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In the new DUST, infantry prices are FAR too high.

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Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7849	Posted - 2014.03.29 14:42:00 - [1] - Quote In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 2290	Posted - 2014.03.29 14:44:00 - [2] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. Welcome to america514 For the Federation!
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7849	Posted - 2014.03.29 14:44:00 - [3] - Quote Though this seems to be a symptom of tiers TBH, but I feel like tiercide is far away, so at least reduce prices for now My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
BL4CKST4R WarRavens League of Infamy 2292	Posted - 2014.03.29 14:53:00 - [4] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Though this seems to be a symptom of tiers TBH, but I feel like tiercide is far away, so at least reduce prices for now CCP should remove all basic-proto suits and add proto suits at level 1 of their related skills. Skilling up only increases the effectiveness of the suit. This fixes NPE This fixes HP disparities This makes balancing a bucketloadofmonkeys easier And makes the game tons funner For the Federation!
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 557	Posted - 2014.03.29 14:59:00 - [5] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? what new players run 50 k isk suits? BACON my recruiter link
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7852	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:01:00 - [6] - Quote deepfried salad gilliam wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? what new players run 50 k isk suits? That's the price of an advanced suit with an advanced weapon + advanced equipment and the modules. I tried, they cost around 30k to 70k (70k being with proto modules). My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 3415	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:02:00 - [7] - Quote Quit splitting the pool of "ISK Destroyed" among the whole team. Add more rewards for WP earned. Players with <100 WP only get paid for time in the match. I GÖú Kittens.
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 1894	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:06:00 - [8] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. I've been making isk and getting ok results in my sver suit. It's tougher on the lone wolf now to be sure, but still doable. I support SP rollover.
deepfried salad gilliam Sanguine Knights 557	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:07:00 - [9] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: deepfried salad gilliam wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? what new players run 50 k isk suits? That's the price of an advanced suit with an advanced weapon + advanced equipment and the modules. I tried, they cost around 30k to 70k (70k being with proto modules). but still how many new players run it, ive never seen anyone whos played for less than 4 months run anything more than an advanced rifle. BACON my recruiter link
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7852	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:07:00 - [10] - Quote Vrain Matari wrote: Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. I've been making isk and getting ok results in my sver suit. It's tougher on the lone wolf now to be sure, but still doable. Talking about new players here bud. Most of us here can run completely militia suits and still dominate. My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.

Reav Hannari Red Rock Outriders 3517	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:12:00 - [11] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Though this seems to be a symptom of tiers TBH, but I feel like tiercide is far away, so at least reduce prices for now CCP should remove all basic-proto suits and add proto suits at level 1 of their related skills. Skilling up only increases the effectiveness of the suit. This fixes NPE This fixes HP disparities This makes balancing a bucketloadofmonkeys easier And makes the game tons funner When I suggested this our fellow players trashed the idea. I still think it's the way to go. Bitter Vet // QA: Learn It, Love It, Do It // @ReesNoturana
xxwhitedevilxx M Maphia Clan Corporation 2077	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:14:00 - [12] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Though this seems to be a symptom of tiers TBH, but I feel like tiercide is far away, so at least reduce prices for now Imo, it would be enough to raise pub matches pay. But please, not the "isk per second" policy, that's totally broken and easily exploitable. >Bastard I : "Cce me ne... futt! XD"
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7852	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:18:00 - [13] - Quote xxwhitedevilxx M wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Though this seems to be a symptom of tiers TBH, but I feel like tiercide is far away, so at least reduce prices for now Imo, it would be enough to raise pub matches pay. But please, not the "isk per second" policy, that's totally broken and easily exploitable. I don't think so. Vehicles are also brought into the mix or price consideration. This will distort too much. My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
Cyzad4 Blackfish Corp. 227	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:26:00 - [14] - Quote Rynoceros wrote: Quit splitting the pool of "ISK Destroyed" among the whole team. Add more rewards for WP earned. Players with <100 WP only get paid for time in the match. So making NPE worse is your answer? Welcome to you're "DOOM"
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 1894	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:37:00 - [15] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: Vrain Matari wrote: Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. I've been making isk and getting ok results in my sver suit. It's tougher on the lone wolf now to be sure, but still doable. Talking about new players here bud. Most of us here can run completely militia suits and still dominate. Ah, the lower-ISK-penalty-in-lieu-of-knowledge model of education. That's got success written all over it. Any new player running advanced suits to try and compete with proto vets is a fool. You're trying to compensate for CCP's matchmaking with ISK. Not gonna work. I support SP rollover.
