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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
312
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Posted - 2014.04.19 03:29:00 -
[1] - Quote
The Minmatar scouts have been seriously screwed over. I never truly realized until I myself specced into Gal scouts. Of course I always figured the Gal scouts were slightly better, but the real discrepancy I see now is absolutely ludicrous. At all levels the Gal scout beats Minmatar Scout in everything, except for two- NKs, but even that's useless since the Minmatar dies much quicker before it's able to get the kill, and hack speed, which is quite good but not worth the overall the benefit compared to what you would get from the Gal scouts.
Let me start by comparing the ADV Min and Gal Scouts, I feel the disparity really hits off here.
While the Min Scout has a slightly higher sprinting speed than the Gal, it takes 2 Comp. Kin cats for a Gal scout to reach 10.01m/s and 1 Comp. + 1 Enhanced Kin Cat for a Min to reach 10.03 m/s which are pretty close. At this point let's observe the rest of the fittings before I make my point. We'll put a K5 SG and STD SMG on both scouts, 198 shields for Min, and about 140 shields on the Gal. Each scout has a STD Cloak, however the gal scout still a low slot left so we'll put a ferroscale plate, which it can fit. The Armor for the Min is 80 due to my skill level, and about 184 for Gal with the plate.
Now let's compare the two:
The Min is running with an eHP of 278, of which only 198 is passively regenerated. The Gal gets over 320 eHP, which is ALL passively regenerated.
The point here is that to even get close to the sprint speed of the Gal scout, the Min scout has to bring it's eHP down to 278, of which only 198 is regenerative, while the Gal gets to regenerate ALL of its eHP yet it still runs at the same speed. The role of the Minmatar scout is to be quicker than other scouts, yet the Gal scout does this much better because it runs at essentially the same speed with MORE passively regenerated eHP. Furthermore the Bonuses of the Gal makes it even better, it gets innate Dampening (25%), while the Min scout get's ****** over by all those Cal scouts. Sure the faster Hacking and NK bonus are pretty cool, but if I die before I can use them, what's the point of having them?
Now the proto variants:
While the Minmatar gets much more flexibility here, it only maxes out with pg of 81. The Gal scout gets around 96 pg, and he can run around 10.73 m/s with 400+ eHP, the Minmatar scout can max out at 330 eHP with 11.12m/s which is not far from 10.73, but if you decide to reduce it to 2 kin cats, instead of 3, it falls to 10.38m/s, and the suit doesn't even reach 390 eHP. Note that again all of the Gal scout's eHP is passively regenerative while about 60% of the Min scout's eHP is passively regenerated. Even with the 10.73 the Gal scout can fit a proto shotgun, while the Min scout can't even fit a CRG-3 without passive the limit by freaking 2 pg with a std cloak, while the Gal scout also has one.
Clearly there are some disparities between the two suits.
Now that I've presented the issue here, let me propose a solution:
Increase the pg for Minmatar scouts. I know it sounds repetitive, but it's seriously needed. Remember that I have engineering 5 and that must make it seriously limiting for those who don't have that same level. The Gal however still has a little more than 15 pg than the Min scout at the ADV level and close to 20 at the proto level.
Another interesting question to ask is, if the Minmatar scout is speed based, then why does it have a much lower amount of pg than other suits when Complex Kin Cats require 15 pg ea? Is it's speed supposed to be restricted to the point where it makes it's speed worthless compared to other scouts who have just as much speed?
Essentially the Minmatar scout should either have a different bonus to make up for it's pg, or increase it's pg. The Minmatar scout could have a bonus of an increase in sprint speed by 2% per level, which would make signficantly more viable and make up for it's difference in eHP when compared to scouts like the Gal.
"One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
312
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Posted - 2014.04.19 03:34:00 -
[2] - Quote
Joel II X wrote:Um, well yeah. Minmatar are glass cannons.
You get a faster hack in and Knives Yup.
You have greater stamina regen.
Only thing that's awful is the kincats and their PG usage. That really kills your suit. If you don't speed tank your scout, I don't know what you're doing lol
By the way, I thought you already had a Gallente Scout...
I just got it to level 4...lol
"One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
312
|
Posted - 2014.04.19 03:35:00 -
[3] - Quote
THUNDERGROOVE wrote:At least you're not Amarr  Fix the PG requirements of KinCats though!
Hey Amarr scouts still live longer than Min....
