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Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 464	Posted - 2014.04.14 08:42:00 - [1] - Quote OK, so one reason why EoN, DNS and whoever is next will always have the upper hand is the amount of ISK they have (both corp and personal). This means that even if they lose a district, they can attack it for days wearing the opposition down. So how can we reduce the difference? Add maintence costs to districts? Let them add scenery and such in to the maps (maybe a hot-dog stand?) For ISK obviously Have different functioning districts that produce other things aside from ISK Any other ideas? Stick 'em 'ere! CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Knight Solitaire 721	Posted - 2014.04.14 10:50:00 - [2] - Quote I thought you were planning to make a crappy talent show when I first read the title. Faigh go maith "Knight Soiaire has the best RE Game" - Crimson Moon V
Shiyou Hidiyoshi Dirt Nap Squad. 532	Posted - 2014.04.14 11:07:00 - [3] - Quote ISK isn't the main reason they have the upper hand. If it was, many districts would be getting flipped and reattacked 24/7 by DNS. You have to win the game on the ground, that is the biggest factor You can do it with 120 clones and it has been done MANY times by corps over the history of PC (it has been done with 100 clones too). The problem is that DNS has the better teams and no matter how many clones you have, if you can't keep them points and do well then you will lose. :/ Just wait when our common goal is accomplished and people in DNS go back to doing other stuff. DNS Dust corps want to fight each other, trust me. If you want a better example then here is one about your corp. Long ago, PHX (TPF as new members call it) had an entire planet with a few other districts. They lost all of them in less than a week to a corp with barely any districts (if they even had any at that time). Reason: PHX couldn't beat the other team on the ground. (this was when Eve OB support wasn't a big deal at all) ISK can't save you if the team on the ground can't win P.S. Red Star was the other team in case you were wondering. holds out hand and a swarm of angry mutated salmon cornflakes appear * Attack my children attack!
Lunatic Kota TeamPlayers Dirt Nap Squad. 142	Posted - 2014.04.14 11:22:00 - [4] - Quote Shiyou Hidiyoshi wrote: ISK isn't the main reason they have the upper hand. If it was, many districts would be getting flipped and reattacked 24/7 by DNS. You have to win the game on the ground, that is the biggest factor You can do it with 120 clones and it has been done MANY times by corps over the history of PC (it has been done with 100 clones too). The problem is that DNS has the better teams and no matter how many clones you have, if you can't keep them points and do well then you will lose. :/ Just wait when our common goal is accomplished and people in DNS go back to doing other stuff. DNS Dust corps want to fight each other, trust me. If you want a better example then here is one about your corp. Long ago, PHX (TPF as new members call it) had an entire planet with a few other districts. They lost all of them in less than a week to a corp with barely any districts (if they even had any at that time). Reason: PHX couldn't beat the other team on the ground. (this was when Eve OB support wasn't a big deal at all) ISK can't save you if the team on the ground can't win P.S. Red Star was the other team in case you were wondering. Fracking k-con and Snugglez. If you find yourself in a fair fight, you didn't plan your mission properly. -David Hackworth
XeroTheBigBoss TeamPlayers Dirt Nap Squad. 1000	Posted - 2014.04.14 12:38:00 - [5] - Quote Yokal Bob wrote: OK, so one reason why EoN, DNS and whoever is next will always have the upper hand is the amount of ISK they have (both corp and personal). This means that even if they lose a district, they can attack it for days wearing the opposition down. So how can we reduce the difference? Add maintence costs to districts? Let them add scenery and such in to the maps (maybe a hot-dog stand?) For ISK obviously Have different functioning districts that produce other things aside from ISK Any other ideas? Stick 'em 'ere! So let me get this straight...We are to be punished for getting into PC before you? We are to be punished for holding all of MH beneath our feet? We are to be punished for smashing a entire alliance of the entire game? We are to be punished for vanquishing all who ever opposed us? No! No! Nooooo!
