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Min vs. Gal - Complete BS

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Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 312	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:29:00 - [1] - Quote The Minmatar scouts have been seriously screwed over. I never truly realized until I myself specced into Gal scouts. Of course I always figured the Gal scouts were slightly better, but the real discrepancy I see now is absolutely ludicrous. At all levels the Gal scout beats Minmatar Scout in everything, except for two- NKs, but even that's useless since the Minmatar dies much quicker before it's able to get the kill, and hack speed, which is quite good but not worth the overall the benefit compared to what you would get from the Gal scouts. Let me start by comparing the ADV Min and Gal Scouts, I feel the disparity really hits off here. While the Min Scout has a slightly higher sprinting speed than the Gal, it takes 2 Comp. Kin cats for a Gal scout to reach 10.01m/s and 1 Comp. + 1 Enhanced Kin Cat for a Min to reach 10.03 m/s which are pretty close. At this point let's observe the rest of the fittings before I make my point. We'll put a K5 SG and STD SMG on both scouts, 198 shields for Min, and about 140 shields on the Gal. Each scout has a STD Cloak, however the gal scout still a low slot left so we'll put a ferroscale plate, which it can fit. The Armor for the Min is 80 due to my skill level, and about 184 for Gal with the plate. Now let's compare the two: The Min is running with an eHP of 278, of which only 198 is passively regenerated. The Gal gets over 320 eHP, which is ALL passively regenerated. The point here is that to even get close to the sprint speed of the Gal scout, the Min scout has to bring it's eHP down to 278, of which only 198 is regenerative, while the Gal gets to regenerate ALL of its eHP yet it still runs at the same speed. The role of the Minmatar scout is to be quicker than other scouts, yet the Gal scout does this much better because it runs at essentially the same speed with MORE passively regenerated eHP. Furthermore the Bonuses of the Gal makes it even better, it gets innate Dampening (25%), while the Min scout get's ****** over by all those Cal scouts. Sure the faster Hacking and NK bonus are pretty cool, but if I die before I can use them, what's the point of having them? Now the proto variants: While the Minmatar gets much more flexibility here, it only maxes out with pg of 81. The Gal scout gets around 96 pg, and he can run around 10.73 m/s with 400+ eHP, the Minmatar scout can max out at 330 eHP with 11.12m/s which is not far from 10.73, but if you decide to reduce it to 2 kin cats, instead of 3, it falls to 10.38m/s, and the suit doesn't even reach 390 eHP. Note that again all of the Gal scout's eHP is passively regenerative while about 60% of the Min scout's eHP is passively regenerated. Even with the 10.73 the Gal scout can fit a proto shotgun, while the Min scout can't even fit a CRG-3 without passive the limit by freaking 2 pg with a std cloak, while the Gal scout also has one. Clearly there are some disparities between the two suits. Now that I've presented the issue here, let me propose a solution: Increase the pg for Minmatar scouts. I know it sounds repetitive, but it's seriously needed. Remember that I have engineering 5 and that must make it seriously limiting for those who don't have that same level. The Gal however still has a little more than 15 pg than the Min scout at the ADV level and close to 20 at the proto level. Another interesting question to ask is, if the Minmatar scout is speed based, then why does it have a much lower amount of pg than other suits when Complex Kin Cats require 15 pg ea? Is it's speed supposed to be restricted to the point where it makes it's speed worthless compared to other scouts who have just as much speed? Essentially the Minmatar scout should either have a different bonus to make up for it's pg, or increase it's pg. The Minmatar scout could have a bonus of an increase in sprint speed by 2% per level, which would make signficantly more viable and make up for it's difference in eHP when compared to scouts like the Gal. "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Joel II X Dah Gods O Bacon 2356	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:33:00 - [2] - Quote Um, well yeah. Minmatar are glass cannons. You get a faster hack in and Knives Yup. You have greater stamina regen. Only thing that's awful is the kincats and their PG usage. That really kills your suit. If you don't speed tank your scout, I don't know what you're doing lol By the way, I thought you already had a Gallente Scout...
