at Dust about a year ago it was 25,000 WP. I learned everything myself in this game, and got stomped relentlessly for some time, but eventually I just worked my way through it. Plus I'm someone who comes back from the older gaming era in which games actually were challenging (Atari and SNES generation ) and required you to spend several months in order to beat them (and no there weren't help guides like there are today), so I had the drive to want to keep going in Dust because it appealed to me as something which was finally challenging. Most new players aren't going to put in that immense amount of time. It is no wonder that they constantly leave. Academy needs to be extended by a huge timeframe. With the SP barriers new players are presented with, Academy should be more than double the time it was when I first joined even. Then there's also the match making fix. We should not be having matches where it's a whole bunch of randoms against two organized squads. Always the last person to leave. Always the one cleaning up people's messes.

Doctor Day EoN Minmatar 141	Posted - 2014.04.27 17:36:00 - [11] - Quote Easy way to fix? Have them spawn in one of those corps who helps new players and then tell them how to use chat channels BOOOM in yo faceeeee Obvious troll is Obvious TROLOLOLOLOL HEAR MY MIGHTY TROLOLOLOL
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 5	Posted - 2014.04.27 17:56:00 - [12] - Quote yes yes. Im so sorry guys. I didn't use paragraphs. Will you please forgive me.
Darken-Sol BIG BAD W0LVES Canis Eliminatus Operatives 1299	Posted - 2014.04.27 17:57:00 - [13] - Quote Bruttuss Brutor wrote: yes yes. Im so sorry guys. I didn't use paragraphs. Will you please forgive me. no. It is unforgivable. Your sons will bear your shame as well. Crush them
Alex-P-Keaton Kramer Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 103	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:01:00 - [14] - Quote this thread is redundant and stupid and the person who made it should not only feel bad about it, but ashamed and embarassed about it as well http://i58.tinypic.com/15f3muh.png http://i57.tinypic.com/301n33b.jpg http://i58.tinypic.com/30c4pwk.jpg
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 5	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:03:00 - [15] - Quote Alex-P-Keaton Kramer wrote: this thread is redundant and stupid and the person who made it should not only feel bad about it, but ashamed and embarassed about it as well Thanks for reading it.
David Mustane D3M3NT3D M1NDZ 1	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:06:00 - [16] - Quote I'm a new player(only 5.2 Mil SP), and I'm already searching for a new game to play. The game is broken and unbalanced, especially to new players. It was a grand concept, be something more than an everyday FPS. CCP failed at this though, its just like any other FPS for a new player. When my first battle was a proto stomp i should have stopped there, but i figured in a few mil i might come up with something. Yeah, there is no point in trying. The bad match making is somewhat to blame, but all the vets and proto stompers are the real reason this game is dying. you can only die so much before you give up. The blame lays with CCP and the **** poor(I can never lose) proto stompers.
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 5	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:11:00 - [17] - Quote David Mustane wrote: I'm a new player(only 5.2 Mil SP), and I'm already searching for a new game to play. The game is broken and unbalanced, especially to new players. It was a grand concept, be something more than an everyday FPS. CCP failed at this though, its just like any other FPS for a new player. When my first battle was a proto stomp i should have stopped there, but i figured in a few mil i might come up with something. Yeah, there is no point in trying. The bad match making is somewhat to blame, but all the vets and proto stompers are the real reason this game is dying. you can only die so much before you give up. The blame lays with CCP and the **** poor(I can never lose) proto stompers. You see!!! And this will only continue, and that's why I fell something needs to be done.
Dunk Mujunk RestlessSpirits 782	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:12:00 - [18] - Quote 400 WP academy graduate here. Been around since the end of last July. I did my research here on these forums when I started and I knew I was going to be in for a beat down when I started. Even with a smidge under 25 mil sp Dust is no cake walk, and you are going to get your ass beat from time to time no matter how much sp you have. The painful truth is there just aren't many people who want to play a style of game requiring such heavy amounts of team work. If you took a totally fresh new player, slapped them in a logi suit and had them rack up 2000 WP and a kdr of 0/8, they would quit the same as they do with barely any wp. The people who enjoy this style of game will stay no matter how rough they have it on their way to large sp amounts. The rest willgo back to CoD where they don't need team work and the matches last 2 minutes. There is a reason a large portion of the MAG community has found sanctuary here in Dust, and there is a reason people who try and hide in corners and refuse to work with a team only last a few games. Nobody fcks monkeys AND people you idiot.You either fck monkeys, or you fck people.Theres no in between. Dave Chappelle
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 5	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:21:00 - [19] - Quote I run solo most of the time and do ok with cheap gear to make profit. If I run solo in proto, I can go 20 and 0 easy, but I do this in a dropsuit, not in a tank or ADS. Just saying that you can play this game either way, but I do understand what your saying though.
