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TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR
Fatal Absolution
Negative-Feedback
1921
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Posted - 2014.03.27 18:22:00 -
[31] - Quote
Yan Darn wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:Tectonic Fusion wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:is that YOU CAN.
scouts can get the same ehp as assaults. FALSE
scouts are basically invisible. Meh. Use an SMG to find them.
scouts are faster than assaults. NO **** SHERLOCK!
Fixed. 1.) pretty sure 1000 ehp is the same as assault. 2.) easier said than done 3.) yes, it is quite obvious. hence why people are using the scout instead of the assault. I'm not afraid to admit that the scout buff has broken assaults and that is WRONG. I think some people are getting overly defensive against your posts and are afraid to ask the question 'why would you play 3/4 assaults over a brick tanked scout?'. Assaults need a buff. And maybe scouts need to trade EHP for something ewar related - I think the technical limit on speed has messed up a crucial aspect of differentiating/balancing lights against meds Now I wait to get flamed by people who will assume I'm a med frame because I dared to suggest something is up with scout/assault balance.
exactly what's happening to me. they don't realize that this defense of assaults is coming from a long time scout. 
i don't understand why people are being so butthurt about my posts when i've stated nothing but facts. i'm not telling anyone how to play, or telling anyone they're good or bad, just stating what is true.
Anime > EVERYTHING
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Ryme Intrinseca
Fatal Absolution
Negative-Feedback
930
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Posted - 2014.03.27 18:33:00 -
[32] - Quote
Youknowutimsayin wrote:Scouts who cloak up and camp objectives earn what? 550WP per game? They aren't effective and aren't a threat so why all the QQ about them?
You could say the same about redline snipers. In fact I've done it for you:
Youknowutimsayin wrote:Redline snipers earn what? 550WP per game? They aren't effective and aren't a threat so why all the QQ about them?
- From a frontline, hacking and flanking scout. |
Lightning xVx
R 0 N 1 N
474
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Posted - 2014.03.27 18:37:00 -
[33] - Quote
Dexter307 wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:Youknowutimsayin wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:Youknowutimsayin wrote:
You should be more worried about the BRICK TANKED FOTM Scouts
fixed that for ya. Why would anyone worry about slow scouts? I guess I'll brick tank one and see what all the fuss is about, but all of my scout fits from Dragonfly to gK.0 are proper shild tanked scouts, as it should be. same ehp as an assault invisible cloaked 2 equipment slots faster need I go on? So its faster and cloaked while having an extra equipment slot like a scout should be Only bad players tank scout suits, if you cant kill them then your bad.
Then we're bad? Sir, your argument is mute. Have you SEEN or fought these Scouts or in Groups? No, I assume. So let me give you a brief summary of what I HAVE FOUGHT.
Caldari Scout: Have WAY better precision enhancers on their suit and it can EASILY pick up anyone in a certain radius of them so there are a few things that can come from this; Armor tank with damage mods and not be picked up AT ALL because you run NO SHIELDS (more shields more sig, no shields less sig), Max Core skills give extra bonus to damp and range, Proto weapons and FINALLY... A cloak.
Gallente Scout:: Just as powerful but are COMPLETELY invisible on radar (But can still be picked up by Caldari Scout). Couple that with Proto level suit, damage mods, Armor stack/Armor Reppers (pushing 1000+ health) , Proto Weapons, Cloak, and those passive reps...Jesus that's just a nasty suit.
Amarr Scout: (if you can even call it a Scout) Can armor tank just like the Gallente but isn't AS bad because the reps aren't on it. Has a large stamina pool, can get close too 1000 eHP, Damage mods, cloak and a little faster then an Assault.
Minmatar: IMHO have nothing on PG and I see less people run this suit because you can't properly speed tank it or fit it in general. My old setup from 1.7 can't even fit on this "new" suit...so...that's saying something. If you want to find the source of the problem: Trail it back to the money. Caldari, Gallente and Amarr. (In that order from what I have seen) are used and abused the most.
Medium suits put a cloak on and they are just as squishy as a regular average joe Scout. I OHK them. |
Ryme Intrinseca
Fatal Absolution
Negative-Feedback
930
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Posted - 2014.03.27 18:42:00 -
[34] - Quote
Scheneighnay McBob wrote:Youknowutimsayin wrote:
Scouts who cloak up and camp objectives earn what? 550WP per game? They aren't effective and aren't a threat so why all the QQ about them?
