DUST Search - No More Mediums?

Medical Crash wrote:

Bormir1r wrote:

Nomed Deeps wrote:

I have noticed lately when playing matches that you normally see nothing but Scouts or nothing but Heavies (with maybe 1 actual logi but been seeing alot more "logi scouts" ::) ). I think the main problem is Scouts are overpowered; 1 too many equip slots plus high ability to bulk HP plus also speed (not too mention overextended cloaking). A heavy by itself is not really overpowered as they are supposed to absorb a lot of hits but an entire team of Sentinels with HMGs (which I saw on a Domination last night) are a little too much to deal with especially in an enclosed area.

SUMMARY: I think a decent fix/re-balance would be to remove 1 equipment slot from Scouts (where they are left with 1), slightly buff HP for Mediums, and leave Heavies alone.

The only scout that is OP is the Gal scout and I'll prove why.

1. It has the most PG of any scout.

2. It's bonuses are very helpful.

3. It does the best in brick tanking compared to other scouts.

4. It can run just as fast as any other scout, which is not right because the Minmatar scout is supposed to be the fastest. And being .01 m/s faster than the Gal scout is basically saying you're the same speed.

5. It has the most versatility and it can do this mostly because of it's PG.

6. All of it's eHP can be passively regenerated.

7. Combined all it's bonuses and advantages make the Gal scout extremely powerful, (which is why it's FOTM), CCP needs to do something about the GAL SCOUT, not particularly the other things (tweaking the armor plates kind of helps).

And you conveniently forget it's most OP and best trait of all. It's Scout+racial dampning. You reduce the effectiveness of that and "Scout514" disappears overnight.