Henchmen21 Planet Express LLC 820	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:44:00 - [16] - Quote As long as I run anything but a logi I tend to do okay over the long term. With logi at best I break even. Some equipment and mods are just over priced. CCP wants it this way because liquid isk means less reason to bu aurum. CCP you better nail 1.8, as it stands 1.7 is a total disaster. Henchmen21: Infantry Gotyougood Ufkr: Vehicles
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 3415	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:45:00 - [17] - Quote Cyzad4 wrote: Rynoceros wrote: Quit splitting the pool of "ISK Destroyed" among the whole team. Add more rewards for WP earned. Players with <100 WP only get paid for time in the match. So making NPE worse is your answer? Players with <100 WP are most likely, and should be, only using MLT and Starter Fits. They need to learn efficiency and pay-for-performance at an early stage. NPE is going to suck until they get PvE. Period. I GÖú Kittens.
Vulcanus Lightbringer Eyniletti Rangers Minmatar Republic 355	Posted - 2014.03.29 15:58:00 - [18] - Quote Dust needs tiericide, or at the very least tier-restrictions based on security status (high-sec: MIL>STD, low-sec: MIL>ADV, null-sec: MIL>PRO). It's the only thing that's going to improve the NPE, not too mention how much easier it would be to balance.
Takahiro Kashuken Red Star. EoN. 3150	Posted - 2014.03.29 16:23:00 - [19] - Quote lolno Infantry prices are far too low Back in the day infantry proto suit cost you 300k unfitted - That was great because as soon as you tried to pub stomp and lost one you were in the red Keep basic cheap, raise prices of adv/proto by a fair bit that way its not proto stomping as much in pubs Intelligence is OP
Spkr4theDead Red Star. EoN. 1964	Posted - 2014.03.30 16:59:00 - [20] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. I thought you were leaving. So............ leave I may be missing something, but I'm pretty sure that I didn't call for a tank nerf before Uprising 1.7. - Atiim

Louis Domi Pradox One Proficiency V. 162	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:04:00 - [21] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. Your Adv gear is way to expensive, for me i still make money in my adv gear if i die in the 12-14 range... and this is only when the isk gains are at 250k+ Still i would say the isk gains are crap.
Nocturnal Soul Immortal Retribution 2594	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:06:00 - [22] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: lolno Infantry prices are far too low Back in the day infantry proto suit cost you 300k unfitted - That was great because as soon as you tried to pub stomp and lost one you were in the red Keep basic cheap, raise prices of adv/proto by a fair bit that way its not proto stomping as much in pubs But then I wouldn't be able to advance stomp in pubs Its alright everyone, no need to worry it's just an Amarr scout :(
Sgt Kirk Fatal Absolution Negative-Feedback 5417	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:11:00 - [23] - Quote Takahiro Kashuken wrote: lolno Infantry prices are far too low Back in the day infantry proto suit cost you 300k unfitted - That was great because as soon as you tried to pub stomp and lost one you were in the red Keep basic cheap, raise prices of adv/proto by a fair bit that way its not proto stomping as much in pubs ha hahahahaha AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA You seriously think that will keep people from protostomping. Do you have any idea how much money the 1% of DUST have? I just bought 800 STD 600 ADV and 400 PRO suits and fittings and it put a very small dent in my 600,000,000 ISK. But you could always make it easier for me to protostomp....although I'm always using the UP **....Damn Caldari lovin CCP. 1st Official Role Playing Gallente Asshole** -Title Awarded by True Adamance
Roy Ventus Axis of Chaos 1541	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:16:00 - [24] - Quote Don't really care for Tiercide right now. We've been through so many overhauls that I don't care to do another one unless it's completely needed. We can lower the prices now until we get other options for gaining ISK other than the simple PVP we have. PVE is the main contender for assisting new players in getting ISK. Dealing with AI(CCP made AI for that matter >.> lulz) is much better than dealing with crazed soldiers. Much more streamline set of tactics and strategies instead of having to constantly adapt(although I would like for the PVE to try to have players on their toes the best they can). Then there's the market and trading. This wouldn't be beneficial for new players but older players who aren't as good on the battlefield could take part in gun laundering, third-party banking(for transferring money in between accounts secretly), and other heavily meta ways of playing the game, associated to the market. I'm still hopeful about that Arena. No reason to why we shouldn't get it considering that it'll increase the active playerbase and overall popularity of Dust when it comes to outsiders. Depending on how they design it, it could be good for players both new and old to make ISK who aren't into the more lore-based PVP. "There once was a time when there wasn't a Roy Ventus and it wasn't much of a time at all." Roy Ventus
BAD FURRY SVER True Blood General Tso's Alliance 699	Posted - 2014.03.30 17:19:00 - [25] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. LOL your not jokeing ??? LOL !!!!!! karma nerf the tank pay out the but for drop suits ! Yes i am a Undead Hell Wolf ... nice to meat you!
