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The issue that really isn't tanks

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SgtMajSquish MLBJ Consolidated Dust 16	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:43:00 - [1] - Quote so i have discovered that when playing solo or with a squad, that everyone turns into a major ***** whenever a tank comes in. It seems that the fatal blow to the team isn't the enemy tank but the friendlies unwillingness to go AV. I Challenge Everyone To Invite 10 People To Dust 514
Scheneighnay McBob Endless Hatred Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 4428	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:48:00 - [2] - Quote And by AV you mean a rail HAV I am your scan error.
True Adamance Praetoriani Classiarii Templares Praetoria Imperialis Excubitoris 8644	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:50:00 - [3] - Quote Scheneighnay McBob wrote: And by AV you mean a rail HAV Anything really..... I don't ever really see much AV on maps. "Get thine Swag out of my face! Next you'll be writing #YOLOswagforJamyl in all your posts!" -Dagger Two
Zahle Undt Bullet Cluster Legacy Rising 1080	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:55:00 - [4] - Quote Didn't we already debate this earlier in the week? we don't see much AV because the 2 light AV options are garbage and not everyone has sentinels with forge guns. Getting WP for vehicle damage and new commandos will help a little but until CCP fixes swarms or introduces a new and effective light AV weapon not much will change in this area. Most tankers are like sand people. They frighten easily, but will quickly return...and in greater numbers.
Seigfried Warheit Caught Me With My Pants Down 227	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:56:00 - [5] - Quote Cause dem permahardeners
Deltahawk Durango Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 160	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:58:00 - [6] - Quote Zahle Undt wrote: Didn't we already debate this earlier in the week? we don't see much AV because the 2 light AV options are garbage and not everyone has sentinels with forge guns. Getting WP for vehicle damage and new commandos will help a little but until CCP fixes swarms or introduces a new and effective light AV weapon not much will change in this area. first day playing dust 514 in dust university, i was advised to make a MLT forge gun fit... EVERYBODY has access to forge guns... I don't believe in an eye for an eye... I believe in two eyes for an eye!
Grimmiers 0uter.Heaven 462	Posted - 2014.03.23 00:59:00 - [7] - Quote Which is why ccp is adding the wp for damaging vehicles back to dust instead "fixing" av vs. tanks. I'm hoping they have potential hotfixes hidden within 1.8 that they'll deploy if the tanks are still a problem. They should at least fix swarm launcher's damage and have a stacking penalty for reppers and hardeners that isn't just a change of resistance percentages. I would like it if stacked armor reppers would slow the repair tick rate and stacked hardeners wouldn't last as long as a single one. SoundCloud Recruiter Link Pronounced Grim-e-urs
Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 3268	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:01:00 - [8] - Quote Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners Can't be said enough. I GÖú Kittens.
SgtMajSquish MLBJ Consolidated Dust 18	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:02:00 - [9] - Quote Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. I Challenge Everyone To Invite 10 People To Dust 514
Forever ETC 703rd Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive 157	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:05:00 - [10] - Quote Earlier today I was playing domination on Ashland, and a tank was parked right in front of the objective and was using a blaster with MCRU. I was the only one with REs trying to scare him out but by the forth time that I rushed him I died and detonated them, but didn't manage to kill it. Then a blueberry took the opportunity to hit with a swarm and managed to open the way. Well, time to go Commando. Fill the Ranks at 703rd. Love,Hate, and everything in between.- ETC 2013 ETC- My Initials!!

Rynoceros Rise Of Old Dudes 3269	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:16:00 - [11] - Quote Yes, I should run a 60,000 ISK SL on a 70,000 ISK fitting against a 50,000 ISK HAV. Wait, even better; I should have half of my team do this - for 1 HAV, while we're all sending up flares for every ******* with a RR to see, we'll dodge this MLT Blaster that can 3 shot the most bricked suit in the game. Meanwhile, the team with the most tanks uses all of their available infantry to win the match and kill our payouts. Or, we could all suit up in super expensive Heavies just to stack Damage Mods (for the last few days of their existence) and run FGs that emit a spotlight bright enough to be spotted from >100m away while they charge for 4 seconds and the HAV escapes to the redline. Hell, that may only require 3 or 4 synchronized players per solo operated tank to be immobilized while doing just enough damage to maybe scare them off. TL, DR; ** AV. HAVs. ** CCP. I GÖú Kittens.
