DUST Search - Dont Nerf Heavy Suits CCP. Dont do it

Tesfa Alem wrote:

Bax Zanith wrote:

Imp Smash wrote:

LEHON Xeon wrote:

The Terminator T-1000 wrote:

I think the problem is players playing Rambo trying to solo a heavy inside 30 meters using an AR

No, the main problem are scrubs using sentinel suits with mid-long to long range light weapons because they need the extra eHP to survive a gunfight.

Heavies are supposed to be badass at close range. That's why they are slow.

Here is an idea - don't nerf the heavy or HMG - instead take away heavy ability to wield light weapons. No more rr heavies. All complaints solved.

Removing light weapon fitting abilities from basic heavy and sentinel frames. As much as I dislike the idea, it might need to happen. However, this perposed change has a logic hole; what excuse would we have to prevent us from using light weapons? People who support this change think the exuse should be because our fingers are too fat for the trigger. If this is the reason, then we would also not have sidearms and commandos.

So, what would the most logical explanation be for our abillity to weald weapons too heavy for medium frams, plus a side arm, yet can't fit a light weapon and a side arm, unless its a commando suit?

No real logical reason for why they physically cannot use light weapons, perhaps just slap on a fitting penalty for not using your role a intended. Lorewise you could say The suit was designed for heavy weapons use when its Primary Weapon platform is selected, tending to overcompensate with light weapons, thus making light weapons more difficult to operate.

All my posts are respec posts (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ LockmeBro!