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7897	Posted - 2014.03.30 19:01:00 - [26] - Quote Spkr4theDead wrote: Cat Merc wrote: In the old DUST, you could take even an STD suit, and expect to get at most 2 deaths if you're good. That's no longer the case, unless you're a thale sniper in the redline, there are MANY ways to die where you pretty much have no way to react. Cloaked shotgunners, HMG's up your but from an LAV driver or someone who just spawned, super tanks that can insta kill you before you can blink, and more and more. You're expected to die, but your wallet cannot take it. 4 deaths in a good ADV suit means you're not making any money. 4 deaths, that can happen super fast. I can hear you now: "But I'm super rich, ISK is lol to me" True, and that's true to me too, I run with a squad so ISK losses are rare, but think of a new player? Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? That's another reason people brick tank, they don't want to lose their expensive suits without having a say in it, without having the possibility of fighting back. Ultimatly this doesn't matter to me, I have a lot of ISK and make it easily, but I care about the new players, and running ADV suits to be somewhat competitive against proto suits is not viable for them. They're forced to switch to MLT suits and have fun being stomped over. I thought you were leaving. So............ leave After what, 6 times I told you? You still don't understand? There's a difference between leaving and taking a break. Now go cry about how underpowered your tank is My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
Ansiiis The Trustworthy Mocking Bird Inc. 944	Posted - 2014.03.30 19:06:00 - [27] - Quote I run solo and still don't see what's the problem. I make ISK at the same rate as before. Don't be stupid - I can obviously see you.
Cat Merc Ahrendee Mercenaries Dirt Nap Squad. 7897	Posted - 2014.03.30 19:08:00 - [28] - Quote Ansiiis The Trustworthy wrote: I run solo and still don't see what's the problem. I make ISK at the same rate as before. I don't have such problems, but you can't deny the battlefield isn't more dangerous than ever. **** happens without you having a fighting chance. Before the only time you don't have a fighting chance is when there's a mass of troops trying to kill you, but those are easy to detect because, well, they're a mass of troops. My intentions is to have a fun game for everyone. If I seem to be biased, I have good hard data to back it up.
Cinnamon267 122	Posted - 2014.03.30 22:10:00 - [29] - Quote BL4CKST4R wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Though this seems to be a symptom of tiers TBH, but I feel like tiercide is far away, so at least reduce prices for now CCP should remove all basic-proto suits and add proto suits at level 1 of their related skills. Skilling up only increases the effectiveness of the suit. This fixes NPE This fixes HP disparities This makes balancing a bucketloadofmonkeys easier And makes the game tons funner I really like this idea, actually. You have a "basic" suit that upgrades as you dump more SP into it. Level 3 gets you more CPU/PG and more slots to work with. But, an issue arises. What does that suit cost? Is it super cheap, or super expensive all the time? Some people have proto gear but choose to run standard/ADV because it's cheaper. What happens then
bogeyman m Krusual Covert Operators Minmatar Republic 131	Posted - 2014.03.31 07:51:00 - [30] - Quote Cat Merc wrote: deepfried salad gilliam wrote: Cat Merc wrote: Do you think they can take losing 50k ISK a suit when matches give you 200k per? what new players run 50 k isk suits? That's the price of an advanced suit with an advanced weapon + advanced equipment and the modules. I tried, they cost around 30k to 70k (70k being with proto modules). Logi gear costs more than that... Duct tape 2.0 > Have WD-40; will travel.



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