Not to mention I did that perfectly fine last build without needing a cloak. People never check corners. I completely called it. Cloaks added a sortof placebo effect to help people realize they can do what we always could.
It was easy before, but at least there was a counter (have a look around). Now you can be looking in a stationary scout's direction from 5m away and you still won't see them. There isn't really a counter, and as 1.7 tanks taught us, there's something wrong when a role has no counter. |
byte modal
54
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Posted - 2014.03.27 20:10:00 -
[35] - Quote
TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:Vespasian Andendare wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:1.) pretty sure 1000 ehp is the same as assault.
2.) easier said than done
3.) yes, it is quite obvious. hence why people are using the scout instead of the assault.
I'm not afraid to admit that the scout buff has broken assaults and that is WRONG.
If you can't see a scout running toward you, then you really need to use your eyes more than the scanner. I know, I know, it's going to be a tough transition from the "You have been scanned" tell-all days of yore, but seriously, unless a scout is just standing there, cloaked, not moving at all, they're incredibly easy to spot. The shimmer makes then stand out like crazy. Aim your weapon at the shimmer and fire. I know you'll have to use your eyeballs and brain more, but hey, it's a small tradeoff. ok, let me get this straight. i don't have problem with scouts AT ALL. i'm not talking about me, as i've been a scout for a LONG time, way before 1.8. i'm talking about assault players who decided to go fotm brick tank scout. everything you're saying, i already know and have stated plenty of times before, but that's not what this is about. it's about the fact that there is NOTHING an assault can do that a scout can't do the same, if not better. i'm not understanding what's so hard to understand about this. the assault is still a good suit, but like the scout suit pre 1.8, it is outdone by other suits in every way.
Hey, all apologies for my part. I got caught up in the scout = invisible death thing earlier on and I guess your posts were read, at least by me, out of context.
I get what you're saying, but I wonder how much of this is simply due to the newness of the new scout slots + the shiny new toy that is the cloak. Right now it's a whole new thing. Assaults may be jumping to scout to test things out and finding they can get the drop on a lot of people much easier than with an assault---currently. What happens when the player base adapts? I play scout so I watch for scout tactics. Keeps me safe, generally at least from scouts. We've been so used to straight up assault AR/AR conflicts that anything different is a huge contrast. So assaults are converting to play a perceived superior assault role, through the scout suit. Players are doing so to either to take part in the advantages that they see or just to screw around with something new. So what comes when some players get tired of it all and decide to spec and gear strictly into scout hunters? Cal scouts turning on cloaked scouts for the challenge may actually bring some balance back. Scouts could be the balancing solution for... well... scouts! Those cloaked scouts may (ya, or may not..sure) get frustrated being sniffed out and revert back to their tried and true method of killing.... including hunting non-cloaking scouts. I just typed scouts a lot =\
I dunno. You have points, but I really think a lot of this is FoTM chasing. Once a few players adapt and counter that will only cause a new ripple effect. Maybe some adjustments are still needed. Sit tight and let's find out? I'm actually excited by it all.
A bit off topic, I am curious of the 2 equipment slot thought process. Scouts get a bonus so OK sure, so scouts are using cloaks now. Stealth for what? Getting behind lines to re-hack? We don't need another equipment slot to help with that. Camping objectives? No need for a second slot there either. Dropping uplinks I guess? Gets us in a little easier, I suppose, to then switch over for a drop, then cloak back out or something. If not, then why the extra slot? Why not either cloak OR uplink. If that's the point of it then why not just make it its own unique slot like the grenade. With it being a second slot, the cloak to me seems more an afterthought novelty without a real role. As has already been noted, scouts were already doing without cloaks what scouts are doing now with. There's just an arse-load more of them playing with the new toy.
Just feels odd to me. Then again, who the hell am I? lol.
- me.
Irony: Post #35
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Yan Darn
Science For Death
416
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Posted - 2014.03.27 20:22:00 -
[36] - Quote
^
I agree with a lot of that.
Could it turn out that 'real' scouts are the ones that convince the assaults to **** off back to their med frames?
The Ghost of Bravo
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TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR
Fatal Absolution
Negative-Feedback
1933
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Posted - 2014.03.27 20:28:00 -
[37] - Quote
byte modal wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:Vespasian Andendare wrote:TranquilBiscuit ofVaLoR wrote:1.) pretty sure 1000 ehp is the same as assault.
2.) easier said than done
3.) yes, it is quite obvious. hence why people are using the scout instead of the assault.