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xSir Campsalotx G0DS AM0NG MEN D.E.F.I.A.N.C.E 185	Posted - 2014.04.03 07:23:00 - [31] - Quote Poor min sentinels... Have y'all noticed the mins movement speed on the basic frame is 4.2? I find the basic frame much better than the sentinel because the extra .15m/s is quite noticeable and helpful. Why not translate this speed because 4.05 movement is lacking when considering the relatively small HP of the min. G0DS AM0NG MEN Director 1.8 is going to be Heavy 514 they said... Looking around all I see are twig men
iliel Capital Acquisitions LLC Dirt Nap Squad. 20	Posted - 2014.04.03 07:28:00 - [32] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: As mentioned in a few other threads, there's no guarantee that Heavy EHP will be reduced. We're simply keeping an eye on it at the moment but wanted to let players know that it was a possibility. Well, I sure hope you're tallying how many times BASIC heavy machine guns mow down PROTOTYPE logistic and/or assault suits at a range greater than twenty meters. At the same time, I guess logibro's April Fools' joke may not have been a joke after all - - Large Blaster Turret being the code word for HMG.
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 346	Posted - 2014.04.03 07:29:00 - [33] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I waited a year for racial heavies. Now i am afraid to spend any of my 11 million unalocatted sp because of a possible nerf to heavy suits so im still using my free dren bpo. This only happens in CCP world I don't blame you. Not a good state of affairs. But holding onto your SP for the moment is right I would say - just means you don't get to enjoy the new content with others at release :( Also means CCP can't get complete feedback figures after release as to how well a suit or style is doing, because they suggested a big nerf and stopped people speccing into something. You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
IAmDuncanIdaho II R 0 N 1 N 346	Posted - 2014.04.03 07:48:00 - [34] - Quote KalOfTheRathi wrote: Until CCP/Shanghai states, in writing, on these forums that there will be no Nerf Hammer of the Heavy suits I am not spending ISK/SP/AUR/LP or effort on Heavies. Because if you do Nerf Hammer them, which 99% of the Mercs think you will, CCP/Shanghai will refuse to refund anything at all. If this was addressed, I think we'd be golden. You must learn honor, or you deserve to learn nothing at all. Rivvy Dinari - Swordmaster of Ginaz
Apison Valusgeffen Edimmu Warfighters Gallente Federation 32	Posted - 2014.04.03 08:30:00 - [35] - Quote The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think the problem is players playing Rambo trying to solo a heavy inside 30 meters using an AR That's it exactly! People are used to the old days when they could just run up on one of us heavies with their (insert choice of rifle here) dance around a little bit, outgun our (insert choice of HMG here), melt our shields AND our armor in a matter of seconds, and drop us like a sack of potatoes. Meanwhile, we're left in a heap on the floor hitting the logibro call button for help as they move on to the next engagement. Then after the match they sit around knocking back beers with their buddies and bragging about all the different ways they just completely wreck the big dumb lummoxes dubbed "heavies". Well now that we're somewhat fixed and actually able to fulfill our intended role (no longer just "heavies" in name only) suddenly those beers aren't as tasty, and they can't understand why they aren't able to tell as many "I totally wrecked this heavy..." war stories. "You shot who in the what now?" Jasper Beardly, The Simpsons: Season 7 - Episode 1 Circa 1995
Alena Ventrallis PAND3M0N1UM Lokun Listamenn 1114	Posted - 2014.04.03 09:40:00 - [36] - Quote Bax Zanith wrote: Imp Smash wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think the problem is players playing Rambo trying to solo a heavy inside 30 meters using an AR No, the main problem are scrubs using sentinel suits with mid-long to long range light weapons because they need the extra eHP to survive a gunfight. Heavies are supposed to be badass at close range. That's why they are slow. Here is an idea - don't nerf the heavy or HMG - instead take away heavy ability to wield light weapons. No more rr heavies. All complaints solved. Removing light weapon fitting abilities from basic heavy and sentinel frames. As much as I dislike the idea, it might need to happen. However, this perposed change has a logic hole; what excuse would we have to prevent us from using light weapons? People who support this change think the exuse should be because our fingers are too fat for the trigger. If this is the reason, then we would also not have sidearms and commandos. So, what would the most logical explanation be for our abillity to weald weapons too heavy for medium frams, plus a side arm, yet can't fit a light weapon and a side arm, unless its a commando suit? I would say that sentinels should lose the sidearm slot as well. And commandos are made with more nimble hands, and so can better weild light weapons at the expense of not having the strength for heavy weapons. Best PVE idea I've seen. Fixed link.