Seigfried Warheit Caught Me With My Pants Down 228	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:19:00 - [12] - Quote SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. Well until that "small issue" is dealt with don't expect much change on the battlefield
Savage Mangler Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 66	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:28:00 - [13] - Quote "......and he stood alone upon a mighty hill, sunlight shining upon golden armour. With his hands he bore a great weapon and with it he cast down fearsome bolts of lightning upon his enemies, smiting his foes as if he were a vengeful god of storms. Twas all for naught, for his enemies called upon great metal beasts, whose hides could not be sundered even by his mightiest weapon. Alone he stood, and alone he would fall, as his allies were scattered by the horrendous sounds emanating from those terrible beasts, their minds broken. Yet he fought on, praying that one day the great god of Balance, who had forsaken his people long ago, would return and lead them all to the promised land." Verse 1337 of the Book of Savage ^My experience being AV in a nutshell. -YOU HAVE BEEN SCANNED- "Good, then they'll know who killed them." Keep your knives sharp....and your wits sharper.
KAGEHOSHI Horned Wolf Dominion of the Supreme Emperor God-King KAGEHOSHI 10087	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:33:00 - [14] - Quote People don't want to use AV because its ineffective; cycling multiple hardeners leads to almost permanent invincibility, swarms don't stop shield recharge on hardened tanks, and tanks just escape to safety and quickly repair all damage as if all your work was for nothing. If you factor in the cost of AV multiplied by the amount of times you'll die in the process, its not only cheaper, but far more effective to use a militia railgun tank. Gû¦Gû+Supreme emperor god-kingpÇÉKAGEH¦PSHIpÇæ// Lord of threads // Forum alt Gû¦Gû+
Patrlck 56 109	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:35:00 - [15] - Quote SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. I don't think you understand permahardeners. If you fit three Complex Shield Hardeners with all Shield Upgrades to 5, when one mod turns off, you just turn on the next one, and you will be 60% hardened for 100% of the time. Complex Shield Hardener with full skill (active time): 30 seconds Complex Shield Hardener with full skill (recharge time): 45 seconds So, if you activate one hardener, it will be active for 30 seconds, and then will recharge for 45 seconds. During those 45 seconds, you would activate one hardener, taking up 30 seconds and leaving just 15 seconds for the first hardener to recharge, which is half the active time for the last hardener. So when the last hardener runs out, the first Hardener is back online, and it just works in a circle. FA's youngest mascot
LT SHANKS Amarr Templars Amarr Empire 1674	Posted - 2014.03.23 01:39:00 - [16] - Quote Everyone should invest into a STD Logi suit, Proxy Mines, REs, and at least packed AV nades. At the beginning of each match, each player should load up this expendable fit and litter the notable tank throughways with explosives. I guarantee that if 10 players did this, tank spam would be slightly more bearable.
Vrain Matari Mikramurka Shock Troop Minmatar Republic 1849	Posted - 2014.03.23 02:01:00 - [17] - Quote Grimmiers wrote: Which is why ccp is adding the wp for damaging vehicles back to dust instead "fixing" av vs. tanks. I'm hoping they have potential hotfixes hidden within 1.8 that they'll deploy if the tanks are still a problem. They should at least fix swarm launcher's damage and have a stacking penalty for reppers and hardeners that isn't just a change of resistance percentages. I would like it if stacked armor reppers would slow the repair tick rate and stacked hardeners wouldn't last as long as a single one. Nice suggestions, Grimmiers. Add a web grenade and we'd be having great AV vs. tank battles. I support SP rollover.
Fyra Yacile Kang Lo Directorate Gallente Federation 36	Posted - 2014.03.23 02:22:00 - [18] - Quote True Adamance wrote: Scheneighnay McBob wrote: And by AV you mean a rail HAV Anything really..... I don't ever really see much AV on maps. Harderners render all infantry AV useless and Tanks are so fast that they can easily get out of range AND after 4 months every1 has had enough of Tank Spam .. bored of it frankly i'm not being forced to play in a style I dont want 2 play coz sum1 is using a Tank .. every now n again sure ... every damn game ? Hell no !!! We desperately need an AV buff and speed reduction of Tanks and penalties on harderners
Soldier Sorajord Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 168	Posted - 2014.03.23 02:23:00 - [19] - Quote SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: so i have discovered that when playing solo or with a squad, that everyone turns into a major *** whenever a tank comes in. It seems that the fatal blow to the team isn't the enemy tank but the friendlies unwillingness to go AV. And so finally comes the realization by the players. You've been running solo AV. It's not that AV Sucks, it's that you don't have a wingman. Tanks are crap without a wingman most of the time, and if a group of three focuses on them, they go down real easy. Take a look at the Wiykromi [Dre] Preach Gun, and you'll decimate every vehicle that ever comes your way, as long as both you and your bud lock on to the same guy with that thing. I've known this all along. It was the same back when it was only about half a year after uprising came out. LAV's and tanks were annoying then, but the problem then when someone had difficulty is the same now. It's that your friendly neighborhood don't run them. Back in the hayday, My squad of SBS/OmniEndeavors (The latter of which is dead now) ran as a