I'm not afraid to admit that the scout buff has broken assaults and that is WRONG.
If you can't see a scout running toward you, then you really need to use your eyes more than the scanner. I know, I know, it's going to be a tough transition from the "You have been scanned" tell-all days of yore, but seriously, unless a scout is just standing there, cloaked, not moving at all, they're incredibly easy to spot. The shimmer makes then stand out like crazy. Aim your weapon at the shimmer and fire. I know you'll have to use your eyeballs and brain more, but hey, it's a small tradeoff. ok, let me get this straight. i don't have problem with scouts AT ALL. i'm not talking about me, as i've been a scout for a LONG time, way before 1.8. i'm talking about assault players who decided to go fotm brick tank scout. everything you're saying, i already know and have stated plenty of times before, but that's not what this is about. it's about the fact that there is NOTHING an assault can do that a scout can't do the same, if not better. i'm not understanding what's so hard to understand about this. the assault is still a good suit, but like the scout suit pre 1.8, it is outdone by other suits in every way. Hey, all apologies for my part. I got caught up in the scout = invisible death thing earlier on and I guess your posts were read, at least by me, out of context. I get what you're saying, but I wonder how much of this is simply due to the newness of the new scout slots + the shiny new toy that is the cloak. Right now it's a whole new thing. Assaults may be jumping to scout to test things out and finding they can get the drop on a lot of people much easier than with an assault---currently. What happens when the player base adapts? I play scout so I watch for scout tactics. Keeps me safe, generally at least from scouts. We've been so used to straight up assault AR/AR conflicts that anything different is a huge contrast. So assaults are converting to play a perceived superior assault role, through the scout suit. Players are doing so to either to take part in the advantages that they see or just to screw around with something new. So what comes when some players get tired of it all and decide to spec and gear strictly into scout hunters? Cal scouts turning on cloaked scouts for the challenge may actually bring some balance back. Scouts could be the balancing solution for... well... scouts! Those cloaked scouts may (ya, or may not..sure) get frustrated being sniffed out and revert back to their tried and true method of killing.... including hunting non-cloaking scouts. I just typed scouts a lot =\ I dunno. You have points, but I really think a lot of this is FoTM chasing. Once a few players adapt and counter that will only cause a new ripple effect. Maybe some adjustments are still needed. Sit tight and let's find out? I'm actually excited by it all. A bit off topic, I am curious of the 2 equipment slot thought process. Scouts get a bonus so OK sure, so scouts are using cloaks now. Stealth for what? Getting behind lines to re-hack? We don't need another equipment slot to help with that. Camping objectives? No need for a second slot there either. Dropping uplinks I guess? Gets us in a little easier, I suppose, to then switch over for a drop, then cloak back out or something. If not, then why the extra slot? Why not either cloak OR uplink. If that's the point of it then why not just make it its own unique slot like the grenade. With it being a second slot, the cloak to me seems more an afterthought novelty without a real role. As has already been noted, scouts were already doing without cloaks what scouts are doing now with. There's just an arse-load more of them playing with the new toy. Just feels odd to me. Then again, who the hell am I? lol. - me.
to be honest, i never even use the second equipment slot because it often messes me up when i'm quick switching to my cloak, and before the cloak, i didn't even use equipment. i don't really understand the point of the second equipment slot, but if other people like it, then whatever. i guess i can use it to better logi scout when i have to.
yeah it's definitely fotm chasing, and it's a real shame that people would abuse it like that, but hey, we've had worse fotm's than this right? i'm sure that it'll pass over and another much worse fotm will take it's place.
Anime > EVERYTHING
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byte modal
54
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Posted - 2014.03.27 20:33:00 -
[38] - Quote
Yan Darn wrote:^
I agree with a lot of that.
Could it turn out that 'real' scouts are the ones that convince the assaults to **** off back to their med frames?
I think that would be awesome, to be honest. I've always fantasized about two sub-roles for the scout that is suggested between Gal/Cal dynamics. A role strictly for doing the obvious: stealthing around hacking, uplinks, and actively/passively scanning for assassinations; and the subtle counter of another scout hunting the first group down. But but but, wouldn't that make the hunter king of the jungle? Eh, not geared for hunting stealthed scouts. They'd only really be good at ambushing cloaked scouts, for the hunt of it. Paper thin for everything else. Hm. I need to get home to see what, if any SP I have left.... ^.^
eh. Who knows. Sure as hell not me.
Irony: Post #35
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