Tesfa Alem Death by Disassociation Top Men. 100	Posted - 2014.04.03 10:34:00 - [37] - Quote Bax Zanith wrote: Imp Smash wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think the problem is players playing Rambo trying to solo a heavy inside 30 meters using an AR No, the main problem are scrubs using sentinel suits with mid-long to long range light weapons because they need the extra eHP to survive a gunfight. Heavies are supposed to be badass at close range. That's why they are slow. Here is an idea - don't nerf the heavy or HMG - instead take away heavy ability to wield light weapons. No more rr heavies. All complaints solved. Removing light weapon fitting abilities from basic heavy and sentinel frames. As much as I dislike the idea, it might need to happen. However, this perposed change has a logic hole; what excuse would we have to prevent us from using light weapons? People who support this change think the exuse should be because our fingers are too fat for the trigger. If this is the reason, then we would also not have sidearms and commandos. So, what would the most logical explanation be for our abillity to weald weapons too heavy for medium frams, plus a side arm, yet can't fit a light weapon and a side arm, unless its a commando suit? No real logical reason for why they physically cannot use light weapons, perhaps just slap on a fitting penalty for not using your role a intended. Lorewise you could say The suit was designed for heavy weapons use when its Primary Weapon platform is selected, tending to overcompensate with light weapons, thus making light weapons more difficult to operate. Redline for Thee, but no Redline for Me.
Bax Zanith 102	Posted - 2014.04.03 15:16:00 - [38] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Bax Zanith wrote: Imp Smash wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think the problem is players playing Rambo trying to solo a heavy inside 30 meters using an AR No, the main problem are scrubs using sentinel suits with mid-long to long range light weapons because they need the extra eHP to survive a gunfight. Heavies are supposed to be badass at close range. That's why they are slow. Here is an idea - don't nerf the heavy or HMG - instead take away heavy ability to wield light weapons. No more rr heavies. All complaints solved. Removing light weapon fitting abilities from basic heavy and sentinel frames. As much as I dislike the idea, it might need to happen. However, this perposed change has a logic hole; what excuse would we have to prevent us from using light weapons? People who support this change think the exuse should be because our fingers are too fat for the trigger. If this is the reason, then we would also not have sidearms and commandos. So, what would the most logical explanation be for our abillity to weald weapons too heavy for medium frams, plus a side arm, yet can't fit a light weapon and a side arm, unless its a commando suit? I would say that sentinels should lose the sidearm slot as well. And commandos are made with more nimble hands, and so can better weild light weapons at the expense of not having the strength for heavy weapons. Okay, I can't remember the last time I used my scrambler pistol, but how would forge gun heavies feel? Its possible to kill infentry with a forge gun, but its not practical. Think of ALL the variables. I'd say walk in my shoes for a day, but you probably still won't understand.
Alldin Kan Imperfects Negative-Feedback 1030	Posted - 2014.04.03 15:37:00 - [39] - Quote Magpie Raven wrote: Please don't do it. Why would you finally put the heavy suit in a good position just to club it over the head with the nerf hammer? If heavies needed nerfing the forums would be lit up with complaints about it. But Its not. Maybe tweak a few things but dont nerf it. Ive seen good cases made for increasing Caldari Shield and decreasing armor and vice versa with gallente. That I could live with. But not the flat 20% HP nerf ive been hearing about ZionTCD still exists? Uprising 1.8 - Invisible War
EverNub Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION 34	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:28:00 - [40] - Quote Magpie Raven wrote: Disturbingly Bored wrote: Magpie Raven wrote: For the first time since Replication. (I think thats what it waas called) The heavy suit is actually effective and feared. Woo boy. You must have missed out on HMG Sharpshooter in Chromosome. That was sumthin'. I actually was there for that. It was crazy. I just couldnt remember which was first. Replication or Chromosome. OMG sharpshooter was Fun and OP on every weapon, specifically for HMG's and SMG's. I remeber pegging people in the " Bowl " map with my HMG from one side to the other...memories What is the use of fighting if you haven't got a tolerable planet to fight over? Trees...Water...Anything but Rocks!