843-BANE BurgezzE.T.F General Tso's Alliance 1068	Posted - 2014.04.14 12:53:00 - [6] - Quote XeroTheBigBoss wrote: Yokal Bob wrote: OK, so one reason why EoN, DNS and whoever is next will always have the upper hand is the amount of ISK they have (both corp and personal). This means that even if they lose a district, they can attack it for days wearing the opposition down. So how can we reduce the difference? Add maintence costs to districts? Let them add scenery and such in to the maps (maybe a hot-dog stand?) For ISK obviously Have different functioning districts that produce other things aside from ISK Any other ideas? Stick 'em 'ere! So let me get this straight...We are to be punished for getting into PC before you? We are to be punished for holding all of MH beneath our feet? We are to be punished for smashing a entire alliance of the entire game? We are to be punished for vanquishing all who ever opposed us? No! No! Nooooo! Why are you talking as if you are even kind of relevant to this blue doughnut? This could have easily been achieved regardless of what side you or TeamPlayers were on. FYI you didn't smash every opponent that ever faced you either, AE spanked you out of PC. remember? Or if you were referring to your blue doughnut victories, FA beat the blue doughnut until they pulled down their panties and bent over, and WTF has defended their district with a victory numerous times... Director // Major // BurgezzE.T.F 18-1 -é-+-ànderdo-+e record \|\| +¦ a-+ -é-+e op+¦a-ée
Killar-12 OLDSPICE. Top Men. 2595	Posted - 2014.04.14 13:06:00 - [7] - Quote There's 5 things (used to be 4) that determined this "Dominant Force" Player Quality FOTM Spammability ISK Reserves in case of district loss Political Situations/Allies/Enemies EVE Support How to Leave PC
Games Haven The Unholy Legion Of DarkStar DARKSTAR ARMY 18	Posted - 2014.04.14 13:08:00 - [8] - Quote Knight Solitaire wrote: I thought you were planning to make a crappy talent show when I first read the title. You just gave Hynox an idea. May or may not be not the guy you might be thinking of.
Killar-12 OLDSPICE. Top Men. 2595	Posted - 2014.04.14 13:16:00 - [9] - Quote Games Haven wrote: Knight Solitaire wrote: I thought you were planning to make a crappy talent show when I first read the title. You just gave Hynox an idea. This or Adding Cubs to one of your Stories? How to Leave PC
Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 466	Posted - 2014.04.14 16:49:00 - [10] - Quote 1. I said one of the factors not the only one 2. I am not saying anyone needs to be punished 3. I am asking for ideas in which; a) Other ways ISK can be used b) To forge a greater link between EVE and Dust c) Ways to make PC more intersting This is not a QQ thread, I have been talking to many people and the devs on how PC can be improved, especially with PC 2.0 round the corner (hopefully). So can we just see some ideas? CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back

Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3456	Posted - 2014.04.14 19:30:00 - [11] - Quote Yokal Bob wrote: OK, so one reason why EoN, DNS and whoever is next will always have the upper hand is the amount of ISK they have (both corp and personal). This means that even if they lose a district, they can attack it for days wearing the opposition down. So how can we reduce the difference? Add maintence costs to districts? Let them add scenery and such in to the maps (maybe a hot-dog stand?) For ISK obviously Have different functioning districts that produce other things aside from ISK Any other ideas? Stick 'em 'ere! Actually fight back instead of asking CCP to fight back for you?
Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 466	Posted - 2014.04.14 19:48:00 - [12] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Yokal Bob wrote: OK, so one reason why EoN, DNS and whoever is next will always have the upper hand is the amount of ISK they have (both corp and personal). This means that even if they lose a district, they can attack it for days wearing the opposition down. So how can we reduce the difference? Add maintence costs to districts? Let them add scenery and such in to the maps (maybe a hot-dog stand?) For ISK obviously Have different functioning districts that produce other things aside from ISK Any other ideas? Stick 'em 'ere! Actually fight back instead of asking CCP to fight back for you? How is this at all relevent? For one thing I always fight my own battles and don't hide behind other's skirts. This post isn't just aimed that those currently holding districts but for anyone holding them in the future. Wouldn't you like other ways to spend ISK? Make the game a bit more interesting? Tie in EVE better with Dust? I have however realised the mistake I made when creating this thread. It may come across as trying to punish district holders, that is not my intention. (I blame lack of sleep, damn insomnia) My intention was to find new ways of using ISK for everyone. Wouldn't you like to see corp flags flying on the district you own? Districts with different functionalities is something I have been working on for a while. The idea been to create a closer relationship between Dust and EVE, but at the same time the owner still has the option to chose which kind of district they would like. This is what I wanted to get ideas for. I apologise for any misunderstanding in my OP CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3343	Posted - 2014.04.14 19:48:00 - [13] - Quote They have a ridiculous amount of talent and experience in PC, that shouldn't be discounted. It's also not their fault that it's human nature to want to win. They've beaten corps down to the point that some of them have dissolved altogether. Then big portions of that talent joins some other super corp. So you started with 40 PC corps, then after a few months it's 30, then 20, then 10. Out of that 10 there was only 3 or 4 that could actually compete with each other. Instead of wasting ISK on a dead game mode, they decided to print ISK. FA had to lock districts to prevent the investment and the work they'd done from getting smashed by attack after attack from AE and NS. Even though they were able to win a large share of matches against them, they had to use cheap tactics to have any chance at making a dent in RA's territory. There are two corps out there right now capable of beating the donut. Now locking is not profitable so that tactic is out. Any land won will quickly be taken back. It's pointless and anyone that says any different is a fool. Level 3 Forum Warrior