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Eruditus 920 Prodigy Ops 45	Posted - 2014.04.21 22:06:00 - [31] - Quote I hope something controversial is unveiled at Fanfest so this forum will have something new to "talk" about. The "scouts are OP" subject has whipped my ass raw. "It is well that war is so terrible, lest we should grow too fond of it." -Robert E. Lee
Yeeeuuuupppp Red and Silver Hand Amarr Empire 255	Posted - 2014.04.21 22:08:00 - [32] - Quote My amarr assault seeks no buff CCP Saberwing: " War elephants for 1.9" Mic status: Muted Feel the wrath of my troll
21yrOld Knight Pradox XVI Proficiency V. 788	Posted - 2014.04.21 22:27:00 - [33] - Quote I run medium suits. I have both logi and assault ck.o, but i to have to admit i have the scout ck.o also. On my way to get the sentinel ck.o. Mike Ruan Said I was Dust Famous *General John Ripper Said I was Dust Famous* Who else thinks I'm Famous?
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Lokun Listamenn 1409	Posted - 2014.04.21 22:57:00 - [34] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Nomed Deeps wrote: I have noticed lately when playing matches that you normally see nothing but Scouts or nothing but Heavies (with maybe 1 actual logi but been seeing alot more "logi scouts" ::) ). I think the main problem is Scouts are overpowered; 1 too many equip slots plus high ability to bulk HP plus also speed (not too mention overextended cloaking). A heavy by itself is not really overpowered as they are supposed to absorb a lot of hits but an entire team of Sentinels with HMGs (which I saw on a Domination last night) are a little too much to deal with especially in an enclosed area. SUMMARY: I think a decent fix/re-balance would be to remove 1 equipment slot from Scouts (where they are left with 1), slightly buff HP for Mediums, and leave Heavies alone. The only scout that is OP is the Gal scout and I'll prove why. 1. It has the most PG of any scout. 2. It's bonuses are very helpful. 3. It does the best in brick tanking compared to other scouts. 4. It can run just as fast as any other scout, which is not right because the Minmatar scout is supposed to be the fastest. And being .01 m/s faster than the Gal scout is basically saying you're the same speed. 5. It has the most versatility and it can do this mostly because of it's PG. 6. All of it's eHP can be passively regenerated. 7. Combined all it's bonuses and advantages make the Gal scout extremely powerful, (which is why it's FOTM), CCP needs to do something about the GAL SCOUT, not particularly the other things (tweaking the armor plates kind of helps). 1. So what it has the least CPU which I would rather have since precision mods and profile dampeners cost 0 PG 2. So are Cal scout for their role and Min scout for minjas. The only scout screwed bonus wise is Amarr 3. Define best, because if I tank the heck out of my Gal scout it is slow as an assault, but putting a bunch of shield extenders on the Cal scout doesn't hurt its speed. 4. Is your problem tanked Gal scouts or fast onesw because unlike Cal scouts the Gal scout cannot be both at the same time. 5. See #1 it is CPU limited 6. Ok the gal scout is the only one that can regen all its HP without a module of some sort. 7. Its bonuses suit its role of being the sneakiest scout, Min is fastest, and Cal is the anti-scout scout. Again the only scout class that got screwed was Amarr. Bascially you are just restating your second point here again. Your "proof" is opinion and you are very well entitled to it, please just do not confuse it with facts. Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 383	Posted - 2014.04.22 02:00:00 - [35] - Quote Medical Crash wrote: Bormir1r wrote: Nomed Deeps wrote: I have noticed lately when playing matches that you normally see nothing but Scouts or nothing but Heavies (with maybe 1 actual logi but been seeing alot more "logi scouts" ::) ). I think the main problem is Scouts are overpowered; 1 too many equip slots plus high ability to bulk HP plus also speed (not too mention overextended cloaking). A heavy by itself is not really overpowered as they are supposed to absorb a lot of hits but an entire team of Sentinels with HMGs (which I saw on a Domination last night) are a little too much to deal with especially in an enclosed area. SUMMARY: I think a decent fix/re-balance would be to remove 1 equipment slot from Scouts (where they are left with 1), slightly buff HP for Mediums, and leave Heavies alone. The only scout that is OP is the Gal scout and I'll prove why. 1. It has the most PG of any scout. 2. It's bonuses are very helpful. 3. It does the best in brick tanking compared to other scouts. 4. It can run just as fast as any other scout, which is not right because the Minmatar scout is supposed to be the fastest. And being .01 m/s faster than the Gal scout is basically saying you're the same speed. 5. It has the most versatility and it can do this mostly because of it's PG. 6. All of it's eHP can be passively regenerated. 7. Combined all it's bonuses and advantages make the Gal scout extremely powerful, (which is why it's FOTM), CCP needs to do something about the GAL SCOUT, not particularly the other things (tweaking the armor plates kind of helps). And you conveniently forget it's most OP and best trait of all. It's Scout+racial dampning. You reduce the effectiveness of that and "Scout514" disappears overnight. I mentioned it's "bonuses" which are it's racial dampening. "One does not simply" run 11.12 m/s. You do it with 63.00 Stamina Regen.