THUNDERGROOVE Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 688	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:34:00 - [3] - Quote At least you're not Amarr Fix the PG requirements of KinCats though! Running at 10.6 m/s ak.0 Projects: TDBS \| SDETool ScrubzBScrubz
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 312	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:34:00 - [4] - Quote Joel II X wrote: Um, well yeah. Minmatar are glass cannons. You get a faster hack in and Knives Yup. You have greater stamina regen. Only thing that's awful is the kincats and their PG usage. That really kills your suit. If you don't speed tank your scout, I don't know what you're doing lol By the way, I thought you already had a Gallente Scout... I just got it to level 4...lol "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 312	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:35:00 - [5] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: At least you're not Amarr Fix the PG requirements of KinCats though! Hey Amarr scouts still live longer than Min.... "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7979	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:38:00 - [6] - Quote You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
THUNDERGROOVE Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 688	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:39:00 - [7] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: THUNDERGROOVE wrote: At least you're not Amarr Fix the PG requirements of KinCats though! Hey Amarr scouts still live longer than Min.... Three bursts of a combat rifle kill us both same. For roughly 45 more base HP with skills I get 0.6 less sprint speed and a ****** bonus. However, I'm happy about my Amarr scout and your thread is about Minmatar scouts. Us as the UP scout users must stick together to support the cause, even with our racial tensions Running at 10.6 m/s ak.0 Projects: TDBS \| SDETool ScrubzBScrubz
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 312	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:41:00 - [8] - Quote THUNDERGROOVE wrote: Bormir1r wrote: THUNDERGROOVE wrote: At least you're not Amarr Fix the PG requirements of KinCats though! Hey Amarr scouts still live longer than Min.... Three bursts of a combat rifle kill us both same. For roughly 45 more base HP with skills I get 0.6 less sprint speed and a ****** bonus. However, I'm happy about my Amarr scout and your thread is about Minmatar scouts. Us as the UP scout users must stick together to support the cause, even with our racial tensions Yea...kind of ironic considering Amarrians were the former masters of the enslaved Min race....but sure lol =D "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3490	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:41:00 - [9] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. You lost all credibility when you posted on a character in Dust University.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 312	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:43:00 - [10] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. Don't get me wrong, I love NKs! It's just the speed of the Min scout is pointless..... it makes me so sad..... "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.

Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Lokun Listamenn 1400	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:51:00 - [11] - Quote I'm not trying to be the "get gud guy" because I am a scrub player at this game even with my millions, anyways, yeah a lot of races are unequal in their respective suits. Much of that are Minmatar suits, because TTK is still pretty low and "speed tanking" is hardest to do IMO . I've played Minmatar assault for pretty much all of Uprising and everyone on the forums says its the worst, but its different and fun and I make it work well enough for my scrub self. My point is, just accept that the suits and guns and everything else are not ever going to be 100% equal and all the bitching WE ALL do on these forums is pretty pointless and a minor detriment to the game (way behind CCP itself). Take pride in using what you like even if its hardmode, or skill into whatever is best at the moment. I've done a little of both sometimes the ton of SP is nice Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Bormir1r Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 312	Posted - 2014.04.19 03:53:00 - [12] - Quote Zahle Undt wrote: I'm not trying to be the "get gud guy" because I am a scrub player at this game even with my millions, anyways, yeah a lot of races are unequal in their respective suits. Much of that are Minmatar suits, because TTK is still pretty low and "speed tanking" is hardest to do IMO . I've played Minmatar assault for pretty much all of Uprising and everyone on the forums says its the worst, but its different and fun and I make it work well enough for my scrub self. My point is, just accept that the suits and guns and everything else are not ever going to be 100% equal and all the bitching WE ALL do on these forums is pretty pointless and a minor detriment to the game (way behind CCP itself). Take pride in using what you like even if its hardmode, or skill into whatever is best at the moment. I've done a little of both sometimes the ton of SP is nice Thanks lol...yea I've enjoyed the hard mode quite a bit actually, it's just I never realized how much harder it really was. "One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
Rusty Shallows 1565	Posted - 2014.04.19 05:22:00 - [13] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. You lost all credibility when you posted on a character in Dust University. Ivy League Educate yourself Himiko Kuronaga. Your statement was the epitome of ignorance. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
The dark cloud The Rainbow Effect 2834	Posted - 2014.04.19 05:25:00 - [14] - Quote To be honest there is not much use for minmatarr scouts. They can be picked up by scanners and have the lowest HP and the toughest fitting. In my opinion they need a buff like the OP stated with more PG. Hell on my Gal. scout fits i allways have PG left over but not the CPU. Head of public relations from The Rainbow Effect.