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3343	Posted - 2014.04.14 19:50:00 - [14] - Quote And Bob, dude you are in the wrong section of the forums for rational thought. Level 3 Forum Warrior
Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 466	Posted - 2014.04.14 20:03:00 - [15] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: They have a ridiculous amount of talent and experience in PC, that shouldn't be discounted. It's also not their fault that it's human nature to want to win. They've beaten corps down to the point that some of them have dissolved altogether. Then big portions of that talent joins some other super corp. So you started with 40 PC corps, then after a few months it's 30, then 20, then 10. Out of that 10 there was only 3 or 4 that could actually compete with each other. Instead of wasting ISK on a dead game mode, they decided to print ISK. FA had to lock districts to prevent the investment and the work they'd done from getting smashed by attack after attack from AE and NS. Even though they were able to win a large share of matches against them, they had to use cheap tactics to have any chance at making a dent in RA's territory. There are two corps out there right now capable of beating the donut. Now locking is not profitable so that tactic is out. Any land won will quickly be taken back. It's pointless and anyone that says any different is a fool. It may be difficult to obtain and keep districts but one should not be put off from trying. Trying encourages others to try as well. The more try in a coordinated manner the better the chances are of obtaining a district. CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3345	Posted - 2014.04.14 20:20:00 - [16] - Quote Yokal Bob wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: They have a ridiculous amount of talent and experience in PC, that shouldn't be discounted. It's also not their fault that it's human nature to want to win. They've beaten corps down to the point that some of them have dissolved altogether. Then big portions of that talent joins some other super corp. So you started with 40 PC corps, then after a few months it's 30, then 20, then 10. Out of that 10 there was only 3 or 4 that could actually compete with each other. Instead of wasting ISK on a dead game mode, they decided to print ISK. FA had to lock districts to prevent the investment and the work they'd done from getting smashed by attack after attack from AE and NS. Even though they were able to win a large share of matches against them, they had to use cheap tactics to have any chance at making a dent in RA's territory. There are two corps out there right now capable of beating the donut. Now locking is not profitable so that tactic is out. Any land won will quickly be taken back. It's pointless and anyone that says any different is a fool. It may be difficult to obtain and keep districts but one should not be put off from trying. Trying encourages others to try as well. The more try in a coordinated manner the better the chances are of obtaining a district. OR you could bore them to death and save your ISK for decent mechanics. ISK is harder to come by these days. Spending billions of ISK on a lost cause while they are making billions a day is probably what they hope we'll all do. They are already recruiting and trying to poach away talent from those outside the donut. Why give them your corp wallet as well? Level 3 Forum Warrior
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2309	Posted - 2014.04.14 20:33:00 - [17] - Quote any corp that participated in lockingdrome and didn't post a thread about passive isk being the devil doesn't matter. You are only here because someone else is getting the isk and not you. you ladys are the worst vag gamers that I have encountered. Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another
Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 467	Posted - 2014.04.14 21:02:00 - [18] - Quote Free Beers wrote: any corp that participated in lockingdrome and didn't post a thread about passive isk being the devil doesn't matter. You are only here because someone else is getting the isk and not you. you ladys are the worst vag gamers that I have encountered. I couldn't care less whether people have more ISK than me. The only thing I would like to see in a player vs player game is exactly that player vs player. I want to see competition and activity, rivalries and fun for all. CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3348	Posted - 2014.04.14 22:04:00 - [19] - Quote Free Beers wrote: any corp that participated in lockingdrome and didn't post a thread about passive isk being the devil doesn't matter. You are only here because someone else is getting the isk and not you. you ladys are the worst vag gamers that I have encountered. Couldn't be further from the truth in my case. I never thought locking was good for the game, it was just necessary. If people hadn't locked PC would have been dead anyway. We just delayed the inevitable. The one difference may have been if you guys hadn't blue'd up. Maybe there would have been two powers going at it, but it really wouldn't be any different than it is now with 5 or 6 A teams dominating the participation. Either way the game mode would still be broken. Unless you consider the paltry participation in PC a good thing. Dust is still just as active as it was the day Uprising dropped but there's a substantial drop in the number of players in PC for months. Is that because we are all huge vaglnas or is it evidence of a broken game mode? Level 3 Forum Warrior