Michael Arck Onuoto Uakan Huogaatsu Lokun Listamenn 4000	Posted - 2014.04.22 02:07:00 - [36] - Quote Survival rate in any of those two suits you mentioned are pretty high. No matter the changes, the nerfs, the buffs or whatever, people will always lean towards what gives them the edge to win. There's no way you can change that (not saying you're asking for it). So yea, I hardly see any mediums. If I do, the first thing I say in my mind before I kill em is "poor medium guy". Still see a healthy amount of logi DSs though... Hnolai ki tuul, ti sei oni a tiu. Are you OUKH?
Izlare Lenix Arrogance. 487	Posted - 2014.04.22 02:17:00 - [37] - Quote Before this patch it was the exact opposite. It was mostly medium frames running around with a few heavies and scouts. Heavies got a slight buff, especially the hmg, and scouts are no longer trash and everyone is complaining and saying scouts are op, nerf them. Scouts and heavies are in a good place right now. Logis are more geared toward logi work instead of logi slaying, which they never should have been. The only problem right now is assaults are out classed by everything. Scouts don't need a nerf, assaults need a buff. Gun control is not about guns...it's about control. The only way to ensure freedom is by having the means to defend it.
Vargralor Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 29	Posted - 2014.04.22 02:39:00 - [38] - Quote Zahle Undt wrote: 1. So what it has the least CPU which I would rather have since precision mods and profile dampeners cost 0 PG 2. So are Cal scout for their role and Min scout for minjas. The only scout screwed bonus wise is Amarr 3. Define best, because if I tank the heck out of my Gal scout it is slow as an assault, but putting a bunch of shield extenders on the Cal scout doesn't hurt its speed. 4. Is your problem tanked Gal scouts or fast onesw because unlike Cal scouts the Gal scout cannot be both at the same time. 5. See #1 it is CPU limited 6. Ok the gal scout is the only one that can regen all its HP without a module of some sort. 7. Its bonuses suit its role of being the sneakiest scout, Min is fastest, and Cal is the anti-scout scout. Again the only scout class that got screwed was Amarr. Bascially you are just restating your second point here again. Your "proof" is opinion and you are very well entitled to it, please just do not confuse it with facts. This is somewhat true but Cal scouts cannot reach anywhere near the levels of survivability as Gal scouts when tanking. Three adv shield extenders provides less tank than a single adv armour plate so on an adv suit the Gal scout can have over triple the tank of the Cal scout or match their tank bonus with a single plate and run other mods on the two other low slots. The proto levels bring the ratios back a little but an armour plate is over double the effectiveness of a shield extender in flat HP. I know the Cal scouts have a great recharge but that only matters if you have a large enough buffer to survive the initial attack long enough for them to regen. When talking about the extremes of brick tanking a Gal scout can add far more raw HP than a Cal scout or match them with two plates and still run damps, cardios or kincats. Edit: Just a suggestion on this, I think as many people have said the scout and heavy suits should not be nerfed, instead the mediums should be buffed. The other change that would help is to lower the HP provided by armour plates by 25% or increase the speed penalty percentage (which will have a much more noticable effect on fast suits).
Tectonic Fusion 1517	Posted - 2014.04.22 03:26:00 - [39] - Quote Echo 1991 wrote: i think scouts should only be able to use sidearms. 2 sidearm slots instead of what they currently have. the only weapon they would really miss is the shotgun. And the Combat Rifle, Rail RIfle, Plasma Canon (Jolly uses this on one of his fits :p), Sniper Rifle (I've seen plenty of scouts sniping), and the Mass Driver (I seriously saw this proto scout chugging a Freedom MD and kicking arse). Although I would actually agree if they unnerf Scrambler Pistols. Solo Player Squad status: Locked
PARKOUR PRACTIONER R 0 N 1 N 1178	Posted - 2014.04.22 03:33:00 - [40] - Quote Doshneil Antaro wrote: Scouts with rep tools are nothing but hipsters. They think they are doing great being a light suit logi. The truth is that I can take bpo miltia logi repping an advanced heavy agaist a proto scout/heavy combo and win 9/10 times. Not to mention that I die less and end up with more wps. Hey, back off. I'm a LogiScout. You wont be complaining when I'm the only one repping you cause everyone else is either cloaker shotties or heavies. I can fit my scout whichever way I please so chill. My LogiScout is the only suit I tank cause I'm just learning how to strafe and tighten my aim. You have upset me. I'm going to be a hipster <---------------------------------------that way, where I'm appreciated. Ex-SCP master, time for a comeback SCR amateur MD and trig-flux Pro