Nirwanda Vaughns 426th Infantry 603	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:23:00 - [20] - Quote there deffinitly needs to be some form of restricted suits/vehicles gamemode. something that both vets and new players can go into to help them get used to things (as well as fixing th ematch making) i proposed a security status based selection similar to EVE where you select where you want combat to take place based on security status of system 1.0-0.5 MLT/STD infantry only no vehicles 0.4-0.1 upto and including ADV plus LAVs 0.0 Anything goes. yes vets will have more SP than newbs and will have a slight advantage even in MLT/STD gear but it wouldn't be as much of a stomp. in CoD/BF the weaponry is all very similar. a new player can still kill a lv50/100 vet. a good fps gamer will have a better chance with 1m sp over a terrible fps gamer (liek myself) with 50m sp even if i have extra shield and armor hp Rolling with the punches

Maciej Szambelan Made in Poland... E-R-A 50	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:30:00 - [21] - Quote 1 room for rookies with up to 5mln sp, second room for players with up to 15, third for players with 15 and more and one open room for everyone and the problem sorted
Dunk Mujunk RestlessSpirits 783	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:33:00 - [22] - Quote Passives have a much larger effect than gear. Matches forcing low end gear on players would still see vets dominate. And from what i've been understanding there is a place where vets and noobs can fight on equal ground. Its called the Battle Academy. Nobody fcks monkeys AND people you idiot.You either fck monkeys, or you fck people.Theres no in between. Dave Chappelle
Thumb Green The Valyrian Guard 992	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:34:00 - [23] - Quote Actually there is a match making system, it's called Scotty. The funny thing is, we had better match making when there was no match making system. It's fcked up that we had a better chance of getting balanced teams when we were thrown randomly into matches. Support Orbital Spawns
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 5	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:36:00 - [24] - Quote These are all good ideas, if CCP would listen. Maybe they will, maybe they won't, but at least I tried.
ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals Seituoda Taskforce Command 1002	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:41:00 - [25] - Quote I have never heard this before. AVERT YOUR EYES!
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 6	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:42:00 - [26] - Quote ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote: I have never heard this before. Do you want anything done about it?
Bruttuss Brutor ZERO TAX MERCS 6	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:43:00 - [27] - Quote Bruttuss Brutor wrote: ZeHealingHurts HurtingHeals wrote: I have never heard this before. Do you want anything done about it? But from what I keep hearing, maybe your right. Maybe I should give up to.
Maciej Szambelan Made in Poland... E-R-A 50	Posted - 2014.04.27 18:48:00 - [28] - Quote Dunk Mujunk wrote: Passives have a much larger effect than gear. Matches forcing low end gear on players would still see vets dominate. And from what i've been understanding there is a place where vets and noobs can fight on equal ground. Its called the Battle Academy. I agree, but if you had more then 5 mln sp you would not be able to play with rookies anyway..
R F Gyro Clones 4u 1322	Posted - 2014.04.27 19:04:00 - [29] - Quote I think CCP are fully aware that their new player experience sucks and is driving players out of the game. Its just that fixing it is not trivial. I would not be at all surprised if a better NPE features strongly in next week's Fanfest presentations. Personally I'd go with a player-balanced approach, where planets of different security status levels have different restrictions in terms of gear that can be used, and different rewards (SP and ISK). Let the players choose to fight in the highest sec status they can survive in. One problem that CCP will have to contend with though is the low player count. Without enough players, lots of options (game mode, security level, server region, etc.) will mean that the servers can't fill any of the battles. Allowing smaller battles (8v8, for example) is one way to solve this, but the system I'd go with is contract matching. Finally, the game needs simple PvE modes so that new players can learn the ropes by killing rogue drones. It doesn't matter if it doesn't pay out ISK or active SP, but we need something to allow people to learn the basic gun game, fittings, teamwork, etc. RF Gyro: 12.5% damage bonus; 10.5% rate of fire bonus
Dunk Mujunk RestlessSpirits 784	Posted - 2014.04.27 19:48:00 - [30] - Quote Maciej Szambelan wrote: Dunk Mujunk wrote: Passives have a much larger effect than gear. Matches forcing low end gear on players would still see vets dominate. And from what i've been understanding there is a place where vets and noobs can fight on equal ground. Its called the Battle Academy. I agree, but if you had more then 5 mln sp you would not be able to play with rookies anyway.. Unfortunately with 16v16 matches and barely any new players, players would be searching for battle forever. Nobody fcks monkeys AND people you idiot.You either fck monkeys, or you fck people.Theres no in between. Dave Chappelle

TechMechMeds SWAMPERIUM 3131	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:11:00 - [31] - Quote Free Beers wrote: paragraphs or TL;DR please Wasn't the title enough by now lol. If you know what a telefrag match is, then I love you. The tritanium I sell is more relevant than dust has ever been.
TechMechMeds SWAMPERIUM 3131	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:15:00 - [32] - Quote All we need.........is a bag of space weed. What we need is a player market and alternate cways to make isk combined with a longer stay in the academy. There's not enough players for matchmaking and considering how imbalanced this game fundamentally is, idon't see how that could work. Of course there's the tiered system of mlt, std, ADV and proto but then it'll just be QQ over passives gains most likely Tldr: bends tldr with mind there is no tldr. If you know what a telefrag match is, then I love you. The tritanium I sell is more relevant than dust has ever been.
dalt ud Vacuum Cleaner. LLC Steel Balls Alliance 613	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:16:00 - [33] - Quote Nobody cares. Include CCP. I saw million threads like this one. But real reason why new people dont come to this game - game is piece of crap. Engine of game - worst i ever seen. CCP know nothing about shooters. They know nothing about balance in shooters. Results? No new players, and old players leave this game one by one.