Gelhad Thremyr Quebec United 169	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:38:00 - [41] - Quote FIX THE FORGE GUN!
EverNub Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION 34	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:45:00 - [42] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: Magpie Raven wrote: Please don't do it. Why would you finally put the heavy suit in a good position just to club it over the head with the nerf hammer? If heavies needed nerfing the forums would be lit up with complaints about it. But Its not. Maybe tweak a few things but dont nerf it. Ive seen good cases made for increasing Caldari Shield and decreasing armor and vice versa with gallente. That I could live with. But not the flat 20% HP nerf ive been hearing about ZionTCD still exists? hahahaha What is the use of fighting if you haven't got a tolerable planet to fight over? Trees...Water...Anything but Rocks!
The Terminator T-1000 Skynet Incorporated 329	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:49:00 - [43] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: As mentioned in a few other threads, there's no guarantee that Heavy EHP will be reduced. We're simply keeping an eye on it at the moment but wanted to let players know that it was a possibility. Which one has the least possibility of getting nerfed, the scout or the heavy? Since 1.8 i have not skilled i to any suits because of fear of getting nerfed. I dont want to skilled into something that is over powered but i also do not want to skilled into something based on what the specs are now and later they get changed and we do not get a sp refund! For example, i agree with the damage mods change (nerf) but the right thing to do was to refund the players their SP and let them decide if they still want to skill in dmg mods based on the new specs. Same thing with profeciency. What is so difficult to refund those skills? What CCP does is not right! Yes CCP owns the game and they have the right to do what they want, but it still does not make it right!
see see-pee A.O.D. VP Gaming Alliance 11	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:52:00 - [44] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: As mentioned in a few other threads, there's no guarantee that Heavy EHP will be reduced. We're simply keeping an eye on it at the moment but wanted to let players know that it was a possibility. hows about this .. nerf it.. and nerf your player base// PERIOD NO ONE IS PLAYING... numbers are down.. the only suit that had only 1 variant & only 2 weapons gets nerfed... AND YOU WILL HAVE TO SHUT DOWN THE SERVERS... mark these words See See-Pee On U Fools~ see see-pee or not to pee ... that's the question
Thanjac Ruthless Chaos 122	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:55:00 - [45] - Quote The answer to heavys with light weapons is make it that in order to fit a light weapon a heavy has to sacrifice mods, or do something to them like the cloaks Proud Commando/ARC Instructor "Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends."
Vespasian Andendare Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 771	Posted - 2014.04.03 16:57:00 - [46] - Quote Disturbingly Bored wrote: Magpie Raven wrote: For the first time since Replication. (I think thats what it waas called) The heavy suit is actually effective and feared. Woo boy. You must have missed out on HMG Sharpshooter in Chromosome. That was sumthin'. Still, as powerful as Sentinel feels in this build, it still dies to rifles at range and to Shotty Scout suits up close (provided they get the drop on you). And that's balance in my book. Honestly, this game is feeling pretty damn great right now if you can look past the dozens of wonky bugs. Assaults, Flaylock, PLC need some love. But beside that, just about everything is feeling pretty good. Very well said. The game feels better than it ever has. We see some suit diversity--finally! Medium suits need some love to make them more compelling, and perhaps scouts could have some counter, but overall the game is awesome. Keep moving in this direction and the playerbase will continue to grow. Add in a revamped NPE that REALLY lets players ease in (instead of 2-3 matches then protostomping) and PVE and you'll have a winner. >> Play Dust 514 FREE! Sign up for exclusive gear today! <<
Vespasian Andendare Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 771	Posted - 2014.04.03 17:01:00 - [47] - Quote IAmDuncanIdaho II wrote: KalOfTheRathi wrote: Until CCP/Shanghai states, in writing, on these forums that there will be no Nerf Hammer of the Heavy suits I am not spending ISK/SP/AUR/LP or effort on Heavies. Because if you do Nerf Hammer them, which 99% of the Mercs think you will, CCP/Shanghai will refuse to refund anything at all. If this was addressed, I think we'd be golden. lol. you guys need to stop banking on getting an sp refund after EVERY change. seriously. it's getting old. >> Play Dust 514 FREE! Sign up for exclusive gear today! <<
Ace Starburst PiZzA DuDeS 81	Posted - 2014.04.03 17:05:00 - [48] - Quote Bax Zanith wrote: Okay, I can't remember the last time I used my scrambler pistol, but how would forge gun heavies feel? Its possible to kill infentry with a forge gun, but its not practical. Think of ALL the variables. It's almost a requirement to have a decent side arm for a forge gun heavy. Something that can put the other guy down quick or make them reconsider the engagement. My personal favorites, the burst Scrambler Pistol and the Assault SMG.
EverNub Da Short Buss RISE of LEGION 34	Posted - 2014.04.03 17:26:00 - [49] - Quote [/quote] Keep moving in this direction and the playerbase will continue to grow. Add in a revamped NPE that REALLY lets players ease in (instead of 2-3 matches then protostomping) and PVE and you'll have a winner. [/quote] Ya i feel bad for new players since there really is no learning curve except to just get proto stomped by vets. CCP really should extend the Academy to help new players get used to the game more and earn some SP kinda like now but 1,000 wp is not a learning curve haha. They should have a cap at more like 5k WP or even give them the option to opt out early if they want at 5k but can stay til 10k? idk an issue though if u guys want new players to buy ur AUR lol What is the use of fighting if you haven't got a tolerable planet to fight over? Trees...Water...Anything but Rocks!
Criteria Shipment Dogs of War Gaming Zero-Day 762	Posted - 2014.04.03 17:29:00 - [50] - Quote CCP Saberwing wrote: As mentioned in a few other threads, there's no guarantee that Heavy EHP will be reduced. We're simply keeping an eye on it at the moment but wanted to let players know that it was a possibility. Nerf the heavy, 5 seconds later you see my fist in your face. Goodbye, world! (püú-ÿ+í-ÿ-é)