Rusty Shallows 1565	Posted - 2014.04.19 05:28:00 - [15] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. Don't get me wrong, I love NKs! It's just the speed of the Min scout is pointless..... it makes me so sad..... Seconded, they need MOAR SPEED! I have always used the Minja Alt for the fatalistic lulz. If not for the blades it wouldn't be fun anymore. Forums > Game: So here is a cookie and a Like. Please keep posting. Bwahahahahahahahahahaha! >>> GòÜ(GÇóGîéGÇó)Gò¥ >>>
Jenza's Pants The Hetairoi 161	Posted - 2014.04.19 05:29:00 - [16] - Quote Minmatar has always had fitting problems. Edit: this is all of their suits across the board.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 2890	Posted - 2014.04.19 05:34:00 - [17] - Quote Sigh I would write something explaining at least your good at something and then state [Amarr scout blank blank blank] but it's just gotten all repetitive. TL; DR CCP is going to point and laugh at are misery. Its alright everyone, no need to worry it's just an Amarr scout :(
Miokai Zahou The Southern Legion League of Infamy 185	Posted - 2014.04.19 06:04:00 - [18] - Quote I like the caldari scout suit :3 Noob isn't really a status, it's the online equivalent of a 5-year old calling you a poopy fart head.
Gaelon Thrace Villore Sec Ops Gallente Federation 124	Posted - 2014.04.19 06:51:00 - [19] - Quote What was the minja bonus before it was changed to hacking speed?
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3499	Posted - 2014.04.19 06:52:00 - [20] - Quote Rusty Shallows wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. You lost all credibility when you posted on a character in Dust University. Ivy League Educate yourself Himiko Kuronaga. Your statement was the epitome of ignorance. I don't need to educate myself on Dust. That's the nice thing about being a regular human being that doesn't require the services of a tutoring organization for an incredibly simplistic video game. Good work on teaching those other guys the fundamentals of pressing the R1 button to fire their weapon though. I'm sure that information will really help them down the road when they tackle the bigger issues, like reloading after the magazine is empty. Gota prepare them when their young, and all that.

Maken Tosch DUST University Ivy League 7987	Posted - 2014.04.19 07:35:00 - [21] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. You lost all credibility when you posted on a character in Dust University. Unlike you, I don't use ad hominems to discredit someone's post. Dedicated Scout // Ninja Knifer Everything I know about the Caldari I learned at Nouvelle Rouvenor
KingBabar The Rainbow Effect 2216	Posted - 2014.04.19 08:56:00 - [22] - Quote Its hard enough to fight you in your Min scoout, the thought of you in a Cal scout is reason for anxiety... That was a compliment, no sarcasm intended. FU and FU Dust community, you're mostly a bunch of moronic carebear crybabies. Get good.
Savage Mangler Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 96	Posted - 2014.04.19 09:22:00 - [23] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Rusty Shallows wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. You lost all credibility when you posted on a character in Dust University. Ivy League Educate yourself Himiko Kuronaga. Your statement was the epitome of ignorance. I don't need to educate myself on Dust. That's the nice thing about being a regular human being that doesn't require the services of a tutoring organization for an incredibly simplistic video game. Good work on teaching those other guys the fundamentals of pressing the R1 button to fire their weapon though. I'm sure that information will really help them down the road when they tackle the bigger issues, like reloading after the magazine is empty. Gota prepare them when their young, and all that. How cute. Tell me, do you have any other equally uncouth things to say or have we finally hit the bottom of your inequivocally shallow pool of social graces? Do respond soon, I look forward to whatever sarcastic and/or bile-infused response you conjure up next. -YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED- "Good, then they'll know who killed them." Keep your knives sharp....and your wits sharper.