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3457	Posted - 2014.04.14 22:21:00 - [20] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: They have a ridiculous amount of talent and experience in PC, that shouldn't be discounted. It's also not their fault that it's human nature to want to win. They've beaten corps down to the point that some of them have dissolved altogether. Then big portions of that talent joins some other super corp. So you started with 40 PC corps, then after a few months it's 30, then 20, then 10. Out of that 10 there was only 3 or 4 that could actually compete with each other. Instead of wasting ISK on a dead game mode, they decided to print ISK. FA had to lock districts to prevent the investment and the work they'd done from getting smashed by attack after attack from AE and NS. Even though they were able to win a large share of matches against them, they had to use cheap tactics to have any chance at making a dent in RA's territory. There are two corps out there right now capable of beating the donut. Now locking is not profitable so that tactic is out. Any land won will quickly be taken back. It's pointless and anyone that says any different is a fool. Smart. Yes, it takes at least an equal number of skilled players to win a war of attrition. That is the primary difference between this game and EVE right now. If we were operating under an EVE ruleset, MH would probably be controlled by TSO right now because they have the numbers. Some people want it to follow the EVE zerg mindset, some people want it to be about who's got the better A-team. Right now its about who's got the better A-team assortment, and numbers only matter if they are players of a certain skill range. I should clarify what I said earlier though. When I say fight back I don't mean throw clone pack after clone pack at us like your wallet is endless and hope we burn out. That's going to take a really long time and it will just depress your own playerbase. What I mean is, dig deep and find the people who actually WANT to fight and are willing to lose, learn, and improve long enough that they can actually win further down the road. FA learns from every loss. Most corps do not.

Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 468	Posted - 2014.04.14 22:23:00 - [21] - Quote Thor Odinson42 wrote: Free Beers wrote: any corp that participated in lockingdrome and didn't post a thread about passive isk being the devil doesn't matter. You are only here because someone else is getting the isk and not you. you ladys are the worst vag gamers that I have encountered. Couldn't be further from the truth in my case. I never thought locking was good for the game, it was just necessary. If people hadn't locked PC would have been dead anyway. We just delayed the inevitable. The one difference may have been if you guys hadn't blue'd up. Maybe there would have been two powers going at it, but it really wouldn't be any different than it is now with 5 or 6 A teams dominating the participation. Either way the game mode would still be broken. Unless you consider the paltry participation in PC a good thing. Dust is still just as active as it was the day Uprising dropped but there's a substantial drop in the number of players in PC for months. Is that because we are all huge vaglnas or is it evidence of a broken game mode? Locking was bad for the game, as was corps using ringers. I believe that ringers should be sought from a corps respective alliance and then only to fill in the odd gaps. otherwise it should be a 16 v 16 match between corps CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Thor Odinson42 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 3351	Posted - 2014.04.14 23:37:00 - [22] - Quote Yokal Bob wrote: Thor Odinson42 wrote: Free Beers wrote: any corp that participated in lockingdrome and didn't post a thread about passive isk being the devil doesn't matter. You are only here because someone else is getting the isk and not you. you ladys are the worst vag gamers that I have encountered. Couldn't be further from the truth in my case. I never thought locking was good for the game, it was just necessary. If people hadn't locked PC would have been dead anyway. We just delayed the inevitable. The one difference may have been if you guys hadn't blue'd up. Maybe there would have been two powers going at it, but it really wouldn't be any different than it is now with 5 or 6 A teams dominating the participation. Either way the game mode would still be broken. Unless you consider the paltry participation in PC a good thing. Dust is still just as active as it was the day Uprising dropped but there's a substantial drop in the number of players in PC for months. Is that because we are all huge vaglnas or is it evidence of a broken game mode? Locking was bad for the game, as was corps using ringers. I believe that ringers should be sought from a corps respective alliance and then only to fill in the odd gaps. otherwise it should be a 16 v 16 match between corps I think ringers from outside of alliance should require a fee by the hiring corp to be paid before they can deploy. Call it a clone reprogramming fee. Level 3 Forum Warrior
Gelhad Thremyr Quebec United Caps and Mercs 235	Posted - 2014.04.15 03:34:00 - [23] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: Yokal Bob wrote: OK, so one reason why EoN, DNS and whoever is next will always have the upper hand is the amount of ISK they have (both corp and personal). This means that even if they lose a district, they can attack it for days wearing the opposition down. So how can we reduce the difference? Add maintence costs to districts? Let them add scenery and such in to the maps (maybe a hot-dog stand?) For ISK obviously Have different functioning districts that produce other things aside from ISK Any other ideas? Stick 'em 'ere! Actually fight back instead of asking CCP to fight back for you? Your so cute, your answers swells of the disconfort this gives you to have less competitive fights ! We DONT CARE ANYMORE about pc ! I will have fun watching you burn yourselves to the ground when a corps gets tired of having no quality conquest....