Awry Barux Ametat Security Amarr Empire 1610	Posted - 2014.04.03 17:35:00 - [51] - Quote Tesfa Alem wrote: Bax Zanith wrote: Imp Smash wrote: LEHON Xeon wrote: The Terminator T-1000 wrote: I think the problem is players playing Rambo trying to solo a heavy inside 30 meters using an AR No, the main problem are scrubs using sentinel suits with mid-long to long range light weapons because they need the extra eHP to survive a gunfight. Heavies are supposed to be badass at close range. That's why they are slow. Here is an idea - don't nerf the heavy or HMG - instead take away heavy ability to wield light weapons. No more rr heavies. All complaints solved. Removing light weapon fitting abilities from basic heavy and sentinel frames. As much as I dislike the idea, it might need to happen. However, this perposed change has a logic hole; what excuse would we have to prevent us from using light weapons? People who support this change think the exuse should be because our fingers are too fat for the trigger. If this is the reason, then we would also not have sidearms and commandos. So, what would the most logical explanation be for our abillity to weald weapons too heavy for medium frams, plus a side arm, yet can't fit a light weapon and a side arm, unless its a commando suit? No real logical reason for why they physically cannot use light weapons, perhaps just slap on a fitting penalty for not using your role a intended. Lorewise you could say The suit was designed for heavy weapons use when its Primary Weapon platform is selected, tending to overcompensate with light weapons, thus making light weapons more difficult to operate. In a similar vein, but for making it impossible to use light weapons: The power output of the Heavy weapon slot would burn out weapons not specifically designed with it in mind. i.e. it breaks your SCR focusing crystals, it burns out the rails in your rail rifle, etc etc /lore Respec in 1.8 due to huge battlefield role shift for MinLogi! All my posts are respec posts (Gò»°Gûí°n+ëGò»n+¦ Gö+GöüGö+ LockmeBro!
NextDark Knight Hellstorm Inc League of Infamy 341	Posted - 2014.04.03 18:00:00 - [52] - Quote Honestly, I don't care if a heavy can carry a light weapon. A heavy weapon should be so bad ass that you wouldn't want to fit anything else in the slot. Bring a tear to my eye seeing the Forge Gun in such a bad state... No splash, No ROF.. doesn't even fire correctly anymore. Forge Changes needed Officer Splash 3.0, Proto 2.7 Advanced 2.5 Standard 2.1. Original ROF needs to return!
Magpie Raven ZionTCD 414	Posted - 2014.04.04 00:22:00 - [53] - Quote Alldin Kan wrote: Magpie Raven wrote: Please don't do it. Why would you finally put the heavy suit in a good position just to club it over the head with the nerf hammer? If heavies needed nerfing the forums would be lit up with complaints about it. But Its not. Maybe tweak a few things but dont nerf it. Ive seen good cases made for increasing Caldari Shield and decreasing armor and vice versa with gallente. That I could live with. But not the flat 20% HP nerf ive been hearing about ZionTCD still exists? Yeah we do. Were kinda hibernating at the moment as far as I can tell. At least until the game is stable and becomes what it was meant to be
fragmentedhackslash Krusual Covert Operators 237	Posted - 2014.04.04 00:39:00 - [54] - Quote Just wait till Kane Speros plans to halve the sniper rifle range to 300 meters goes through... then you will see some QQ. Pain is just weakness leaving your body. Every day is a holiday. Every meal is a feast.
castba Penguin's March 363	Posted - 2014.04.04 01:08:00 - [55] - Quote Bormir1r wrote: Magpie Raven wrote: Please don't do it. Why would you finally put the heavy suit in a good position just to club it over the head with the nerf hammer? If heavies needed nerfing the forums would be lit up with complaints about it. But Its not. Maybe tweak a few things but dont nerf it. Ive seen good cases made for increasing Caldari Shield and decreasing armor and vice versa with gallente. That I could live with. But not the flat 20% HP nerf ive been hearing about The HMG is a little too good though. Yet rubbish outside for 20m. Shot gun is massive, yet rubbish outside of 10m Knives are a ohk against most sits but are rubbish outside of 2m. How do these weapons stack up at 30m+? Unless you have a shot gun or nova knives, why are you engaging an HMG heavy within 20m? HMG sucks if your tactics are good.