Smooth Assassin Stardust Incorporation IMMORTAL REGIME 1282	Posted - 2014.04.19 09:31:00 - [24] - Quote They both have their differences and roles, minmatar is an assassin and the gallante is able to hide easily. In combat a gal scout could easily flank a min but wouldn't be able to catch up to its speed, with the minmatar strafing abilities it can easily end a gal scout with its primery weapon unless if its a PLC or flaylock. *Assassination is my thing.*
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3499	Posted - 2014.04.19 10:35:00 - [25] - Quote Maken Tosch wrote: Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Maken Tosch wrote: You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless. You lost all credibility when you posted on a character in Dust University. Unlike you, I don't use ad hominems to discredit someone's post. It is a fact that no one in Dust University has ever accomplished anything of relevant value in this game. I therefore deduce that they must teach incredible worthless things and be full of incredibly worthless people, unworthy of filling a decent topic with good banter, let alone attempting to make a valid point. Do you have evidence to counter this deduction? Savage Mangler wrote: How cute. Tell me, do you have any other equally uncouth things to say or have we finally hit the bottom of your inequivocally shallow pool of social graces? Do respond soon, I look forward to whatever sarcastic and/or bile-infused response you conjure up next. Ho there friend, I assure you it comes with a package attached. I would recommend you keep riding, lest your white knighting end with an unfortunate surprise.
Savage Mangler Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 96	Posted - 2014.04.19 11:19:00 - [26] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Ho there friend, I assure you it comes with a package attached. I would recommend you keep riding, lest your white knighting end with an unfortunate surprise. Oh I do hate surprises but alas I can ride no further at moment, for my horse Tranquility is rather weary and my armor is chafing slightly. I tip my hat to you for remaining mostly civil with me though. As a final note, might I add that while those at D-UNI are not known for anything remarkable, they do at least try to help with player retention. The only retention the rest of us help with is how many bullets the newberries can hold. -YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED- "Good, then they'll know who killed them." Keep your knives sharp....and your wits sharper.
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3499	Posted - 2014.04.19 11:34:00 - [27] - Quote The desire to help bad players continue to be bad (but active!) does not, unfortunately, give one a valuable opinion. Nor does it convince those such as myself to allow a bad opinion to go unchallenged without harassment, especially when it is used in such a way as to appear superior to someone else with a more experienced background.
Savage Mangler Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 97	Posted - 2014.04.19 12:31:00 - [28] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: The desire to help bad players continue to be bad (but active!) does not, unfortunately, give one a valuable opinion. Nor does it convince those such as myself to allow a bad opinion to go unchallenged without harassment, especially when it is used in such a way as to appear superior to someone else with a more experienced background. Maken Tosch is an experienced knifer. To discredit that simply because of his affiliation is, to put it politely, narrow minded. It is similiar to someone discrediting you due to the stigma attached to those affiliated with DNS. -YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED- "Good, then they'll know who killed them." Keep your knives sharp....and your wits sharper.
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 357	Posted - 2014.04.19 12:45:00 - [29] - Quote I agree something should be done to help min scouts. Make them have racial skills that set them apart like the others (poss. Amarr excluded, but that's another thread) Would like to see Minmatar PG increased, or kincats PG decreased. Possible increase to base speed and sprint speed too perhaps. Something to put their speed significantly ahead of the rest. One thing I noticed on protofits.com - there is a separate value for strafe speed, and it's not the same as base speed. So it should be possible to increase base speed without increasing strafe speed, if people thought that would be OP. I played min scout from open beta through to 1.7. Not playing it any more - specced into Gallente and Caldari instead. Would really like to see the min scout more viable. You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. ~ Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
Arkena Wyrnspire Fatal Absolution 12392	Posted - 2014.04.19 13:09:00 - [30] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: The desire to help bad players continue to be bad (but active!) does not, unfortunately, give one a valuable opinion. Nor does it devalue their opinion. You have long since made your choice. What you make now is a mistake. EUrobro



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