"One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
312
|
Posted - 2014.04.19 03:41:00 -
[4] - Quote
THUNDERGROOVE wrote:Bormir1r wrote:THUNDERGROOVE wrote:At least you're not Amarr Fix the PG requirements of KinCats though! Hey Amarr scouts still live longer than Min.... Three bursts of a combat rifle kill us both same. For roughly 45 more base HP with skills I get 0.6 less sprint speed and a ****** bonus. However, I'm happy about my Amarr scout and your thread is about Minmatar scouts. Us as the UP scout users must stick together to support the cause, even with our racial tensions 
Yea...kind of ironic considering Amarrians were the former masters of the enslaved Min race....but sure lol =D
"One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
312
|
Posted - 2014.04.19 03:43:00 -
[5] - Quote
Maken Tosch wrote:You lost all credibility when you called NKs useless.
Don't get me wrong, I love NKs! It's just the speed of the Min scout is pointless..... it makes me so sad.....
"One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
312
|
Posted - 2014.04.19 03:53:00 -
[6] - Quote
Zahle Undt wrote:I'm not trying to be the "get gud guy" because I am a scrub player at this game even with my millions, anyways, yeah a lot of races are unequal in their respective suits. Much of that are Minmatar suits, because TTK is still pretty low and "speed tanking" is hardest to do IMO . I've played Minmatar assault for pretty much all of Uprising and everyone on the forums says its the worst, but its different and fun and I make it work well enough for my scrub self. My point is, just accept that the suits and guns and everything else are not ever going to be 100% equal and all the bitching WE ALL do on these forums is pretty pointless and a minor detriment to the game (way behind CCP itself). Take pride in using what you like even if its hardmode, or skill into whatever is best at the moment. I've done a little of both  sometimes the ton of SP is nice
Thanks lol...yea I've enjoyed the hard mode quite a bit actually, it's just I never realized how much harder it really was.
"One does not simply" look for a scout, it looks for you.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
325
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Posted - 2014.04.19 16:04:00 -
[7] - Quote
Gaelon Thrace wrote:What was the minja bonus before it was changed to hacking speed?
It was profile dampening just ike Gal.
"One does not simply" run 11.12 m/s.
You do it with 63.00 Stamina Regen.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
325
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Posted - 2014.04.19 16:43:00 -
[8] - Quote
LittleCuteBunny wrote:NO to PG changes
If you desire to balance dropsuit's CPU/PG, you must to look at the whole class instead of just 2 dropsuits.If you wanted to modify the PG from one dropsuit you must also change the CPU of other dropsuits, I personally dislike how Gallente is best different roles but changing CPU and PG is not the route.
Amarr CPU / PG = 446 / 92
Gallente CPU / PG = 433 / 97
CaldariCPU / PG = 457 / 87
Minmatar CPU / PG = 480 / 81
CCP should try to make each dropsuits configuration shine with modules, if changes to its RAW CPU or PG are made it could also end up in players abusing the dropsuit in different manners.
Solution: Kinetic and Hacking modules should require more CPU and less PG
If Kinetic/Hacking modules require more CPU...
- It is very unlikely a Gallente Scout (lowest CPU) would be using such modules efficiently
- More likely a Minmatar Scout would be able to take advantage of its huge CPU pool.
I did also state that this was an alternative.What I don't understand is why the Caldari, which has more PG when it has less low slots on the proto, and why it has less CPU but more High slots than the Minmatar scout.
"One does not simply" run 11.12 m/s.
You do it with 63.00 Stamina Regen.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
326
|
Posted - 2014.04.19 16:50:00 -
[9] - Quote
Ludvig Enraga wrote:Joel II X wrote:Um, well yeah. Minmatar are glass cannons.
You get a faster hack in and Knives Yup.
You have greater stamina regen.
Only thing that's awful is the kincats and their PG usage. That really kills your suit. If you don't speed tank your scout, I don't know what you're doing lol
By the way, I thought you already had a Gallente Scout... You lose too much eWar if you speed tank Min Scout.
The problem is you have to speed tank it....eWar makes it too weak otherwise....
"One does not simply" run 11.12 m/s.
You do it with 63.00 Stamina Regen.
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Bormir1r
Fatal Absolution
Dirt Nap Squad.
333
|
Posted - 2014.04.20 01:34:00 -
[10] - Quote
DEZKA DIABLO wrote:It's not really just the gal, it's all suits, minmatar is the worst , every suit has its place:
Gal: ewar/ speed/ armor
Amar: : armor / speed
Cal: shields
Minmatar however is a dual tank but it's a shield and biotic dual tank so it needs a ton of pg or a biotic reduction bonus.
Yes but does CCP know this?
"One does not simply" run 11.12 m/s.
You do it with 63.00 Stamina Regen.
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