group, and I used to not know anything about Vehicles and destroying them, but I was a noob. They taught me the way of swarm launchers and AV Grenades, as well as the forge gun. I started using them, and hell, as long as somebody else was helpin me, I never had the issue again of having to deal with them all alone and getting whooped again. Maybe instead of complaining about AV, you should teach your friendly neighborhood blueberries to use, at the very least, a basic AV grenade, or something better than a MLT/Basic Swarm launcher. Teach them not only to use it, but when to use it. Then maybe, just maybe, we wouldn't be complaining about something that actually isn't as weak as we all think. PS as far as swarms go, they need bettter range, that's all. AV nades are fine. FG is fine as well. But srsly. Teach your blueberries to run something other than a rifle and a locus grenade, and We'll all live better lives :) (Subbed to this topic because somebody finally realized what the REAL** Problem is. Click Here to set up a Character that will get an AR, SMG, and a Caldari BPO
Soldier Sorajord Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 168	Posted - 2014.03.23 02:27:00 - [20] - Quote Fyra Yacile wrote: True Adamance wrote: Scheneighnay McBob wrote: And by AV you mean a rail HAV Anything really..... I don't ever really see much AV on maps. Harderners render all infantry AV useless and Tanks are so fast that they can easily get out of range AND after 4 months every1 has had enough of Tank Spam .. bored of it frankly i'm not being forced to play in a style I dont want 2 play coz sum1 is using a Tank .. every now n again sure ... every damn game ? Hell no !!! We desperately need an AV buff and speed reduction of Tanks and penalties on harderners Not even gonna waste My time on this one, He will never learn. You'll eventually find you will have to run AV bud. I mean cmon. This is a SciFi Game. Why the hell wouldn't there be vehicles everywhere? Vehicles are awesome! So maybe instead of complaining then tell your buds to run AV With you, and actually focus fire instead of assuming one man has the right to kill ANYTHING easily, even a skilled vehicle master :) Click Here to set up a Character that will get an AR, SMG, and a Caldari BPO

Alena Ventrallis The Neutral Zone 951	Posted - 2014.03.23 02:30:00 - [21] - Quote Seigfried Warheit wrote: SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. Well until that "small issue" is dealt with don't expect much change on the battlefield Thats not the issue. More than one hardener is. And all hardeners being the same is a problem. Best PVE idea I've seen. Fixed link.
Soldier Sorajord Subsonic Synthesis RISE of LEGION 168	Posted - 2014.03.23 02:34:00 - [22] - Quote Alena Ventrallis wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. Well until that "small issue" is dealt with don't expect much change on the battlefield Thats not the issue. More than one hardener is. And all hardeners being the same is a problem. (Whisper) And surprisingly Enough.... YELLS "THE SHIELDS ARE ACTUALLY HARDER TO KILL THAN THE ARMORED BLASTER TANKS!" Click Here to set up a Character that will get an AR, SMG, and a Caldari BPO
Zero Harpuia Turalyon 514 Turalyon Alliance 1485	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:12:00 - [23] - Quote Soldier Sorajord wrote: Alena Ventrallis wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. Well until that "small issue" is dealt with don't expect much change on the battlefield Thats not the issue. More than one hardener is. And all hardeners being the same is a problem. (Whisper) And surprisingly Enough.... YELLS "THE SHIELDS ARE ACTUALLY HARDER TO KILL THAN THE ARMORED BLASTER TANKS!" There are Shield Hardeners and you know it, stop being an *******. In fact, if you go look at just about any research done into the subject of AV, Swarms are useless. Swarms, Large and Small Blasters, and even some Small Missiles are too weak to cause a Shield Hardened vehicle to stop naturally recharging. You either use an FG (and invest into Heavy Weapons and Heavy Suits), hope that you can hit with a Plasma Cannon (and even then he'll have just restarted his shields by the time you reload the thing, if you even hit), get within Grenade range (and if it's Flux, hope the HAV is still), or you have to walk right up and touch him, then hope he can't hear your beeping REs. And after all that, if you damage him enough he just runs away, or even worse adds insult to injury by recalling the vehicle while you are pelting it with 'AV.' Also, to the people here arguing that it shouldn't take just one guy to kill an HAV. Why not? An HAV is driven by one person. If the enemy has ONE HAV, and we have to have TWO people with AV to even hope to kill him, then there is ONE guy on the enemy team completely free to run rampant with whatever weapon he wants. If the enemy has the full SIX HAVs, we would have to have, at minimum, EIGHT AVers to ensure that at least two of them survive long enough to fire their shots, and at least TWELVE to keep the HAVs from just being called back in as the pilots respawn (assuming they were dumb enough to not bail). If we can only kill one HAV a minute, they'll just keep calling in more and more HAVs as long as they are winning the match. And six HAVs will win any match with just the space they create, as long as they have one single infantryman who isn't brain-dead and decides to cap the points. That works in Planetside because it's an MMO with fluid team sizes, from 1v1 to 1v100 and everything in-between. Here, we have to work with a maximum of 16 a side. If Team A's 12 have to hope to suppress Team B's 6, then Team B has already won. They have 16 guys who can kill all of Team A's 16, while Team A has 6 who can try to kill 12, and 12 who can try to kill 6. Shields as Weapons Zelda Dynasty Warriors is a real thing.