castba Penguin's March 363	Posted - 2014.04.04 01:11:00 - [56] - Quote Racro 01 Arifistan wrote: why dont heavys look on teh brightside of life? they may be loseing base ehp (dosnt make of for much anyway) but they will still have close to 2-3 times the base hp of a medium frame.. but that sentinal bonus almost virtually doubles your hp. (against respective damge types anyways). what i think ccp should do is leave the base heavy frame alone (lets face it this is rare to be used) slightly nerf the sentinel suits hp (come on this thing has a resistence bonus) then hevays get the choice of pure raw HP, specific damage type resistence. or the trollmandos with 2 light wepaons. You'be been told a million times to stop exaggerating.
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1141	Posted - 2014.04.04 02:51:00 - [57] - Quote jerrmy12 kahoalii wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: As mentioned in a few other threads, there's no guarantee that Heavy EHP will be reduced. We're simply keeping an eye on it at the moment but wanted to let players know that it was a possibility. Good, but minmatar and caldari sentinels need buffing... That is very true. This character was considering Minmatar because of past experience (now fully negated) as a Minmatar Logi. A Minmatar Scout, Logi and Heavy seemed liked a reasonable idea. Then I looked at the miniscule EHP and with a possible Nerf Hammer instead of a Buff the suit is junk. Assault too but that was a given. The only thing the Assault has going for it is the clip size increase. Except that it only increases projectile weapon clips and with the now, overly complex, resistances why bother. Projectile is not a particularly effective weapon choice. And bonuses don't work at all until your health is back to normal. So spawning in anywhere but the ground or MCC is a death sentence. Welcome to Dust And so it goes.
KING CHECKMATE Tal-Romon Legion Amarr Empire 4790	Posted - 2014.04.04 02:53:00 - [58] - Quote Magpie Raven wrote: Please don't do it. Why would you finally put the heavy suit in a good position just to club it over the head with the nerf hammer? If heavies needed nerfing the forums would be lit up with complaints about it. But Its not. Maybe tweak a few things but dont nerf it. Ive seen good cases made for increasing Caldari Shield and decreasing armor and vice versa with gallente. That I could live with. But not the flat 20% HP nerf ive been hearing about As a scout i approve of this. Like drones? = https://forums.dust514.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=153604&find=unread
KalOfTheRathi Nec Tributis 1141	Posted - 2014.04.04 02:56:00 - [59] - Quote castba wrote: Bormir1r wrote: [quote=Magpie Raven] The HMG is a little too good though. Yet rubbish outside for 20m. Shot gun is massive, yet rubbish outside of 10m Knives are a ohk against most sits but are rubbish outside of 2m. How do these weapons stack up at 30m+? Unless you have a shot gun or nova knives, why are you engaging an HMG heavy within 20m? HMG sucks if your tactics are good. The very expensive Freedom Assault finally has a little range but it is far from deadly. My alt uses them and the days when clearing a rooftop with it are just a faint memory. Of course he quit running heavies when the combat and rail rifles killed him consistently without even taking a single point of damage. He quit wasting ISK and suits. Free suits and sniper rifles worked well enough. At least HMGs are the total embarrassment they were. They are very limited use weapons however. With adequate supply depots that might be alright but supply depots are rare these days. And so it goes.

CCP Saberwing C C P C C P Alliance 3211	Posted - 2014.04.04 02:58:00 - [60] - Quote Criteria Shipment wrote: CCP Saberwing wrote: As mentioned in a few other threads, there's no guarantee that Heavy EHP will be reduced. We're simply keeping an eye on it at the moment but wanted to let players know that it was a possibility. Nerf the heavy, 5 seconds later you see my fist in your face. Sounds pretty serious. CCP Saberwing // DUST 514 Community Manager // @kanafchian




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