TechMechMeds SWAMPERIUM 3131	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:18:00 - [34] - Quote Thumb Green wrote: Actually there is a match making system, it's called Scotty. The funny thing is, we had better match making when there was no match making system. It's fcked up that we had a better chance of getting balanced teams when we were thrown randomly into matches. Hahaha, yeah it seemed much better before Scotty. Scotty was more of a virus than anything. If you know what a telefrag match is, then I love you. The tritanium I sell is more relevant than dust has ever been.
Seymor Krelborn L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 2193	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:22:00 - [35] - Quote you are absolutely right OP.... we complained to CCP about this for a long time and they did attempt to implement a matchmaking system unfortunately with the small player base, it just doesn't work, and I'm sure it's broken to boot. also did you notice how most of the negative or troll comments in your thread are from DNS... do yourself a favor, never pay attention to them, they are the worst people in this community. this game makes me sad....
Nirwanda Vaughns 426th Infantry 604	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:33:00 - [36] - Quote Dunk Mujunk wrote: Passives have a much larger effect than gear. Matches forcing low end gear on players would still see vets dominate. And from what i've been understanding there is a place where vets and noobs can fight on equal ground. Its called the Battle Academy. Not comepletely true. a bad player will still be a bad player no matter how many sp they have. someone with maxed skills in dropsuit upgrades will have an advantage through extra hp and damage but it wont be as extreme as it would be if they were in a ful proto suit. a proto gallente logi can comfortably get 830armor with 6hps regen, 3 damage mods and a proto weapon. at least in a STD suit they're limited by modules and fitings to brign the hp and damage down. and liek i said before. a good fps gamer will still kill someone who relies on their proto suit hp. it'd actually weed out the men from the boys Rolling with the punches
Michael Cratar Fenrir's Wolves 330	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:37:00 - [37] - Quote Great, another person that gets all but hurt over people useing proto gear. Sorry for playing the game. The only things that make this game unenjoyable is the lack of content, and stupid people. I do not know love, only ( -í° -£-û -í°). Closed Beta Vet
Seymor Krelborn L.O.T.I.S. D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 2194	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:39:00 - [38] - Quote Michael Cratar wrote: Great, another person that gets all but hurt over people useing proto gear. Sorry for playing the game. The only things that make this game unenjoyable is the lack of content, and stupid people. well, if you quit we will be closer to solving your 2nd problem this game makes me sad....
echo47 Minmatar Republic 265	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:47:00 - [39] - Quote There is so much more to stomping and not getting stomped than gear. Gear is a part of it but not end all. It is kind of shortsided to blame it only on gear. Q-syncing, communication and a balanced squad is way more of a factor in my opinion. Restricting by Gear will only make q-syncing corps richer and remove gear as an advantage for smaller corps and solo players. I would rather look bad and win, than look good and lose.
Stupid Blueberry Nova Corps Marines Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 159	Posted - 2014.04.27 20:56:00 - [40] - Quote Bruttuss Brutor wrote: They Quit because there's no match making system. They start at the academy, and think this game is pretty cool. And then when they get out of the Academy, (usually after 1 match), they get crushed by all prototype gear players. Some people will say, well that's how the game was designed. Or they don't care about the amount of new players dust gets, but I bet money CCP cares about getting new players to stick around, but they take advice from vets who have never been on the other side. They started on a level playing field and worked there way up, side by side and now there at the top of the food chain. I'm not mad at them, there just playing the game how it was designed, but if CCP want's this game to succeed, they will have to make a match making system. I started playing this game about 6 mounts ago, and am now around 15 million lifetime skill points, so I know what its like to have to climb that ladder. It's very very difficult and takes a long time. Me I like a challenge, so I endured and pushed forward, even though I got my a*s kicked a lot those first few months and now it was worth it, but must people play a few matches and say this is crazy. and there right, being honest about it, cause they will just go play a different game where they don't get massickered every game. But that's the way the vets like it, so CCP for some reason doesn't change it. But if they wont this game to move forward, they must put in place a match making system of some kind. Do you think vets would stick around if you made a few of them start over as new players and play with 90% proto players, HELL NO, they would put down the controller and say (this game needs some sort of match making system) or they just wouldn't play, just like new players, but they would never admit that because that would never happen and most of them really don't care if this game succeeds or not. CCP- you have to do something. I really love this game and want it to succeed but if you don't do something and do it fast, its gonna fail. Nobody should have to go through all the BS just to have fun on a game, and they wont. I believe this beaten horse should be very tender by now. Ishukone loyalist and Caldari Scout enthusiast. Nerf the CR so I can justify using something else!



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