Himiko Kuronaga Fatal Absolution Dirt Nap Squad. 3463	Posted - 2014.04.15 05:16:00 - [24] - Quote Gelhad Thremyr wrote: blah blah something blah blah viva quebec yea, whatever.
Zatara Rought Fatal Absolution 2556	Posted - 2014.04.15 05:29:00 - [25] - Quote 843-BANE wrote: Why are you talking as if you are even kind of relevant to this blue doughnut? This could have easily been achieved regardless of what side you or TeamPlayers were on. FYI you didn't smash every opponent that ever faced you either, AE spanked you out of PC. remember? Or if you were referring to your blue doughnut victories, FA beat the blue doughnut until they pulled down their panties and bent over, and WTF has defended their district with a victory numerous times... You try getting rampaged sometime and walk away the same. CEO of FA B3RT>PFBHz>TP>IMP>FA Follow me on twitter Skype Zatara.Rought
Arcanine Rising Fatal Rainbow Holdings 4	Posted - 2014.04.15 05:49:00 - [26] - Quote Just a small thought: If you rid yourself of passive (or make it basically little more than nothing DUST side) and all the isk is generated through the biomass of clones in the battle, then you can safely reduce clone pack clost down without fear of inducing profitable locking. Sure you probably need to figure out a non isk reason that gives purpose to holding districts (a friend of mine today mentioned districts manufacturing specialist variants of stuff like FW) but other than that I think it's great. I think this will encourage more corps to feel inclined to fight in PC. I don't think encouraging people spamming clone packs is a bad thing. There should be 100 fights going on each day IMO.
iliel Capital Acquisitions LLC Dirt Nap Squad. 31	Posted - 2014.04.15 06:08:00 - [27] - Quote Hot dog stands. Clearly, that's the solution.
Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 468	Posted - 2014.04.15 06:18:00 - [28] - Quote Arcanine Rising wrote: Just a small thought: If you rid yourself of passive (or make it basically little more than nothing DUST side) and all the isk is generated through the biomass of clones in the battle, then you can safely reduce clone pack clost down without fear of inducing profitable locking. Sure you probably need to figure out a non isk reason that gives purpose to holding districts (a friend of mine today mentioned districts manufacturing specialist variants of stuff like FW) but other than that I think it's great. I think this will encourage more corps to feel inclined to fight in PC. I don't think encouraging people spamming clone packs is a bad thing. There should be 100 fights going on each day IMO. Indeed, but the stuff manufactured could also extend to the EVE side via a corp vault. Maybe salvage parts or parts of ships? And I agree people using clone packs, is a good thing, more fights should be going on :) CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Yokal Bob The Phoenix Federation Caps and Mercs 468	Posted - 2014.04.15 06:20:00 - [29] - Quote iliel wrote: Hot dog stands. Clearly, that's the solution. you never know when it may come in handy... especially if you have an outside TV to go with it, oh and a fridge and a couple dozen chairs. That way I can visit and watch anime all day :) CPM1 candidate I want my logi tank back
Free Beers Imperfects Negative-Feedback 2322	Posted - 2014.04.15 06:32:00 - [30] - Quote Himiko Kuronaga wrote: FA learns from every loss. Most corps do not. This. There is a very small player base that has the skill and understands what it takes to be competitive in PC and there is the rest that just "want to play pc". Also skill is only one factor in the game. Team work and tactics can trump skill. Every mercs life ends the same way. It is only the details of how he lived and died that distinguishes one from another

Cinder Integ Ancient Exiles. Dirt Nap Squad. 175	Posted - 2014.04.15 14:31:00 - [31] - Quote Killar-12 wrote: There's 5 things (used to be 4) that determined this "Dominant Force" Player Quality FOTM Spammability ISK Reserves in case of district loss Political Situations/Allies/Enemies EVE Support And don't forget number 6. Whether or not I'm online! Trading Carrots for Isk! Come and Get em!


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