Sarus Rambo Direct Action Resources 69	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:18:00 - [24] - Quote SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue "A small issue" "small" wut. This sums up 75% of the forum posts.
Henrietta Unknown Sooper Speshul Ponee Fors Dropsuit Samurai 73	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:21:00 - [25] - Quote Rynoceros wrote: Yes, I should run a 60,000 ISK SL on a 70,000 ISK fitting against a 50,000 ISK HAV. Wait, even better; I should have half of my team do this - for 1 HAV, while we're all sending up flares for every ******* with a RR to see, we'll dodge this MLT Blaster that can 3 shot the most bricked suit in the game. Meanwhile, the team with the most tanks uses all of their available infantry to win the match and kill our payouts. Or, we could all suit up in super expensive Heavies just to stack Damage Mods (for the last few days of their existence) and run FGs that emit a spotlight bright enough to be spotted from >100m away while they charge for 4 seconds and the HAV escapes to the redline. Hell, that may only require 3 or 4 synchronized players per solo operated tank to be immobilized while doing just enough damage to maybe scare them off. TL, DR; ** AV. HAVs. ** CCP. I work a 13,000 ISK Scout or Speedy Logi fit. Works well if the douche isn't moving, and there are plenty of opportunities. You have to get your buddies to cover you from infantry though.
TYCHUS MAXWELL Sebiestor Field Sappers Minmatar Republic 85	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:22:00 - [26] - Quote SgtMajSquish MLBJ wrote: Seigfried Warheit wrote: Cause dem permahardeners thats a small issue, one that can be fixed by only allowing one module at a time to be active. But it hasn't been fixed... You know my assault rifle would be OP if it did 1000 damage a shot, but it doesn't. Yeah it's a small fix, but CCP ain't fixing it so it's still a massive issue when dealing with an actual tanker and not weekend tankers aka militia scrubs.
Darken-Soul BIG BAD W0LVES Canis Eliminatus Operatives 1537	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:28:00 - [27] - Quote Savage Mangler wrote: "......and he stood alone upon a mighty hill, sunlight shining upon golden armour. With his hands he bore a great weapon and with it he cast down fearsome bolts of lightning upon his enemies, smiting his foes as if he were a vengeful god of storms. Twas all for naught, for his enemies called upon great metal beasts, whose hides could not be sundered even by his mightiest weapon. Alone he stood, and alone he would fall, as his allies were scattered by the horrendous sounds emanating from those terrible beasts, their minds broken. Yet he fought on, praying that one day the great god of Balance, who had forsaken his people long ago, would return and lead them all to the promised land." Verse 1337 of the Book of Savage ^My experience being AV in a nutshell. why were you holding my meat? Who wants some?
Leadfoot10 Molon Labe. General Tso's Alliance 880	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:29:00 - [28] - Quote Another tank with a rail gun and a few damage modifiers is all that's needed to keep tanks in check against infantry. It ain't that hard folks -- and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than any remotely-dangerous AV fitting.
Vitharr Foebane Living Like Larry Schwag 834	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:37:00 - [29] - Quote Leadfoot10 wrote: Another tank with a rail gun and a few damage modifiers is all that's needed to keep tanks in check against infantry. It ain't that hard folks -- and it's a heck of a lot cheaper than any remotely-dangerous AV fitting. and therein lies the problem... Thanks CCP for making the HMG Heavy viable again :3 That's no excuse to slack off on releasing a heavy laser though =.=
Zack3000 Smith SilenT AngelS 43	Posted - 2014.03.23 03:38:00 - [30] - Quote LT SHANKS wrote: Everyone should invest into a STD Logi suit, Proxy Mines, REs, and at least packed AV nades. At the beginning of each match, each player should load up this expendable fit and litter the notable tank throughways with explosives. I guarantee that if 10 players did this, tank spam would be slightly more bearable. K



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