Rowdy Railgunner Capital Acquisitions LLC Dirt Nap Squad. 400	Posted - 2014.04.22 03:41:00 - [41] - Quote Minny medium logi is the only way to go if you are repping a heavy. My core focused reps so much that a Gallente sentinel has to be primary from atleast 4 people to overcome my reps. If there is only 4 he is going to kill 2 of you in 5 seconds. Then the other 2 will die. If there is 5 of you he will kill 2-3 before he goes down and if you haven't targeted me I will take out one more. Possibly stick him with an 80% needle and then the rest of you will die. If this same galsent is repped by two min six kin logis, run away. Because he will kill you all and you won't kill us.
Racro 01 Arifistan 501st Knights of Leanbox INTERGALACTIC WARPIGS 306	Posted - 2014.04.22 09:34:00 - [42] - Quote Deltahawk Durango wrote: Racro 01 Arifistan wrote: i agree with most of it. but give the scouts extender/plate hp penalty. slighlty nerf SENTINELS hp by 5% buff assault hp by 3% or 5% logis get slighlty more speed. fixed leave my commando alone... only one of my fittings exceed 1000 hp... thanks for corretcing me. i like the hp the commando has. but its slightly too slow. and the sentinal bonus makes it too difficult to bring down even one of them when they run is groups of 3. so since they have damage reduction bons;'s. i belive they should recive 5% hp reduction. then it will be viable to actually kill them. *Elite Gallenten Soldier*
Gelan Corbaine Gladiators Vanguard 396	Posted - 2014.04.22 10:45:00 - [43] - Quote Racro 01 Arifistan wrote: thanks for corretcing me. i like the hp the commando has. but its slightly too slow. and the sentinal bonus makes it too difficult to bring down even one of them when they run is groups of 3. so since they have damage reduction bons;'s. i belive they should recive 5% hp reduction. then it will be viable to actually kill them. If they are running 3 to 1 to you why should you be able to kill them ? 1 on 1 a heavy is no problem even in an assault suit with a weapon that the heavy is resistant against . 3 require teamwork and tactics ( namely someone playing bait while the RE scout sneaks up on them ) No job is worth doing if you don't get paid in the end .
Korvin Lomont United Pwnage Service RISE of LEGION 927	Posted - 2014.04.22 11:28:00 - [44] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Nomed Deeps wrote: I have noticed lately when playing matches that you normally see nothing but Scouts or nothing but Heavies (with maybe 1 actual logi but been seeing alot more "logi scouts" ::) ). I think the main problem is Scouts are overpowered; 1 too many equip slots plus high ability to bulk HP plus also speed (not too mention overextended cloaking). A heavy by itself is not really overpowered as they are supposed to absorb a lot of hits but an entire team of Sentinels with HMGs (which I saw on a Domination last night) are a little too much to deal with especially in an enclosed area. SUMMARY: I think a decent fix/re-balance would be to remove 1 equipment slot from Scouts (where they are left with 1), slightly buff HP for Mediums, and leave Heavies alone. The only scout that is OP is the Gal scout and I'll prove why. 1. It has the most PG of any scout. 2. It's bonuses are very helpful. 3. It does the best in brick tanking compared to other scouts. 4. It can run just as fast as any other scout, which is not right because the Minmatar scout is supposed to be the fastest. And being .01 m/s faster than the Gal scout is basically saying you're the same speed. 5. It has the most versatility and it can do this mostly because of it's PG. 6. All of it's eHP can be passively regenerated. 7. Combined all it's bonuses and advantages make the Gal scout extremely powerful, (which is why it's FOTM), CCP needs to do something about the GAL SCOUT, not particularly the other things (tweaking the armor plates kind of helps). funny enough I encounter more cal scouts. BTW the anarr can do better in brick tanking as the amarr scout is the only one that can pass the 1000 eHP mark if I am not mistaken but of course without the passive rep(that take ages to fully rep you) On the speed thing that's not quite accurate the only thing the gal scout can achieve is he can get pretty close to minni sprint speed. The gal scout will never be able to have higher strafe or walking speed...and by dedicating himself to minni speed the gal scout needs to highly specialize so he will be vulnerable...and the amarr scout is just 0.1 m/s slower than the gal scout as well... The cal scout can get up to 800Hp where 500 can be regenerated at 50hp/s and the cal scout has clearly the best combination of skills. The cal scout is IMHO currently the best assault option. Good speed insane regen more than enough potential HP and able to see most suits with passives alone... The cal scout can be a proto scanner with passives alone (ok at a smaller range but 360 degree and perma on) The minni scout is great for the hacking bonus alone, the NK bonus doesn't make much sense on the minni but the combination of high speed and the fastest hacking makes it a more than viable scout even though he is not the best at killing.


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